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Gazette - Questions Linger about Halak Trade

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Old
07-11-2010, 08:53 AM
  #1
HomaridII
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Gazette - Questions Linger about Halak Trade

http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...037/story.html

"What surprised me the most about this whole thing is that (the Canadiens) didn't take their time to move Halak," McGuire said.

"If the Canadiens think that was the best deal they could have got for Jaroslav Halak, I would beg to differ, and I would argue that with them because I know of some teams that were absolutely shocked that he was traded and they didn't even get a call."

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07-11-2010, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...037/story.html

"What surprised me the most about this whole thing is that (the Canadiens) didn't take their time to move Halak," McGuire said.

"If the Canadiens think that was the best deal they could have got for Jaroslav Halak, I would beg to differ, and I would argue that with them because I know of some teams that were absolutely shocked that he was traded and they didn't even get a call."
and yada, yada, yada, yada...

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07-11-2010, 08:59 AM
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Nice, i bet some people won't let it go for the next 2 yrs. Especially if Halak does well and Price bombs. It's always like this.. some people still want Koivu and Kovalev back.

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07-11-2010, 09:01 AM
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Yah we need another thread about Halak. Who gives a **** he is a St Louis Blue now, get over it. You guys remind me of the guy who gets dumped by his girlfriend and keeps bugging her ass to take you back ! It's over, move on!

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07-11-2010, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...037/story.html

"What surprised me the most about this whole thing is that (the Canadiens) didn't take their time to move Halak," McGuire said.

"If the Canadiens think that was the best deal they could have got for Jaroslav Halak, I would beg to differ, and I would argue that with them because I know of some teams that were absolutely shocked that he was traded and they didn't even get a call."
Habs organization was and still is badly managed for years. Not bad enough to get a lottery pick but good enough to borderline make the playoffs year after year. Do not be blind with the last playoffs success, the Habs did not play well in most of the games.

Getting outshot most of the games like 2 for 1 is not the recipe to win the Stanley Cup (unless you have a hot goalie). The time in our zone compared to the time in their zone was very bad too.

And now Gauthier is thinking wrong if he is happy with the team right now... remember we lost to the Leafs in the last game to get the last spot in the playoffs...

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:09 AM
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HomaridII
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Originally Posted by PunkinDrublic View Post
Yah we need another thread about Halak. Who gives a **** he is a St Louis Blue now, get over it. You guys remind me of the guy who gets dumped by his girlfriend and keeps bugging her ass to take you back ! It's over, move on!
I don't necessarily agree with anything on the article, I just posted it because I thought it was worth reading and because I get $1 from hf for every response to a thread I start.

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:14 AM
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I don't mind McGuire most of the time, but he's talking in hingsight. That's pretty easy to do. It's not like Kopitar and Staal were obvious choices at the time of the draft. Brule, Skille. Setogushi, Lee and Bourdon went before them. Also, at the time, Halak wasn't even supposed to become this good.

I hope he's wrong about the "we could have had more" thing. Then again, if Eller was the one we wanted, it would have been this trade over one with a first round pick and a prospect...

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07-11-2010, 09:16 AM
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It isn't about what the best value we could've got for him. Our GM was high on Lars Eller and wanted Lars Eller, to be quite frank for a prospect, to our team, he has more value then most other teams could've offered. Almost like a reverse-Markov situation, sure we could get better "value" overall, but could we get a better fit?

Eller is a prospect that is in the mold of a player we could definitely use, a sure fire fit for our team and needed asset.

Maybe other teams could've given NHL ready players, a top 6 forward, etc, stuff that would've addressed immediate needs possibly but far less long term needs.

Habs are developing size now and Eller was the only way they were going to be able to start developing size that is NHL ready now till 5 years from now, not 3 years from now till 5 years from now.

Eller was the real deal and St. Louis and Montreal make good partners. (Maybe not now though). Either way they're out west. I think St. Louis/Dallas are probably Gauthiers main 2 trading partners, not because they're fits but possibly because the relationships with those franchises are good.

