HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Los Angeles Kings
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Official Rumor Thread--Kings Rumor Mill V

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-24-2010, 12:56 PM
  #76
Sydor25
LA Kings
 
Sydor25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: North Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 21,849
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Sydor25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
6.7 million for 2 D is not enough, we also have to extend Doughty.

Either Kovy ain't going to happen or one of Stoll, Williams needs to be dealt.
Williams is gone next year, that is Doughty's raise all by itself.

$6.7 million for a #4 and #6 defenseman for 1 season? Hell, he Kings could already have their defensemen signed in Hickey/Voynov/Muzzin & Fransson. That is less than $2 million. The Kings play a strong defensive system, they don't need all stars on defense to keep he shots against down. Bernier will have a higher save percentage than Quick's from last season. That alone will keep the goals against down or the same next year. Kovalchuk would help the 5-on-5 scoring.

Sydor25 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 12:58 PM
  #77
Rabbit
Captain Cook
 
Rabbit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South Bay California
Country: United States
Posts: 4,499
vCash: 500
If you guys sign/acquire Kovy, I'm going to s**t bricks.

Rabbit is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:02 PM
  #78
Chruceg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tantrum4 View Post
Luck? Give me a break. They were the best team in the playoffs by far. And that was all due to spending to the cap and not playing the "let's see how much cap space we can have" game like so many fans want their team to do. The money is there to be spent, not saved.
You're damn right it was luck.

What happens if Hossa gets kicked out of game five of the Nashville series like he should have? Nashville goes up 3-2 with a game at home. What happens if Toews, Kane, or Niemi gets hurt in the playoffs? What happens if Philly scores in overtime of game six? What happens Halak doesn't play out of his mind and Washington or Pittsburgh rolls to the Stanley Cup Finals?

I completely agree that Chicago was the best built team in the NHL this past year. But winning the Stanley Cup relies too much on little bounces, freak injuries, and unlikely supporting guys to say anything with certainty.

Also, I've never said not to spend money. Please don't build a straw man argument here. There is a difference between the way that Detroit spends to the cap and the way Chicago spent to the cap. There will be a time when LA spends up to the cap. It may even be this year but overspending for only one CHANCE at the cup is illogical and most likely going to end in heartache.


Last edited by Chruceg: 06-24-2010 at 01:11 PM.
Chruceg is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:02 PM
  #79
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,072
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Williams is gone next year, that is Doughty's raise all by itself.

$6.7 million for a #4 and #6 defenseman for 1 season? Hell, he Kings could already have their defensemen signed in Hickey/Voynov/Muzzin & Fransson. That is less than $2 million. The Kings play a strong defensive system, they don't need all stars on defense to keep he shots against down. Bernier will have a higher save percentage than Quick's from last season. That alone will keep the goals against down or the same next year. Kovalchuk would help the 5-on-5 scoring.
Sydor25, no way Lombardi replaces OD and Jones with two young players, he barely thinks even one is ready. Kings do need at least one legit top 4 NHL D man and who is going to sign a one year deal?

We need the cap space and I don't think Lombardi even wants to be right up agaisnt the cap either. I still don't buy Kovy. Trade Stoll or Williams and then we will talk, that will then give the Kings 10 million; they can shell out 3-4 for a top 4 NHL D man, maybe 1-2 for a #6 D man, re-sign Doughty and still have wiggle room.

Johnny Utah is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:07 PM
  #80
Chruceg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Boston, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 870
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Oops, you're right about that. I forgot about that overage, but has anything been released officially by the league on the exact amount?
This is the closest I could find to a source but I don't think anything is official. Link EDIT: Apparently Dreger tweeted that the official number is 3.7 million but I can't find a link.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Buff's performance can be found on every Stanley Cup winning team, you have to get scoring from unlikely sources. Remember Chris Kontos scored a ton of goals in a playoff year and was never heard from again.

Does Atlanta have a Kane and Toews to get the most out of Buff? Doubt it, it took Lindros to get Leclair to a 40 goal scorer, whos knows if he would have become a 40 goals scorer on Montreal.
I agree completely with almost everything. Especially that Byfuglien won't put up any numbers in Atlanta. It's just that I think Atlanta overpaid. Nobody else was offering even close to that. Yet another reason why Atlanta is going to suck again.

Chruceg is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:12 PM
  #81
BigBrown
They did it again!
 
BigBrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 4,231
vCash: 500
Something that needs to be remembered is that when a contract ends you need to replace that player somehow. So even if we free up a bunch of salary when Williams' and Handzus' contracts are up, that's a top 6 winger and third (or second, however you count it) line center that needs to be replaced.

You could argue that Schenn would replace Handzus but now you are no longer saving $4 million. I don't even think we have any top 6 NHL ready wingers in the system at all to replace Williams.

