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#12 Montreal Canadiens prospects

View Poll Results: who's #12?
Cedrick Desjardins, G 13 7.18%
Joonas Nattinen, C 6 3.31%
Joe Stejskal, D 0 0%
Ian Schultz, RW 7 3.87%
Gabriel Dumont, C 1 0.55%
Aaron Palushaj, RW 45 24.86%
Andreas Engqvist, C 28 15.47%
Andrew Conboy, LW 0 0%
Mathieu Carle, D 28 15.47%
Maxim Trunev, RW 0 0%
Greg Pateryn, D 2 1.10%
Brendan Gallagher, RW 2 1.10%
Steve Quailer, RW 4 2.21%
Mac Bennett, D 45 24.86%
Brock Trotter, C 0 0%
Voters: 181. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
07-25-2010, 01:01 PM
  #26
Stjonnypopo
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Once again, Engqvist.

He's gonna play for the habs at some point this season, open your eyes fellow Habs fans!!

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07-25-2010, 01:01 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
And Palushaj becomes the coveted #1 most overrated prospect in Habs land... okay 2nd after Avtsin

But seriously, he doesn't have the upside of Engqvist, Carle or Bennett and it's not like he's more of a sure shot either.
Geez, god forbid someone disagrees with your all mighty opinion.

palushaj did well last season in the A. Not many people got to see engqvist play and carle's injury list keeps growing. All these things contributed to what you see currently.

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07-25-2010, 01:48 PM
  #28
danyhabsfan
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why Palushaj?


Carle could problably play for the habs this season.
Bennett is also a better choice.

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07-25-2010, 02:03 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Bullsmith View Post
Palushaj.

I have to say, despite the lack of true blue-chippers below Subban and maybe Eller, this is still a very deep list. Palushaj's a very talented guy with a legit shot at making the NHL and he's fighting for twelfth spot. And there are legit prospects beneath him too. I was just eyeing the Leafs list, and it's drastically shallow in comparison. Then again Burke was able to come up with guys like Bozak and Gustavson outside the draft, not to mention the absolute fleecing he gave Calgary. (Why is that Calgary GMs feel a need to provide Toronto with franchise-caliber players in return for overpaid mediocraties? Did Gilmour teach them nothing?) Anyway, back on topic, good work TT!
IMO, Leblanc, Kristo, Tinordi could easily fall into that category, and despite hitting bumps in the road, Weber and Maxwell too.

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07-25-2010, 02:04 PM
  #30
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IMO, Leblanc, Kristo, Tinordi could easily fall into that category, and despite hitting bumps in the road, Weber and Maxwell too.
Dunno if they are blue-chippers, but they are close to it.

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07-25-2010, 02:10 PM
  #31
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Bennett, add Walsh.

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07-25-2010, 02:20 PM
  #32
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bennett gaining ground...wooo!

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07-25-2010, 02:33 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
Mark my words on this one, and feel free to tell me if I was wrong, but I am VERY high on Greg Pateryn. Only 20 years old, he has both size and mobility, plus some toughness, all things we need in our backend. I think he is actually in our Top 5-6 prospects.

I think his stock here is underrated because the Habs didn't draft him, so we don't have as many Trevor Timmins quotes in the files regarding him. LOL.
I think him being a former Leafs pick kinda kills some of his potential.

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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
lol...montreal is a polite guy so he probably won't reply like me...but what the ****? Some of your arguements are retarded. Hockey is not a priority for Leblanc? why? because he's spending an extra year in one of the most prestigious universities on the planet? C'mon. Maxwell no hockey sense? Of course the guy has hockey sense. I'll let committment pass, because I'll assume you mean he's lack of physical committment at the NHL level in terms of getting his nose dirty. Not sure how you can say Leblanc, maxwell, engvist, bennett, carle, white and so on are NHL fillers at best, but greg pateryn and Schultz will be 'useful NHLers'...White for instance already has the mold of a guy who will be a useful bottom 6 guy but the unproven shultz is on the list. Not sure what you're thinking.
Yeah, I don't see what Schultz has done to be considered a better prospect than White. Sure he can fight better and is taller, but in arguably every other aspect of the game White is better.


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07-25-2010, 02:36 PM
  #34
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Yeah, I don't see what Schultz has done to be considered a better prospect than White. Sure he can fight better and is taller, but in arguably every other aspect of the game White is better.
I gotta admit though, if conboy, shultz and white all make it. Pretty damn tough 4th line.

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07-25-2010, 03:00 PM
  #35
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Engqvist......I think he wil be the 3th liner center in 3-4 years.....

