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Lombardi on Leafs Lunch June 1st, 2010

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06-01-2010, 04:54 PM
  #1
Johnny Utah
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Lombardi on Leafs Lunch June 1st, 2010

http://www.640toronto.com/HostsandSh...nch/Audio.aspx

At about the 21 minute mark. Enjoy.

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06-01-2010, 04:57 PM
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Sydor25
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Dean talked about how it is easier to get a lower cap hit for older players because you can sign the long term deals and have them decrease, Kovalchuk anyone?

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06-01-2010, 05:07 PM
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Telos
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Kovalchuk! Kovalchuk! Kovalchuk! Do it Dean! Sounds good Boy that was a promising interview.

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06-01-2010, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Telos View Post
Kovalchuk! Kovalchuk! Kovalchuk! Do it Dean! Sounds good Boy that was a promising interview.
Seems like he is willing to go to a 10 or 12 year deal, if it keeps the cap hit down.

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06-01-2010, 05:13 PM
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Sydor25
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This is going to be the longest month of my life.....

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06-01-2010, 05:13 PM
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Ollie Weeks
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I liked his acknowledgement of the need to be aggressive in adding pieces to the team. It bodes well for the future, not just July 1st.

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06-01-2010, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Slippery Moses View Post
I liked his acknowledgement of the need to be aggressive in adding pieces to the team. It bodes well for the future, not just July 1st.
That was the most interesting part of the article for me because he openly acknowledged that you need to go get a big piece, citing chicago as the example. Ofcourse he hedged that claim a bit, but he did sound as if he thinks that a big addition is important. It was a pretty good interview. I like him ragging on basketball.

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06-01-2010, 06:08 PM
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Herby
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I just fundamentally disagree with almost everything these guys and DL say...I think they are firmly stuck in the pre-lockout NHL.

When guys like Crosby and Ovechkin are winning scoring titles at 20, and Doughty is a Norris finalist at 20 how can you expect these guys to not be paid as star players.

The days of guys coming in and learning the ropes for a couple of years are over, look at two of the names mentioned, Backstrom and Getzlaf. By the time these guys entry level deals were over they were both core players, both stars, arguably in Backstrom's case a superstar. Or how about Crosby, his third year in the league he lead the Pens to the Finals, is he supposed to sign for some kind of second tier contract as the face of the league?

How quickly these guys forget, one of the big problems if the pre-lockout NHL was the bidding wars for older and aging players, bad contracts given to people like Uwe Krupp, Steve Duchesne, Valeri Kamensky and Bill Guerin.

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06-01-2010, 06:14 PM
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MxH0CKEY
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
This is going to be the longest month of my life.....
No it won't. Next year or the year after around this time when the Kings are still playing will be the longest month of your life!
Trust me! Trust Dean!

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06-01-2010, 06:18 PM
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Johnny Utah
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
I just fundamentally disagree with almost everything these guys and DL say...I think they are firmly stuck in the pre-lockout NHL.

When guys like Crosby and Ovechkin are winning scoring titles at 20, and Doughty is a Norris finalist at 20 how can you expect these guys to not be paid as star players.

The days of guys coming in and learning the ropes for a couple of years are over, look at two of the names mentioned, Backstrom and Getzlaf. By the time these guys entry level deals were over they were both core players, both stars, arguably in Backstrom's case a superstar. Or how about Crosby, his third year in the league he lead the Pens to the Finals, is he supposed to sign for some kind of second tier contract as the face of the league?

How quickly these guys forget, one of the big problems if the pre-lockout NHL was the bidding wars for older and aging players, bad contracts given to people like Uwe Krupp, Steve Duchesne, Valeri Kamensky and Bill Guerin.
Strongly disagree. Their point is valid and Brian Burke spoke about this as well, what happened to the 2nd contract? Gone.

Players now go from making 900K to 9 million? Are you kidding me?!

It used to be players made the minimum then they get the 3-4 million dollar deal and then prove something in the playoffs and then get your 9 million.

