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Old
06-03-2010, 01:06 AM
  #76
JDM
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Kopitar took the time to learn the defensive side. Kovalchuk still floats.
This is a misleading statement.

Its not like Kopi took it upon himself to learn defense. He did what his coach told him to do and his GM challenged him to do, damn near condemned his career if he didn't learn defense.

Who ever told Kovalchuk to learn defense? No coach or GM in Atlanta had the balls to do that. Murray and Lombardi would. They wouldn't bring Kovy in and cowtow to him. They would bring him in with the condition and understand that he will not play Kovalchuk's game, but rather, the KINGS' game.

Which brings me to system. System is everything for defense. Take a good defensive player and put him in a system that isn't built around defense, and that seemingly good defensive player all of a sudden won't look so hot. It is a player's job to play the system of his team, and Atlanta has never had a sound defensive system in place. Not to mention enough sound defensive players to support the scoring. Or goaltending... or much else most of the years. Or an identity, much like the Kings, oh, 4 years ago. Hell, 3 years ago.

Put Kovalchuk, a guy who is determined to win and has the competitive fire and skill to burn his opponents, in a sound defensive system that he spends a training camp and a season learning and adjusting to, and watch out. That's when you have a deadly combo.

Kovalchuk would be one of two top forwards. Getting Kovalchuk does not negate Kopitar being a dominant and defensively sound #1 center, and in a few years, even better than Kovalchuk overall and being a true #1 forward. Getting Kovalchuk doesn't stop us from getting a good 2nd line center. Maybe not a Malkin/Crosby combo. But there aren't a lot of Malkin's lying around.

You worry so much about the cap, and paying 3 players over ~7 million or over.

Well how by gosh did the Wings get by with Lidstrom making 7.5, Datsyuk getting 6.7, Zetterberg 6.08, AND Rafalski @ 6?

Or the Pens, with Malkin and Crosby at 8.7 and Gonchar and Fluery at 5?

Or Philly, 4 forwards @ 5 million or over, and 2 defensemen over 6.

Chicago is about to have almost 20 million tied up in their top 3 forwards, along with Campbell and Keith taking up almost another 13. Now will they have some issues this summer with the cap? Yes. Will those issue turn them into a crappy team? Highly doubtful.

Because their top players are worth the money.

Now you can argue that Kovalchuk isn't the kind of player to give that money to, and while I would strongly disagree with you, that is a reasonable stance to take. The stance that adding Kovalchuk would dismantle the team in such a way that we would lose more important players is a fallacy. You need to expect paying 25-30 million for your top 4 or 5 players. Its the way it goes, and its the way to stay competitive. If you aren't willing to fork over money for talent, and just want to fill the team with cheaper and ultimately less talented options, you aren't going to remain a contender for very long, if at all.

I can't operate under the assumption of paranoia and worse case scenario. Be wary of it, of course. Be smart, of course. But I just can't see a cup in the future of a team that is run with thoughts of doom on the horizon.

Woah.... that was a lot more than I intended to write.

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06-03-2010, 01:06 AM
  #77
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Everybody keeps using Chi as an example of what this Franchise can be but I see one big problem. We don't have an sniper like Kane anywhere in this franchise. You can compare a lot of people in Chi to LA but we don't have that shooter.
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06-03-2010, 01:12 AM
  #78
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You lost me at the cap will continue to grow. Says who? In this god awful economy? Thank god DL has his eye on the cap 3 years from now because it is very crucial to layer your contracts and not to overpay too many players.
Has there been a year yet when it went down? The cap will go up as revenues will continue to increase as the league continues its marketing campaign and hockey attracts bigger crowds. ESPN wants to show hockey again as well.

Like I said elsewhere, you guys focus way too much on the cap and not nearly enough on the players. Leave the cap to jeff Solomon, and sign the best players possible. I've yet to see a team hurt by the cap, and I have strong doubt that I will any time soon either.