I'm just saying it's not as easy as looking at who needs a raise and how much salary is freed up, you need to consider the salary of the replacements as well and how viable they are as NHL contributors too.

BigBrown is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:17 PM
  #82
KopitarFAN
Reno Sucks!
 
KopitarFAN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Lost Wages, NV
Country: United States
Posts: 9,648
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
Something that needs to be remembered is that when a contract ends you need to replace that player somehow. So even if we free up a bunch of salary when Williams' and Handzus' contracts are up, that's a top 6 winger and third (or second, however you count it) line center that needs to be replaced.

You could argue that Schenn would replace Handzus but now you are no longer saving $4 million. I don't even think we have any top 6 NHL ready wingers in the system at all to replace Williams.

I'm just saying it's not as easy as looking at who needs a raise and how much salary is freed up, you need to consider the salary of the replacements as well and how viable they are as NHL contributors too.
Simmonds can step in and play RW in the top 6. If Schenn makes the team this year, and does well, you can bet they'll give him a shot in the top 9 in 2011.

KopitarFAN is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:21 PM
  #83
Sydor25
LA Kings
 
Sydor25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: North Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 21,849
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Sydor25
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
Something that needs to be remembered is that when a contract ends you need to replace that player somehow. So even if we free up a bunch of salary when Williams' and Handzus' contracts are up, that's a top 6 winger and third (or second, however you count it) line center that needs to be replaced.

You could argue that Schenn would replace Handzus but now you are no longer saving $4 million. I don't even think we have any top 6 NHL ready wingers in the system at all to replace Williams.

I'm just saying it's not as easy as looking at who needs a raise and how much salary is freed up, you need to consider the salary of the replacements as well and how viable they are as NHL contributors too.
Schenn could replace Stoll and remember that Dean said Schenn's bonuses are probably not easy to achive, so his true cap hit will only be $900,000.

Handzus may re-sign at a discount or Lewis could replace him.

This is why you need to draft well, it doesn't matter how much cap space you have, you will always need to eventually replace the more expensive vets with cheaper, younger players.

Sydor25 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:25 PM
  #84
Buddy The Elf
Kings!
 
Buddy The Elf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Belmont Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 10,023
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post
Your damn right it was luck.

What happens if Hossa gets kicked out of game five of the Nashville series like he should have? Nashville goes up 3-2 with a game at home. What happens if Toews, Kane, or Niemi gets hurt in the playoffs? What happens if Philly scores in overtime of game six? What happens Halak doesn't play out of his mind and Washington or Pittsburgh rolls to the Stanley Cup Finals?
There is SOME luck involved but you make a whole lot of assumptions. LIke the Hossa situation, how do you know Nashville would have won that game if Hossa was kicked out? That makes no sense. I think that was Hossa's first goal of the playoffs wasn't it? Chicago is a good team, a favorite going into the playoffs and there is no luck involved in that.

Wanna talk about luck? Talk about Montreal. Sure they played great and they earned their way to the Conference finals but they got REALLY lucky that both Pittsburgh and Washington **** the bed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post
Also, I've never said not to spend money. Please don't build a straw man argument here. There is a difference between the way that Detroit spends to the cap and the way Chicago spent to the cap. There will be a time when LA spends up to the cap. It may even be this year but overspending for only one CHANCE at the cup is illogical and most likely going to end in heartache.
We don't have to overspend for one chance. I don't get this whole doom and gloom scenario around the 2011/2012 season. I posted the numbers in the last thread, please show me where the problem is. The biggest problem is Smyth's salary but even he could be worked in if necessary and it doesn't rely upon the Kings filling the roster with prospects. The Kings can sign Kovalchuk this season and remain competitive through 11/12. After 2011/2012 and Smyth's contract comes off the books, they'll be in very good shape. The Kings would be no where near Chicago's situation.

Buddy The Elf is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:28 PM
  #85
BigBrown
They did it again!
 
BigBrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 4,231
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Schenn could replace Stoll and remember that Dean said Schenn's bonuses are probably not easy to achive, so his true cap hit will only be $900,000.

Handzus may re-sign at a discount or Lewis could replace him.

This is why you need to draft well, it doesn't matter how much cap space you have, you will always need to eventually replace the more expensive vets with cheaper, younger players.
Absolutely. I agree with pretty much everything you said here but you said it yourself earlier, "Williams is gone next year, that is Doughty's raise all by itself". That's not exactly true and that was what I was trying to say. In that case Williams himself needs to be replaced and if you say Simmonds can move up you are missing the point.

BigBrown is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:29 PM
  #86
Youngblood93
Registered User
 
Youngblood93's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
Posts: 1,962
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
Something that needs to be remembered is that when a contract ends you need to replace that player somehow. So even if we free up a bunch of salary when Williams' and Handzus' contracts are up, that's a top 6 winger and third (or second, however you count it) line center that needs to be replaced.

