HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

July 1st Start of Free Agency

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-01-2010, 09:14 AM
  #76
nyr2417
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dredden View Post
I think we sign Foster and Biron today.
lets hope, i've been advocating for the foster signing for about 2 months now

nyr2417 is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:14 AM
  #77
I Eat Crow
Fear The Mullet
 
I Eat Crow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 6,047
vCash: 500
A free agency GDT? You guys are funny

Don't expect anything big for the Rangers today. You're going to be disappointed if you do.

I Eat Crow is online now  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:16 AM
  #78
freewheeler
Registered User
 
freewheeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 210
vCash: 500
Kovvy scores, no doubt. But he also throws the entire system off balance. I realize the rangers have not implemented many "systems", but it seems like they are trying to establish an identity finally. Kovvy would throw that off. He also brings a lot of negatives. Terrible defensively, longest shifts in the NHL, and commands the powerplay like Jagr (the sole purpose is to set him up - he takes a lot of bad shots). The best thing the Devils did (as a Ranger fan) was get Kovvy - it was out of character and I believe ensured their early defeat.

freewheeler is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:19 AM
  #79
pwoz
Registered User
 
pwoz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 2,453
vCash: 500
Kovy was the best Devil in their series. Everyone else disappeared and Marty was showing his age.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/v...cd3d&pid=56745

pwoz is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:19 AM
  #80
MSG the place to be*
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by yboldt14 View Post
Kovvy scores, no doubt. But he also throws the entire system off balance. I realize the rangers have not implemented many "systems", but it seems like they are trying to establish an identity finally. Kovvy would throw that off. He also brings a lot of negatives. Terrible defensively, longest shifts in the NHL, and commands the powerplay like Jagr (the sole purpose is to set him up - he takes a lot of bad shots). The best thing the Devils did (as a Ranger fan) was get Kovvy - it was out of character and I believe ensured their early defeat.
Agreed, you dont give a guy the second most money in the league to OV with so many negatives/question marks surrounding his game.

MSG the place to be* is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:21 AM
  #81
WhipNash27
Quattro!!
 
WhipNash27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Westchester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,474
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
The fact of the matter is that no matter how many goals he has scored, he has never come close ONCE to winning ANYTHING in the NHL. And that's WITH the likes of Marc Savard and Marian Hossa playing with him. I just don't understand how people think Kovy + Gabby = STANLEY CUP.
Marc Savard had one good year with ATL which happened to be the year after the lockout (his last before going to Boston). That season, they had musical chairs in the goalie position. When your goalies are
Mike Dunham
Kari Lehtonen
Michael Garnett
Adam Berkhoel
Steve Shields
IDK what to really say. Three players makes not a team.

The winning thing could also be said about Hossa as well. He finally won this year, didn't he? He was on many great Ottawa teams, never did anything. They went to the finals after he left. Went to the finals twice and lost on Pitt & Det who were two teams who were quite loaded with more talented players than him. Then finally won on a Chicago team that was quite stacked.

Kovalchuk has never had a truly great team to play with from top to bottom.

WhipNash27 is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:21 AM
  #82
BrooklynRangersFan
Change is good.
 
BrooklynRangersFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brooklyn of course
Country: United States
Posts: 10,063
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
Yeah and Ken Griffey Jr. was once on pace to hit about 900 homers. If the guy retires with 700 you can call him generational, fantastic, masterbratorial...whatever the hell you want. As of right now he is just a really good offensive player who scores a lot of goals and has never heard of the concept of playing defense.

The fact of the matter is that no matter how many goals he has scored, he has never come close ONCE to winning ANYTHING in the NHL. And that's WITH the likes of Marc Savard and Marian Hossa playing with him. I just don't understand how people think Kovy + Gabby = STANLEY CUP.
Ah, I see. You didn't tell us that you'd set the ground rules that a player can only be judged in hindsight in order to apply such labels on them. By your definition, Gretzky himself couldn't be categorized as anything other than a "really good offensive player" until after he'd retired. And that's just silly.

