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Lombardi on Leafs Lunch June 1st, 2010

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06-02-2010, 01:13 AM
  #51
Kingz4life
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
What exactly would be the "ridiculous offer"?

To me, the 5.5M for 10 yrs don't sound THAT ridiculous if JJ continues to play the way he did in the playoffs. Having said that, I would prefer to sign JJ for something close to 4M-4.5M for 5 yrs.
If, we can lock up Doughty and Johnson long term for a CAP hit equal or less than a combined 11M than DL deserves props. Hopefully no more than 12M max but its possible...

Doughty - 6.5M
Johnson - 4.5M

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06-02-2010, 01:35 AM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingz4life View Post
If, we can lock up Doughty and Johnson long term for a CAP hit equal or less than a combined 11M than DL deserves props. Hopefully no more than 12M max but its possible...

Doughty - 6.5M
Johnson - 4.5M
Those numbers seem like they would be easily attainable. Depends on next year though. Particularly Johnson. I fear the most for him if he has a good year... It is the same situation all over again with a player having a good year and Dean not wanting to pay till proven over some time. Doughty is a lock, Johnson is on a slippery slope. Your numbers are reasonable though.

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06-02-2010, 02:09 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
Does it matter? The team who signs him to one will be banking on his potential.
I think DL will trade him before it gets to that. Imo, Johnson is a great athlete but he doesn't have the hockey 'smarts' to be a true great #1 d-man.

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06-02-2010, 02:17 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
What exactly would be the "ridiculous offer"?

To me, the 5.5M for 10 yrs don't sound THAT ridiculous if JJ continues to play the way he did in the playoffs. Having said that, I would prefer to sign JJ for something close to 4M-4.5M for 5 yrs.
Play like what? 7 assists, 4 of which came on the pp. -5 rating. He also has his share of lapses on the defensive end yet we always like to blame his partner.

I was a big fan of the JMFJ trade when it happened but I'm still waiting for Jack prove his worth. A 10 year contract for 5.5 is ridiculous imo. He either gets a short term team for $3-4 mill... or he gets a long term deal at a lower cap hit.

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06-02-2010, 03:00 AM
  #55
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Play like what? 7 assists, 4 of which came on the pp. -5 rating. He also has his share of lapses on the defensive end yet we always like to blame his partner.

I was a big fan of the JMFJ trade when it happened but I'm still waiting for Jack prove his worth. A 10 year contract for 5.5 is ridiculous imo. He either gets a short term team for $3-4 mill... or he gets a long term deal at a lower cap hit.
I agree with the JJ part. still a wildcard that could go either way.

As for Doughty, he grew up a Kings fan, was drafted 2nd overall by them and is living a Cinderella story. If he is smart and wants to be part of a long term winning team he would forfit a little salary to give us that extra bit of caproom. I am hoping for a 12 yr 70 - 72 million contract which = 5.83 mil - 6 mil a year. He gets long term stability and is a free agent at 32, where he can still get another big contract. It may not be as high as a few of the guys but its more then Keith, Weber, Pronger, Visnovsky, Green, Markov, Souray, Robidas and Seabrook are making.

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06-02-2010, 03:26 AM
  #56
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Doughty is a unique case. There's never been a defenseman in the CAP era to come right into the league and have the impact he's having.

What if he wins the Norris? Does that not make him worth more than Kane, who got 6.5M for five years?

He should be worth more than Kopitar.

If DD and his agent ask for 7.5M, Dean can't really argue.

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06-02-2010, 03:28 AM
  #57
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If Doughty wins the Norris he is the most valuable defenseman in the league bar none and will be up in the ranks of the highly touted elite like Crosby etc... Especially if he goes out and is in the discussion again next year. He is already in that category defenseman wise as-is, but if he gets the hardware this young, he joins them in that category overall.

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06-02-2010, 03:32 AM
  #58
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Part of me doesn't want him to win the Norris.

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06-02-2010, 11:35 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
Part of me doesn't want him to win the Norris.
I CAN'T THINK LIKE THIS ^^^^,

I understand what you are saying and where its coming from, but to my mind its just WRONG!

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06-02-2010, 11:54 AM
  #60
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Part of me doesn't want him to win the Norris.
Until after he is signed long term.

I think that him just being nominated has already drove his cost way up.

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06-02-2010, 11:58 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
Part of me doesn't want him to win the Norris.
Don't worry, he isn't. Not this year anyway. It's going to be Duncan Keith in a landslide.

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06-02-2010, 12:32 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
Doughty is a unique case. There's never been a defenseman in the CAP era to come right into the league and have the impact he's having.

What if he wins the Norris? Does that not make him worth more than Kane, who got 6.5M for five years?

He should be worth more than Kopitar.

If DD and his agent ask for 7.5M, Dean can't really argue.
Dion Phaneuf did. And look how unattractive his contract is now because of his early success.

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06-02-2010, 12:39 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Thrice View Post
Dion Phaneuf did. And look how unattractive his contract is now because of his early success.
Disagree

Phaneuf was moved for other reasons. His contract is also not bad.


Last edited by Gentle Ben Kenobi: 06-02-2010 at 12:44 PM.
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06-02-2010, 01:03 PM
  #64
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I agree with the JJ part. still a wildcard that could go either way.

As for Doughty, he grew up a Kings fan, was drafted 2nd overall by them and is living a Cinderella story. If he is smart and wants to be part of a long term winning team he would forfit a little salary to give us that extra bit of caproom. I am hoping for a 12 yr 70 - 72 million contract which = 5.83 mil - 6 mil a year. He gets long term stability and is a free agent at 32, where he can still get another big contract. It may not be as high as a few of the guys but its more then Keith, Weber, Pronger, Visnovsky, Green, Markov, Souray, Robidas and Seabrook are making.