And being in CAP HELL has really hurt to remaining two teams still playing hockey in June, eh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JDM
I can't operate under the assumption of paranoia and worse case scenario. Be wary of it, of course. Be smart, of course. But I just can't see a cup in the future of a team that is run with thoughts of [CAP] doom on the horizon.
Me either. Which is why for the longest time I have always scoffed at DL's statements of the absolute necessity of cap conservation, which in my view was done to minimize losses (i.e., red ink, not those on the ice) when I have yet to see teams that are at or close to the cap be handcuffed by it. While I certainly dont want Reddin or Drury's contract, somehow the Rangers still managed to sign Gaborik, and Chicago with Kane, Toews, Campbell and Huet and Keith still managed to sign Hossa. if your not going after Kovalchuk because you are worried about losing Simmonds then you need to figure out what your priorities are: Winning a Cup or keeping your payroll down (so you can always have, but never use, CAP SPACE).


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06-03-2010, 01:25 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by DIEHARD the King fan View Post
Has there been a year yet when it went down? The cap will go up as revenues will continue to increase as the league continues its marketing campaign and hockey attracts bigger crowds. ESPN wants to show hockey again as well.

Like I said elsewhere, you guys focus way too much on the cap and not nearly enough on the players. Leave the cap to jeff Solomon, and sign the best players possible. I've yet to see a team hurt by the cap, and I have strong doubt that I will any time soon either.

And being in CAP HELL has really hurt to remaining two teams still playing hockey in June, eh?
It hasn't hurt CHI because their core isn't making much, yet. Hopefully DL will be smarter than Holmgren and Tallon by locking up his core before blowing his FA wad. He's been great with cap management, in DL I trust.

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06-03-2010, 01:28 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by JDM View Post
This is a misleading statement.

Its not like Kopi took it upon himself to learn defense. He did what his coach told him to do and his GM challenged him to do, damn near condemned his career if he didn't learn defense.

Who ever told Kovalchuk to learn defense? No coach or GM in Atlanta had the balls to do that. Murray and Lombardi would. They wouldn't bring Kovy in and cowtow to him. They would bring him in with the condition and understand that he will not play Kovalchuk's game, but rather, the KINGS' game.

Which brings me to system. System is everything for defense. Take a good defensive player and put him in a system that isn't built around defense, and that seemingly good defensive player all of a sudden won't look so hot. It is a player's job to play the system of his team, and Atlanta has never had a sound defensive system in place. Not to mention enough sound defensive players to support the scoring. Or goaltending... or much else most of the years. Or an identity, much like the Kings, oh, 4 years ago. Hell, 3 years ago.

Put Kovalchuk, a guy who is determined to win and has the competitive fire and skill to burn his opponents, in a sound defensive system that he spends a training camp and a season learning and adjusting to, and watch out. That's when you have a deadly combo.

Kovalchuk would be one of two top forwards. Getting Kovalchuk does not negate Kopitar being a dominant and defensively sound #1 center, and in a few years, even better than Kovalchuk overall and being a true #1 forward. Getting Kovalchuk doesn't stop us from getting a good 2nd line center. Maybe not a Malkin/Crosby combo. But there aren't a lot of Malkin's lying around.

You worry so much about the cap, and paying 3 players over ~7 million or over.

Well how by gosh did the Wings get by with Lidstrom making 7.5, Datsyuk getting 6.7, Zetterberg 6.08, AND Rafalski @ 6?

Or the Pens, with Malkin and Crosby at 8.7 and Gonchar and Fluery at 5?

Or Philly, 4 forwards @ 5 million or over, and 2 defensemen over 6.

Chicago is about to have almost 20 million tied up in their top 3 forwards, along with Campbell and Keith taking up almost another 13. Now will they have some issues this summer with the cap? Yes. Will those issue turn them into a crappy team? Highly doubtful.

Because their top players are worth the money.

Now you can argue that Kovalchuk isn't the kind of player to give that money to, and while I would strongly disagree with you, that is a reasonable stance to take. The stance that adding Kovalchuk would dismantle the team in such a way that we would lose more important players is a fallacy. You need to expect paying 25-30 million for your top 4 or 5 players. Its the way it goes, and its the way to stay competitive. If you aren't willing to fork over money for talent, and just want to fill the team with cheaper and ultimately less talented options, you aren't going to remain a contender for very long, if at all.