Unfortunately, I think the majority of the sporting world disagrees with you. I certainly remember Ken Griffey Jr. being called a generational talent for many, many years. (Also, for the record, I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that he gets into the HoF...)

EDIT: Also, please just STOP it with the "I just don't undertand how people think Kovy + Gabby = STANLEY CUP" stuff. Outside of a few very overenthusiastic posters, the majority of us who are in the sign Kovy now at the right price (if you can get him for something around $9MM or below in my case) camp believe that this is a unique opportunity to get a player of this caliber for nothing other than cap space. We believe that you sign him now, BECAUSE HE'S ON THE MARKET NOW, and you get him when you can. Then, you develop the kids, wait for Drury et. al. to come off the books in 2 years and you're set to contend seriously for a good long time starting in about 2 years.


Last edited by BrooklynRangersFan: 07-01-2010 at 09:26 AM.
BrooklynRangersFan is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:21 AM
  #83
offdacrossbar
with the 10th pick..
 
offdacrossbar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: da cuse
Country: Tuvalu
Posts: 8,059
vCash: 500
anyone arguing against kovalchuk coming here, for any reason other than hes too expensive, is silly.

his last 5 years have been absolutely money. the teams hes played on have been average and that includes last years devils team with fatso the flopper- who cant stop anything anymore- in net.

this guy is a filthy sniper. period.

he, alone, addresses essential team needs from goal scoring, scoring balance and a lethal pp point shot. one guy. alone.

to not want him is beyond foolish, if for any other reason other than he is too expensive.

god forbid we over pay for a player that actually contributes to the teams success.



having said that, i just dont see us being able to afford him but if we could, i would not let him go anywhere else.

offdacrossbar is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:22 AM
  #84
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,644
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
Yeah and Ken Griffey Jr. was once on pace to hit about 900 homers. If the guy retires with 700 you can call him generational, fantastic, masterbratorial...whatever the hell you want. As of right now he is just a really good offensive player who scores a lot of goals and has never heard of the concept of playing defense.

The fact of the matter is that no matter how many goals he has scored, he has never come close ONCE to winning ANYTHING in the NHL. And that's WITH the likes of Marc Savard and Marian Hossa playing with him. I just don't understand how people think Kovy + Gabby = STANLEY CUP.
Thats because you dont understand that it takes talent to win in the NHL and, especially post lockout, it takes a lot of firepower up front.

Gaborik and Kovalchuk on the first two lines creates a formidable top 6 right off the bat....I dont care if you have Erik Christensen, Ryan Callahan, whoever up there with them because Gaborik and Kovalchuk are a lock to score 80+ goals despite their linemates.

As the years go on when contracts start coming off the cap and prospects are fully developed, it'll only get better.

I hate to keep beating the Kovalchuk horse, but hes truly the only move this team could make that would be a true difference maker. And I think it comes down to different philosophies.....I think the anti-Kovalchuk crowd has this pie in the sky philosophy that all of our prospects are going to develop to their full potential and and we are going to have this deep team. Me? I'd rather have the talented cornerstones in place of Lundqvist, Gaborik, and Kovalchuk before any of this happens. Because if the prospects dont work out, at least Im left with capspace and those 3 stars, instead of sitting around with my thumb up my ass wondering what happened to this great "team depth" I envisioned.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:23 AM
  #85
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,644
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by yboldt14 View Post
Kovvy scores, no doubt. But he also throws the entire system off balance. I realize the rangers have not implemented many "systems", but it seems like they are trying to establish an identity finally. Kovvy would throw that off. He also brings a lot of negatives. Terrible defensively, longest shifts in the NHL, and commands the powerplay like Jagr (the sole purpose is to set him up - he takes a lot of bad shots). The best thing the Devils did (as a Ranger fan) was get Kovvy - it was out of character and I believe ensured their early defeat.
Really? We must have been watching different seasons because I saw the most disjointed/clueless team since the lockout.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:26 AM
  #86
mullichicken25
Registered User
 
mullichicken25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: NJ
Posts: 2,536
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
anyone arguing against kovalchuk coming here, for any reason other than hes too expensive, is silly.

