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Old
06-21-2010, 01:01 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by I am The Mush View Post
If we're only talking statistically and not about actual ability, I don't think you're that crazy.
I should've specified but yes, I was talking about statistically.

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06-21-2010, 01:03 AM
  #52
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I just wanted to weigh in on the hip injury front. I am a Biomedical Engineer, with a concentration in Biomechanics. I am currently trying to find out the specifics of his hip injury and surgery.

But we can't compare this to Emery as his condition of avascular necrosis, where there was a lack of blood flow, and bone actually died and decayed. Most people who aren't of professional athlete build are lucky to be able to walk after this surgery.

Now, I believe Niity's condition was a case of femoroacetabular impingement. Which is essentially the head of the femur or the hip socket is in some way irregular and not perfectly rounded as it should be. J.S. Giguere had this issue and since his surgery has not had any further issues that I know of, essentially the doctor goes in and sands down whatever the impinged surface is and resets the hip.

Also, while I am on the soapbox, if you have a young goaltender, please, PLEASE, refrain from teaching them the butterfly method until they are lanky enough for it to be effective. If you check out the little chart in the PPT I made, please notice the correlation in age learned and hip surgery. If your kid isn't going to be an NHL goalie, he is still going to live with the stress on his hips, and not have a million dollar contract or specialist like Phillipon to fall back on...

For reference, here is a basic PPT I did on the issues with Butterfly goaltending from a Biomechanics point of view: http://docs.google.com/present/embed...49_263g558h7dm

Also this is a great article from SI about the issues goaltenders have had as well: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...ies/index.html

And if you really want to get educated, an article on the surgery from the doctor who pioneered it and has worked on many professional athletes, the most recent one being A-Rod, IIRC: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1950586/
Good stuff man.

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06-21-2010, 01:04 AM
  #53
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I'm sure Niittymaki is itching to come to a place that he was passed up for being a start twice on.

Once over a Mr. Robert Esche, mind you.

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06-21-2010, 05:36 AM
  #54
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Eklund sucks and all, but would it supprise anyone if Nitty signed in Philly?

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06-21-2010, 07:36 AM
  #55
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Would seeing what Tampa wants for Mike Smith be a considerable option? I mean looking at the guy's stats, his GAA is not so good but his sv% looks okay.
I like Smith but his health is also a huge question. He makes what like 3.5mm wih year or 2 to go? Tampa i think would move him for next to nothing.

nitty,biron,leighton. Christ i would ratehr have a 45 year old Dominick Hasek at this point

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06-21-2010, 07:39 AM
  #56
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I would prefer both Biron and Nitty to Leighton. Nitty's hips do scare me though. As many have said, I'm not so sure he can handle full time duty.

It's funny how thrilled I'd be with a Biron and Nitty combination again haha (as opposed to what we had this year).

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06-21-2010, 07:42 AM
  #57
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I don't think Niitty would think of this as the team that wouldn't give him a chance. There's a new coach and a new goalie coach so that should make all the difference to him. I think goalies realize there are only so many jobs available and they'll take what they can get.

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06-21-2010, 07:52 AM
  #58
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I was suspecting that it was a fhdgrttjfff of the jfjfhshthfffff but femoroacetabular impingement makes sense too.

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06-21-2010, 07:58 AM
  #59
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The only thing that makes sense is the fact they're familiar with him. He'd have to be making less than Boucher, and the Boucher would need to be traded or dumped (which I don't see Holmgren wanting to waive him) if Niittymaki is going to be the backup. He had a very good year this year, which is funny considering Holmgren felt he was damaged goods and, assuming this rumor is valid, would now want him back. There's a few gettable goalies who if we had them this past season, would have won with.

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06-21-2010, 07:59 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by DMadd View Post
Eklund sucks and all, but would it supprise anyone if Nitty signed in Philly?
Yes, I think that ship has sailed. And Holmgren specifically called Nitty "damaged goods" last year, and stated that he didn't trade him because he felt it would be dishonest on his part. One halfway decent year in Tampa changes that?

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06-21-2010, 08:19 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jd2210 View Post
I was suspecting that it was a fhdgrttjfff of the jfjfhshthfffff but femoroacetabular impingement makes sense too.
Same thing. That is Icelandic for femoroacetabular impingement.