I can't operate under the assumption of paranoia and worse case scenario. Be wary of it, of course. Be smart, of course. But I just can't see a cup in the future of a team that is run with thoughts of doom on the horizon.

Woah.... that was a lot more than I intended to write.
Good post. All those teams mentioned have a great drafting record and ownership willing to spend to the cap. I'd be fine with Kovalchuk as long as it doesn't cost us a great top 4, and we are able to roll 3 real good lines.

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Old
06-03-2010, 02:22 AM
  #81
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How could Jones have a higher rating then O'D?
If it was turnover ratio...I can believe it... Other than that...they must have some good drugs on that staff...

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06-03-2010, 12:51 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
The only time +/- is relevant to me is during fantasy hockey. Kovalchuk floats almost as bad as Pavel Bure did but hopefully TM can get more out of him.
Kovalchuk floats? He's one dimensional? Wow. I guess you missed the game where he dropped the gloves last year to get his team going? Or in the playoffs this year when he challenged Richards to a fight in the first round? How many times have you seen Kopitar do that? Did you miss the quotes from Lou Lamerello about how great of a team player he is and only wants to win? His teammates in Atlanta didn't vote him in as captain for nothing.


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06-03-2010, 01:23 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Kopitar took the time to learn the defensive side. Kovalchuk still floats.
Everyone thought it was crazy that Kovalchuk was traded to the Devils because they play a defensive style. Everyone talked about how he couldn't hold his own in the defensive end and he wouldn't be able to score in that system. Despite a few games right after the trade of not producing, he still managed these stats with the Devils:

gms G A P +/-

New Jersey NHL 27 10 17 27 9


and the playoffs this year

gms G A P +/-

New Jersey NHL 5 2 4 6 0


And his final stats of the year w/ Atlanta and NJ combine:

gms G A P +/-

2009-10 Total Atl/NJ NHL 76 41 44 85 10


After he was trade to NJ, I tried to watch all their games. As I mentioned above, he didn't look great the first few games with NJ, despite getting a lot of shots on goal. Once he got back into his groove and learned the system (remember, he'd only been with Atlanta before the trade), he excelled. He didn't "float" and actually had a couple great takeaways in the defensive zone that impressed me.

I'm not one of the people that is dying to have him here (though I think it would be awesome), nor am I penciling him in like some already. I do believe that Dean will try hard to get him, but that doesn't mean he will sign here.

If you don't think our top need is a top line sniper (that's a LW to boot), you're nuts. Our 5-on-5 was terrible this past year and especially in the playoffs. I do think we need to add another D man, but not someone on a long term contract. We just need to have a gap player until Hickey/Voynov/Muzzin/Teubert, etc are ready to take the next step and be an impact player. As far as snipers in our system...zip. When is the last time a player at 27 years of age who averaged a total of 87.4 points over the past 5 season on below average teams become available for cash? I sure as hell can't think of any. Also take into account that he is a big body at 6-2 and 230lbs and averages 79 games a year.

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06-03-2010, 02:08 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
Everyone thought it was crazy that Kovalchuk was traded to the Devils because they play a defensive style. Everyone talked about how he couldn't hold his own in the defensive end and he wouldn't be able to score in that system. Despite a few games right after the trade of not producing, he still managed these stats with the Devils:

gms G A P +/-

New Jersey NHL 27 10 17 27 9


and the playoffs this year

gms G A P +/-

New Jersey NHL 5 2 4 6 0


And his final stats of the year w/ Atlanta and NJ combine:

gms G A P +/-

2009-10 Total Atl/NJ NHL 76 41 44 85 10


After he was trade to NJ, I tried to watch all their games. As I mentioned above, he didn't look great the first few games with NJ, despite getting a lot of shots on goal. Once he got back into his groove and learned the system (remember, he'd only been with Atlanta before the trade), he excelled. He didn't "float" and actually had a couple great takeaways in the defensive zone that impressed me.