If you pretend the D'ago deal was part of this deal, which it very well could have been made in advance. Maybe part of the deal was we give you Pulashaj now, later when you're done your playoff run we get Halak for Eller. Looking at it as a hole, it isn't such a bad deal after all. (Remember how pissed St. Louis fans were when they lost this guy for D'ago? Now habs fans are sort of pissed about what we got for Halak, it balances it out a bit though imo, we ***** their team of 2 of their best prospects and a fighter prospect, and they got a goalie out of it who may be a top 10 goalie in the league, he also may not be though. Remember with any young player it's always a gamble, I don't doubt Halak personally but many people do.)

We get the better of 3 prospects in the deal. They get the better NHLer in the deal (if D'ago can be called one then I guess 2 NHLers)

I think it was the reason Gauthier didn't wait to hear other offers. He had probably made the deal in advance. He was high on Eller plain and simple.

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
I don't necessarily agree with anything on the article, I just posted it because I thought it was worth reading and because I get $1 from hf for every response to a thread I start.
so you're about to make a few hundred bucks I guess ;-)

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07-11-2010, 09:19 AM
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I wonder if Pierre McGuire is still in his quest to convince the world that HE should be the GM and not Pierre Gauthier.

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07-11-2010, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
It isn't about what the best value we could've got for him. Our GM was high on Lars Eller and wanted Lars Eller, to be quite frank for a prospect, to our team, he has more value then most other teams could've offered. Almost like a reverse-Markov situation, sure we could get better "value" overall, but could we get a better fit?

Eller is a prospect that is in the mold of a player we could definitely use, a sure fire fit for our team and needed asset.

Maybe other teams could've given NHL ready players, a top 6 forward, etc, stuff that would've addressed immediate needs possibly but far less long term needs.

Habs are developing size now and Eller was the only way they were going to be able to start developing size that is NHL ready now till 5 years from now, not 3 years from now till 5 years from now.

Eller was the real deal and St. Louis and Montreal make good partners. (Maybe not now though). Either way they're out west. I think St. Louis/Dallas are probably Gauthiers main 2 trading partners, not because they're fits but possibly because the relationships with those franchises are good.

If you pretend the D'ago deal was part of this deal, which it very well could have been made in advance. Maybe part of the deal was we give you Pulashaj now, later when you're done your playoff run we get Halak for Eller. Looking at it as a hole, it isn't such a bad deal after all. (Remember how pissed St. Louis fans were when they lost this guy for D'ago? Now habs fans are sort of pissed about what we got for Halak, it balances it out a bit though imo, we ***** their team of 2 of their best prospects and a fighter prospect, and they got a goalie out of it who may be a top 10 goalie in the league, he also may not be though. Remember with any young player it's always a gamble, I don't doubt Halak personally but many people do.)

We get the better of 3 prospects in the deal. They get the better NHLer in the deal (if D'ago can be called one then I guess 2 NHLers)

I think it was the reason Gauthier didn't wait to hear other offers. He had probably made the deal in advance. He was high on Eller plain and simple.
Of course they are good trading partners, we lose our trades with them, they want to trade with us more for sure .

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
It isn't about what the best value we could've got for him. Our GM was high on Lars Eller and wanted Lars Eller, to be quite frank for a prospect, to our team, he has more value then most other teams could've offered. Almost like a reverse-Markov situation, sure we could get better "value" overall, but could we get a better fit?

Eller is a prospect that is in the mold of a player we could definitely use, a sure fire fit for our team and needed asset.

Maybe other teams could've given NHL ready players, a top 6 forward, etc, stuff that would've addressed immediate needs possibly but far less long term needs.

Habs are developing size now and Eller was the only way they were going to be able to start developing size that is NHL ready now till 5 years from now, not 3 years from now till 5 years from now.

