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Update on Price contract talks

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Old
08-04-2010, 01:08 PM
  #26
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by HalakRulz View Post
Good!! I think a short-term deal is the way to go with Price right now. He still has to prove his worth so give him this year to prove it and then sign him long-term after that if he plays well. He has to earn something in his career, he can't have everything just handed to him.

No sense rushing and signing him to a long term deal if he's never going to amount to the #1 goalie everybody thinks he should be....then we're stuck with a struggling young goalie that has a long, ugly contract....kinda like Tim Thomas.....nobody wants to take a chance on him because he's an average goalie at best and he's making $6 million a season.
You wouldn't make a good GM.

In Gauthier's position, you have to take advantage of the fact that Price is undervalued right now to try and get a bit longer term deal(3-4 years) at less than he should be woth given continued development(4-6 mil possibly in years 3 and 4). If you sign him for 1 year and he has a break out year you have to pay him a lot more than 2.5-2.75 in years 2-3-4 than you might be able to this summer.

In the cap world signing longer contracts with young players for less than they might end up being worth can help you a lot.

As Price's agent, I would rather go 1 or 2 years because I can see my client being worth twice the current value if he makes good progress in the next 24 months.

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08-04-2010, 01:11 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by maxpower2010 View Post
I would do that in a second. Hell I'd do Ryan for Price straight up.

If we're going to have a money hungry player I'd rather it be a 35 goal scorer than a mid-tier goaltender.
Ryan is a good player, but we need a guy like Price in his prime more than we need him. Plus, Ryan will end up costing 5+ mil on his next contract and would leave us without a #1 goalie.

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08-04-2010, 01:14 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
There goes the Theory that trading Halak gave Price more bargaining power
Uhh, how? Logic fail on your part.

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08-04-2010, 01:22 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Ryan is a good player, but we need a guy like Price in his prime more than we need him. Plus, Ryan will end up costing 5+ mil on his next contract and would leave us without a #1 goalie.
Good player? He'd be our most talented forward since Kovy.

Oh, and he can do this...




Assuming a guy like Price in his prime is a top-5 tender (and that's a fairly big assumption), he'd cost us 5 million anyways.

Alas, it's all for naught because we should know by now the love affair management has with Price; he's not going anywhere.

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08-04-2010, 01:24 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by maxpower2010 View Post
Uhh, how? Logic fail on your part.
because if he had all this said bargaining power he wouldn't be looking for a shorter deal. The shorter deal is being sought because they feel like he can get a bigger contract that what he is being offering if he plays well this year.

If he had all this bargaining power he would be asking for his 4 million now and not looking to take a shorter contract in order to play for it.

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08-04-2010, 02:00 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
because if he had all this said bargaining power he wouldn't be looking for a shorter deal. The shorter deal is being sought because they feel like he can get a bigger contract that what he is being offering if he plays well this year.

If he had all this bargaining power he would be asking for his 4 million now and not looking to take a shorter contract in order to play for it.
He might not be in a position to ask for a big contract, but he's in a position to get what he wants even if that's not what the team wants.

Price know that Gauthier might want/try to sign him to a 3-4 years contract with a reasonable amount, but if Price wants only a one year deal, in the end, he knows, and we all know that Gauthier won't start the year with Auld and Desjardins.

If Gauthier had kept Halak (signed (could have traded him with a 1 year deal) or not), Gauthier could still have started the year with Halak and be confortable with that, so it would have been in Price best interest to come to an agreement with the habs.

I'm not saying we are doomed because of the trade, just saying that I think that it had an impact in the negociation. The way I see it, Gauthier is trying to find a long term deal that would be interesting for Price. Price won't sign more than a 1 or 2 years deal, and he will be overpaid a bit because he knows Gauthier won't go with Auld as a starter to not overpay Price by 250-500k, whereas if Halak was still a habs, I'm not sure Gauthier would get many more years from Price, but he wouldn't have to overpay him.

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08-04-2010, 02:03 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by ppil View Post
He might not be in a position to ask for a big contract, but he's in a position to get what he wants even if that's not what the team wants.

Price know that Gauthier might want/try to sign him to a 3-4 years contract with a reasonable amount, but if Price wants only a one year deal, in the end, he knows, and we all know that Gauthier won't start the year with Auld and Desjardins.

If Gauthier had kept Halak (signed (could have traded him with a 1 year deal) or not), Gauthier could still have started the year with Halak and be confortable with that, so it would have been in Price best interest to come to an agreement with the habs.

I'm not saying we are doomed because of the trade, just saying that I think that it had an impact in the negociation. The way I see it, Gauthier is trying to find a long term deal that would be interesting for Price. Price won't sign more than a 1 or 2 years deal, and he will be overpaid a bit because he knows Gauthier won't go with Auld as a starter to not overpay Price by 250-500k, whereas if Halak was still a habs, I'm not sure Gauthier would get many more years from Price, but he wouldn't have to overpay him.
I don't know this for a fact but I'm pretty sure neither goalie would have signed for the Habs before the other was dealt, especially Halak and he had arbitration rights meaning he might have ended up with 4+ mil(MacArthur was given 2.5 mil!!!).