I'm not one of the people that is dying to have him here (though I think it would be awesome), nor am I penciling him in like some already. I do believe that Dean will try hard to get him, but that doesn't mean he will sign here.

If you don't think our top need is a top line sniper (that's a LW to boot), you're nuts. Our 5-on-5 was terrible this past year and especially in the playoffs. I do think we need to add another D man, but not someone on a long term contract. We just need to have a gap player until Hickey/Voynov/Muzzin/Teubert, etc are ready to take the next step and be an impact player. As far as snipers in our system...zip. When is the last time a player at 27 years of age who averaged a total of 87.4 points over the past 5 season on below average teams become available for cash? I sure as hell can't think of any. Also take into account that he is a big body at 6-2 and 230lbs and averages 79 games a year.
Sure, we need a winger but I still think an upgrade on the back end and down the middle would be better.

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06-03-2010, 02:33 PM
  #85
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You know, it's not just the pieces, it's the time the pieces are available.

You don't pass on the possibility of playing one of the great duo's of all time (Kopi and Kovy) just because your future 2nd line center is 2 development years away. Or because parts of your core D is a couple of years away.

You just don't do that. When you get a chance to get an elite talent (one of the top 5 players in the world) on your core number one center / forward's wing you do everything possible to make that happen. You don't say "Gee, I wish this would have happened a couple of years from now. I guess we'll have to pass."


Last edited by Duc620: 06-03-2010 at 06:22 PM.
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06-03-2010, 02:45 PM
  #86
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What if the Kings sign Kovalchuk this season...run with pretty much the same forward units as we had last season + Ilya and Schenn

Then at the end of the season we have alot of options.

Handzus comes off the books (but his value is fair)
Williams comes off the books (overpaid)

The Kings could also move Jarret Stoll for a draft pick after the season and let Schenn take his spot after a year of learning. Or they could keep Stoll and let Handzus go (would prefer Zeus to stay)


Quick if he has a decent enough season could possibly be moved for a younger forward or a veteran second pairing d-man.

Then going into 2011-2012, when I think this team could really contend, the Kings have a lineup like this...

Kovalchuk (8) - Kopitar (6.8) - Moller (1.1)
Brown (3.1) - Schenn (900k) - Simmonds (2.2)
Richardson (1.4) - Handzus (3) - Parse (900k)
Clifford (740k) - FA/Prospect - FA/Prospect

Scratch: Westgarth (600k), Clune 700K

Doughty (6) - Scuderi (3.5)
Johnson (3.5) - FA (4.0)
Voynov (1.2) - Greene (3.0)
Drewiskie (600k)

Bernier (1.5)
Veteran backup (900k)

+ Smyth buyout 3.0 mill

Total 58.44 million
---------------------------

That puts the Kings at the very edge of the cap, I did my best guesses on what Doughty, JJ and Simmonds might get next summer, hoping Zues re-signs for three, but if he won't we could always keep Stoll who has a slightly lower cap hit than Zues.

That does not include any bonuses for Schenn, but apparently his bonuses will be pretty much non-achievable so he can get into the lineup quicker.

Would love to keep Smyth as a 2nd liner, but just no way its going to work, not at 6 million. And no one is going to take him in a trade unless its something like Smyth + decent prospect for a draft pick, his salary is just too bad, and it will be even worse next summer. So if Ilya signs we can afford Smyth for this coming year, but not for 2012

I know Moller on the first line won't be a popular choice, but he has a nice shot and good hands and will find space playing with those two superstars, Loktionov could also fill this role if he beats out Moller

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06-03-2010, 02:53 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
What if the Kings sign Kovalchuk this season...run with pretty much the same forward units as we had last season + Ilya and Schenn

Then at the end of the season we have alot of options.

Handzus comes off the books (but his value is fair)
Williams comes off the books (overpaid)

The Kings could also move Jarret Stoll for a draft pick after the season and let Schenn take his spot after a year of learning. Or they could keep Stoll and let Handzus go (would prefer Zeus to stay)


Quick if he has a decent enough season could possibly be moved for a younger forward or a veteran second pairing d-man.

