How is it a horrible deal? So add another prospect or pick. But I still think Montreal gets a better deal. They get 2 excellent very young prospects that'll be playing us for years to come. Markov only has a few years left and A.K. is a question mark if he'll ever break through.Our team would be much better now that we can fit Kovalchuk on the team considering that we have excellent low cap-hit nhl ready prospects on the third line. We would have three excellent scoring lines and a decent defense.
I had this lineup posted elsewhere:
2010-11 MONTREAL CANADIENS
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
* Ilya Kovalchuk ($10.000m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Mike Cammalleri ($6.000m)
* Matthew Lombardi ($3.250m) / Scott Gomez ($7.357m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
* Benoit Pouliot ($1.100m) / * Logan Couture ($1.242m) / Lars Eller ($1.271m)
* Tom Pyatt ($0.900m) / * Maxim Lapierre ($0.900m) / Travis Moen ($1.500m)
Mathieu Darche ($0.500m)
DEFENSEMEN
* Douglas Murray ($2.500m) / P.K. Subban ($0.875m)
Jaroslav Spacek ($3.833m) / * Jason Demers ($0.543m)
Hal Gill ($2.250m) / Josh Gorges ($1.100m)
Ryan O'Byrne ($0.942m)
GOALTENDERS
* Carey Price ($2.500m) / * Antero Niittymaki ($0.650m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP:$59.6m; PAYROLL: $59.713m; CAP ROOM: $0.312m BONUSES: $0.425m
Trade:
to San Jose: Andrei Kostitsyn, Andrei Markov, Roman Harmlik ~14.45
to Montreal: Jason Demers, Logan Couture, Douglas Murray ~4.285 + non-signed ufa's Nabakov6m and Blake3.5m=9.5m which gives them enough cap space= ~13.785m
UFA's:Matthew Lombardi, Ilya Kovalchuk, Antero Niittymaki
I know the trade is improbable, but San Jose does need help on defense.
True Sharks need help on defense. But you do know that you're giving up on Markov that easily. And secondly, I know you have an idea for next year's roster. But we can't give up Markov, and hope to make cap sace in order to sign Kovalchuk. We can't take such a risk in signing Kovy. Moreover, don't you think we'd have more chance getting Kovalchuk with Markov on the team then without him? I do like Couture and Demers, but not for Markov. If Markov were to be traded, it would be for much more IMO.
I haven't read the thread except the last two posts but I don't need to becuase this post says it all
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean-Guy Drouin
I would try to get rid of Spacek instead.
He's way worse than Hamrlik and even if he's not UFA at the end of the year, a 3M$ salary would be easier to trade than Hamrlik's 5,5M$.
Hammer was more reliable through the year but was merely burnt out. Getting rid of $3m is alot easier and we can always use the he shut down Sid The Kid sales line.
He's way worse than Hamrlik and even if he's not UFA at the end of the year, a 3M$ salary would be easier to trade than Hamrlik's 5,5M$.
I wonder if they'd move us Doherty for Spacek.
I've seen quite a bit of Doherty and while he's a project, he's just got so many benefits. He's 19-years old, 6'7, 220 lbs. Good skater and mobility for his size as well.
This would add to prospect pool (he'd play another year in the OHL before jumping to the AHL), with us still having a solid top-6 defense.
Markov - O'Byrne
Hamrlik - Subban
Gill - Gorges
It would also give us well over $3M to search for a winger for the top-2 lines or a suitable defenseman replacement if we aren't comfortable with O'Byrne. Of course, even then, our first month of year our bottom pairing would likely be something like O'Byrne and Carle - but I'm fine with that for now.
Buyout Hamrilk and have nearly $2M of cap space chewed up for no reason? Add in Laraque and that's nearly $2.5M of buyouts alone. I'll pass.
Hamhuis and Michalek aren't signing for $3.5M. So in essence, lets say we sign Hamhuis for $4.5M - we'd basically be paying him $6.5M for 2-years.
Oh and good luck re-signing Markov and Gorges the year after with no money. Gorges will command at least $3M per year and Markov will likely get a raise up to $6.5M per year or so.
No problem.
Gorges can get a chunck from the departure of Gill ( a +2.25m)
Markov can get a chunck from the departure of Spacek ( a+3.8m)
O'B and Subban are still RFA's and Weber will likely break in the lineup at also ELC pricing.
Still worth it down the road IMO especially if the UFA signed a long term contract. We get younger, more mobile, faster and more physical.
I could see Anaheim being a possible trade partner for the Habs when it comes to Hamrlik. I actually wonder if something built around Hamrlik and Wisniewski, with whom they can't agree on a new contract (made 2,75M last year), wouldn't be feasible...