You could argue that Schenn would replace Handzus but now you are no longer saving $4 million. I don't even think we have any top 6 NHL ready wingers in the system at all to replace Williams.

I'm just saying it's not as easy as looking at who needs a raise and how much salary is freed up, you need to consider the salary of the replacements as well and how viable they are as NHL contributors too.
That's a good point but you can always deal for a top 6 wing or resign Williams at a solid cap hit

Youngblood93 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:33 PM
  #87
BigBrown
They did it again!
 
BigBrown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 4,231
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Youngblood93 View Post
That's a good point but you can always deal for a top 6 wing or resign Williams at a solid cap hit
Sure, when you look at it from a roster standpoint it's not that big of a deal... But it's harder when you look at the salary cap standpoint. The argument was made that we have plenty of money coming off the books soon but I wanted to stress that while we do, we also have to add some salary to replace whatever we lost.

BigBrown is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:35 PM
  #88
no name
Registered User
 
no name's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Tornado Alley
Posts: 11,868
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kovalchuk89 View Post
Matthew Barry has been a work horse these past few days here is another article from hockeybuzz enjoy
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Matth...izon/125/28963
<<Could he trade the affordable and locked up Quick and sign someone like Mason?>>
Matt's been reading my posts.

no name is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:36 PM
  #89
BigKing
Spot Picker
 
BigKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Belmont Shore, CA
Posts: 3,451
vCash: 500
Why is it a formality that O'Donnell is gone? He is still a legit #6 guy on the blueline and can be had for cheap on a 1-year deal. Drewiske is signed on the cheap and could easily be a full-time guy as well.

There is not going to be a $4mm signing of a defenseman. Drafting a ton of blueliners is not something you do only to go and sign Greene and Scuderi to $3M+ deals while knowing that Doughty/Johnson will make more than both of them on their next extensions. You don't go and sign a guy for another three years at a UFA price when your core for the foreseeable future is Doughty, Johnson, Greene and Scuderi.

This defense manged to be pretty good last season and Johnson seems primed to break out a bit. You don't wind up paying $3M or more to every one of your defensemen. Jesus.

Only way this team gets a solid #4-5 defenseman is via trade for a guy who has a good contract already signed. Lombardi said last summer it was all about a winger and he went hard for the top guy in Hossa and was after Knuble. He wound up getting Smyth because they needed something. He knows Smyth is not enough so a winger is still the primary need on this team when looking at the current roster and the prospect pool.

BigKing is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:37 PM
  #90
Johnny Utah
Registered User
 
Johnny Utah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Posts: 7,072
vCash: 500
Um, Big King, both Lombardi and Hextall have both said in interviews this summer a top 4 D man is a priority, esp a guy who can move the puck out of the zone. No way Drewiske can become a top 4.

We lost 4 in Frolov, 1 in OD, and 1.25 in Jones, but we need to replace all 3 and have wiggle room and re-sign Doughty. No way a top 6 forward will cost less than 4 and 2 more top 6 D man will cost a combined 2. 5 either...

This is why I see Gagne as a better right for Lombardi than Kovy, he will make 2-3 less.

Johnny Utah is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:37 PM
  #91
wabwat
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: pasadena, ca.
Posts: 6,755
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to wabwat
Quote:
Originally Posted by no name View Post
<<Could he trade the affordable and locked up Quick and sign someone like Mason?>>
Matt's been reading my posts.

if something like this were to happen, i posted on LGK that Mason was the one who grabbed my attention as well.

wabwat is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:38 PM
  #92
KINGS17
Smartest in the Room
 
KINGS17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 15,974
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post
You're damn right it was luck.

What happens if Hossa gets kicked out of game five of the Nashville series like he should have? Nashville goes up 3-2 with a game at home. What happens if Toews, Kane, or Niemi gets hurt in the playoffs? What happens if Philly scores in overtime of game six? What happens Halak doesn't play out of his mind and Washington or Pittsburgh rolls to the Stanley Cup Finals?

I completely agree that Chicago was the best built team in the NHL this past year. But winning the Stanley Cup relies too much on little bounces, freak injuries, and unlikely supporting guys to say anything with certainty.

Also, I've never said not to spend money. Please don't build a straw man argument here. There is a difference between the way that Detroit spends to the cap and the way Chicago spent to the cap. There will be a time when LA spends up to the cap. It may even be this year but overspending for only one CHANCE at the cup is illogical and most likely going to end in heartache.
Oh noes, too much logic involved in this post.

KINGS17 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:38 PM
  #93
wabwat
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: pasadena, ca.
Posts: 6,755
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to wabwat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
We lost 4 in Frolov, 1 in OD, and 1.25 in Jones, but we need to replace all 3 and have wiggle room and re-sign Doughty. No way a top 6 forward will cost less than 4 and 2 more top 6 D man will cost a combined 2. 5 either...