his last 5 years have been absolutely money. the teams hes played on have been average and that includes last years devils team with fatso the flopper- who cant stop anything anymore- in net.

this guy is a filthy sniper. period.

he, alone, addresses essential team needs from goal scoring, scoring balance and a lethal pp point shot. one guy. alone.

to not want him is beyond foolish if for any other reason other than he is too expensive.

god forbid we over pay for a player that actually contributes to the teams success.



having said that, i just dont see us being able to afford him but if we could, i would not let him go anywhere else.
i dont think i ever said this before, or will ever say it again, but i agree with everything he just said

to not want him on this team is silly...but to understand we can't afford him is realistic

mullichicken25 is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:26 AM
  #87
freewheeler
Registered User
 
freewheeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 210
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
anyone arguing against kovalchuk coming here, for any reason other than hes too expensive, is silly.

his last 5 years have been absolutely money. the teams hes played on have been average and that includes last years devils team with fatso the flopper- who cant stop anything anymore- in net.

this guy is a filthy sniper. period.

he, alone, addresses essential team needs from goal scoring, scoring balance and a lethal pp point shot. one guy. alone.

to not want him is beyond foolish, if for any other reason other than he is too expensive.

god forbid we over pay for a player that actually contributes to the teams success.



having said that, i just dont see us being able to afford him but if we could, i would not let him go anywhere else.
There are a number of scouts and GMs that have been quoted anonymously as opposed to Kovvy. Again, he scores, but brings negatives that players of a similar salary do not. Gaborik plays defense, and does what needs to be done to win. I would not pay him more than Gabby. You can throw stats around all day, but how many titles did the Devils win without a Kovvy? Its about winning, not HOF numbers.

freewheeler is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:27 AM
  #88
dtrap
Registered User
 
dtrap's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Charleston, SC
Country: United States
Posts: 1,720
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dtrap
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubiSnacks17 View Post
Marc Savard had one good year with ATL which happened to be the year after the lockout (his last before going to Boston). That season, they had musical chairs in the goalie position. When your goalies are
Mike Dunham
Kari Lehtonen
Michael Garnett
Adam Berkhoel
Steve Shields
IDK what to really say. Three players makes not a team.
Just like Kovy, Gabby and Hank make a team not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DubiSnacks17 View Post
The winning thing could also be said about Hossa as well. He finally won this year, didn't he? He was on many great Ottawa teams, never did anything. Went to the finals twice and lost on Pitt & Det. Then finally won on a Chicago team that was quite stacked.
But the guy at least came close. I mean he has been in the last three Cup finals. If we were to do that I would be VERY happy.

And Hossa in my mind fits a system much better than Kovy. During the Cup finals even though he wasn't scoring, he was still creating offense. That's better than Kovy skating around trying to force shots and then loafing on defense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DubiSnacks17 View Post
Kovalchuk has never had a truly great team to play with from top to bottom.
Look I know he scores a lot of goals and that makes people go ooo and ahh, but honestly I get the feeling the team that gives him nine million a year is going to be disappointed.

Unless it's LA of course...they really seem like the only situation that will be a perfect fit.

But at the end of the day...if he signs here and we win...that's all that matters.

dtrap is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:28 AM
  #89
Jersey Girl
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DubiSnacks17 View Post
Marc Savard had one good year with ATL which happened to be the year after the lockout (his last before going to Boston). That season, they had musical chairs in the goalie position. When your goalies are
Mike Dunham
Kari Lehtonen
Michael Garnett
Adam Berkhoel
Steve Shields
IDK what to really say. Three players makes not a team.
Yeah, there is no say you can make the Stanley Cup finals with guys like these. Or Michael Leighton and Brian Boucher. Oh, wait a second...

