If Montreal goes out in the 1st round, in the 4 or 5 games that they were pretty much universally expected to play, depending on if Halak stole ONE game or not, does this thread exist?
Players get hot. Teams get hot. Montreal is that team right now, especially due to Halak, and certainly Cammalleri. However, it's no guarantee that Cammalleri would've scored 11 goals for the Kings in the playoffs, or even that if Cammalleri were here that the Kings would've put themselves in a better position for the possibility that something like this could happen.
If someone knew that Montreal as a team, and Cammalleri as a player, would be where they're at right now...then please tell me what bets I should make, because you're basically Biff Tannen. Otherwise, it's just too easy to make this type of thread right now.
The same people who didn't like the Cammy trade from the beginning, are the same people who don't like it now. I never liked it. Never. Cammy being hot right now doesn't change that. He's proven people wrong at every level he's ever played, and is doing it again.
You're right though, there's no guarantee Cammy scores this much for the Kings in the playoffs. Just like there's no guarantee Kovalchuck scores 11 goals in the playoffs for the Kings. His performance for Jersey should be evidence of that.
If Montreal goes out in the 1st round, in the 4 or 5 games that they were pretty much universally expected to play, depending on if Halak stole ONE game or not, does this thread exist?
Players get hot. Teams get hot. Montreal is that team right now, especially due to Halak, and certainly Cammalleri. However, it's no guarantee that Cammalleri would've scored 11 goals for the Kings in the playoffs, or even that if Cammalleri were here that the Kings would've put themselves in a better position for the possibility that something like this could happen.
If someone knew that Montreal as a team, and Cammalleri as a player, would be where they're at right now...then please tell me what bets I should make, because you're basically Biff Tannen. Otherwise, it's just too easy to make this type of thread right now.
this argument hasn't been made because of his performance in these playoffs. its been made since the arbitration meetings because you could tell that DL wasn't handling him correctly. what you’re assuming and what others have jumped on is that we're only continuing to argue because of where the Habs are right now and his play.
Just like there's no guarantee Kovalchuck scores 11 goals in the playoffs for the Kings. His performance for Jersey should be evidence of that.
Correct. We'll see if Montreal does this year after year, but we've also seen that sometimes it's just right place, right time, right year.
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what you’re assuming and what others have jumped on is that we're only continuing to argue because of where the Habs are right now and his play.
Right now, if the particular circumstances that exist were different, would we be talking about this, again? It's possible. About as possible as the Habs taking out the Caps, and having the Pens playing a game 7.
this argument hasn't been made because of his performance in these playoffs. its been made since the arbitration meetings because you could tell that DL wasn't handling him correctly. what you’re assuming and what others have jumped on is that we're only continuing to argue because of where the Habs are right now and his play.
I don't think Cammalleri wanted to play in LA anymore. He wants to be treated like a star and he gets that in Canada and especially in Montreal. He'd never get treated that way in LA. Well, maybe for a couple of months during the playoffs - but that's it. He wanted more than money or LA could provide. Just face it. It has nothing to do with how he was treated or what the Kings were going to be. He deserves the star treatment a hockey player gets in Canada. Let him enjoy it.
How many times does this have to be beaten into Kings fans heads. Cammalleri didn't want to play for the Los Angeles Kings. Had no desire. Out right said he didn't want to be a King
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Originally Posted by adevandry
I'm disappointed that L.A. couldn't get more in trade for him, but Cammalleri wasn't going to return.
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Originally Posted by cneil99
Cammy had no intention to stay in LA
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Originally Posted by Duc620
I don't think Cammalleri wanted to play in LA anymore. He wants to be treated like a star
I'm not saying the above statements aren't true, or that my link below proves them wrong, I'm just saying I don't see anything unequivocally substantiating them.
"Q: Do you want to be back?
Cammalleri: I definitely want to be a King. It will be interesting to see what we do."
Can't we all just agree that NO ONE knows the truth?
Seriously, we know that DL didn't want to give Cammy the contract Cammy wanted. We know Cammy didn't want to sign the contract DL wanted him to sign.
Honestly, that's it. None of you know anymore than that. All this talk of egos and crap is stupid. Its speculation beyond those known facts. Completely. The evidence both sides is weak and needs heavy reading into to mean anything.
There's no reason to hate Cammy or DL here. It happened. It was a discord, and without knowing the necessary facts that no one will likely ever know, it is best to just say they were both equally at fault, which is probably the closest to the truth.
