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Season a pass or a fail??

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Old
04-29-2010, 11:38 AM
  #51
jstreet
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Originally Posted by MemphisHockeyFan View Post
We gift wrapped this series for the Hawks and handed it to them.
agreed.



at least we arent Washington.

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Old
04-29-2010, 11:51 AM
  #52
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Are you talking all-offense and getting swept in 4 straight games (pretty much)? Or, how Washington's powerplay was worse than ours in the playoffs?

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04-29-2010, 12:07 PM
  #53
David Singleton
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
For us to be favored means not being the #7 seed .. or the #8 seed. Hell, one of our appearances as the #4 seed was against a team that tied us for the conference lead in wins that season. One of our two appearances as a #4 seed we could have been favorites.

When we're a top three seed, we'll have the expectation to win. As a #7, we're the underdog and to advance requires players going far above and beyond what we saw from our team. We got some damn good play
Yes, we did. We got some breakdowns and errors too, but that's to be fully expected. No one, or team, is perfect.

Quote:
, we needed near miraculous.
No.

What we needed was for this team to average their paltry 17% effectiveness on the PP or for the Blackhawks to only kill their normal 85.3% of kills.

Instead we see a 4% conversion rate (or 96% kill rate by the Hawks).

Losing while playing to one's abilities is one thing. Losing while grossly falling below one's abilities is another thing. Doing it while having two of the best players in the League (Suter and Weber) on the ice makes it even worse.


You and I both like statistics, and you put much more time into it than I do.

That said, the playoffs have never been about seeds or statistics- unless your a member of the media unfamiliar with a team having to choose a favorite. They always have been and always will be about matchups.

This team believed they should beat Chicago because they knew their own abilities and knew what Chicago brought to the table in terms of abilities for the series. And with the exception of the power play and some discipline problems, this team played to their abilities. No one said it would be easy, but it was more than achievable.

The fact they failed isn't the problem for the fans, and likely for the players. It's how they failed. And seeds, statistics, or expectations didn't have a role in that either. Only the players on the ice and the coaches on the bench (both teams).

That's not meant as a harsh statement to them or anyone else in particular.

It's meant to point out that expectations shouldn't be made by seeds or statistics alone (if at all). They should be made by examining how the teams matchup against one another. I don't point that out to you as I know you made your own analysis, but many just follow some random pundit that, after seeing maybe five total Predator games, keeps spouting that Chicago will easily bust Nashville's trap, etc.

My expectations going into the series was that Nashville would win in six or seven games based upon Rinne being as solid as he had been and their team defense being as solid as it was in the latter part of the season. Chicago had several strong offensive players, but Nashville should have been able to neutralize them enough to win (which effectively happened)- and they were missing two large pieces to their blueline. To win, Nashville did have to convert opportunities into goals, including bringing their power play back to the 16% realm. That's where they lost- drastically so.

Thanks 101 for the discussion.


Last edited by David Singleton: 04-29-2010 at 12:15 PM.
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Old
04-29-2010, 01:39 PM
  #54
PredsV82
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Originally Posted by David Singleton View Post
The fact they failed isn't the problem for the fans, and likely for the players. It's how they failed. And seeds, statistics, or expectations didn't have a role in that either. Only the players on the ice and the coaches on the bench (both teams).
this is my point as well.

if we had been owned from the first drop of the puck, I could deal with that better than the way we lost. similarly if we had gone back and forth and each team "won" their games instead of us "losing" a couple that we could and should have won, and in spectacularly inept fashion, I would feel much better.

But I will spend all summer and likely most of next year muttering "if only..."

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04-29-2010, 04:07 PM
  #55
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One stat that is overlooked is that since the last time we played Chicago in the regular season, the records of the two clubs were virtually identical. Definitely within a few points of one another so stats aside, the teams were playing at about the same level since January so I don't think I'd consider us underdogs to them. We were also the 4th hottest team since the Olympic break.

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04-29-2010, 06:22 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
One stat that is overlooked is that since the last time we played Chicago in the regular season, the records of the two clubs were virtually identical. Definitely within a few points of one another so stats aside, the teams were playing at about the same level since January so I don't think I'd consider us underdogs to them. We were also the 4th hottest team since the Olympic break.
While it's fun to speculate, that doesn't matter. It's a long season. Their "bad" stretch was a heck of a lot better than ours. We were the underdogs. Some would argue that Chicago was just "waiting" for the playoffs.

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04-29-2010, 08:46 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Conando View Post
Fail ... we had enough talent to get past the first round ... Hornqvist a serious net presence for the first time in our franchise history
Anyone who says the Preds have more talent than the Blackhawks would be lying to themselves. If we base it solely on talent, we rightfully deserved to be ousted in the first round.

Anyway, we didn't win the Cup, which is always the ultimate goal, no? That would make anything less a fail, perhaps just with some not-so-bad parts here and there.

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Old
04-30-2010, 08:27 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Jackleg Jack View Post
Anyone who says the Preds have more talent than the Blackhawks would be lying to themselves. If we base it solely on talent, we rightfully deserved to be ousted in the first round.

Anyway, we didn't win the Cup, which is always the ultimate goal, no? That would make anything less a fail, perhaps just with some not-so-bad parts here and there.
nobody said we have more... they said we had enough.

the habs beating the caps should put an end to any rationalization of "we really shouldnt have thought we would win in the first place"

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04-30-2010, 09:02 AM
  #59
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To compare our series to the Habs - Caps isn't exactly right. Habs played well, no question but the Cpas played terrible. Hawks didn't play terrible. They came to win and did. Yes we had our chances, but the mark of a great team is when you make a mistake they take advantage.

