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Reality for 2010-11: Post-Gagne

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Old
07-19-2010, 05:33 PM
  #26
jd2210
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I honestly think this is the team Homer plans on going to camp with. He'll resign Powe, and Bart will start with the Phantoms. Man I hope I'm wrong. We need a flipping goalie.

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07-19-2010, 05:41 PM
  #27
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[QUOTE=Chris Shafer;26989657]
. Washington and Pittsburgh are overrated, though they might have improved this past offseason. We're still the upper echelon of NHL teams with the sickest defense I've ever seen.

UOTE]
Maybe. however until the flyers show they can beat the pens, it doesnt matter if they are overrated. Wash is a good offensive team who will light up Leighton worse than xmas tree. Both teams have a clear cut advanatge in goal and their goalies are not great but still clearly better than what the flyers have. The flyers could have 6 Prongers on d and i still odnt thinkthey win the cup with the crap they have in net.

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07-19-2010, 05:42 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by jd2210 View Post
I honestly think this is the team Homer plans on going to camp with. He'll resign Powe, and Bart will start with the Phantoms. Man I hope I'm wrong. We need a flipping goalie.
I believe this is the team he's going with to, but he's not going to re-sign Powe unless Cote is waived. Our roster is actually too full right now.

It's funny when you compare our off-season to our division rivals.

Pens: Added Michalek and Martin at reasonable prices.

Rangers: Signed Biron and re-signed Prospal. Boogard is lol-worthy, but they actually did need an enforcer.

Devils: Volchenkov and Kovalchuk signed. New coach.

Islanders: It's the Islanders.

So, yeah, our two biggest competitors vastly improved and even the Rags got a bit better. We are actually worse then last year in my opinion.

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07-19-2010, 05:59 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
I believe this is the team he's going with to, but he's not going to re-sign Powe unless Cote is waived. Our roster is actually too full right now.

It's funny when you compare our off-season to our division rivals.

Pens: Added Michalek and Martin at reasonable prices.

Rangers: Signed Biron and re-signed Prospal. Boogard is lol-worthy, but they actually did need an enforcer.

Devils: Volchenkov and Kovalchuk signed. New coach.

Islanders: It's the Islanders.

So, yeah, our two biggest competitors vastly improved and even the Rags got a bit better. We are actually worse then last year in my opinion.
I don't agree with this. They have improved, yes, but so have the Flyers. The Pens added Michalek and Martin but lost Gonchar. Not that great. The Rangers stayed the same. No questions asked. Devils got Volchenkov and Kovalchuk, and that is terrifying. But they lost Martin and will have to lose some other contracts as well, so we will see how good they really are when the season starts. And the Islanders don't scare me...yet. The Flyers added Meszaros and O'Donnell on D which gives us prob the best in the league. Zherdev should adequately replace Gagne if not exceed what Gagne could do. Leino with a full season COULD replace Gagne. JVR COULD also replace Gagne. Those aren't guarantees, but they are certainly definite possibilities. Also a goalie is hopefully coming. So yes, the other teams in the division got better but I wouldn't call them vastly better. The Flyers improved at the same rate as the other teams in the division, and potentially got better than the other teams depending on what happens in net and how Zherdev et al perform.

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Old
07-19-2010, 06:00 PM
  #30
CharlieGirl
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The goaltending is the same, which diss the tandem or not, they got us to the finals.
Not really. Emery got a number of wins before getting injured. Leighton and Boucher were extremely lucky to face the teams they did in the playoffs, until the finals. Then when faced with a team with a real offense, we all know what happened.

If the Flyers had had to face Washington or Pittsburgh along the way, I don't believe for a moment that they go to the Cup Finals.

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Old
07-19-2010, 06:47 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
I believe this is the team he's going with to, but he's not going to re-sign Powe unless Cote is waived. Our roster is actually too full right now.

It's funny when you compare our off-season to our division rivals.

Pens: Added Michalek and Martin at reasonable prices.

