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Old
06-24-2010, 11:49 AM
  #26
Miller Time
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Gomez's two cup rings say hello to Marleau and the Chokes, I mean the Sharks.


gomez was a passenger on those cup winning teams, not a go-to guy. What has he done, results and production wise, since he signed his "go-to-guy" contract?

diddly squat.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
Pavelski=Plekanec. Plekanec at 4.5 for 5 years with no NTC would had make more sense
plekanec @ 3.5-4M for 4 years would have made the most sense... but our management team wasn't sure enough to sign him long-term as an RFA.

Pavelski as an RFA gets 4M, as a UFA this year he would easily have signed for 5M.

how is it that so many people fail to understand the negotiation difference between RFA's and UFA's?

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06-24-2010, 11:49 AM
  #27
dd
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Pavelski at 4 mil, 4 years much better than Pleks higher no trade contract.
Pavelski > Plekanec hands down re contract.
Marleau overpaid, but then again, just look at Gomez' contract!!

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06-24-2010, 11:51 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by dd View Post
Pavelski at 4 mil, 4 years much better than Pleks higher no trade contract.
Pavelski > Plekanec hands down re contract.
Marleau overpaid, but then again, just look at Gomez' contract!!
was Pavelski a RFA?

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06-24-2010, 11:56 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post


gomez was a passenger on those cup winning teams, not a go-to guy. What has he done, results and production wise, since he signed his "go-to-guy" contract?

diddly squat.




plekanec @ 3.5-4M for 4 years would have made the most sense... but our management team wasn't sure enough to sign him long-term as an RFA.

Pavelski as an RFA gets 4M, as a UFA this year he would easily have signed for 5M.

how is it that so many people fail to understand the negotiation difference between RFA's and UFA's?
he was 2nd and 3rd in points in 99-2000 and '02-'03 respectively.

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06-24-2010, 12:03 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
Pavelski=Plekanec. Plekanec at 4.5 for 5 years with no NTC would had make more sense
Pavelski's RFA and isn't giving up his UFA years, he'll be worth Pleks money or more when he gets to UFA time, most likely. In the meantime UFAs get more than RFAs, all things being equal otherwise, so it's not a fair comparison.

Marleau at 7 compared to Pleks at 5 seems about right. Both are getting a bit more than they're worth, maybe, but also quite possibly a bit less than they'd have gotten on the open market. The simple fact is there is a dramatic shortage of quality UFAs, especially top 6 forwards.

IMO that Cammallari signing just looks better and better though.

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06-24-2010, 12:05 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
he was 2nd and 3rd in points in 99-2000 and '02-'03 respectively.
Stop it with your logic. Logic doesn't mean anything on these boards.

Points in playoffs = coasting. Just ask Kane.

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06-24-2010, 12:07 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by CrimsonSkorpion View Post
Stop it with your logic. Logic doesn't mean anything on these boards.

Points in playoffs = coasting. Just ask Kane.
I'm not some huge gomez fan, actually i'm really hoping we can ditch his contract in the next year (doubtful), but to say he was a passenger on those teams is ludicrous. I also think anyone who doesn't look at the injuries to our forward core this past season as an excuse for poor performances early on need their heads examined.

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06-24-2010, 12:08 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
he was 2nd and 3rd in points in 99-2000 and '02-'03 respectively.
Internet dont like fact..stop it please

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06-24-2010, 12:09 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
he was 2nd and 3rd in points in 99-2000 and '02-'03 respectively.
lol, what? he finishes with 12 points those playoffs and the season with 55. what are you talking about?

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06-24-2010, 12:10 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
I'm not some huge gomez fan, actually i'm really hoping we can ditch his contract in the next year (doubtful), but to say he was a passenger on those teams is ludicrous. I also think anyone who doesn't look at the injuries to our forward core this past season as an excuse for poor performances early on need their heads examined.
Trust me, I'm on the same side as you.

Gomez's contract is putrid, I don't think anyone can argue that. To trade him would simply be a move of ditching his contract and not a knock at the player he is. He's good during the season, a solid playmaker and in the playoffs he's an absolute warrior. But unfortunately, his unbelievably ridiculous contract puts on these beer goggles on fans of the team and they become drunk with rage and forget completely about the contributions.

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06-24-2010, 12:10 PM
  #36
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lol, what? he finishes with 12 points those playoffs and the season with 55. what are you talking about?
i got the season stats, never said they were playoff stats. People don't get that in the playoffs, it's a different game entirely. The coaches key into the stars of the opposite team and completely shut them down. It happens a lot.

and yeah, those 55 points were 2 points shy of the team lead in points.

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06-24-2010, 12:14 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
i got the season stats, never said they were playoff stats. People don't get that in the playoffs, it's a different game entirely. The coaches key into the stars of the opposite team and completely shut them down. It happens a lot.
So he was no show Joe before?

If we're talking about Stanley Cup winners, people would assume your talking about playoffs, not where he finished in the points race on his own team.


Last edited by HabsHockey: 06-24-2010 at 12:20 PM.
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06-24-2010, 12:16 PM
  #38
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Brian Burkes plan is going up in smoke. Traded all his picks away and needed to hit big in FA. Now unless they bring in Kovy (not happening), or get something great for Kaberle, the Leafs are going to be horrible again next year and without a first round pick again!

He's probably set the Leafs back another decade.
LOVE IT, his big yap has caused him this heartache, no gm wants to deal with him

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06-24-2010, 12:20 PM
  #39
Watsatheo
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They got a good deal with Pavelski.