I haven't read the thread except the last two posts but I don't need to becuase this post says it all
Hammer was more reliable through the year but was merely burnt out. Getting rid of $3m is alot easier and we can always use the he shut down Sid The Kid sales line.
Oh boy, this is my first post so I'm noivous. But first, thanks to one of the moderators here for allowing me to be on board.....natey2k4.
So Hamrlik or no Hamrlik..........
I understand cap space and I'm for moving him only if it means making the Habs better. But the injury to Markov to me makes moving # 44 risky. He's been a heckuva a reliable guy. He appears to be a coachable guy and low maintenance. I've not seen too many athletes call themselves out in a crazed media and back it up with results. Hamrlik did that and I give him extended kudos for doing so. I'm guessing coach was appreciative too.
Hamrlik mentoring Subban is something I hope for next year. If there is a guy who has walked in those shoes it's Hamrlik. He himself was only 18 with the weight of a new franchise on his shoulders and of a minority group. Subban is about to experience something that Hamrlik already knows a lot about and then some.
The Habs need to get bigger. So trading Hamrlik is the answer. Does he hit for punishment? Sometimes but he wallpapers and is very good at separating the player from the puck. Does he fight? No he sucks at that but will still stand up for his teammates as best he can.
The Habs are pathetic at even strength. So trading Hamrlik is the answer. He was top ten in the NHL amongst D in even strength points last year. He accumulated as many ES playoff points this year as Markov has in his playoff history as a Hab. He accumulated as many points as any D since 1993.
Buy him out and sign Volchenkov for no less than 4 mil. So that would cost the Habs 5.8 mil which is more than Hamrlik's salary for a player who hasn't played more than about 70 games in the last three years. A-Train blocks shots and hits though. Reminds me of another former Hab in Toronto. No thanks.
Hamrlik has a niche on a team whether it's in Montreal or elsewhere. As another poster mentioned he has served the organization well. He signed here, has played his guts out here, he's promoted the Habs and I wish the guy the best wherever he ends up for the 2010 - 2011 season.
Do you guys think this would be possible? Getting rid of his $5.5 million salary for next season would go a LONG way this summer.
I know he's a solid, veteran defenseman. But still, if we could get a 2nd or 3rd round pick or a prospect for him, I'd personally do it in a second.
Markov-Subban
Spacek-O'Byrne
Gill-Gorges
I'd be alright with that. And there's always a chance we could find a somewhat cheep replacement for Hamrlik on the UFA market. Z. Michalek would be a great addition, but I imagine he will get 4+ on the market.
So, I know some fans probably don't like this idea. But at this point, personally, I'd ship him out for whatever I could get..as long as we're not getting much in salary back.
This requires that O'Byrne AND Subban are ready for top 4 spots on a day to day basis?......I would think not.....one more year then I agree...but not now.....
Oh, so we're going to buy out Spacek too? Awesome.
You're right I'm off by a year. So instead of Spacek - which buying out would be ridiculous since it would be equal to the cap hit itself - then we simply do not re-sign AK (+3.25).
Given our start with the defence last year I'm just not crazy about parting with Hamrlik quite yet. He carried the D on his back for a good part of last year. Even when Markov came back he was shouldering heavier minutes. His highest value will come at the trade deadline next Feb. IMHO. And he has three good reasons to play focused hockey this year:
1. Markov is out again.
2. He'll have the young Subban to watch over.
3. He's in the last year of his contract.
It would have to be something really beneficial coming in to move him at this point. Hamrlik will know exactly what is expected of him at the start. A newer guy maybe not so much.
Given our start with the defence last year I'm just not crazy about parting with Hamrlik quite yet. He carried the D on his back for a good part of last year. Even when Markov came back he was shouldering heavier minutes. His highest value will come at the trade deadline next Feb. IMHO. And he has three good reasons to play focused hockey this year:
1. Markov is out again.
2. He'll have the young Subban to watch over.
3. He's in the last year of his contract.
It would have to be something really beneficial coming in to move him at this point. Hamrlik will know exactly what is expected of him at the start. A newer guy maybe not so much.
I like the way you think
there's other ways to make cap room
The team you have to find is the team with lots of cap space and that think they're thin on D and miss that vet presence.
- Colorado? It's pretty thin right now. Clark and Salei might be out. Quincey on RFA. How much will Quincey get? Picks and/or prospects for Hamrlik and more?
- Dallas? They owe us one....
- LA would welcome a vet....
- Phoenix: Don,t necessarily need a vet....but Morris, Michalek and Schneider could be gone.
- San Jose: Losing Blake....gaining Hamrlik?
