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X to the Flyers for Matt Carle (From SJ)

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Old
06-23-2010, 09:48 PM
  #1
JPavs8Clutchy*
 
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X to the Flyers for Matt Carle (From SJ)

Fill in the X. Pretty simple little game. I think Carle would be a great addition, and he fills an important need (puck moving D-man). So, what is wanted from San Jose?

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06-23-2010, 09:50 PM
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ToTheNet
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No givesies backsies?

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06-23-2010, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ToTheNet View Post
No givesies backsies?
Do you mean none of this?

Sharks
Matt Carle
X

Flyers
X

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06-23-2010, 09:56 PM
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DeadPhish5858
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Steve Downie + 1st

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06-23-2010, 09:58 PM
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Giroux tha Damaja
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadPhish5858 View Post
Steve Downie + 1st
This is a tall order for San Jose. Needing Downie makes it tough on them.

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06-23-2010, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by DeadPhish5858 View Post
Steve Downie + 1st
What? Do you guys have a prospect named Steve Downie? Because last time I checked he is a player on the Lightning.

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06-23-2010, 10:13 PM
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DeadPhish5858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am The Mush View Post
This is a tall order for San Jose. Needing Downie makes it tough on them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JPavs8Cluthcy View Post
What? Do you guys have a prospect named Steve Downie? Because last time I checked he is a player on the Lightning.
I didn't see the (from SJ) part. Nevermind.

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06-23-2010, 10:29 PM
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rob zettler, dave snuggeroud, and irteres irbe. Cup is coming to pihlly

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06-23-2010, 10:30 PM
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its guna be Coburn for a goalie.
mark that down dude.

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Old
06-23-2010, 10:34 PM
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BillyShoe1721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPavs8Cluthcy View Post
What? Do you guys have a prospect named Steve Downie? Because last time I checked he is a player on the Lightning.
That's what we had to go through to get Carle. We traded a 1st round pick (where we could have picked Markstrom, the best goalie prospect in the world that hasn't played an NHL game, or John Carlson, a future stud top pairing defenseman that's physical and does it all) for Steve Eminger. We later traded Downie along with Steve Eminger for Carle.

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06-24-2010, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
That's what we had to go through to get Carle. We traded a 1st round pick (where we could have picked Markstrom, the best goalie prospect in the world that hasn't played an NHL game, or John Carlson, a future stud top pairing defenseman that's physical and does it all) for Steve Eminger. We later traded Downie along with Steve Eminger for Carle.
Ugh Homer..... We wouldn't be having these discussions about FAs if we had one of Markstromm or Carlson.

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06-24-2010, 10:45 AM
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Ugh Homer..... We wouldn't be having these discussions about FAs if we had one of Markstromm or Carlson.
Ah, the Homer bashing. Ever heard of Joacim Eriksson? How about Sergie Bobrovsky? Johan Backlund? Homer has done a great job of replenishing the farm with strong goalie prospects. We don't however have a legit #1 goalie, something that takes 5+ years to develop after you draft him. So, for that problem - you should have said.....Ugh Bobby Clarke.....

As for Carlson, we still have some solid D prospects in the system. I think Kevin Marshall has a shot to make the team next year, not to mention Bartulis who just graduated, and Coburn whom Homer aquired, and Pronger, and Timonen, and Carle, and Hamhuis.....other than them, Homer really screwed up the D on this team....

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06-24-2010, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by phillyfanatic View Post
Ah, the Homer bashing. Ever heard of Joacim Eriksson? How about Sergie Bobrovsky? Johan Backlund? Homer has done a great job of replenishing the farm with strong goalie prospects. We don't however have a legit #1 goalie, something that takes 5+ years to develop after you draft him. So, for that problem - you should have said.....Ugh Bobby Clarke.....