Can't we all just agree that NO ONE knows the truth?
Seriously, we know that DL didn't want to give Cammy the contract Cammy wanted. We know Cammy didn't want to sign the contract DL wanted him to sign.
Honestly, that's it. None of you know anymore than that. All this talk of egos and crap is stupid. Its speculation beyond those known facts. Completely. The evidence both sides is weak and needs heavy reading into to mean anything.
There's no reason to hate Cammy or DL here. It happened. It was a discord, and without knowing the necessary facts that no one will likely ever know, it is best to just say they were both equally at fault, which is probably the closest to the truth.
I am with the camp that says DL blew it in that he literally threw squidward away PLUS a first round pick for Colton (effectively).
I mean, MC has proven what most of us knew and that was that he wasn't a "one dimensional player" like DL implied nor was he "only going to sign in Canada" as others have asserted. MC would have signed at $5.4m per year according to his agent (if you can believe agents) and to me, that was a fair price then and as it turned out (like a few posters here had said) he is cheap at that price.
Why not sign with CGY if all he wanted to do was play in Canada? Why not? Because he was to become a UFA and he went where the best contract was to be had. MTL gave him what he wanted and it was a bonus that he got to go the Habs, Canada's favorite team (the Leafs would be second). Maybe it did matter to him and if so, that doesn't mean that we couldn't have signed him when we first had the chance.
When DL said that not signing the squid was about having the right type of character he is talking out of his bum (look ma, no hands). If anything, squid has gone on to prove most everything that DL said about him wrong (one dimensional, prone to injury etc).
Still, the only way in my opinion that DL blew it was that he used MC as a throw in to pick Colton. I mean, does he honestly expect us to believe that MC wouldn't have been a valuable asset at the trade deadline the following season? I mean, even if MC didn't draw a ton of interest it isn't like DL hasn't proven that he will let a player play out his contract without getting anything for him (hello Fro).
In my opinion, for Colton to prove that the trade wasn't a terrible one, he would have to turn out to be more than just a solid defencive dman buit he would have to turn out to be one at an elite level.
Still, in my opinion the squid debacle is one of a very few mist steps that DL has made and even with his less than perfect record, I would not only hate to see him bail on us but if I were King, I would try and sign him (DL) for another 5 years asap.
I fail to see how Cammy has proven he wasn't only going to sign in Canada since he did, sign in Canada. I'm not saying that he wouldn't have signed elsewhere, but that you can't say he proved he would. He also still is a one-dimensional player. Just because that one dimension is something he really excels at and is something a team needs, particularly ours, does not mean he all of a sudden gets credit for playing defense or being physical. I did however, always see Cammy as someone who could develop into a very good leader. For a little while I even thought he was our future captain.
If we had someone that lit it up like Cammy in our series with Vancouver then things would be different, however Cammy was never going to stay with us after his contract was over sad but true, the only thing that makes this whole situation sting more then it has to is that we drafted Teubert instead of Myers
Even if we did sign Cammy for 5 mill. We would now likely NOT be in the running for Kovy or Marleau... Since 5 million of those dollars that would go to one of those guys would be in Cammy's bank account. And both of these players are better then Cammy. In particular Kovy. You still really have to wait and see how all this pans before you consider the trade a failure or not. Not just whether or not CT pans out, but if Kovy sings with LA this off-season.
Even if we did sign Cammy for 5 mill. We would now likely NOT be in the running for Kovy or Marleau... Since 5 million of those dollars that would go to one of those guys would be in Cammy's bank account. And both of these players are better then Cammy. In particular Kovy. You still really have to wait and see how all this pans before you consider the trade a failure or not. Not just whether or not CT pans out, but if Kovy sings with LA this off-season.
Lets just hope that we sign Kovy or Marleau,thats also an issue because DL might not be willing to give the money needed for one of those players, and if he doesn't get anyone to solve our offensive woes then he will preach that our younger players have to get better, im not bagging on DL I love his work but you know that would be the case if it happens.
Squids one dimension is that he can play LW/C/RW and RD on the PP.
His other one dimensions are that he plays both ends of the ice (finishing this season among the tops on his team up front at +7.
Another of his one dimensions is that he is a solid locker room presence (according to media reports which are always dubious) and seen as a team leader both on and off the ice (I suppose that means other than just the locker room but I am not certain).