Plekanec
Eller
Engqvist

( yes no leblanc )

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07-25-2010, 03:19 PM
  #36
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lol...montreal is a polite guy so he probably won't reply like me...but what the ****? Some of your arguements are retarded.
Thanks. I'll admit I am being bold and taking a chance saying what I really think and not going with the crowd. Would you really prefer if everyone just parroted the same opinion for fear of sounding different and thus called 'retarded'?


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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post

Hockey is not a priority for Leblanc? why? because he's spending an extra year in one of the most prestigious universities on the planet? C'mon.
Well, that's my opinion, reading the whole situation, knowing the family background, seeing how he reacted to not making TCJ last year, seeing how WEAK the school he chose is hockey-wise. I think, honestly, that most prospects are more desperate to make the NHL than he is, and that in the end, most good prospects will beat him out. For every ONE Ken Dryden, there are thousands more hockey dropouts.

I have been right on these boards far more often than wrong, but absolutely nothing guarantees I can't be wrong on Leblanc or any other prediction, taken alone.

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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Maxwell no hockey sense? Of course the guy has hockey sense. I'll let committment pass, because I'll assume you mean he's lack of physical committment at the NHL level in terms of getting his nose dirty.
That IS what I mean by commitment, you are correct. And I don't think his hockey sense is TERRIBLE, but it is not good enough to read the game at an NHL level and contribute as a Centreman. The only think I can say is that perhaps if he is moved to LW, his sense will be relatively better, since the demands in that position are less. However, I do not find him tough enough, nor possessing a good enough shot to excel at either role a winger needs to excel at.

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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Not sure how you can say Leblanc, maxwell, engvist, bennett, carle, white and so on are NHL fillers at best, but greg pateryn and Schultz will be 'useful NHLers'...White for instance already has the mold of a guy who will be a useful bottom 6 guy but the unproven shultz is on the list. Not sure what you're thinking.
Let me explain. I have seen enough of Maxwell, Carle and White to have an initial opinion, and it is not that great in terms of upside. Pateryn and Schultz I have seen less, especially Schultz.

I am NOT saying that I would take Schultz over White right now. In fact, if i were Hamilton GM, Schultz might head to Cincy this year. What I AM saying is that the highest potential I can see Schultz attaining is higher than the highest potential I can see White attaining. His chances of attaining that highest potential is not that great of course. In HF terms, perhaps White is 5.5B and Schultz is 6.0-6.5D. Or, Schultz has more chance to become Risebrough (say 3%) than White has to become Tremblay (0.5%). However, White has more chance to make the NHL as another Steve Begin (25%) and hang on for a while.

Pateryn over Carle or Weber is a matter of frame and raw ability. Neither Bulldog has impressed me much at all.

Engqvist is too slow for the NHL, imnsho, and furthermore had less points than our DEFENCE prospect Klubertanz, playing on the SAME SWEDISH TEAM!!! Bennett is too small and weak to make it as an all-round defender. He has a chance to make it as an offensive specialist.

I guess I am cheating with Leblanc for effect. Of course his highest upside is better than most of our prospects but I am VERY concerned he will never max out his ability due to lack of will or motivation to do so. He COULD be more than filler. But I think he won't even get to the NHL for us to see what he can do.

Believe me I desperately want to be WRONG about him!

In my ideal world, you will be shaking your head in a few years trying to figure out how I knew Pateryn would make it big, but laughing at my 2010 pessimism about Leblanc.



Last edited by BaseballCoach: 07-25-2010 at 03:24 PM.
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Old
07-25-2010, 03:20 PM
  #37
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I was under the impression Olivier Fortier was not re-signed by us, so why put him in the "add" list?

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07-25-2010, 03:25 PM
  #38
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I was under the impression Olivier Fortier was not re-signed by us, so why put him in the "add" list?
I don't know where you got this, because he still have two years left on his contract.

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Old
07-25-2010, 03:46 PM
  #39
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At this point, Bennett.

Dumont with no vote ? Incredible.

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07-25-2010, 03:47 PM
  #40
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Thanks. I'll admit I am being bold and taking a chance saying what I really think and not going with the crowd. Would you really prefer if everyone just parroted the same opinion for fear of sounding different and thus called 'retarded'?
No I understand, just far out there IMO. You omitted some excellent prospects, seems like you brought them down, like leblanc to suit your 'pateryn' will surprise theory.

Quote:
Well, that's my opinion, reading the whole situation, knowing the family background, seeing how he reacted to not making TCJ last year, seeing how WEAK the school he chose is hockey-wise. I think, honestly, that most prospects are more desperate to make the NHL than he is, and that in the end, most good prospects will beat him out. For every ONE Ken Dryden, there are thousands more hockey dropouts.

