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Old
07-29-2010, 12:41 PM
  #26
kivaerijo
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Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post
One of the main problems is the demonetization of oil. We need petroleum. Without petro, no plastics, no materials for a better life.

!
and those are the important words there. such a subjective idea. my life might be a lot better if i didnt have a lot of the plastic things in my life (bet our country wouldnt be as obese with a lot of plastic items in our lives anyway)

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07-29-2010, 12:48 PM
  #27
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i could be misunderstanding what you are saying...but..i have had my car since 1994..still runs great...paid for...love it, hope to be driving a wrangler with classic plated in a few years . i dont feel the need to get a new car every 5-8 years. so if i have to spend a little more money,,,and over the course of 10-20 years, it will save me money, and it helps the environment (even the slightest bit), and i like the car...why wouldnt i buy a hybrid?

seems to make sense to me. but like i said, i dont need a new car that often, hopefully never actually. but i know i am not the norm, and dont dream about the new "thing" out there all the time.

and i dont see why driving a hybrid has to be some yuppie/environmental gimic. it could just be that "why not try and help a little"

that all being said...dont think that i would pay the 5 dollars a year either way. usually i dont use them anyway..and if i do, it is for longer than 3 hours anyway (and usually free at that hour), or for a few minutes. but i dont think i use 5 dollars all year anyway.
The average new car buyer only keeps a car for around 5 years. About half the registered cars are less than 8 years old. Considering that it takes 5-8 years for say a Ford Focus Hybrid's projected gas savings to equal the increased cost, for most people it doesn't save any money.

I've yet to compare the maintenance costs of the hybrid engine to a conventional internal combustion.

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07-29-2010, 02:03 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
The average new car buyer only keeps a car for around 5 years. About half the registered cars are less than 8 years old. Considering that it takes 5-8 years for say a Ford Focus Hybrid's projected gas savings to equal the increased cost, for most people it doesn't save any money.

I've yet to compare the maintenance costs of the hybrid engine to a conventional internal combustion.
It doesn't save any money but it doesn't cost any more after that length of time. And you've reduced the carbon emissions and the need to import gasoline from our enemies.

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07-29-2010, 03:13 PM
  #29
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Personal preference is fine, but I don't buy the arguments about helping the environment or keeping money away from our enemies. Hybrids aren't the clean, environment-friendly machines that marketing firms would have us believe, and call me stupid but I just don't see us throwing gobs of cash at governments who are actively trying to kill us. Nor do I see a nation full of hybrid drivers defeating pollution and terrorism simply because we all bought a Prius. Simple answers to complex questions are generally just wrong answers.

But like I said, if you like the car and feel comfortable spending the extra money then by all means buy it.

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07-29-2010, 08:12 PM
  #30
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It doesn't save any money but it doesn't cost any more after that length of time. And you've reduced the carbon emissions and the need to import gasoline from our enemies.
We only imported 3,316,000 barrels of gasoline in May so I'll assume you meant oil ... we imported 89x as much crude.

So Canada is now our enemy? We import more oil from there than ALL of the Persian Gulf. The UK? India? ok ... maybe Mexico based on their hypocrisy when it comes to illegal immigration.

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07-29-2010, 08:43 PM
  #31
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We only imported 3,316,000 barrels of gasoline in May so I'll assume you meant oil ... we imported 89x as much crude.

So Canada is now our enemy? We import more oil from there than ALL of the Persian Gulf. The UK? India? ok ... maybe Mexico based on their hypocrisy when it comes to illegal immigration.
Actually we imported 347 million barrels in May (http://www.pickensplan.com/news/2010...inue-to-climb/ In the first five months of this year, that's $50 billion more than the same period last year.

Five million barrels a day from the OPEC nations. (I'll presume you're not among those who think Saudi Arabia is really our friend.)

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07-29-2010, 09:02 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by lstcyr View Post
Actually we imported 347 million barrels in May (http://www.pickensplan.com/news/2010...inue-to-climb/ In the first five months of this year, that's $50 billion more than the same period last year.

Five million barrels a day from the OPEC nations. (I'll presume you're not amhttp://hfboards.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=27161210ong those who think Saudi Arabia is really our friend.)
The import figure you state is total CRUDE OIL AND PRODUCTS, not GASOLINE as you mentioned in your first post.

Canada provides more petroleum that the Persian Gulf in its entirety. Mexico provides more than any single Persian Gulf state ... about 82% of the total Gulf region. Canada and Mexico combine for about 78% of what we get from all of OPEC.

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07-30-2010, 07:14 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
The import figure you state is total CRUDE OIL AND PRODUCTS, not GASOLINE as you mentioned in your first post.

Canada provides more petroleum that the Persian Gulf in its entirety. Mexico provides more than any single Persian Gulf state ... about 82% of the total Gulf region. Canada and Mexico combine for about 78% of what we get from all of OPEC.
Yes I am quoting crude oil imports not gasoline. While you are correct about Canada, Mexico, etc., the point is that based upon a $70 per barrel price (below the May average), we sent $24.3 billion dollars out of the country in May. Of that amount, $10.9 billion went to the OPEC countries. There have to be better ways for us to spend our money domestically.

