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Enver Lisin not given QO

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:13 PM
  #51
Bluenote13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mouth View Post
Trading up to get a prelim Lauri Crapikowski was the first mistake

Giving a very marginal player a silly nickname by the fans was the second

Trading him to phoenix was addition by subtraction.

Trading him for The Enver Lisin project was doomed because "projects" never works in Rangerland

Especially with a coach who had the nads to make Lisin sit on the bench for a whole entire game and not log one second of ice time.
So we could make room for Brian Boyle, Aaron Clueless, and the other cast of scrubs?? Yeah great additions, good call Captain Video.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:19 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mouth View Post
Trading up to get a prelim Lauri Crapikowski was the first mistake

Giving a very marginal player a silly nickname by the fans was the second

Trading him to phoenix was addition by subtraction.

Trading him for The Enver Lisin project was doomed because "projects" never works in Rangerland

Especially with a coach who had the nads to make Lisin sit on the bench for a whole entire game and not log one second of ice time.
i was never a fan of the Korpedo pick at the time, with that said he was a very useful player and it made no sense whatsoever to trade him for a project.

Lisin, imho, was given FAR too many chances to prove himself. from game 1 of the preseason he never looked like an NHLer to me, maybe 3 times in the entire year did he play well enough to even look like he belonged. the only thing he had was speed. it was like watching a hyper kid running around like a chicken with its head cut off not knowing what the hell to do out there.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:20 PM
  #53
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Neither Korp, or Lisin were any good any way. Have fun In the KHL Enver.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:21 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I'm talking about Sather handling his assets, not the way they were brought along.
The assets were worth practically nothing. Being former first round picks means nothing when you've either sucked or haven't lived up to that potential.

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We traded one guy he didn't like for another guy he didn't like. He didn't like Korpikosi, but coach of the year candidate Tippett thinks he's one of his teams valuable players. Guess Torts knew he wouldn't be able to get the best out of him, same with Lisin.

Wonderful management.
Like I said, there were rumors that Korpikoski wasn't going to re-sign with the Rangers

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:36 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Who's crying? Sather wasted another 1st round pick with nothing to show for it, thats the main point no?

A wasted asset is a wasted asset. That Makes 3 1st rounders(montoya, Jessiman, Korpikoski) with absolutely NOTHING to show for it. I can't think of any recent teams that have ZERO assets after giving up 3 1st rounders in trades.

Absolutely dreadful management you'd expect from a novice GM.
To be fair, how many teams can say that in the past decade, they've had 3 or less first rounders turn into nothing? The draft is kind of a crap chute, especially outside of the top 5.

What was he really going to turn Korpikoski into? Lisin was the best value you could've asked for, it was a project player that showed some promise with 13 goals in 47 games. If he would've panned out, that's a top 6 player coming from a 4th line player being dealt.

And he did turn Montoya and Hossa into Sjostrom, who was pretty solid for us.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:37 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
The assets were worth practically nothing. Being former first round picks means nothing when you've either sucked or haven't lived up to that potential.



Like I said, there were rumors that Korpikoski wasn't going to re-sign with the Rangers
Sure they were worth something if teams were willing to trade for them. Hell, a 5th round draft pick would've been better than Lisin. There were no facts about that rumor at all unless you know something we don't.

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06-22-2010, 03:40 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Hell, a 5th round draft pick would've been better than Lisin.
This isn't true at all, and it's really easy to say in hindsight.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:42 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post

What was he really going to turn Korpikoski into
? .
Maybe one of our more valuable players like Tippett did.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:44 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Maybe one of our more valuable players like Tippett did.
i think you're overrating korp's season a bit there.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:44 PM
  #60
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I'm not that bent out of shape about this turn of events, but I can certainly see why some people would be. Sather (and Maloney, to a certain extent) did a bunch of things wrong, from the Korpikoski pick to the trade itself. Yet another example of bad drafting followed by poor asset management. A bunch of bad decisions were made and now we have nothing to show for it.

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Old
06-22-2010, 03:45 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
This isn't true at all, and it's really easy to say in hindsight.
Actually, I contested this trade the day it happened on these very boards

"Oh you should see his skating, and he's fast, did ya know he could skate?"

YEah, I knew. And I knew two teams who had already given up on him.

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06-22-2010, 03:51 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
i think you're overrating korp's season a bit there.
He was one of the players early on that had to find a niche on our team, and probably that shyness is something that worked against him early. But he figured out that if he works hard to get himself a role on this team he could be a very valuable player, that's where hes come to.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/JimGintonio/79502

His coach says it and I agree.

The kids a winner, he's just not as flashy as the Enver Lisin's of the world.

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Old
06-22-2010, 04:09 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
lisin is gone and it was expected. he was waived so that was the end right there. he was unable to do whatever it was that torts needed him to do for him to play.
So, he was unable to play hockey?

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06-22-2010, 04:10 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Sure they were worth something if teams were willing to trade for them. Hell, a 5th round draft pick would've been better than Lisin. There were no facts about that rumor at all unless you know something we don't.
Sure, that's true, but I liked the move when it was made. Lisin's upside was huge. All the tools but no toolbox. Sometimes those players learn to play, sometimes they don't.

