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Old
07-09-2010, 12:44 AM
  #26
Martyros
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Originally Posted by mercury View Post
That would be an insane steal for the Kings.
insane steal? trading away our 2nd best defender, creating hole in an already-depleted defensive core and trading away our current number 1 goalie signed to a great deal for yet ANOTHER center that would be looking for a raise? Fair? Value-wise? Sure, but it doesn't benefit the kings, while it benefits the flyers as they shed some salary while adding even MORE great defensive depth. Calling it "insane steal" is just absurd.

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07-09-2010, 12:54 AM
  #27
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You are wrong. JJ and Quick for Carter is not even fair for Carter, let alone overpayment.
Then keep him.

JJ and Quick is overpayment for LA. We take on more salary and give a top 3 d-man and a starting goalie, both of whom aren't close to entering their prime. Your team is the one with a clear need to upgrade in net and unload some salary.

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07-09-2010, 12:58 AM
  #28
mercury
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Originally Posted by Martyros View Post
insane steal? trading away our 2nd best defender, creating hole in an already-depleted defensive core and trading away our current number 1 goalie signed to a great deal for yet ANOTHER center that would be looking for a raise? Fair? Value-wise? Sure, but it doesn't benefit the kings, while it benefits the flyers as they shed some salary while adding even MORE great defensive depth. Calling it "insane steal" is just absurd.
No, it doesn't. The last thing the Flyers need is another defenseman, and Carter is an RFA after this season, not UFA. It doesn't make sense. They could get a better package somewhere else, as could the Kings if they somehow acquired Carter for that package.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:01 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
Then keep him.

JJ and Quick is overpayment for LA. We take on more salary and give a top 3 d-man and a starting goalie, both of whom aren't close to entering their prime. Your team is the one with a clear need to upgrade in net and unload some salary.
The Flyers are under the cap as it stands (would/will be over if they sign Zherdev without making a move). As I've stated, the LAST thing the Flyers need is another top-4 defensemen. Why trade Carter for JJ and Quick if we can get Vokoun+ for him, waive Boucher, and be fine under the cap? We've got this blueline right now:

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Coburn
Meszaros-O'Donnell
Bartulis


What would we do with Jack Johnson? And do you HONESTLY believe that would be the best package offered for Carter?

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:04 AM
  #30
Martyros
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Originally Posted by mercury View Post
No, it doesn't. The last thing the Flyers need is another defenseman, and Carter is an RFA after this season, not UFA. It doesn't make sense. They could get a better package somewhere else, as could the Kings if they somehow acquired Carter for that package.
I know he's an RFA. My main point is that is is NOT an "insane steal".

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:05 AM
  #31
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The Kings are looking to build off their core, not trade it. So guys like JJ and Brown won't be moved, and Quick will at least stay with the team for a year or two until either he or Bernier establishes themself as the longterm #1 goalie for the kings (with the other traded or stuck in a back up position). The Kings would only be interested in moving expendable pieces like Stoll, Williams, Drewiske, Moller, Hickey etc. However, I doubt Philly would like a package made up of those players for Carter.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:07 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mercury View Post
The Flyers are under the cap as it stands (would/will be over if they sign Zherdev without making a move). As I've stated, the LAST thing the Flyers need is another top-4 defensemen. Why trade Carter for JJ and Quick if we can get Vokoun+ for him, waive Boucher, and be fine under the cap? We've got this blueline right now:

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Coburn
Meszaros-O'Donnell
Bartulis


What would we do with Jack Johnson? And do you HONESTLY believe that would be the best package offered for Carter?

We wouldn't know until Carter gets traded and see what the return is.

But either way I'm fine. You keep Carter, we'll keep Quick and JJ.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:07 AM
  #33
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ahahaha NO

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:12 AM
  #34
mercury
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Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
We wouldn't know until Carter gets traded and see what the return is.

But either way I'm fine. You keep Carter, we'll keep Quick and JJ.
That would be FINE by me. Carter doesn't have to go anywhere.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:13 AM
  #35
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Am I the only one who finds it hilarious how insanely overrated in regards to trade value Jeff Carter is on HF? Jesus Christ...

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:22 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
No from Philly. We don't need Johnson and if we're sending over Carter, we better get Bernier.

Carter is about fair value for Brown + Bernier.

That said, LA doesn't need a center really. They wouldn't do it.
Overpayment by Kings. Brown is an excellent player, he's more than stats.

In last 3 years Carter scored 108. Brown scored 81. That's 27 goal difference in 3 years, so averages out to 9 goals per year extra. However Brown is more physical and not to mention he's signed at a fair cap hit for 4 more years...I think people underrate him. Carter is better, but not enough to add a top prospect and save salary.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:23 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Overpayment by Kings. Brown is an excellent player, he's more than stats.