Eller was the real deal and St. Louis and Montreal make good partners. (Maybe not now though). Either way they're out west. I think St. Louis/Dallas are probably Gauthiers main 2 trading partners, not because they're fits but possibly because the relationships with those franchises are good.

If you pretend the D'ago deal was part of this deal, which it very well could have been made in advance. Maybe part of the deal was we give you Pulashaj now, later when you're done your playoff run we get Halak for Eller. Looking at it as a hole, it isn't such a bad deal after all. (Remember how pissed St. Louis fans were when they lost this guy for D'ago? Now habs fans are sort of pissed about what we got for Halak, it balances it out a bit though imo, we ***** their team of 2 of their best prospects and a fighter prospect, and they got a goalie out of it who may be a top 10 goalie in the league, he also may not be though. Remember with any young player it's always a gamble, I don't doubt Halak personally but many people do.)

We get the better of 3 prospects in the deal. They get the better NHLer in the deal (if D'ago can be called one)

I think it was the reason Gauthier didn't wait to hear other offers. He had probably made the deal in advance. He was high on Eller plain and simple.
I am with you on that. IMO the Habs identified the potential trading partners and the parameters of what they wanted in return (a elite forward prospect who was NHL ready NOW, no salary in return) and settled on Eller. After that it was just a matter of negotiating. JD has said that Gauthier only wanted Eller and no matter how much the Blues tried to change the deal, we only wanted Eller. To me, that tells me that the other potential trading partners did not have an elite forward NHL ready prospect, preferebly a center, who we could get in return.

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:25 AM
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so you're about to make a few hundred bucks I guess ;-)
If only it was true .. hehehehehe

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07-11-2010, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
"If the Canadiens think that was the best deal they could have got for Jaroslav Halak, I would beg to differ, and I would argue that with them because I know of some teams that were absolutely shocked that he was traded and they didn't even get a call."
There's something wrong with that. I can remember reading and hearing after the playoffs that the Habs were shopping both Price & Halak. So now it was news to some teams. Where were they? Sticking their heads where the sun did not shine.

The teams that were shocked, I'm guessing, were the ones that probably made ridiculous offers and were caught trying to bluff Gauthier. I'm not a big Gauthier fan but I think he got the best deal possible under the circumstances. He was caught between a rock & a hard place. And those teams that are shocked now, knew it at the time and were trying to squeeze Gauthier.

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Old
07-11-2010, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
I am with you on that. IMO the Habs identified the potential trading partners and the parameters of what they wanted in return (a elite forward prospect who was NHL ready NOW, no salary in return) and settled on Eller. After that it was just a matter of negotiating. JD has said that Gauthier only wanted Eller and no matter how much the Blues tried to change the deal, we only wanted Eller. To me, that tells me that the other potential trading partners did not have an elite forward NHL ready prospect, preferebly a center, who we could get in return.
Exactly everyone can ***** and moan about the trade all they want but the fact of the matter is that St. Louis basically got the edge to negotiating for one of the goalies earlier in the season.

I wouldn't be surprised if Gauthier got a call from JD back in the winter that went along the lines of,

JD "Hello, Pierre we hear your going to be moving a goaltender this summer"
PG "Yes, that's correct we haven't decided which will be moved yet or what our desired return is but this will be ringing true in a few months, I take it your interested JD?"
JD "Very, as an act of good faith and possibly the first kick of the can at the end of the season at either. We'd like to do a preamble trade to show our genuine interest and would expect a gentleman's agreement where we will get an opportunity to get a hold of one of them at the end of the season"
PG "Alright, well a potential deal could revolve around one of the goalies and Matt D'Agostini, so perhaps Matt D'Agostini for a prospect now and will complete the deal with the main pieces at the end of the season"
JD " agreed"

Then the final deal become
To St.Louis
Halak
D'Agostini

To MTL
Eller
Palushaj
Schultz

Which is much more fair then people made it out to be

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07-11-2010, 09:57 AM
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Then the final deal become
To St.Louis
Halak
D'Agostini

To MTL
Eller
Palushaj
Schultz

Which is much more fair then people made it out to be
This the way I feel too.