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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Yes, I think that ship has sailed. And Holmgren specifically called Nitty "damaged goods" last year, and stated that he didn't trade him because he felt it would be dishonest on his part. One halfway decent year in Tampa changes that?
I don't think it would stop Niitty from coming back (that's not like a comment on him personally or anything), though I don't know if we would be his first choice. I think Holmgren would be the reason that didn't happen.

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06-21-2010, 08:20 AM
  #62
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There are about 10 guys I'd rather have than Nitty as our starter that avail July 1 or sooner. Injury prone and inconsistent? No thanks.

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06-21-2010, 08:23 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by I am The Mush View Post
I don't think it would stop Niitty from coming back (that's not like a comment on him personally or anything), though I don't know if we would be his first choice. I think Holmgren would be the reason that didn't happen.
Yeah, I'd hope there aren't hurt personal feelings... but at the same time, it was pretty clear that Holmgren felt he was no longer a reliable solution in net anymore. It would be relatively illogical to let one halfway decent year in Tampa (where he notably wore down over the course of the season) change your perception of a guy you had in house for all those years.

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06-21-2010, 08:26 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by jd2210 View Post
There are about 10 guys I'd rather have than Nitty as our starter that avail July 1 or sooner. Injury prone and inconsistent? No thanks.
Well, remember we apparently have a decent goaltending coach. When Niittymaki was here in 2009, and was having trouble with rebounds, he told he media that he "doesn't know what else to do."

I think with Jeff Reese as the new goaltending coach, Holmgren might be more apt to entertain even more so about bringing back guys to play goal. I say this because when Niittymaki and Robert Esche first came here, rebound control was a big strength and by the time they left they would leave rebounds of beach balls out by the blueline.

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06-21-2010, 08:27 AM
  #65
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06-21-2010, 08:30 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Well, remember we apparently have a decent goaltending coach. When Niittymaki was here in 2009, and was having trouble with rebounds, he told he media that he "doesn't know what else to do."

I think with Jeff Reese as the new goaltending coach, Holmgren might be more apt to entertain even more so about bringing back guys to play goal. I say this because when Niittymaki and Robert Esche first came here, rebound control was a big strength and by the time they left they would leave rebounds of beach balls out by the blueline.
No it wasn't. Nitty was a technical mess and all over the place when he first got here, and improved a bit towards the end. Esche's rebound control was always bad, he was just playing on a very good team at first, and it was the good ole days when the defense could mug people around the net and nullify the rebound problem. Esche was also hurt by them taking away some of his padding, because he basically just relied on the puck hitting him.

In other news, I love the "Jeff Reese is the messiah" meme around here. I have yet to see an explanation for why the goaltending was *ing awful in Tampa Bay under his tutelage after Khabi left.

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06-21-2010, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
In other news, I love the "Jeff Reese is the messiah" meme around here. I have yet to see an explanation for why the goaltending was *ing awful in Tampa Bay under his tutelage after Khabi left.
Exactly.

Yes, Jeff Reese seemed to help Leighton, a career journeyman who needed to save his career; but that doesn't mean the guy can make every goalie he ever coaches a better goalie. Some goalies have specific flaws that are easily correctable. Some goalies are more coachable than others.

One instance does not a trend make.

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06-21-2010, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
Exactly.

Yes, Jeff Reese seemed to help Leighton, a career journeyman who needed to save his career; but that doesn't mean the guy can make every goalie he ever coaches a better goalie. Some goalies have specific flaws that are easily correctable. Some goalies are more coachable than others.

One instance does not a trend make.
QFT.

Jeff Reese's job with Leighton was really, really easy. The problems that Esche and Niitty had with good rebound control are not as easily corrected as telling Leighton to stop coming out too far and sliding himself into no man's land.

And certain goaltenders and styles work well with certain coaches, it's not like a given coach can take any goalie and fix their game. Some goalies play differently and have different nuances that Reese may/not be as familiar with, which affects his ability to understand and improve their game as well.

Reese > Lemelin, but he's not god.



Also, nice avy.