I have been right on these boards far more often than wrong, but absolutely nothing guarantees I can't be wrong on Leblanc or any other prediction, taken alone.
He'll grow up. I mean, if you're questioning his desire, I can't argue nor agree with you, because I don't know his personally but as I said, not every kid at 18 is thinking about the big show. Some just want to be kids. He's staying with what he's comfortable with, let him go to havard. As much as I want him in the CHL, I can respect his decision. As for being wrong, look, I can mention any team in the league and say 'they won't win cup next year' and there's what, a 29/30% chance I'm right. Very easy to suggest someone won't be a star or a legit top 2 center, cuz they don't grow on trees. He's as talented and has as much desire as any other legit top 2 center prospect. Some make it, some don't.

Quote:
That IS what I mean by commitment, you are correct. And I don't think his hockey sense is TERRIBLE, but it is not good enough to read the game at an NHL level and contribute. The only think I can say is that perhaps if he is moved to LW, his sense will be relatively better, since the demands in that position are less. However, I do not find him tough enough, nor possessing a good enough shot to excel at either role a winger needs to excel at.
I actually think he's better at center IMO. We'll see though. I can agree with your commitment concept however I think his hockey IQ is above average in terms of prospects.

Quote:
Let me explain. I have seen enough of Maxwell, Carle and White to have an initial opinion, and it is not that great in terms of upside. Pateryn and Schultz I have seen less, especially Schultz.

I am NOT saying that I would take Schultz over White right now. In fact, if i were Hamilton GM, Schultz might head to Cincy this year. What I AM saying is that the highest potential I can see Schultz attaining is higher than the highest potential I can see White attaining. His chances of attaining that highest potential is not that great of course. In HF terms, perhaps White is 5.5B and Schultz is 6.0-6.5D. Or, Schultz has more chance to become Risebrough (say 3%) than White has to become Tremblay (0.5%). However, White has more chance to make the NHL as another Steve Begin (25%) and hang on for a while.

Pateryn over Carle or Weber is a matter of frame and raw ability. Neither Bulldog has impressed me much at all.

Engqvist is too slow for the NHL, imnsho, and furthermore had less points than our DEFENCE prospect Klubertanz, playing on the SAME SWEDISH TEAM!!! Bennett is too small and weak to make it as an all-round defender. He has a chance to make it as an offensive specialist.

I guess I am cheating with Leblanc for effect. Of course his highest upside is better than most of our prospects but I am VERY concerned he will never max out his ability due to lack of will or motivation to do so. He COULD be more than filler. But I think he won't even get to the NHL for us to see what he can do.

Believe me I desperately want to be WRONG about him!

In my ideal world, you will be shaking your head in a few years trying to figure out how I knew Pateryn would make it big, but laughing at my 2010 pessimism about Leblanc.

Besides shultz aggressive nature and fighting ability, what makes you suggest he can be a bordeline 2nd line(based on your 6.5 potential)? I fail to see how white is 5.5B. White is probably 6.5C IMO. A fringe player now(he hasn't made it yet), but possible to be a 3rd liner. His offensive #s in the WHL are better than shultz's.

I can understand saying pateryn has impressed you more than carle...but really, more than weber? Weber is a legit top 4 potential D. He may not end up as one, but he certainly has the potential to be one. Pateryn...not so much IMO, but i'm no expert.

Engqvist may be slow, but Lang is a pretty slow guy too. Lang made a career and he wasn't fast or physical, same could happen with Engqvist. If he has the smarts, it will compensate IMO. We'll see I guess.

I'm also curious to know how much PP time Engqvist gets over a guy like Kluber. Besides, dif roles, one's an offensive d-man who prob gets pushed off puck easy and another is a big two-way center. It's like me asking who you'd prefer, a guy like Ribeiro or Mike Richards. One is better offensively and has more points but the other is a better two-way player. Hell, I'd take Jordan Staal over Ribeiro too and the point difference is even greater.

I can agree with your ideal world. Hopefully they all make it right? We'll see. I suppose one guy who will surprise you is Bennett too. I keep reading he has stud potential and he's not even on your usefulness list We all have our preferences I just think you're throwing a lot of kids under the bus to support your theory.

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07-25-2010, 04:27 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
I can understand saying pateryn has impressed you more than carle...but really, more than weber? Weber is a legit top 4 potential D. He may not end up as one, but he certainly has the potential to be one. Pateryn...not so much IMO, but i'm no expert.

Engqvist may be slow, but Lang is a pretty slow guy too. Lang made a career and he wasn't fast or physical, same could happen with Engqvist. If he has the smarts, it will compensate IMO. We'll see I guess.

I'm also curious to know how much PP time Engqvist gets over a guy like Kluber.

I can agree with your ideal world. Hopefully they all make it right? We'll see. I suppose one guy who will surprise you is Bennett too. I keep reading he has stud potential and he's not even on your usefulness list We all have our preferences I just think you're throwing a lot of kids under the bus to support your theory.
Weber has not impressed me, sorry. Too small without explosive speed to make up for it. and without even the unreal shot of a MAB. Filler at best.