I'll stop there but, show me other players who not only poses these capabilities but do so at an elite level and then show me which ones are still considered to be one dimensional.
Mike is showing he IS a clutch performer in the playoff.
Yesterday he had another great game, with 2 beautiful goals.
So far he has 11 goals and 16 points in 13 games.
I hated seeing him traded...and now that trade looks even worst, with Teubert still far from being even an AHLer.
I'm pretty sure Lombardi traded him because Cammy never wanted to sign here.
He was really disappointed after the arbitration and think
that was the point when he decided not to sign again.
So, it was the best think to trade him.
Sure i would rather have him than Smyth for that price
Well, the way I slice things up you took his one dimension (offense) and sliced it up into several demidimensions.
His versatility at C and wing is nice, but I believe he has been used primarily as a wing (I could be wrong).
As for his +7, that doesn't mean anything to me. He does not excel at defense and I haven't noticed him on the ice at the end of games to protect leads, which is what you do with your better defensive players.
I'm not taking anything away from Cammy. I'm not saying "he's 1 dimensional and therefore sucks or shouldn't be a King or doesn't deserve his money" or anything like that. Only that he gets paid to do one thing and only one thing, score goals. Which is fine.
I just felt you were over-compensating for the attacks being levied against him in this thread. Its a reach in my eyes to say that Cammy does much of anything besides score goals, which he does exceptionally well.
I gotta disagree with you on this years signings having anything to do with what happened with squid. I would argue that if we had signed MC that we likely wouldn't have needed to sign Kovy etc or that if we still needed to sign a big name ufa that we would have had other leverage/needs and or players to move along.
I mean, this is sort of off subject but following the logic that says that we have to wait and see if we sign a giant named ufa this off season is akin to saying that DL was totally wrong in bringing in gap players while he was building our current team (and its depth of talent). If we had never brought in players like Calder we might have scored fewer points and drafted better players.
Then we likely wouldn't have needed to sign a major ufa this off season. That is the trouble with using speculation as part of an argument.
Also, at the time that squidward was dealt DL had no idea rather or not he would want to be attempting to sign a major ufa like kovy etc this far off into the future, unless......
Also, at this point MC is proving to be one of the best scoring forwards during the playoffs in the entire league. We've already proven that we can make the playoffs with our current roster so adding a guy who averages a point a game when it counts in MC might be the better decision than having Kovi or PM neither of which are close to him when it comes to playoff scoring.
MC- 19 games played-12 goals 7 assists =19points or 1ppg avg
Kovy- 9 gp 3 goals 5 assists = 8 points or 9.7avg
PM- 102gp 40 goals 29 assists = 69 points or 7.1avg (?)
MC is the more consistent playoff scoring threat among the three and that is what we will be signing Kovy etc for, right? I mean, we are already a playoff caliber team without Kovy as we speak and with a few smart additions we will be even better (either via ufa or through our own system). In my opinion, the ONLY reason to get a Kovy type of player is to win the cup.
I am just not certain that MC isn't also that type of player.
Of course, I also believe that if we had kept MC that we would have done better than we had over the past few years and that in doing so we would have missed out on DrewD, a player who has HOF written all over him so once again, I am left to speculation as being part of my argument.
Though, I would still debate that the fact that he has several categories (levels) at which he is exceptional as a scoring forward proves him to be a multi dimensional forward. He does play on the PK and that counts towards establishing him as a two way forward though, not by the true definition of the term ("two way forward).
I'm not saying the above statements aren't true, or that my link below proves them wrong, I'm just saying I don't see anything unequivocally substantiating them.
"Q: Do you want to be back?
Cammalleri: I definitely want to be a King. It will be interesting to see what we do."
I see him getting pk time in his stats but to be fair, I don't think he was a regular on the pk. Likely a shift worker ya know? Sent out towards the end of a pk so he is on the ice when it expires giving him pk time. Maybe it shouldn't be counted as being part of a pk unit in fairness.
If we had someone that lit it up like Cammy in our series with Vancouver then things would be different, however Cammy was never going to stay with us after his contract was over sad but true, the only thing that makes this whole situation sting more then it has to is that we drafted Teubert instead of Myers
Whats worse is how much complaining people do about it. Hindsight is always 20/20. Myers was considered a project just like Teubert was. He just happened to have an upward explosion in his development curve that noone could have predicted.