Rangers: Signed Biron and re-signed Prospal. Boogard is lol-worthy, but they actually did need an enforcer.

Devils: Volchenkov and Kovalchuk signed. New coach.

Islanders: It's the Islanders.

So, yeah, our two biggest competitors vastly improved and even the Rags got a bit better. We are actually worse then last year in my opinion.
Looking at what a team adds without also looking at what they lost is useless.

Pens added: Michalek and Martin
Pens subtractd: Gonchar, Ponikarovsky, Fedotenko, Guerin, Leopold, Eaton
With 2.9M in cap space

Devs added: Volchenkov, Arnott
Devs subtracted: Martin, McAmmond, Skoula, Neidermayer
With -2.3M in cap space (assuming Kovy got 6M per year)

Flyers added: Meszaros, Zherdev, O'Donnell, Shelley, Walker
Flyers subtracted: Gagne, Asham, Krajicek
With 1M in cap space

Not doing the Rangers. They didn't add anyone of significance.

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:03 PM
  #32
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Any chance Kariya signs for cheap?

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07-19-2010, 07:39 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
Looking at what a team adds without also looking at what they lost is useless.

Pens added: Michalek and Martin
Pens subtractd: Gonchar, Ponikarovsky, Fedotenko, Guerin, Leopold, Eaton
With 2.9M in cap space
Got worse on the wing and marginally improved defensively.

Devs added: Volchenkov, Arnott
Devs subtracted: Martin, McAmmond, Skoula, Neidermayer
With -2.3M in cap space (assuming Kovy got 6M per year)
Got a little deeper offensively, but their defense is relatively a wash.

Flyers added: Meszaros, Zherdev, O'Donnell, Shelley, Walker
Flyers subtracted: Gagne, Asham, Krajicek
With 1M in cap space
Got significantly better defensively, and stayed relatively stagnant offensively.

Not doing the Rangers. They didn't add anyone of significance.
See bold.

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07-19-2010, 07:46 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
See bold.
One big difference:

Rangers: have a franchise goaltender and a decent backup
Pens - have a franchise goaltender and a decent backup
Devils - have an aging, but still franchise goaltender (and have now added a huge offensive weapon)

Flyers have.... nothing. Not even a decent backup.

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07-19-2010, 07:48 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
One big difference:

Rangers: have a franchise goaltender and a decent backup
Pens - have a franchise goaltender and a decent backup
Devils - have an aging, but still franchise goaltender (and have now added a huge offensive weapon)

Flyers have.... nothing. Not even a decent backup.
Fleury is hardly a franchise goalie.

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07-19-2010, 07:48 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
Looking at what a team adds without also looking at what they lost is useless.

Pens added: Michalek and Martin
Pens subtractd: Gonchar, Ponikarovsky, Fedotenko, Guerin, Leopold, Eaton
With 2.9M in cap space

Devs added: Volchenkov, Arnott
Devs subtracted: Martin, McAmmond, Skoula, Neidermayer
With -2.3M in cap space (assuming Kovy got 6M per year)

Flyers added: Meszaros, Zherdev, O'Donnell, Shelley, Walker
Flyers subtracted: Gagne, Asham, Krajicek
With 1M in cap space

Not doing the Rangers. They didn't add anyone of significance.
devils added Talinder on D. their d is improved.

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:48 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Fleury is hardly a franchise goalie.
Would you rather have Fleury or Leighton/Boucher?

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:51 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I don't agree with this. They have improved, yes, but so have the Flyers. The Pens added Michalek and Martin but lost Gonchar. Not that great. The Rangers stayed the same. No questions asked. Devils got Volchenkov and Kovalchuk, and that is terrifying. But they lost Martin and will have to lose some other contracts as well, so we will see how good they really are when the season starts. And the Islanders don't scare me...yet. The Flyers added Meszaros and O'Donnell on D which gives us prob the best in the league. Zherdev should adequately replace Gagne if not exceed what Gagne could do. Leino with a full season COULD replace Gagne. JVR COULD also replace Gagne. Those aren't guarantees, but they are certainly definite possibilities. Also a goalie is hopefully coming. So yes, the other teams in the division got better but I wouldn't call them vastly better. The Flyers improved at the same rate as the other teams in the division, and potentially got better than the other teams depending on what happens in net and how Zherdev et al perform.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
Looking at what a team adds without also looking at what they lost is useless.