Then going into 2011-2012, when I think this team could really contend, the Kings have a lineup like this...

Kovalchuk (8) - Kopitar (6.8) - Moller (1.1)
Brown (3.1) - Schenn (900k) - Simmonds (2.2)
Richardson (1.4) - Handzus (3) - Parse (900k)
Clifford (740k) - FA/Prospect - FA/Prospect

Scratch: Westgarth (600k), Clune 700K

Doughty (6) - Scuderi (3.5)
Johnson (3.5) - FA (4.0)
Voynov (1.2) - Greene (3.0)
Drewiskie (600k)

Bernier (1.5)
Veteran backup (900k)

+ Smyth buyout 3.0 mill

Total 58.44 million
---------------------------

That puts the Kings at the very edge of the cap, I did my best guesses on what Doughty, JJ and Simmonds might get next summer, hoping Zues re-signs for three, but if he won't we could always keep Stoll who has a slightly lower cap hit than Zues.

That does not include any bonuses for Schenn, but apparently his bonuses will be pretty much non-achievable so he can get into the lineup quicker.

Would love to keep Smyth as a 2nd liner, but just no way its going to work, not at 6 million. And no one is going to take him in a trade unless its something like Smyth + decent prospect for a draft pick, his salary is just too bad, and it will be even worse next summer. So if Ilya signs we can afford Smyth for this coming year, but not for 2012

I know Moller on the first line won't be a popular choice, but he has a nice shot and good hands and will find space playing with those two superstars,
Loktionov could also fill this role if he beats out Moller
Wow, you apparently like Moller more than I do. And believe me, I like Moller. I do think that Moller needs quality ice time to show what he can do. Having said that, I much prefer Simmonds on the first line over Moller. Kovy-Kopi-Simmonds line just screams success for years to come. Maybe Moller can replace Parse on the third line or perhaps share time there.

Remember, Brown doesn't play LW. So, we can't have both Simmonds and Brown on the same line.

Personally, I would like to add another winger, whether it'd be from FA or trade but adding another top 6 or at very least, top 9 wing would be ideal.

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06-03-2010, 03:00 PM
  #88
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Wow, you apparently like Moller more than I do. And believe me, I like Moller. I do think that Moller needs quality ice time to show what he can do. Having said that, I much prefer Simmonds on the first line over Moller. Kovy-Kopi-Simmonds line just screams success for years to come. Maybe Moller can replace Parse on the third line or perhaps share time there.

Remember, Brown doesn't play LW. So, we can't have both Simmonds and Brown on the same line.

Personally, I would like to add another winger, whether it'd be from FA or trade but adding another top 6 or at very least, top 9 wing would be ideal.
A new trend in the NHL is playing younger/cheaper players with star players to add balance to the lines, that is what I was doing here, much like Ottawa did with Peter Regan playing with Spezza and Alfredsson

If you have Simmonds on the #1 line is really weakens the second line.

Trust me, going through this was painful, the Kings life would be so much easier right now if the Ryan Smyth trade had never been made. Preissing would be coming off the books after next season, we would not have this gaping hole on defense with Quincey and we would have all of the money spent on Smyth to actually use towards Kovalchuk, Doughty, Simmonds and Johnson.

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06-03-2010, 03:07 PM
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A new trend in the NHL is playing younger/cheaper players with star players to add balance to the lines, that is what I was doing here, much like Ottawa did with Peter Regan playing with Spezza and Alfredsson

If you have Simmonds on the #1 line is really weakens the second line.

Trust me, going through this was painful, the Kings life would be so much easier right now if the Ryan Smyth trade had never been made. Preissing would be coming off the books after next season, we would not have this gaping hole on defense with Quincey and we would have all of the money spent on Smyth to actually use towards Kovalchuk, Doughty, Simmonds and Johnson.
What? The Kings wouldn't have made the playoffs without Smyth and everyone would be screaming for DL to be fired. The loss of Smyth was a huge reason why Kopitar tapered off.