- StLouis: Are we done with them? Tons of question marks on D as far as some UFA that might not be back for a team that is supposed to be quite up there next year....Hamrlik would be a great mentor for Pietrangelo. (I hear people saying that if he'd be a great mentor for Alex, he'd be a great mentor for PK....I know...But it's pretty much about knowing Hamrlik shouldn't be there and being a little proactive there.)
There are possiblities. Let's see if we want to do it. And if so, if we're convincing enough. Same applies for Spacek as well if it's not Hamrlik. You can spice up a Hamrlik/Spacek deal by adding prospects like Weber in there. Especially in Colorado, they might remember that they took a certain Brett Clark from our hands, a Clark that looked, at that time, just like a young Weber...
Then on D, if we're unable to get a D back from the team you trade Hamrlik/Spacek to, you concentrate your effort on Clark and/or Michalek.
Hamrlik will not be moved, unless it is at the trade deadline. His salary is just too high.
Quite honestly, I do not mind letting him play out his contract - it is only for this season. Hamrlik has been a good soldier for Montreal, and was one of Gainey's better UFA signings over the years.......
Hamrlik will not be moved, unless it is at the trade deadline. His salary is just too high.
Quite honestly, I do not mind letting him play out his contract - it is only for this season. Hamrlik has been a good soldier for Montreal, and was one of Gainey's better UFA signings over the years.......
Point is that while dealing him at the deadline makes sense IF we're out of a playoff spot and a team feels they're one Hamrlik away to bolster their D, it's a moot point and won't do a whole lot for us. More than half of a season done, the guy is UFA after this year, we're not going to have more than a pick, and I'm not talking about 1st round....and we are talking about 2011.....unless Gauthier aims at 2012 and predicts it would be a much better one.
Hamrlik will not be moved, unless it is at the trade deadline. His salary is just too high.
Quite honestly, I do not mind letting him play out his contract - it is only for this season. Hamrlik has been a good soldier for Montreal, and was one of Gainey's better UFA signings over the years.......
As bad as people want to get rid of his contract we all should sit here an be happy it wasn't Souray we signed that summer. He never full-filled his contract, always injured as suspected and didn't produce point wise either.
Hammer has a two way game and when played properly in a 2nd pairing role he is good, maybe a million over paid but still better than Sheldon.
Souray wants to be traded, and if there is a market for that guy, then there is a definite market for Hammer.
I don't care if Hamrlik is traded but the Habs better be doing something nifty if he is traded especially with Markov out. I'm not for "finding a taker" for the sake of finding a taker just for cap relief.
I don't care if Hamrlik plays out his contract either. There's no telling what shape this team will be in come February. If he plays out his contract though there could be an advantage. He possibly would re-sign for a minimal cost. I'd much rather pay Hamrlik 2.5 mil than Hal Gill 2.25 mil. I'm not saying Hammer would go for that but it's conceivable to get him at a reduced cost and have him play solid hockey with reduced minutes. And he could continue his mentoring ways.
To be honest I'd consider moving Hal Gill now if the cap space is needed. O'Byrne slides in and that's a savings of about 1.25. To me that's the same difference of trading Hamrlik and then signing Volchenkov at a minimum of 4.5 mil. It would also open a space for a Weber or Carle.
He's way worse than Hamrlik and even if he's not UFA at the end of the year, a 3M$ salary would be easier to trade than Hamrlik's 5,5M$.
Is there a reason we shouldn't move both? Spacek got better in the playoffs but the rest of the year he was our worst D after MAB. And it was the other way around. They're clumsy and old. Any young guys could fit in their roles. Better clumsy young than clumsy old.
I have no problem with Hamrlik. I don't think he is useless like some others suggest, but the problem with the Habs is their Cap situation. They currently have 8.772024 mil in cap space with 8 positions needed to be filled. The Habs strength is their depth on LD, Markov - Hamrlik - Spacek(most complaints last season were he was playing his wrong side) - Gill - Gorges(though he can play on the right side). So if able to move Hamrlik they should target a RD with good size, players in FA that I would like to see them target that would come about 2mil or more cheaper than Hamrlik are:
Zbynek Michalek - R - 6'2" 210lbs - 27 years old
Kurtis Foster - R - 6'5" 220lbs - 28 years old
Pavel Kubina - R - 6'4" 245lbs - 33 years old
Derek Morris - R - 6'0" 221lbs - 32 years old
I would not be surprised if O'Byrne was also moved this summer, he should have good value but I'm not sure how much trust Martin has in him. So if both Hamrlik and O'Byrne were moved and the team signed one of the Dmen I have listed than the line-up could look something like this:
Markov - Michalek
Spacek - Subban
Gill - Gorges
Carle(has to clear waivers so I think he is on the roster this season)
I think it would be very hard to move him but most teams needs defence so I think it's still possible. I think we should move him because we do have younger players that can replace him or at worst, we could sign another UFA to replace him.