Given what the market for goaltenders has been in the post-lockout NHL I think the return that we got was as good as we could have gotten. Essentially we got a Top 15 1st rounder, a 2nd rounder and a 3rd. It's far from terrible.. Not to mention Eller has already showed he can be great at the AHL level and he's shown good things in his 7 games at the NHL level so his odds at busting out are very low.

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07-11-2010, 10:12 AM
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If these teams were interested in a player you would think they would do the calling.

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07-11-2010, 10:14 AM
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I don't necessarily agree with anything on the article, I just posted it because I thought it was worth reading and because I get $1 from hf for every response to a thread I start.
Let me give you a hand.

Why is it the English media constantly bash the Habs organization? It's because of the English media that the Canadiens can't attract free agents and that the pressure is too much for our young players. I think the Canadiens should ban all the English media from getting credentials to cover the team. That would teach them a lesson. And they don't even right goodly.

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07-11-2010, 10:18 AM
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Yes Pierre.....the Habs should have waited until all the other teams had their goalie positions filled so that there would have been very little market for Halak. Maybe Halak would have gone to SKA of the KHL instead of Nabokov.

Gawd I wish some desperate NHL team would give McGuire a job just to get him off the air.

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07-11-2010, 10:21 AM
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Let me give you a hand.

Why is it the English media constantly bash the Habs organization? It's because of the English media that the Canadiens can't attract free agents and that the pressure is too much for our young players. I think the Canadiens should ban all the English media from getting credentials to cover the team. That would teach them a lesson. And they don't even right goodly.

If it was Bertrand Raymond that would have wrote this article, this thread would already have 300 post in it.

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07-11-2010, 10:23 AM
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If it was Bertrand Raymond that would have wrote this article, this thread would already have 300 post in it.
That's because he's 4x the idiot that Pierre McGuire is.

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Old
07-11-2010, 10:27 AM
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Habs organization was and still is badly managed for years. Not bad enough to get a lottery pick but good enough to borderline make the playoffs year after year. Do not be blind with the last playoffs success, the Habs did not play well in most of the games.

Getting outshot most of the games like 2 for 1 is not the recipe to win the Stanley Cup (unless you have a hot goalie). The time in our zone compared to the time in their zone was very bad too.

And now Gauthier is thinking wrong if he is happy with the team right now... remember we lost to the Leafs in the last game to get the last spot in the playoffs...
you're probably the same guy who said all those UFA signings were a big fail, only to cheer for them when they made it to the ECF. Then you whined about the team again when they lost.

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07-11-2010, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by HomaridII View Post
http://www.montrealgazette.com/sport...037/story.html

"What surprised me the most about this whole thing is that (the Canadiens) didn't take their time to move Halak," McGuire said.

"If the Canadiens think that was the best deal they could have got for Jaroslav Halak, I would beg to differ, and I would argue that with them because I know of some teams that were absolutely shocked that he was traded and they didn't even get a call."
It's funny, I thought that they traded him at the right time, before the other goalies hit the market. Had they waited, teams would have known who wanted to go where, possibly narrowing the possible destinations even further and by the same token, the return in a trade.

Further more, by trading him at that time, it allowed the Habs to go after the backup that THEY wanted right off the bat.

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07-11-2010, 10:27 AM
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Yes Pierre.....the Habs should have waited until all the other teams had their goalie positions filled so that there would have been very little market for Halak. Maybe Halak would have gone to SKA of the KHL instead of Nabokov.

Gawd I wish some desperate NHL team would give McGuire a job just to get him off the air.
I second that!!

Can't wait to tear him apart for all the bonehead moves he makes.
The day will come when he is exposed for the phony wannabe GM he thinks he is.

Can't wait for the day.

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Old
07-11-2010, 10:57 AM
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Marc Staal before Carey Price ?

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