Jersey Girl is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:29 AM
  #90
Dredden
JT Miller
 
Dredden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 1,429
vCash: 500
CraigCustance

Hedberg and Thrashers still talking, but no agreement yet. Other options for the Moose include NYR, MTL, NJD...

Dredden is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:32 AM
  #91
Lion Hound
@JoeTucc26
 
Lion Hound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 3,701
vCash: 500
I think you have a better chance of meeting Elvis than Kovalchuk signing here. The writing was on the wall with the comments about going young, and building from within etc. They are Cap-Strapped, not Cash-Strapped...And maybe that's not such a bad thing while Sather is still cutting the checks.

Lion Hound is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:34 AM
  #92
rvdnsx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 377
vCash: 500
I think the Rangers have to at least inquire about Kovalchuk. Maybe he is willing to take a bit less to play in New York. In a perfect world, I would:

-Sign Kovy for between 8-9 Million per year
-Sign a backup goalie of either Auld or Hedberg
-Find a trade partner for Redden (regardless of whether we hate the guy or not, Slats has to give him a chance to play in the NHL somewhere) or demote him to Hartford
-Resign Marc Staal for around 4-4.5M per season, if Girardi wants more then 3M, let him walk and get picks for him.
-If we can trade Roszival and not take any salary back we can use the cap space for a decent UFA defenseman like Willie Mitchell or even Anton Volchenkov.

Other then that I would just let the kids earn some spots in training camp.

rvdnsx is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:38 AM
  #93
mti79
Registered User
 
mti79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,199
vCash: 50
Not making a separate thread because I've never been one to pretend I know stuff/people, and I figured our GDT thread would be the right place with this seeing as how the boards are going to be littered with all kinds of threads today....

With that said, look for the Rangers to sign Martin Biron to backup Henrik this year. That's what I'm hearing. No word on terms. I like it.

mti79 is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:39 AM
  #94
dtrap
Registered User
 
dtrap's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Charleston, SC
Country: United States
Posts: 1,720
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dtrap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Thats because you dont understand that it takes talent to win in the NHL and, especially post lockout, it takes a lot of firepower up front.

Gaborik and Kovalchuk on the first two lines creates a formidable top 6 right off the bat....I dont care if you have Erik Christensen, Ryan Callahan, whoever up there with them because Gaborik and Kovalchuk are a lock to score 80+ goals despite their linemates.

As the years go on when contracts start coming off the cap and prospects are fully developed, it'll only get better.
I don't understand what it takes talent win? A monkey could tell you that...the point is that it takes a certain mix of talent.

LHere is what I see. I see the fact that the last bunch of Stanley Cup Champions have had a legit number 1 center, a pair of shutdown defenseman, a pretty average goaltender who happened to get hot at the right time and a group of grinders who will go balls to the wall in the corner but can also chip in some goals. So don't tell me having two superstar wingers is the formula because it's not. The Penguins won the cup and they haven't been able to find the correct wing for Crosby since he came into the league. If great wings was the formula the Capitals would have won three or four by now.

The other problem with your argument is your thought that once those contracts come off the board, we will be ok. You are thinking two years ahead, not 4 or 5. Ok so we dump Redden to sign Kovy. We replace one huge contract with an even bigger one. Gabby still makes a lot and Hank still makes a lot. Staal is going to make a lot in about 2 years (if he doesn't right now...thanks Bobby Orr) and Cally and Dubi are sure to get raises into the 3-3.5 range next offseason. Think a year later..MDZ is up for a new deal and he should get around 3.5 - 4. I think it really is in the Rangers best interest to be patient. There will ALWAYS be good goal scorers available in free agency. A guy like Kovy is the final piece to a Stanley Cup Championship team, a guy you sign when you are coming into or are a season away from a serious run. That is not us. It is silly to sign and guy and say "just you wait until 2013...we'll be ready then."

dtrap is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:43 AM
  #95
Garfinkel1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: CT
Posts: 3,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tube Sock View Post
Oh noes, Erik Christensen the waiver wire hero isn't going to be a Ranger!
I don't care if we drafted the guy in the 7th round, picked him up off waivers, signed him undrafted or got traded here... It shouldn't be much of a factor.