Pens added: Michalek and Martin
Pens subtractd: Gonchar, Ponikarovsky, Fedotenko, Guerin, Leopold, Eaton
With 2.9M in cap space

Devs added: Volchenkov, Arnott
Devs subtracted: Martin, McAmmond, Skoula, Neidermayer
With -2.3M in cap space (assuming Kovy got 6M per year)

Flyers added: Meszaros, Zherdev, O'Donnell, Shelley, Walker
Flyers subtracted: Gagne, Asham, Krajicek
With 1M in cap space

Not doing the Rangers. They didn't add anyone of significance.
That wasn't really my point.

Most of the teams we'll be competing with either got better or at least made the right moves this off-season.

Not only did our team make all the wrong moves, but I'd argue that we're worse then last season.

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07-19-2010, 07:51 PM
  #39
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Would you rather have Fleury or Leighton/Boucher?
None of the above.

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:51 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Fleury is hardly a franchise goalie.
Depends from person-to-person.

Still, that's arguing semantics. That's not CG's point.

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:53 PM
  #41
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I must be the only one who doesn't have a problem with Homer's moves. We all knew that Gagne was getting moved. Walker will probably get sent to the minors or put on waivers. I don't think Homer's done yet. He fixed up the defense by getting Mezaros and O'Donnell. Signing Zherdev to a 1 year deal let's him see what Zherdev can do in our offense. I think that Leino and Giroux will have better seasons and face it, no one is as injury prone as Simon was.

He knows Turco is out there and would be a great addition. Let's hold off on burning him at the stake just yet.
Im with ya man

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Old
07-19-2010, 08:37 PM
  #42
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here's a problem, what happens if chicago doesnt want to resign niemi after arbitration? what will that do to the turco situation?

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07-19-2010, 08:42 PM
  #43
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here's a problem, what happens if chicago doesnt want to resign niemi after arbitration? what will that do to the turco situation?
That's the 29th, right? Flyers should sign Turco this week to avoid that being an issue.

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07-19-2010, 08:50 PM
  #44
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That's the 29th, right? Flyers should sign Turco this week to avoid that being an issue.
they should. sadly, they should have kept gagne, and not done almost everything they have this offseason. i really dont trust holmgren to take a crap without trading the copyright to the Flyers logo to pittsburgh at this point.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:03 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Garbage Goal View Post
That wasn't really my point.

Most of the teams we'll be competing with either got better or at least made the right moves this off-season.

Not only did our team make all the wrong moves, but I'd argue that we're worse then last season.
Please state your argument. I don't see how the Flyers are worse.

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07-19-2010, 09:25 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by BWAVgal View Post
I must be the only one who doesn't have a problem with Homer's moves. We all knew that Gagne was getting moved. Walker will probably get sent to the minors or put on waivers. I don't think Homer's done yet. He fixed up the defense by getting Mezaros and O'Donnell. Signing Zherdev to a 1 year deal let's him see what Zherdev can do in our offense. I think that Leino and Giroux will have better seasons and face it, no one is as injury prone as Simon was.

He knows Turco is out there and would be a great addition. Let's hold off on burning him at the stake just yet.
I agree with this post.

I think Homer will sign Turco and face it-- Gagne was injury prone. I see the good and the bad from this deal and after reviewing both sides, I think it's more of a good trade if we look past losing Gagne.

We could make the situation work for us if we WANT to. Show some support people and don't quit on the team just yet!