Lang for most of his career was a better skater than Engqvist is now. Lang at 38 years old had smarts that most 38 yos still in the league possess but in his prime was faster than Engqvist. Lang in his later years could have probably racked up ppg in Sweden, maybe more. Perhaps if Engqvist can convert to RW and outplay Ryan White, we might have a hard-nosed winger willing to go to the net for the bottom lines. I just don't trust his speed for C.

As for Bennett, I added him to the usefulness list hours ago, but only as an offensive specialist. Might be smarter than Weber but is he stronger physically?

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07-25-2010, 04:29 PM
  #42
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Mac Bennett again for me,I'd have him at #9

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07-25-2010, 06:02 PM
  #43
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At this point, Bennett.

Dumont with no vote ? Incredible.
Why didn't you vote for Dumont? Now take your reason and times it by everyone else.

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07-25-2010, 07:39 PM
  #44
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Voted Carle for the second time in a row. People have seemed to forgotten him since he keeps getting injured.

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07-25-2010, 09:40 PM
  #45
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Geez, god forbid someone disagrees with your all mighty opinion.

palushaj did well last season in the A. Not many people got to see engqvist play and carle's injury list keeps growing. All these things contributed to what you see currently.
I never said people couldn't disagree with me, but I don't see the logic in picking Palushaj

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07-25-2010, 10:08 PM
  #46
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Mac Bennett again for me,I'd have him at #9
Same here!

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07-26-2010, 08:25 AM
  #47
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Well, you saw the same things I did, and he is only 20 yo. Solid frame, moves well, will take the body, sounds like McDonagh, doesn't it? Unfortunately, he wasn't drafted by Timmins, thus underrated here.

The other reason I have him possibly as high as #5-6 is that many of our guys are being vastly over-rated imo.

I don't think the following players have much NHL IMPACT potential:
Louis Leblanc (hockey is not a priority for him), Yannick Weber (size and speed issues), Ben Maxwell (hockey sense and commitment issues), David Desharnais (size and speed issues), Ryan White (speed and hockey sense issues).
No Pateryn does not sound like McDonagh. I've seen a good bit of both, and McDonagh was a stud in the USHS and at Wisconsin he was a regular since his freshman year, something Pateryn hasn't been after two years in the NCAA and McDonagh plays in a tough conference. McDonagh is more physical, as he has the strength and will use his frame more, Pateryn takes the body but it's not a big part of his game, at least when he plays.

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Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo View Post
Once again, Engqvist.

He's gonna play for the habs at some point this season, open your eyes fellow Habs fans!!
Playing for the Habs this year doesn't make a prospect better then another, imo it's not a race, as you are comparing guys that are 18 with guys that are 23 so there's a huge difference in their development stages, which makes it so hard to rank them but is also part of the fun. I like what I've seen from Engqvist but I don't blame people for waiting to see what he can do over here first. But at least time we might of signed a Euro FA that actually helps the Habs, would be a nice change of pace.

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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
Weber has not impressed me, sorry. Too small without explosive speed to make up for it. and without even the unreal shot of a MAB. Filler at best.

Lang for most of his career was a better skater than Engqvist is now. Lang at 38 years old had smarts that most 38 yos still in the league possess but in his prime was faster than Engqvist. Lang in his later years could have probably racked up ppg in Sweden, maybe more. Perhaps if Engqvist can convert to RW and outplay Ryan White, we might have a hard-nosed winger willing to go to the net for the bottom lines. I just don't trust his speed for C.

As for Bennett, I added him to the usefulness list hours ago, but only as an offensive specialist. Might be smarter than Weber but is he stronger physically?
I have the same concerns for Weber and Engqvist.

Bennett is not going to be an offensive specialist, not by any means. His defensvie game is as good as his offensive game. He's got the potential to be a very solid two way D. He was named to the All Star team at the World Junior A Challenge and it wasn't for his offense.

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07-26-2010, 12:53 PM
  #48
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Poll is closed but i vote Bennett.

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07-26-2010, 01:52 PM
  #49
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Carle and Bennett over Palushaj please.


Carle and Palushaj have about the same PPG and Carle is a defenseman.

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07-26-2010, 02:16 PM
  #50
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Bennett is not going to be an offensive specialist, not by any means. His defensvie game is as good as his offensive game. He's got the potential to be a very solid two way D. He was named to the All Star team at the World Junior A Challenge and it wasn't for his offense.
Hockeydb.com lists Bennett at 5'11" and 168 pounds. That makes Josh Gorges seem like Zdeno Chara in comparison.

How do you see Bennett's defensive game translating to NHL conditions?

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