As for Carlson, we still have some solid D prospects in the system. I think Kevin Marshall has a shot to make the team next year, not to mention Bartulis who just graduated, and Coburn whom Homer aquired, and Pronger, and Timonen, and Carle, and Hamhuis.....other than them, Homer really screwed up the D on this team....
All of those prospects are not even in the same stratosphere as Markstrom or Carlson, who everyone was screaming at Holmgren to pick. Markstrom carried a ****** Byrnas team to the playoffs and Carlson was playing top 4 minutes for Washington in the playoffs IIRC. Eriksson has yet to even play in the SEL, let alone put up a 2.01GAA. Markstrom was drafted in 2008 and will be a starting goalie by the 2011 season, book it. Strong goalie prospects? Decent, but nothing "strong". We would also be in a much better cap situation if we had one of them.

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Old
06-24-2010, 11:48 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyfanatic View Post
Ah, the Homer bashing. Ever heard of Joacim Eriksson? How about Sergie Bobrovsky? Johan Backlund? Homer has done a great job of replenishing the farm with strong goalie prospects. We don't however have a legit #1 goalie, something that takes 5+ years to develop after you draft him. So, for that problem - you should have said.....Ugh Bobby Clarke.....

As for Carlson, we still have some solid D prospects in the system. I think Kevin Marshall has a shot to make the team next year, not to mention Bartulis who just graduated, and Coburn whom Homer aquired, and Pronger, and Timonen, and Carle, and Hamhuis.....other than them, Homer really screwed up the D on this team....
Do you realize Markstrom and Eriksson were drafted the same year? Markstom just signed, and will probably see some games in the NHL next year, and likely will have the starting gig the year after that. Eriksson will finally play in the SEL for the first time next year, while Markstrom has been playing in the SEL the entire time since being drafted.

Carlson was drafted after Marshall and has already seen time in the NHL. He has a much higher ceiling, and likelihood of panning out. There is no comparison.

Homer absolutely pissed away that draft pick, and gave up on Eminger after 12 games. That is astonishing.

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Old
06-24-2010, 11:50 AM
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Not sure what San Jose has to offer us really... can they afford to take on salary and send a prospect/pick back to open up some space for us to sign Hamhuis?

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06-24-2010, 11:54 AM
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Don't the Sharks have two decent puck moving d-men in Boyle and Demers? I'd think they'd be more interested in Coburn.

Coburn for Stalock and their 1st rounder?

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06-24-2010, 12:24 PM
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Terence Peterman
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Originally Posted by 2Claude2Giroux View Post
Don't the Sharks have two decent puck moving d-men in Boyle and Demers? I'd think they'd be more interested in Coburn.

Coburn for Stalock and their 1st rounder?
I'd be somewhat interested in that, but I don't think it's something Holmgren would look at.

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06-24-2010, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Claude2Giroux View Post
Don't the Sharks have two decent puck moving d-men in Boyle and Demers? I'd think they'd be more interested in Coburn.

Coburn for Stalock and their 1st rounder?
SJ thinks Stalock is their answer in goal within the next 2-3 years, I doubt they move him.

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06-24-2010, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
All of those prospects are not even in the same stratosphere as Markstrom or Carlson, who everyone was screaming at Holmgren to pick. Markstrom carried a ****** Byrnas team to the playoffs and Carlson was playing top 4 minutes for Washington in the playoffs IIRC. Eriksson has yet to even play in the SEL, let alone put up a 2.01GAA. Markstrom was drafted in 2008 and will be a starting goalie by the 2011 season, book it. Strong goalie prospects? Decent, but nothing "strong". We would also be in a much better cap situation if we had one of them.
Question. Is your armchair comfortable?

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06-24-2010, 10:11 PM
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Terence Peterman
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Originally Posted by DenverBoone View Post
Question. Is your armchair comfortable?
Would you even have posted if it wasn't indirectly related to Matt Carle?

Billy's right -- the whole string of trades that made Carle a Flyer was and remains totally ass-backwards. It was unnecessary, preemptive for nothing, and sloppy. Having Markstrom or Carlson would be absolutely huge for this organization right now (Markstrom especially). It's a "what if" situation that was 100% avoidable.