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06-24-2010, 12:24 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
i got the season stats, never said they were playoff stats. People don't get that in the playoffs, it's a different game entirely. The coaches key into the stars of the opposite team and completely shut them down. It happens a lot.

and yeah, those 55 points were 2 points shy of the team lead in points.
The thing is, points weren't the key to those New Jersey teams. They were built on defense and goaltending. The stars were mainly on defense and goaltending: Brodeur, Stevens, Niedermayer, Rafalski, and Daneyko.

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06-24-2010, 12:47 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
Pavelski=Plekanec. Plekanec at 4.5 for 5 years with no NTC would had make more sense
No it does not, you are way out on that one....Plek was a UFA.....Pavelski is a RFA......very different bargining position......

Plek at 5M is a home town reduction....he could have gotten much more on the open market....

I was not a fan at re-signing Plek (most will remember that I wanted Frolov) but the Plek deal is a great deal for Montreal....

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06-24-2010, 12:47 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
They got a good deal with Pavelski.
Agreed.

Thank God Marleau is off the market. I was worried Montreal was going to do something stupid.

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06-24-2010, 12:48 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post


gomez was a passenger on those cup winning teams, not a go-to guy. What has he done, results and production wise, since he signed his "go-to-guy" contract?

diddly squat.




plekanec @ 3.5-4M for 4 years would have made the most sense... but our management team wasn't sure enough to sign him long-term as an RFA.

Pavelski as an RFA gets 4M, as a UFA this year he would easily have signed for 5M.

how is it that so many people fail to understand the negotiation difference between RFA's and UFA's?
Are you so young that you were not watching hockey in those days?.....that is the only reason I can see for this comment that has no bearing with reality.....

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06-24-2010, 12:50 PM
  #44
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Disagree 100%. Wouldn't pay 5 million for Marleau.
Agreed. How he's become so overrated I'll never understand. People are hypnotized by statistics.

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06-24-2010, 12:51 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
Pavelski=Plekanec. Plekanec at 4.5 for 5 years with no NTC would had make more sense
RFA vs. UFA = not the same at all

Plek cost us 2.75 as a RFA. See the difference?

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06-24-2010, 12:51 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
I'm not some huge gomez fan, actually i'm really hoping we can ditch his contract in the next year (doubtful), but to say he was a passenger on those teams is ludicrous. I also think anyone who doesn't look at the injuries to our forward core this past season as an excuse for poor performances early on need their heads examined.
But we may want to remember that we got Gomez for peanuts...and were in need of a Gomez.......I think the slew of injuries in Montreal last year forced JM to put Gomez on the ice too long and in non-Gomez situation.....a more balance team this year should allow Gomez to soar....and show why he is regarded as a start (I did not say superstar).....

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06-24-2010, 12:52 PM
  #47
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Also consider, quite besides the RFA factor: Pavelski's career high is 25 goals and 59 points. Pretty good, to be sure, but we're not talking a guy with 69 and 70 point seasons on his resume, or a career high of 29 goals. And yes, points aren't everything, but Plekanec is a points-aren't-everything champ anyway.

All in all, I kind of like the way the Plekanec deal compares.

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06-24-2010, 12:54 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by 1SJSharkie1 View Post
The thing is, points weren't the key to those New Jersey teams. They were built on defense and goaltending. The stars were mainly on defense and goaltending: Brodeur, Stevens, Niedermayer, Rafalski, and Daneyko.
Very valid and accurate statement....

So many here are from the Playstation generation and look at statistics as if it was the end all of it all.......Not in hockey where intangibles are just as important, if not more, at times....

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Also consider, quite besides the RFA factor: Pavelski's career high is 25 goals and 59 points. Pretty good, to be sure, but we're not talking a guy with 69 and 70 point seasons on his resume, or a career high of 29 goals. And yes, points aren't everything, but Plekanec is a points-aren't-everything champ anyway.

All in all, I kind of like the way the Plekanec deal compares.
As it turns out, Plek is a cap friendly contract to be sure.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyzombies View Post
Pleks doesn't bring what Pavelski does when it counts. Neither does Thornton, Marleau or Heatley. Pavelski is the true leader of that team.
Oh my...your 24 rings must also be blocking your vision......nothing close to reality here....Everyone knows Thornton is the lead of that team.....go read SJ newspapers....see what the players are saying....inform yourself before making gross statements like that...


Last edited by Darz: 06-24-2010 at 01:11 PM.
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06-24-2010, 12:54 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Also consider, quite besides the RFA factor: Pavelski's career high is 25 goals and 59 points. Pretty good, to be sure, but we're not talking a guy with 69 and 70 point seasons on his resume, or a career high of 29 goals. And yes, points aren't everything, but Plekanec is a points-aren't-everything champ anyway.

All in all, I kind of like the way the Plekanec deal compares.
Pleks doesn't bring what Pavelski does when it counts. Neither does Thornton, Marleau or Heatley. Pavelski is the true leader of that team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sargent Pepper View Post
Oh my...your 24 rings must also be blocking your vision......nothing close to reality here....Everyone knows Thornton is the lead of that team.....go read SJ newspapers....see what the players are saying....inform yourself before making gross statements like that...
I lived there for 16 years, I know what I'm talking about. Thornton is not the captain of that team at all. They'll probably give the 'C' to Pavelski next year.

I would trade Plekanec and whatever they wanted for Pavelski. That guy's a true warrior.


Last edited by Darz: 06-24-2010 at 01:11 PM.
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06-24-2010, 01:01 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by tinyzombies View Post
I lived there for 16 years, I know what I'm talking about. Thornton is not the captain of that team at all. They'll probably give the 'C' to Pavelski next year.
Funny, My firm was partner with one in the valley for a few years...I was there many times a year until last year and I read the exact opposite.....Thornton is the man in SJ......I like Pavelski....but dont confuse him with being the leader of the team....yet, anyway....

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