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06-21-2010, 08:56 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
In other news, I love the "Jeff Reese is the messiah" meme around here. I have yet to see an explanation for why the goaltending was *ing awful in Tampa Bay under his tutelage after Khabi left.

Well....just ask them (everyone else are the ones telling us this). He's been light years better than Reggie Lemelin. When you look at who they had, there wasn't much hope to begin with. However, Khabibulin improved under him, I think they just need someone legitimate.

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06-21-2010, 08:58 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by DUHockey9 View Post
Exactly.

Yes, Jeff Reese seemed to help Leighton, a career journeyman who needed to save his career; but that doesn't mean the guy can make every goalie he ever coaches a better goalie. Some goalies have specific flaws that are easily correctable. Some goalies are more coachable than others.

One instance does not a trend make.
Quote:
Originally Posted by infidelappel View Post
QFT.

Jeff Reese's job with Leighton was really, really easy. The problems that Esche and Niitty had with good rebound control are not as easily corrected as telling Leighton to stop coming out too far and sliding himself into no man's land.

And certain goaltenders and styles work well with certain coaches, it's not like a given coach can take any goalie and fix their game. Some goalies play differently and have different nuances that Reese may/not be as familiar with, which affects his ability to understand and improve their game as well.

Reese > Lemelin, but he's not god.



Also, nice avy.
The other problem is that the "fix" for Leighton is a massive Catch-22. Leighton's problem before was that he would go out to challenge and lacked the athleticism/quickness to get back into position after he left a rebound. So, what do you do... move him back in the net a bit. Problem then is that shooters have a bit better angle, and it doesn't actually solve the rebound problem.

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06-21-2010, 08:59 AM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
No it wasn't. Nitty was a technical mess and all over the place when he first got here, and improved a bit towards the end. Esche's rebound control was always bad, he was just playing on a very good team at first, and it was the good ole days when the defense could mug people around the net and nullify the rebound problem. Esche was also hurt by them taking away some of his padding, because he basically just relied on the puck hitting him.

In other news, I love the "Jeff Reese is the messiah" meme around here. I have yet to see an explanation for why the goaltending was *ing awful in Tampa Bay under his tutelage after Khabi left.
Because his goalies were ****ing awful. You can only polish a turd so much, and even then, it's just a shiny turd. His results last year have me feeling pretty confident that he's not hurting anything. Messiah status can't be granted until he successfully teaches Boucher how execute a butterfly slide and a leg extension from the butterfly (as opposed to falling over like the friggin leaning tower of Piza and trying to cover the entire net with your glove).

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06-21-2010, 09:00 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Well....just ask them (everyone else are the ones telling us this). He's been light years better than Reggie Lemelin. When you look at who they had, there wasn't much hope to begin with. However, Khabibulin improved under him, I think they just need someone legitimate.
Yeah... about that, folks tend to be positive when they talk about people they work with.

And, has he been better than Lemelin? Lemelin got great goaltending out of Biron and Nitty the last couple of years. He got great seasons out of a collage of marginal goalies over the years. Lemelin didn't deserve the criticism he got around here, and Reese doesn't deserve the praise he's gotten of late either.

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06-21-2010, 09:02 AM
  #73
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Because his goalies were ****ing awful. You can only polish a turd so much, and even then, it's just a shiny turd. His results last year have me feeling pretty confident that he's not hurting anything.
If you're that good a coach, you shouldn't be in charge of the worst goaltending in the league over a few seasons.

Sure it was a turd, but there wasn't any polish on it. They weren't bad, they were the worst in the league. And now he's a miracle worker... well, where was the miracle down there?

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06-21-2010, 09:04 AM
  #74
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i think we have enough backup goalies.

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06-21-2010, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by I am The Mush View Post
Because his goalies were ****ing awful. You can only polish a turd so much, and even then, it's just a shiny turd. His results last year have me feeling pretty confident that he's not hurting anything. Messiah status can't be granted until he successfully teaches Boucher how execute a butterfly slide and a leg extension from the butterfly (as opposed to falling over like the friggin leaning tower of Piza and trying to cover the entire net with your glove).
He got something out of a Leighton turd.

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