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06-03-2010, 03:11 PM
  #90
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What? The Kings wouldn't have made the playoffs without Smyth and everyone would be screaming for DL to be fired.
Took the words right out of my mouth. Smyth's 53 points and +8 rating in 67 games was huge for us. When healthy, Smyth was a big part of, not only our PP and 1st line, but our locker room. Guys learned from Smyth last year, which might be a greater value than his 53 points. I don't understand why people all of the sudden are turning on Smyth. He was a big reason for the Kings success this year.

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06-03-2010, 03:15 PM
  #91
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What? The Kings wouldn't have made the playoffs without Smyth and everyone would be screaming for DL to be fired.
You might be right, you might not. And yes making the playoffs was important to the team, but if the Kings can't fit Kovalchuk into the plans, you can thank this trade.

The Kings could have probably acquired a cheaper alternative, perhaps a FA to be or atleast someone with a shorter term on the contract.

Or what they really should have done is just paid Marian Gaborik, he would have scored 50 goals last year on our team, our elite scoring winger problem would be solved, Quincey and JJ would be our 2nd defense pair and the team would be a lot closer to the Cup and still well within the cap.

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06-03-2010, 03:17 PM
  #92
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Took the words right out of my mouth. Smyth's 53 points and +8 rating in 67 games was huge for us. When healthy, Smyth was a big part of, not only our PP and 1st line, but our locker room. Guys learned from Smyth last year, which might be a greater value than his 53 points. I don't understand why people all of the sudden are turning on Smyth. He was a big reason for the Kings success this year.
Because he is making 6 million a year!

Would you rather have Gaborik at 7.5 mill and still have Quincey or get Ryan Smyth?

I appreciate what Smyth did before the Olympic break, but he is grossly overpaid. And still has two years left. And it very well might prevent us from getting Kovalchuk this summer.

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06-03-2010, 03:18 PM
  #93
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You might be right, you might not. And yes making the playoffs was important to the team, but if the Kings can't fit Kovalchuk into the plans, you can thank this trade.

The Kings could have probably acquired a cheaper alternative, perhaps a FA to be or atleast someone with a shorter term on the contract.

Or what they really should have done is just paid Marian Gaborik, he would have scored 50 goals last year on our team, our elite scoring winger problem would be solved, Quincey and JJ would be our 2nd defense pair and the team would be a lot closer to the Cup and still well within the cap.
Gaborik isn't that presence the Kings needed in the locker room and won't pay the price for those dirty goals Smyth scores.
Gaborik wouldn't have made Kopitar better like Smyth did.
You gotta crawl before you can walk.

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06-03-2010, 03:21 PM
  #94
JBernierFan
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Because he is making 6 million a year!

Would you rather have Gaborik at 7.5 mill and still have Quincey or get Ryan Smyth?

I appreciate what Smyth did before the Olympic break, but he is grossly overpaid. And still has two years left. And it very well might prevent us from getting Kovalchuk this summer.
And if Gaborik would have gotten hurt this year and missed most of it at 7.5 mill people would have wanted Dean fired. Who's to say he would have stayed healthy on our team? Or that he would have scored as many goals as he did on the Rangers.

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06-03-2010, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Kovalchuk (8) - Kopitar (6.8) - Moller (1.1)
Brown (3.1) - Schenn (900k) - Simmonds (2.2)
Richardson (1.4) - Handzus (3) - Parse (900k)
Clifford (740k) - FA/Prospect - FA/Prospect

Scratch: Westgarth (600k), Clune 700K

Doughty (6) - Scuderi (3.5)
Johnson (3.5) - FA (4.0)
Voynov (1.2) - Greene (3.0)
Drewiskie (600k)

Bernier (1.5)
Veteran backup (900k)

+ Smyth buyout 3.0 mill

Total 58.44 million
---------------------------
I like the lineup in general, but here's a few of my thoughts on differences that need to be accounted for:

The FA/Prospect boxes still need a $600k cap hit each for your forward lines. ($1.2mm total)

Quick's $1.8mm magically disappeared - I doubt DL trades him for draft picks and a bag of pucks.