This is why I see Gagne as a better right for Lombardi than Kovy, he will make 2-3 less.

they lost $2.9 with Frolov. we're talking cap-hit, not real world monies.

wabwat is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:40 PM
  #94
KINGS17
Smartest in the Room
 
KINGS17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 15,974
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBrown View Post
Something that needs to be remembered is that when a contract ends you need to replace that player somehow. So even if we free up a bunch of salary when Williams' and Handzus' contracts are up, that's a top 6 winger and third (or second, however you count it) line center that needs to be replaced.

You could argue that Schenn would replace Handzus but now you are no longer saving $4 million. I don't even think we have any top 6 NHL ready wingers in the system at all to replace Williams.

I'm just saying it's not as easy as looking at who needs a raise and how much salary is freed up, you need to consider the salary of the replacements as well and how viable they are as NHL contributors too.
Well by then the cap will increase to $70M and problem solved.

KINGS17 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:43 PM
  #95
Kingz4life
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Country: Armenia
Posts: 2,105
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Kingz4life
DL knows what he is doing with the CAP, as much as he would take Chicago's situation (Lord Stanley's Champions) there is no way he would let our CAP get to that point.

Doughty, Johnson, and Simmonds are all due raises. But they are also RFA's so they don't HAVE to be locked up for more than 1 year when their curent contract is up.

With that said we all want them locked up for a number of years and a CAP friendly hit.

If, DL wants to keep Handzus and Williams around, he will get creative and do it. Like someone mentioned earlier we can always trade Stoll's 3.6M CAP hit and replace it with Schenn's primarily bonus escalated 3.14 hit.


LETS GET KOVALCHUK!!!

Kingz4life is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:45 PM
  #96
BigKing
Spot Picker
 
BigKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Belmont Shore, CA
Posts: 3,451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
We lost 4 in Frolov, 1 in OD, and 1.25 in Jones, but we need to replace all 3 and have wiggle room and re-sign Doughty. No way a top 6 forward will cost less than 4 and 2 more top 6 D man will cost a combined 2. 5 either...

This is why I see Gagne as a better right for Lombardi than Kovy, he will make 2-3 less.
Gagne is only a 1-year answer. After this season, you are still in the same boat of needing a #1 LW.

Everyone needs to pull their heads out. Kovalchuk is the obvious choice. The past 4 Cup-winners all had more than one guy they were paying top dollars for. Detroit has managed to make it work, Pittsburgh is still a force, Chicago will be fine and Anaheim would have been fine if not for #27 and #8 dicking them around.

Depth guys are just that: depth. This is already a depth team for crying out loud! 1 30 goal scorer and nobody else even at 25. They kind of reminded me of the 1997-98 team that had a bunch of 20 goal guys, a Norris caliber d-man in Blake and a goalie that was decent but not a guy you had utmost confidence in going into the playoffs.

You add the gamebreaker. There are so many more "depth guys" out there than players of Kovalchuk's stature. Doughty isn't going anywhere so there is no need to worry about that either.

You don't get awards for keeping Cap space; you certainly don't get a Stanley Cup for it.

BigKing is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:46 PM
  #97
JMFJ 3
Registered User
 
JMFJ 3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Country: French Polynesia
Posts: 4,770
vCash: 500
I think at this point it's more likely we acquire Gleason than Kovy, Carolina seems willing to move him.

JMFJ 3 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:47 PM
  #98
Cook24
Registered User
 
Cook24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chino, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 2,023
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Cook24
I think our need right now is Kovalchuk, more than it is a top 4 defenseman. We have a plethora of good young defenseman coming up soon. I only see us signing a FA defenseman whos between 30-35 to a 1 or 2 year deal worth about 2-2.5mil per year. Just the fact that we don't have Jones anymore is an immediate upgrade.

Cook24 is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:49 PM
  #99
BigKing
Spot Picker
 
BigKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Belmont Shore, CA
Posts: 3,451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Oh noes, too much logic involved in this post.
Winning a championship in any sport requires luck. It would have taken luck for a low-salary team like Nashville to win the Cup as well.

Chicago was in a better position to make their own luck, as it were. The old saying of "that's why they play the game" is very true. Bounces go one way, calls go one way etc...

Not enough logic involved in this post actually. If you want to insinuate that Chicago won the Cup solely due to luck, than you are ignorant. Saying it takes luck to win the Cup as an argument against signing Kovalchuk makes no sense.

BigKing is offline  
Old
06-24-2010, 01:49 PM
  #100
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 32,215
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMFJ 3 View Post
I think at this point it's more likely we acquire Gleason than Kovy, Carolina seems willing to move him.
Is there a source confirming this besides Dancing Boy? I don't see Gleason being dealt.

Ziggy Stardust is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:36 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.