I'm glad we took the risk and I'd probably of done it again. Korpedo was a dime a dozen player. It's worth losing a player like that on a chance to hit a home run. We can find Korpedos every year in free agency for under a million a season.

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06-22-2010, 04:20 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Sure, that's true, but I liked the move when it was made. Lisin's upside was huge. All the tools but no toolbox. Sometimes those players learn to play, sometimes they don't.

I'm glad we took the risk and I'd probably of done it again. Korpedo was a dime a dozen player. It's worth losing a player like that on a chance to hit a home run. We can find Korpedos every year in free agency for under a million a season.
Poor asset management

And I'll take Tippetts words every time over yours

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06-22-2010, 04:28 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Poor asset management

And I'll take Tippetts words every time over yours
Don't really care. Don't see how it's poor asset management at all. We trade a dime a dozen player for a home run swing.

You gotta pay to play.

And a coach praising one of his own players? Real shocker there.

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Old
06-22-2010, 04:39 PM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Don't really care. Don't see how it's poor asset management at all. We trade a dime a dozen player for a home run swing.

You gotta pay to play.

And a coach praising one of his own players? Real shocker there.
That's really the bottom line. I don't see how it can be looked at any other way.

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06-22-2010, 04:40 PM
  #68
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So if we now drop Voros we will all be happy

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06-22-2010, 04:42 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Don't really care. Don't see how it's poor asset management at all. We trade a dime a dozen player for a home run swing.

You gotta pay to play.

And a coach praising one of his own players? Real shocker there.
Well, ya never gonna hear that from Torts about Lisin now, so I think the coaches quote is relevant, more so than you just labeling him a dime a dozen.

Cup teams don't win with dime a dozens, they win with WINNERS. From the guy skating 30 MPG to the guy who takes his 1 shift per period - you still need guys with winning attitudes, not just some guy who fills a slot. LK does that, plus he plays multiple forward positions, PK, and is way more successful in shootouts than any of our 3rd liners.

Brian Boyle filled a need, guess that makes that trade worth it, or would you want a measly 3rd rounder this friday, after all, 3rd rounders tend to be dime a dozen players

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06-22-2010, 04:46 PM
  #70
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My objection is that I never thought Lisin was a home run swing.

He was a second round pick who was never even a dynamic AHL forward and somehow we thought that was a swing for the fences?

Heck I'd rather have kept Korpikoki has a bottom six forward, at least he could play that role.

I felt (and argued) that Lisin's one angle was his offense and even that was never enough to carry him to a top six forward spot.

In the end I was one of those who was never in love with Lisin's "potential" in the first place.

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06-22-2010, 04:52 PM
  #71
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Torts didn't like him... Whom, the hell, does he like? Callahan? Anisismov?
Seriously, name me young player he is good with.

Sad, all I can say... Torts cannot teach anyone anything. We are doomed.

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06-22-2010, 04:53 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Well, ya never gonna hear that from Torts about Lisin now, so I think the coaches quote is relevant, more so than you just labeling him a dime a dozen.

Cup teams don't win with dime a dozens, they win with WINNERS. From the guy skating 30 MPG to the guy who takes his 1 shift per period - you still need guys with winning attitudes, not just some guy who fills a slot. LK does that, plus he plays multiple forward positions, PK, and is way more successful in shootouts than any of our 3rd liners.

Brian Boyle filled a need, guess that makes that trade worth it, or would you want a measly 3rd rounder this friday, after all, 3rd rounders tend to be dime a dozen players
Let me know when Phoenix wins the Cup.

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06-22-2010, 04:54 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 94now View Post
Torts didn't like him... Whom, the hell, does he like? Callahan? Anisismov?
Seriously, name me young player he is good with.

Sad, all I can say... Torts cannot teach anyone anything. We are doomed.
He's good with:

Dubinsky, Anisimov, Callahan, Staal and Girardi. All of these players were better at the end of the year than at the beginning of it.

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06-22-2010, 04:56 PM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
My objection is that I never thought Lisin was a home run swing.

He was a second round pick who was never even a dynamic AHL forward and somehow we thought that was a swing for the fences?

Heck I'd rather have kept Korpikoki has a bottom six forward, at least he could play that role.

I felt (and argued) that Lisin's one angle was his offense and even that was never enough to carry him to a top six forward spot.

In the end I was one of those who was never in love with Lisin's "potential" in the first place.
Lisin was a home run swing, in my opinion, because he's the tools with no toolbox guy. His upside was that as a good top 6 player. A 60 point guy or so. He was a second round pick because of the lack of a toolbox. Sometimes these guys learn it, sometimes these guys don't.

I was fine moving a spare part like Korpedo for him due to us having the ability to find a guy with the lack of upside of Korpedo more than to find a guy with the upside of Lisin.

Korpedo was gone after the year, anyway. At least the rumors were such.

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Old
06-22-2010, 04:56 PM
  #75
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Korpikoski wasn't happy here and was gone one way or another. If Sather didn't trade him, he was going to the KHL. You're not going to get a whole lot for a player who's already got one foot out the door.

Lisin was in the same boat in Phoenix.

The Rangers were going to lose Korpikoski for nothing. They got a year out of Lisin, which may not have resulted in much on the ice, but was huge help in the development and acclimatization of one of their top prospects off it. WIN.

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