You guys thinking that any player is going to take less salary for any reason are dreaming. It's the NHLPA and Agents job to make sure they railroad owners for the highest contract they can get.

Drew signing a mega deal only helps other Defensive men in the league get more salary. People thinking that Drew is going to sign for less money because he is a king are in fantasy land. The NHLPA will make sure Drew is signing a Max deal for his talent level....

Same for Kovi.....Now that doesn't mean the deal won't be cap Friendly, but you can bet your bottom it will be a lot of money.

If Drew signs for Peanuts I will be shocked......Cause that means Drew gave the NHLPA the big finger...


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06-02-2010, 01:23 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
You guys thinking that any player is going to take less salary for any reason are dreaming. It's the NHLPA and Agents job to make sure they railroad owners for the highest contract they can get.

Drew signing a mega deal only helps other Defensive men in the league get more salary. People thinking that Drew is going to sign for less money because he is a king are in fantasy land. The NHLPA will make sure Drew is signing a Max deal for his talent level....

Same for Kovi.....Now that doesn't mean the deal won't be cap Friendly, but you can bet your bottom it will be a lot of money.

If Drew signs for Peanuts I will be shocked......Cause that means Drew gave the NHLPA the big finger...


Try again.

The NHLPA only checks if the contract is ok with the CBA and if it's not then they can refuse to approve a contract.

The negotiating process is Player + players agent vs GM & assistant(cap expert/owner/assistant GM/head scout) and the negotiating process involves more than just throwing numbers.


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06-02-2010, 01:29 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Loktionov View Post


Try again.

The NHLPA only checks if the contract is ok with the CBA and if it's not then they can refuse to approve a contract.

The negotiating process is Player + players agent vs GM & assistant(cap expert/owner/assistant GM/head scout).
He is far more correct than you think.

When players take low salary deals (like Kariya and Selanne did with Colorado) the NHLPA is all over them and accuses of them not being team players and hurting other player's salaries.

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06-02-2010, 01:31 PM
  #67
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I want to make love to Dean Lombardi and have his babies.. Yes I'm a dude but I'm just in love with this guy

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06-02-2010, 01:31 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Loktionov View Post


Try again.

The NHLPA only checks if the contract is ok with the CBA and if it's not then they can refuse to approve a contract.

The negotiating process is Player + players agent vs GM & assistant(cap expert/owner/assistant GM/head scout) and the negotiating process involves more than just throwing numbers.
You have never worked for a Union have you....

Drew's agent and the NHLPA as we speak right now are (Asking every teams GM's under the table how much they would pay Drew in the open market to play for them.) So they can form a battle plan to get as much as possible from the LA kings...... It's a Giant game of cat and mouse, and it's about who is the first to flinch. Drew and his Agent or LA....

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06-02-2010, 01:35 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Little Bunny Foo Foo View Post
He is far more correct than you think.

When players take low salary deals (like Kariya and Selanne did with Colorado) the NHLPA is all over them and accuses of them not being team players and hurting other player's salaries.
Yes pre-CBA. And there were waay more contract holdouts pre CBA.

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06-02-2010, 01:36 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Little Bunny Foo Foo View Post
He is far more correct than you think.

When players take low salary deals (like Kariya and Selanne did with Colorado) the NHLPA is all over them and accuses of them not being team players and hurting other player's salaries.
Not to mention other players, If Drew signs low you can bet Jack Johnson will be all over Drew's ass...

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06-02-2010, 01:37 PM
  #71
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Yes pre-CBA. And there were waay more contract holdouts pre CBA.
I am saying this politely, but you are talking out of your ass.

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06-02-2010, 01:48 PM
  #72
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Ofcourse the NHLPA will want Drew to get top dollars. However damacles, its not a foregone conclusion that Drew will listen or care. He can still sign whatever contract he wants. My guess is it will be somewhere in between a bargain and top dollar. Expensive but reasonable. He's not going to turn around and screw the Kings and hold out just because the NHLPA told him to. The only reason I could see Drew going that far would be if Dean tries to screw him first. And we can logically reason that he won't, given Kopi is the closest comparable.

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06-02-2010, 01:50 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
You have never worked for a Union have you....

Drew's agent and the NHLPA as we speak right now are (Asking every teams GM's under the table how much they would pay Drew in the open market to play for them.) So they can form a battle plan to get as much as possible from the LA kings...... It's a Giant game of cat and mouse, and it's about who is the first to flinch. Drew and his Agent or LA....
That would be a high violation of the CBA. Only contracts from players who became UFA & RFA 's can be negotiated.


And I was part of a negotiating process back in high school (for basketball) and the negotiating is basically a exchange of opinions about the future commitment, personal feelings of the players and it's pretty much like a new job hiring - nothing to flashy there, a lot of opinion talks between the two sides. The second to last part of negotiation is talk about the number of years a player prepared to commit in his next contract.
The last thing is the players agent and the organization (GM/owner) throwing out similar contracts to what he expects and at the end if there is an dis/agreement there usually are more than one contract proposed to a player who can accept/Decline whatever he wants.


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06-02-2010, 01:59 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by Little Bunny Foo Foo View Post
I am saying this politely, but you are talking out of your ass.
Well I haven't heard the NHLPA cry about Parise's, Browns, Jack Johnsons, Getzlafs, Perrys, Burrows, St. Louis, Savards, T. Kaberles, ... contracts,
did you?

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06-02-2010, 02:04 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Loktionov View Post
Yes pre-CBA. And there were waay more contract holdouts pre CBA.
That has more to do with GMs being scared of offer sheets imo. They tend to 'overpay' to make sure their RFA is signed before an offer sheet is thrown at him.

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