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06-01-2010, 06:25 PM
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Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
The days of guys coming in and learning the ropes for a couple of years are over, look at two of the names mentioned, Backstrom and Getzlaf. By the time these guys entry level deals were over they were both core players, both stars, arguably in Backstrom's case a superstar. Or how about Crosby, his third year in the league he lead the Pens to the Finals, is he supposed to sign for some kind of second tier contract as the face of the league?
You don't think that Leetch, Selanne and Yzerman were superstars after their first few years in the league?

Yzerman:

http://www.hockeyzoneplus.com/salaries/4251

Leetch:

http://www.hockeyzoneplus.com/search...earchdbdisplay

Selanne scored 76 goals as a rookie and didn't get a huge raise like Backstrom & Kopitar:

http://www.hockeyzoneplus.com/search...earchdbdisplay

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06-01-2010, 06:33 PM
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TonySCV
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Right.. the problem is you've got a guy like Ovechkin who is already getting paid huge money despite the fact he has been terrible in the playoffs. Backstrom is another huge leap of faith. Yes, the guy has had a great season or two, but there's no middle step. It's entry level dollars to huge lifetime contract dollars. There's no in-between.

Granted, the odds are very good that the Backstrom's and Ovechkin's (and Doughty's) of the world will prove their worth eventually, but this is a pretty ****ed up system where people don't have to demonstrate their ability to do their job before getting paid as though they've done it already. $7+MM a year deals should be reserved for top players who have already proven they can win... not guys who you hope will win someday.

Am I glad there is a cap? Yes. Is the vanishing of the 2nd contract for top players one of the worst aspects of the post-cap CBA? Absolutely. It's great for the top players... sucks for pretty much everyone else.

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06-01-2010, 06:37 PM
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Herby
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Strongly disagree. Their point is valid and Brian Burke spoke about this as well, what happened to the 2nd contract? Gone.

Players now go from making 900K to 9 million? Are you kidding me?!

It used to be players made the minimum then they get the 3-4 million dollar deal and then prove something in the playoffs and then get your 9 million.
Yes, the second contract is gone, so is the two-line pass, ties, clutching and grabbing and boring hockey. Because with advances in training, weight gaining etc these guys come in and dominate at a very young age, which didn't happen nearly as much, especially in the dead puck era from 1994-2004.

Just for fun, DL mentioned Marleau. Marleau had 40 pts his third season in the NHL and the Sharks were gone in the first round. In Crosby's 3rd year he had 72 pts in 53 games and lead the Pens to the Cup Finals. Ovechkin in his third year had 65 goals, do you really expect him to sign for 3 million a year when he is coming off a Rocket Richard season, GTFO with that, he would rightly leave for bigger money in the KHL.

Ryan Getzlaf - 24G, 58A, 82 Pts
Anze Kopitar - 27G, 39A, 66 Pts
Eric Staal - 45G, 55A, 100 Pts
Nick Backstrom - 33G, 68A, 101 Pts
Evgeni Malkin - 35G, 78A, 113 Pts
Patrick Kane - 30G, 58A, 88 Pts
Jonathan Toews - 25G, 43A, 68 Pts

So you think all these players, many of them Cup Winners, should be tiered into making 3-4 mill a season while players like Ryan Smyth and Rob Blake are making 6 million a year?

Get used to it, these guys are going to sign 7-10 year deals that take them to 29-33. It works out for everyone, guys get large guaranteed money and the teams get them through almost all their prime years. Its win-win for everyone.

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06-01-2010, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by TonySCV View Post
Right.. the problem is you've got a guy like Ovechkin who is already getting paid huge money despite the fact he has been terrible in the playoffs. Backstrom is another huge leap of faith. Yes, the guy has had a great season or two, but there's no middle step. It's entry level dollars to huge lifetime contract dollars. There's no in-between.

Granted, the odds are very good that the Backstrom's and Ovechkin's (and Doughty's) of the world will prove their worth eventually, but this is a pretty ****ed up system where people don't have to demonstrate their ability to do their job before getting paid as though they've done it already. $7+MM a year deals should be reserved for top players who have already proven they can win... not guys who you hope will win someday.