It comes down to the guy played like a million dollar player when he came here and played well for us. I think a 2yr/2m contract would be good and fair contract. However, they must be assuming Dubi or AA will be centering Gabs so he really isn't needed. Who knows!

Garfinkel1 is online now  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:43 AM
  #96
Jersey Girl
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtrap View Post
The other problem with your argument is your thought that once those contracts come off the board, we will be ok. You are thinking two years ahead, not 4 or 5. Ok so we dump Redden to sign Kovy. We replace one huge contract with an even bigger one. Gabby still makes a lot and Hank still makes a lot. Staal is going to make a lot in about 2 years (if he doesn't right now...thanks Bobby Orr) and Cally and Dubi are sure to get raises into the 3-3.5 range next offseason. Think a year later..MDZ is up for a new deal and he should get around 3.5 - 4. I think it really is in the Rangers best interest to be patient. There will ALWAYS be good goal scorers available in free agency. A guy like Kovy is the final piece to a Stanley Cup Championship team, a guy you sign when you are coming into or are a season away from a serious run. That is not us. It is silly to sign and guy and say "just you wait until 2013...we'll be ready then."
This is extremely well said.

Jersey Girl is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:47 AM
  #97
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,445
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post

I hate to keep beating the Kovalchuk horse, but hes truly the only move this team could make that would be a true difference maker. And I think it comes down to different philosophies.....I think the anti-Kovalchuk crowd has this pie in the sky philosophy that all of our prospects are going to develop to their full potential and and we are going to have this deep team. Me? I'd rather have the talented cornerstones in place of Lundqvist, Gaborik, and Kovalchuk before any of this happens. Because if the prospects dont work out, at least Im left with capspace and those 3 stars, instead of sitting around with my thumb up my ass wondering what happened to this great "team depth" I envisioned.
I agree. Well put too. With Kovalchuk Torts becomes adequate and place becomes desirable, i.e. others may consider it. I have no doubt Sather realizes that. Yet I am doubtful Kovalchuk will sign here.

94now is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:48 AM
  #98
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,598
vCash: 500
July 1st, the Rangers' fans equivalent to winning the Cup.

Though I'm not so confident this year that Sather will "win" the free agency sweepstakes this year, thank God.

OverTheCap is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:48 AM
  #99
dtrap
Registered User
 
dtrap's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Charleston, SC
Country: United States
Posts: 1,720
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dtrap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
This is extremely well said.
Thank you

dtrap is offline  
Old
07-01-2010, 09:51 AM
  #100
KingWantsCup
Super Saiyan Hank
 
KingWantsCup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 5,269
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by UAGoalieGuy View Post
$14 million with 14 roster players signed. Have to re-sign Staal and Girardi (About $7 million total) and a back-up (About $1 million). If Christiansen and Shelley do not re-sign, figure Weise and Stepan to fill their spots ($1.7 million total). Possibly McD making the squad if he doesn't go back to school (Another $900K). That leaves about $3 million in cap space, with a 20 man roster. If the Rangers waive Redden, they will have almost $10 million in cap space. If they can find a deal where they can trade Brashear and/or Voros out, they could have close to $12 to $13 million.

Gotta watch out for the summer cap of $65 million, though.
Beautifully broken down. Redden as always is the problem. Burying him is easy I just hope Sather will do it for Ilya.

KingWantsCup is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:15 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.