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:29 PM
  #47
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Someone posted this exact lineup earlier with perhaps the exception of Powe but, this is how I would do it. I wouldn't be opposed to getting Turco but, it would be a dick move to make considering we just signed Leighton or to Boucher who's play helped us get to the playoffs and the SCF. We could waive Boucher which would give us 3.5 million + in cap space, or we could send Bartulis down and have 3.2 million in cap space, and we could maybe sign Turco for 2.5 million?

edit: We would be waiving Cote and Walker, and re-signing Powe. If we can trade Cote to a team that would be willing to play him and he'd want that I'd be all for that, even if it was just for future considerations. Can someone who is on a teams roster be given permission to try out for another team?

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Jeff Carter ($5.000m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Nikolai Zherdev ($2.000m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Ville Leino ($0.800m)
Daniel Carcillo ($1.075m) / Claude Giroux ($0.821m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Darroll Powe ($0.650m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Ian Laperriere ($1.166m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($3.200m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Sean O'Donnell ($1.300m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Michael Leighton ($1.550m) /Brian Boucher ($0.925m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $57,684,763; BONUSES: $937,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,652,737


Last edited by ilovetheflyers8: 07-19-2010 at 09:38 PM.
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Old
07-19-2010, 09:55 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by ilovetheflyers8 View Post
Someone posted this exact lineup earlier with perhaps the exception of Powe but, this is how I would do it. I wouldn't be opposed to getting Turco but, it would be a dick move to make considering we just signed Leighton or to Boucher who's play helped us get to the playoffs and the SCF. We could waive Boucher which would give us 3.5 million + in cap space, or we could send Bartulis down and have 3.2 million in cap space, and we could maybe sign Turco for 2.5 million?

edit: We would be waiving Cote and Walker, and re-signing Powe. If we can trade Cote to a team that would be willing to play him and he'd want that I'd be all for that, even if it was just for future considerations. Can someone who is on a teams roster be given permission to try out for another team?

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Jeff Carter ($5.000m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Nikolai Zherdev ($2.000m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Ville Leino ($0.800m)
Daniel Carcillo ($1.075m) / Claude Giroux ($0.821m) / James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m)
Darroll Powe ($0.650m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Ian Laperriere ($1.166m)
Jody Shelley ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Braydon Coburn ($3.200m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Sean O'Donnell ($1.300m)
Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Michael Leighton ($1.550m) /Brian Boucher ($0.925m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $57,684,763; BONUSES: $937,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,652,737
No way they waive Walker. If they had that intention they would have let him or his agent know ahead of time so he didn't gush all over about being Flyer.

It just looks like Carle or Coburn would get moved although the Flyers would have the slowest bottom pairing d (O'Donnell & Walker) in the league.

What teams are out there that could use a 5/6 dman like Walker (tough, shot blocker, excellent at protecting skilled players)?

CAR, NYI, ATL, EDM?

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07-19-2010, 10:04 PM
  #49
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Please state your argument. I don't see how the Flyers are worse.
Look at the roster. They down-graded from Gagne to Zherdev. Big down-grade there.

They'll have Carcillo playing in the top nine again.

Powe and Asham are being replaced by Shelley. Big down-grade.

We have eight d-men...which makes no ****ing sense. Meszaros was probably the least desirable option out of all the top four d-men Homer could have gone after. Ask Ottawa and Tampa fans, the guy has been regressing the last four years straight. So our third pairing is improved, but at a massive cost.

Last year we had Emery, Boucher, and Leighton split games so no one had to deal with a starter's load. Even in the playoffs Boosh and Leighton split games. This year we have no Emery and Leighton is going to be given a starter's load. That's a down-grade.

So pretty much a big down-grade in everywhere but defense and even then the upgrade at defensive was excessive and at a large cost.

I also think the East will undoubtedly be better this year (as well as some of the contenders in the West).

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07-19-2010, 10:05 PM
  #50
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We're worse off because we're going into the season with Michael F. Leighton as our starting goaltender. At least last year we were going into the season with Emery.

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