Doughty will make more than Kopitar.

I doubt Smyth gets bought out. While his cap hit is high, his actual salary is $4mm. From a cash perspective, the Kings would spend $4mm to buy him out, plus $1 - 4mm to replace him on the roster. That's $5-8mm in cash to manipulate $2mm net in cap space (Smyth's net gain of $3mm + $1mm for replacement), ie, there's no real cash / cap incentive in doing so. Besides, Smyth's production will probably be in line with that $1-$4mm replacement anyway.

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06-03-2010, 03:26 PM
  #96
The Black1963
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Because he is making 6 million a year!

Would you rather have Gaborik at 7.5 mill and still have Quincey or get Ryan Smyth?

I appreciate what Smyth did before the Olympic break, but he is grossly overpaid. And still has two years left. And it very well might prevent us from getting Kovalchuk this summer.
Yeah, Smyth is overpaid but at 6.25M, I don't think it's that bad. The guy still has value and will be a solid 2nd line LW for at least 1 more year. However, I'm definitely open to upgrading if possible.

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06-03-2010, 03:29 PM
  #97
Herby
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Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
And if Gaborik would have gotten hurt this year and missed most of it at 7.5 mill people would have wanted Dean fired. Who's to say he would have stayed healthy on our team? Or that he would have scored as many goals as he did on the Rangers.
Your injury point is valid, but to say he wouldn't have produced is ludicrous. Marian Gaborik is one of the elite players in the NHL. He spent almost his entire career playing in Jacques Lemaire's pathetic boring system with little offensive help and still put up amazing numbers.

He would have been absolutely magic playing with Kopitar and imagine the Kings PP for years to come with Kopitar, Doughty, Gaborik and Johnson.

Kings potential lineup last season if they had signed Gaborik...

Gaborik - Kopitar -Williams
Frolov - Stoll - Brown
Richardson - Handzus- Simmonds

Doughty- Scuderi
Johnson- Quincey
OD- Greene

I think thats a much much stronger team than we had this season.

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06-03-2010, 03:37 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Your injury point is valid, but to say he wouldn't have produced is ludicrous. Marian Gaborik is one of the elite players in the NHL. He spent almost his entire career playing in Jacques Lemaire's pathetic boring system with little offensive help and still put up amazing numbers.

He would have been absolutely magic playing with Kopitar and imagine the Kings PP for years to come with Kopitar, Doughty, Gaborik and Johnson.

Kings potential lineup last season if they had signed Gaborik...

Gaborik - Kopitar -Williams
Frolov - Stoll - Brown
Richardson - Handzus- Simmonds

Doughty- Scuderi
Johnson- Quincey
OD- Greene

I think thats a much much stronger team than we had this season.

It is much stronger. Smyth is a scrub. I can't wait till he is gone.

however I still can appreciate what his presence did for our youth.

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06-03-2010, 03:45 PM
  #99
Herby
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Originally Posted by SkoalMan11 View Post
It is much stronger. Smyth is a scrub. I can't wait till he is gone.

however I still can appreciate what his presence did for our youth.
I don't think he is a scrub, I just think he has the worst contract on the team, by quite a large margin. He is a 2nd line player who is paid like a star forward, which he clearly isn't. In a capped league you just cannot pay 6.2 million for a 2nd liner.

Even if he was signed through only this season it would be bad, but ok. The fact that he is signed through 2012 when Doughty, JJ and Simmonds cap hits are going to rise significantly is what makes it really bad.

Just crunching these numbers I just have a hard time seeing how we can fit Kovalchuk, Doughty, JJ and Simmonds while staying under the cap with Smyth's deal.

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06-03-2010, 04:06 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
What? The Kings wouldn't have made the playoffs without Smyth and everyone would be screaming for DL to be fired. The loss of Smyth was a huge reason why Kopitar tapered off.
Agreed.

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