Am I glad there is a cap? Yes. Is the vanishing of the 2nd contract for top players one of the worst aspects of the post-cap CBA? Absolutely. It's great for the top players... sucks for pretty much everyone else.
Terrible in the playoffs???? Were talking about the same Ovechkin right??? Secondly why pay 6+ mil for stiffs like Drury and Gomez "caused they proved it in the playoffs" when you can have a far superior player at even younger age in Backstrom/Kopitar. The bottom line is before the second contract was a way to artificially keep player salaries down for younger guys instead of paying players what they deserved....

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06-01-2010, 06:42 PM
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Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
So you think all these players, many of them Cup Winners, should be tiered into making 3-4 mill a season while players like Ryan Smyth and Rob Blake are making 6 million a year?
Yes.

Yzerman, Sakic, Selanne, Leetch, Chelios, Lindros (one of the biggest hyped players ever), Jagr, etc all signed normal 2nd tier contracts even though they were all top scoring, winning players.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Get used to it, these guys are going to sign 7-10 year deals that take them to 29-33. It works out for everyone, guys get large guaranteed money and the teams get them through almost all their prime years. Its win-win for everyone.
I agree that this is the trend and the owners have themselves to blame for it with the lowering of the FA age. It still doesn't make it right and this is what will prevent dynasties from forming in the cap era.

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06-01-2010, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Yes.

Yzerman, Sakic, Selanne, Leetch, Chelios, Lindros (one of the biggest hyped players ever), Jagr, etc all signed normal 2nd tier contracts even though they were all top scoring, winning players.
In an uncapped league. Where money didn't have to be spread strategically.

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06-01-2010, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Yes.

Yzerman, Sakic, Selanne, Leetch, Chelios, Lindros (one of the biggest hyped players ever), Jagr, etc all signed normal 2nd tier contracts even though they were all top scoring, winning players.




I agree that this is the trend and the owners have themselves to blame for it with the lowering of the FA age. It still doesn't make it right and this is what will prevent dynasties from forming in the cap era.
I want our guys to be locked up for years =]

Kovalchuk, Kopitar, Brown, Simmonds, Schenn, Doughty, Johnson, Bernier/Quick

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06-01-2010, 06:47 PM
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I laugh at all of you that think he was talking about Kovalchuk when it was obvious that he was talking about Marleau.

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06-01-2010, 06:48 PM
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Sydor25
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Originally Posted by KopitarFAN View Post
In an uncapped league. Where money didn't have to be spread strategically.
Sure, but this is hurting the league more than it is helping and we will probably have another lockout so the owners can try and fix their mistake again.

The players are not to blame for these contracts, the owners started their own bidding wars and now have to continue with these contracts to stay competitive.

Lombardi hates these 2nd contracts, but he also knows that you have to do it. He did sign Kopitar, didn't he? He knows that he has to adapt and I'm sure he will get Doughty locked up to a 7+ year deal.

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06-01-2010, 06:48 PM
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Terrible in the playoffs???? Were talking about the same Ovechkin right??? .
It almost makes me wonder if people are actually watching the games when they say stuff like Ovechkin is terrible in the playoffs. Well over point per game, he has just been unfortunate to be on the bad side of 3 game 7 losses. he is still young and has a long, bright future ahead of him.

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06-01-2010, 06:49 PM
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Sydor25
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I laugh at all of you that think he was talking about Kovalchuk when it was obvious that he was talking about Marleau.
When did Marleau play for New Jersey?

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06-01-2010, 06:49 PM
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I laugh at all of you that think he was talking about Kovalchuk when it was obvious that he was talking about Marleau.
I'm one of the few who wouldn't object to that(obviously not at the same price).

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06-01-2010, 06:58 PM
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Herby
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So people don't think its right that guys like Backstrom, Staal, Kopitar, Ovechkin and Getzlaf are signed to 6-7 mill a year deals before their 24th birthday...but are totally cool with Ryan Smyth, Chris Drury and Rob Blake making $6 mill a year?

Sorry, the biggest problem with the CBA are still guys like Smyth, Redden and Drury being paid like stars when they clearly aren't. Not the best and most marketable players being paid like stars.

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06-01-2010, 07:07 PM
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15 years $5.5mill cap hit. Don't talk to me till it's signed

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06-01-2010, 07:16 PM
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I blame ass face in edmonton for the vanek offer sheet. That was the first contract where I scratched my head and said 'really?? ****ing REALLY?!'

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