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07-30-2010, 10:00 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
We only imported 3,316,000 barrels of gasoline in May so I'll assume you meant oil ... we imported 89x as much crude.

So Canada is now our enemy?
We import more oil from there than ALL of the Persian Gulf. The UK? India? ok ... maybe Mexico based on their hypocrisy when it comes to illegal immigration.

Um....we ARE Nashville Predators fans.....

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07-30-2010, 10:52 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by kivaerijo View Post
and those are the important words there. such a subjective idea. my life might be a lot better if i didnt have a lot of the plastic things in my life (bet our country wouldnt be as obese with a lot of plastic items in our lives anyway)
Plastic is not the blame for that. Plastic is cheaper and more malleable for producing products. Those unhealthy devices just happen to be made from them.

Now if you want to talk about high fructose corn syrup and the lack of fiber in peoples diets.......

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07-30-2010, 12:06 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by lstcyr View Post
Yes I am quoting crude oil imports not gasoline. While you are correct about Canada, Mexico, etc., the point is that based upon a $70 per barrel price (below the May average), we sent $24.3 billion dollars out of the country in May. Of that amount, $10.9 billion went to the OPEC countries. There have to be better ways for us to spend our money domestically.
If there were a better way for the private sector to get the resources needed domestically, they would. Ludicrous government polices over the past few decades have forced the US to look abroad for our fuel. Rather than tap our domestic reserves, use all available methods, and responsibly develop the next generation of portable power production we make it nearly impossible to use our own resources, ignore nuclear while chasing pie in the sky solutions, and knee-jerk towards whatever the latest fad system is.

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07-30-2010, 12:10 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
If there were a better way for the private sector to get the resources needed domestically, they would. Ludicrous government polices over the past few decades have forced the US to look abroad for our fuel. Rather than tap our domestic reserves, use all available methods, and responsibly develop the next generation of portable power production we make it nearly impossible to use our own resources, ignore nuclear while chasing pie in the sky solutions, and knee-jerk towards whatever the latest fad system is.
The only time I agree with Sean Hannity is with the development of future fuel sources ... develop them all

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07-30-2010, 02:43 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
If there were a better way for the private sector to get the resources needed domestically, they would. Ludicrous government polices over the past few decades have forced the US to look abroad for our fuel. Rather than tap our domestic reserves, use all available methods, and responsibly develop the next generation of portable power production we make it nearly impossible to use our own resources, ignore nuclear while chasing pie in the sky solutions, and knee-jerk towards whatever the latest fad system is.
I thought you worked for the government in the military not the oil industry.

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07-30-2010, 03:28 PM
  #39
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I thought you worked for the government in the military not the oil industry.
You left out the nuclear industry as well. We can't joke about the auto industry since the government owns 2/3 of major domestic producers now.

Hybrids improve fuel efficiency, but are still internal combustion engines. Using a Ford Fusion for comparison .. the base model starts around $20k while the hybrid version starts near $28k. The annual fuel savings is about $600 ... so over ten years for the consumer to save a dime from increased fuel efficiency.

The key phrase "responsibly develop the next generation of portable power production" ..... the gasoline based internal combustion engine came about because it beat out other options in the market place. Steam cars were around in the 1800s but are problematic. Pure electric still lack range and power not to mention that the electricity comes primarily from fossil fuel based facilities. At the same time, hybrids tend to be a bit weak and the gearing options are lacking.

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07-30-2010, 03:46 PM
  #40
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So Canada is now our enemy?.
Yes. YEs it is. Especially anything that comes out of Toronto.


But let's get back to the oil discussion, shall we?

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07-30-2010, 05:10 PM
  #41
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You left out the nuclear industry as well. We can't joke about the auto industry since the government owns 2/3 of major domestic producers now.
Darn. Forgot the nuclear industry. Thank God the government owns the major domestic car companies. I'm sure you can imagine what would have happened if they had to file bankruptcy. The employment rate would be 15% rather than having the car companies hiring people back (slowly but surely). I'd guess you have a different scenario of what would have happened. Love to hear it.

Since you work for the government and the car companies are owned by the government, do you get an employee discount?

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07-30-2010, 06:08 PM
  #42
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Darn. Forgot the nuclear industry. Thank God the government owns the major domestic car companies. I'm sure you can imagine what would have happened if they had to file bankruptcy. The employment rate would be 15% rather than having the car companies hiring people back (slowly but surely). I'd guess you have a different scenario of what would have happened. Love to hear it.

Since you work for the government and the car companies are owned by the government, do you get an employee discount?
I actually asked for an employee discount and owner pricing .... didn't work.

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07-30-2010, 10:26 PM
  #43
lstcyr
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I actually asked for an employee discount and owner pricing .... didn't work.
nice. good try.

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09-17-2010, 11:57 PM
  #44
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It stalled

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09-25-2010, 11:53 AM
  #45
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If you can afford a hybrid - you can afford to park. This really does disgust me. Coming to games isn't cheap and it's what I save for. That's my choice. But I pay as much in taxes as everyone else and should therefore receive the same privileges as everyone else. Regardless of what car I drive. Maybe if I wasn't paying so much to park I could afford a hybrid, eh?

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