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04-30-2010, 09:33 AM
  #60
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To answer the original question I say pass for sure. The season didn't end on a great note but that will be the case for every team except one. Ask yourself "if you could have been guaranteed this season back in September would you have taken that"? If you say yes then it has to be a pass. I don't live in Nashville so I can't comment on the buzz about the Preds in the city. It did seem that the buzz grew and that the Preds created some excitement going into next year. If that is the case then I vote pass as well.

They didn't squeak into the playoffs and they ran a better team to the very edge in the playoffs. They were an unfortunate minute away from putting a stanglehold on a team that was picked to win the cup by many experts. All that is a positive and should be looked at above and beyond the one bad minute. The question everyone had about whether or not Rinne can be the guy was answered and that can't do anything but help going forward. 2 pages of harping about how it ended seems like a waste of time to me. A lot of good came out of this season. Take that and move into next year with more hope than you had last Sept.

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Old
04-30-2010, 01:15 PM
  #61
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to quote Mark Cuban, who said it best, "The last time I looked, five teams have championships out of 30. I'd say we'll try to go out there and do our best and try not to be reactive like all the media will ask us to be. Like I say every year, there's one team that wins and 29 teams who tie for last place. You don't change the way you approach success simply because of questions."




BINGO. You have to learn this as fans...

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04-30-2010, 04:03 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by jlsg View Post
To compare our series to the Habs - Caps isn't exactly right. Habs played well, no question but the Cpas played terrible. Hawks didn't play terrible. They came to win and did. Yes we had our chances, but the mark of a great team is when you make a mistake they take advantage.
wasnt directly comparing. was simply refuting the position put forth by others that we should be uspet about the loss because we shouldnt have expected to win anyway. I would say that after winning game 2, in the manner we won it, I think it was perfectly reasonable to expect this team to win the series. Same thing when we have a PP and a one goal lead in game 5... at that moment I expected to win the series and rightly so. Or when we came back and tied the game in the first period of the 6th... i honestly thought that if we went on to win that game we would win the series... and i dont think I am unreasonable for having thought that..

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04-30-2010, 04:07 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by utmfisher19 View Post
to quote Mark Cuban, who said it best, "The last time I looked, five teams have championships out of 30. I'd say we'll try to go out there and do our best and try not to be reactive like all the media will ask us to be. Like I say every year, there's one team that wins and 29 teams who tie for last place. You don't change the way you approach success simply because of questions."




BINGO. You have to learn this as fans...

sorry, but no, we dont. Cuban is an owner, I am a fan. I want my team to win, and I expect them to win when they are in the situations that I mentioned in the above posts. Im not asking for a championship... I just want to win a playoff series, and EIGHT teams manage to accomplish that feat EVERY YEAR ....but we have yet to manage to do it once despite having five tries...

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04-30-2010, 04:09 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
sorry, but no, we dont. Cuban is an owner, I am a fan. I want my team to win, and I expect them to win when they are in the situations that I mentioned in the above posts. Im not asking for a championship... I just want to win a playoff series, and EIGHT teams manage to accomplish that feat EVERY YEAR ....but we have yet to manage to do it once despite having five tries...
You are right, you don't. But then when people say "the sky is falling" after you (general you, not specifically to you) post, expect it.

You can expect more of your team, but to question what is obviously working to put ourselves in a better position EVERY YEAR to advance to the second reound is funny to me. We have a successful team. We aren't going to change it because we didn't win a championship.

And we, as fans, need to learn that.


Last edited by utmfisher19: 04-30-2010 at 04:19 PM. Reason: The you above was a general you, not specific you
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Old
04-30-2010, 04:19 PM
  #65
PredsV82
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Originally Posted by utmfisher19 View Post
You are right, you don't. But then when people say "the sky is falling" after you post, expect it.

You can expect more of your team, but to question what is obviously working to put ourselves in a better position EVERY YEAR to advance to the second reound is funny to me. We have a successful team. We aren't going to change it because we didn't win a championship.

And we, as fans, need to learn that.
well, as I have said before, the reason to change isnt even directly related to not winning a championship, its to give the impression that SOMETHING is different.

If you'll remember, I have almost always supported those who in the past have argued for 'steady as she goes"

but i sense that this year, and with the way we lost, its going to be different. I just don think we will capture the 'soft fans" interest with everything exactly the same next year. now, if we leave everything the same, have another 100 point season, and actually follow thorugh with a playoff series win, i think things will improve big time... but I suspect after the gut wrenching chokejob this year there is more than the usual disilusionment heading into the summer...

managament will know how things are going if season tix sales are way down... if they are, then they had better think about doing something to spark some interest

thats my point, not necessarily that change is needed to guarantee a better outcome... its needed because right or wrong, the preds appear to be "stagnant"

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04-30-2010, 04:45 PM
  #66
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I don't think the casual fan is as impacted by the fortunes of the team as the rabid fan, nor do I think they are affected by perceived stagnation. They're there for the fun--the point system and the rankings don't matter that much. Hearing that we're "Fifth" sounds good, but really, we could be 5th in the division and a lot of them would still think that sounded "good". After reading or seeing that we lost a game, many are surprised to hear that we're still whatever ranking we were before. Or if we won that we are lower. Hockey standings require a learning curve, even if you are interested in the sport.

For the casual fan attending a game, if we win, great, but if not and it was a "good game", that's okay too. They're not living and dying with this team. Yet. Case in point--my sister. Casual fan. She will never be a STH but she goes to more games every year. She had a great time at her first playoff game, despite the loss. The atmosphere and the electricity and the noise trumped the loss. Because I was in Athens for game 5, my whole family watched it together and I believe they agonized over it as much as I did. Did it keep them from attending or watching the next game? No. And it won't keep them from watching next year. Little by little, they're learning more about the game, learning the players, learning the coach, and even learning a bit of strategy.

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