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06-24-2010, 10:13 PM
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And if Markstrom ***** the bed and Carlson never fully develops and just becomes a decent D man?

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06-24-2010, 10:42 PM
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Terence Peterman
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And if Markstrom ***** the bed and Carlson never fully develops and just becomes a decent D man?
And if Matt Carle is never paired with the Keystone Rock of the Philadelphia defense?

There were other, more efficient ways to go about improving the defense at that point. Carle was just as big a gamble as either Carlson or Markstrom would have been or could be. He could even be considered worse, because his cap hit contributed to cap issues last year. It's not as if he came in and displayed himself as an indisputable answer, nor is it as if he was acquired with a solid, consistent background that validated anything.

That Steve Downie was also lost in that trade makes it look even worse at the time, because if you weren't blindly hating him around here you knew all he needed to do was get the **** away from John Stevens and/or be in one place (the Phantoms or Flyers) for more than a couple days at a time to show he could produce in some capacity or role. He's a guy who can play anywhere in the lineup. If any of the people who say the Carle hate is invalid can find the time to take their eyes and nose from his ******* and stop saying how great it looks and smells, they might see how the fashion in which he was brought here made zero sense and has only paid off since he's had a top five, Norris winning, first ballot Hall of Fame defenseman as his partner.

Imagine this team with Downie playing anywhere we needed him and Markstrom right now...or Carlson if you want, it really doesn't matter. At least two of the three holes this team has right now are filled long-term.

Edit: If Markstrom ***** the bed, that's one thing. If Carlson becomes "just decent," we have ourselves another Matt Carle, except he's not throwing a 3.5 MM cap hit on us for at least a few years.


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Old
06-25-2010, 06:33 AM
  #23
ToTheNet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonny View Post
And if Matt Carle is never paired with the Keystone Rock of the Philadelphia defense?

There were other, more efficient ways to go about improving the defense at that point. Carle was just as big a gamble as either Carlson or Markstrom would have been or could be. He could even be considered worse, because his cap hit contributed to cap issues last year. It's not as if he came in and displayed himself as an indisputable answer, nor is it as if he was acquired with a solid, consistent background that validated anything.

That Steve Downie was also lost in that trade makes it look even worse at the time, because if you weren't blindly hating him around here you knew all he needed to do was get the **** away from John Stevens and/or be in one place (the Phantoms or Flyers) for more than a couple days at a time to show he could produce in some capacity or role. He's a guy who can play anywhere in the lineup. If any of the people who say the Carle hate is invalid can find the time to take their eyes and nose from his ******* and stop saying how great it looks and smells, they might see how the fashion in which he was brought here made zero sense and has only paid off since he's had a top five, Norris winning, first ballot Hall of Fame defenseman as his partner.

Imagine this team with Downie playing anywhere we needed him and Markstrom right now...or Carlson if you want, it really doesn't matter. At least two of the three holes this team has right now are filled long-term.

Edit: If Markstrom ***** the bed, that's one thing. If Carlson becomes "just decent," we have ourselves another Matt Carle, except he's not throwing a 3.5 MM cap hit on us for at least a few years.
I like Downie, I was upset to see him go, although Matt Carle was a guy I always liked so it was not that hard for me to swallow.

The fact is . . . the Flyers are in win NOW mode and that means sacrificing the future. Could Carlson have come in and helped? Perhaps, but not in the extent that Carle did, especially with the way the Flyers tend to hold their prospects back for a year or two before bringing them up. It is a tough decision, but I don't think it was the worst one ever.

If you want to blame anyone . . . blame Steve Eminger for those few years of looking like he could be a player and worth a 1st rounder.

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06-25-2010, 09:42 AM
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If you want to blame anyone . . . blame Steve Eminger for those few years of looking like he could be a player and worth a 1st rounder.
You mean the guy who hadn't played more than 68 games or scored more than 20 points in a season prior to becoming a Flyer, and found himself in the press box so frequently the year before the deal he only made his way into 20 games?

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06-25-2010, 10:04 AM
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I hate Steve Eminger

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