In last 3 years Carter scored 108. Brown scored 81. That's 27 goal difference in 3 years, so averages out to 9 goals per year extra. However Brown is more physical and not to mention he's signed at a fair cap hit for 4 more years...I think people underrate him. Carter is better, but not enough to add a top prospect and save salary.
I think Brown AND Bernier is overpayment by L.A., as well.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:28 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by defer View Post
you are telling me that a #1 goalie with a 1.8 cap hit for 3 more seasons and a Top 2 defensemen who still has like 4 years of RFA left is not worth a center who, although injured, played horrible in the playoffs and only has 1 year left before a big payday?
No, he's telling you that a young, but currently average starting goaltender and a top 4 dman who's only signed for one more year and looking for a big pay day is not worth a 6'3 right-shooting center who can skate like the wind, is at the very least decent defensively and scored 79 goals over the last two seasons.

See I can do that, too.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:37 AM
  #39
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Carter's glorious .46 Playoff PPG seems to always get forgotten in these conversations.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:43 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takavorner View Post
Carter's glorious .46 Playoff PPG seems to always get forgotten in these conversations.
He's had separated shoulders and broken feet in consecutive play-off appearances.

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Old
07-09-2010, 01:51 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Takavorner View Post
Am I the only one who finds it hilarious how insanely overrated in regards to trade value Jeff Carter is on HF? Jesus Christ...
Not at all, and I'm a Flyers fan. Forget with regards to his trade value, Jeff Carter is just insanely overrated, period. People can talk about his 40-goal potential, but if you watched him on a day-to-day basis, you wouldn't really be all that impressed. His game is very predictable, which he'll demonstrate on one of the 5+ times per game he streaks down the wing into the zone and fires a shot high and wide. He's also soft for a guy his size and rarely uses that big body to his advantage. It's a shame, because there have been glimpses where you can see how potentially dominant Jeff Carter could be if he just had that extra gear in his game (Danny Briere's first game back in Buffalo springs to mind as a prime example of what I'm talking about). The guy is as good a skater as there is in the league, and the lethality of his shot is up there with the best. But when it comes down to it, I just don't think he has the mentality or personality to be a star player.

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Old
07-09-2010, 02:01 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by dookie88 View Post
No, he's telling you that a young, but currently average starting goaltender and a top 4 dman who's only signed for one more year and looking for a big pay day is not worth a 6'3 right-shooting center who can skate like the wind, is at the very least decent defensively and scored 79 goals over the last two seasons.

See I can do that, too.
Yeah, except Carter wants that big pay day too next year.

Do it right.

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Old
07-09-2010, 02:14 AM
  #43
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Anyone calling a 25-year-old 40-goal scorer who is good defensively "overrated" needs to get their head examined.

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Old
07-09-2010, 03:25 AM
  #44
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Old
07-09-2010, 03:28 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takavorner View Post
Am I the only one who finds it hilarious how insanely overrated in regards to trade value Jeff Carter is on HF? Jesus Christ...
Yes you are. Don't you have a clue why every team in the league is always trying to make a deal for him. Guess not

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Old
07-09-2010, 04:20 AM
  #46
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As long as Carter has that 1 year of RFA he is ATLEAST worth what would be an awesome offer sheet compensation. That said he isn't nearly over-rated in these proposals. We'll stick with him, thanks.

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Old
07-09-2010, 04:41 AM
  #47
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Wow, terrible deal really for both teams.

We don't need JJ. We are not having quick if carter is up for grabs. We are taking bernier.

Kings fans are probably the worst people on this board for overrating their own players. Sure every team does it. But every single one of your players cannot be gained through trade unless it's stoll or quick. It's hillarious. You realise that you have gotta give to get right?

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Old
07-09-2010, 06:04 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Takavorner View Post
Carter's glorious .46 Playoff PPG seems to always get forgotten in these conversations.
The Kings have made the playoffs how many times since the lockout? How far did they get in the playoffs when they made it?

I just find it funny that you're commenting on Carter's ppg when he was playing on 2 broken feet among other ailments. It happens too often. A player battles his ass off and does anything for his team, but the outside world only sees stats and gives the man no credit.

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Old
07-09-2010, 06:12 AM
  #49
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You can have him for free.
Deal!

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Old
07-09-2010, 06:36 AM
  #50
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Deal!
She has a bit of a soft spot (or hard...depending on how you're looking at it) for Quick. So she is all about shipping Bernier off before he makes her man ride the pine

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