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08-04-2010, 02:04 PM
  #33
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He might not be in a position to ask for a big contract, but he's in a position to get what he wants even if that's not what the team wants.
That was the whole point of the people who complained. They said this Carey Price power to ask for a big time contract...looks like the opposite is happening.
Quote:
Price know that Gauthier might want/try to sign him to a 3-4 years contract with a reasonable amount, but if Price wants only a one year deal, in the end, he knows, and we all know that Gauthier won't start the year with Auld and Desjardins.
Price ultimately decides whether he signs or not, be it one year, two or three year, whether not Halak is or is not there.
Quote:
If Gauthier had kept Halak (signed (could have traded him with a 1 year deal) or not), Gauthier could still have started the year with Halak and be confortable with that, so it would have been in Price best interest to come to an agreement with the habs.
I don't understand what you are trying to say here
Quote:
I'm not saying we are doomed because of the trade, just saying that I think that it had an impact in the negociation. The way I see it, Gauthier is trying to find a long term deal that would be interesting for Price. Price won't sign more than a 1 or 2 years deal, and he will be overpaid a bit because he knows Gauthier won't go with Auld as a starter to not overpay Price by 250-500k, whereas if Halak was still a habs, I'm not sure Gauthier would get many more years from Price, but he wouldn't have to overpay him
I think after the year Price had it would have been in his best interest to sign a short deal to prove what he can do so that he can cash out, regardless of whether or not Halak was there.

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08-04-2010, 02:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
because if he had all this said bargaining power he wouldn't be looking for a shorter deal. The shorter deal is being sought because they feel like he can get a bigger contract that what he is being offering if he plays well this year.

If he had all this bargaining power he would be asking for his 4 million now and not looking to take a shorter contract in order to play for it.
Isn't it apparent to you that all this haggling over term and amount is due to bargaining power. Price now knows he's our only option for next season, meaning he will be getting his chance to take the next step. If that wasn't the case, perhaps he'd be more inclined to taking a 2 to 3 year deal slightly over his current value of 2 million.

Regardless, how do you know he's not asking for 4 million or close to it?

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08-04-2010, 02:16 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by maxpower2010 View Post
Isn't it apparent to you that all this haggling over term and amount is due to bargaining power. Price now knows he's our only option for next season, meaning he will be getting his chance to take the next step. If that wasn't the case, perhaps he'd be more inclined to taking a 2 to 3 year deal slightly over his current value of 2 million.

Regardless, how do you know he's not asking for 4 million or close to it?
The whole argument about bargaining power was that price would be asking for the moon, people claiming that he would ask for Halak money. Go read everyone's complaining on the subject. Even if Halak wouldn't have been traded Carey price still could have held out for a one year deal considering it's his best option since he can do so much better and imrpove his worth much more.

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08-04-2010, 02:16 PM
  #36
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Ryan turned down 5 years at 25 million from Anaheim how exactly would they sign him and get a goalie?

This just confirms that the term is what they dont agree on, the habs are probably offering him a bit more for 3 years and he might want the same for 1 or 2 would be the most logical guess.

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08-04-2010, 02:23 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
The whole argument about bargaining power was that price would be asking for the moon, people claiming that he would ask for Halak money. Go read everyone's complaining on the subject. Even if Halak wouldn't have been traded Carey price still could have held out for a one year deal considering it's his best option since he can do so much better and imrpove his worth much more.
Not really since he would of been going into the season as the backup with no guarantee of playing more than 30 games.

And about Price asking for the moon, isn't that amount subjective? I mean anything over 3 million on a one year deal is the moon in my books, yet others who think he's already a top-5/10 goalie would consider that amount a steal.

What it boils down to is that with Halak gone, Price has more bargaining power than before.

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08-04-2010, 02:32 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by maxpower2010 View Post
Not really since he would of been going into the season as the backup with no guarantee of playing more than 30 games.

And about Price asking for the moon, isn't that amount subjective? I mean anything over 3 million on a one year deal is the moon in my books, yet others who think he's already a top-5/10 goalie would consider that amount a steal.

What it boils down to is that with Halak gone, Price has more bargaining power than before.
You sign Halak you probably lose Plek. So this whole thing about not trading him to get Price to sign to a smaller contract is a ridiculous argument.

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08-04-2010, 02:37 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by jnthomas View Post
You sign Halak you probably lose Plek. So this whole thing about not trading him to get Price to sign to a smaller contract is a ridiculous argument.
You don't know that for certain. Simple moves could of been made, but like I said management's obsession with Price clouded their judgement yet again.

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08-04-2010, 02:41 PM
  #40
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To those that think we should have held on to Halak until Price was signed and then trade Jaro is a perfect example of bargaining under bad faith. If Price accepts a smaller contract and then they trade Halak making him the starter, him and his camp would be royally pissed. Not a good thing to do with your starter if in fact you have made the decision to go with him in the future.

I think managers have to do what they have to do to win but by doing it the way PG has done it clears the air for the team and there is no ambiguity, everyone knows Price will be the starter. Carey will be signed to a reasonable deal and term, he is not going to hold out as this is a big year for him and would destroy his reputation imo. *****ing over $500,000 up or down is kind of pointless as he is now the guy and will have to deliver whether he has earned it yet or not if he wants to become a big money goaltender in the future.

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08-04-2010, 02:44 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by 11Goat11 View Post
To those that think we should have held on to Halak until Price was signed and then trade Jaro is a perfect example of bargaining under bad faith. If Price accepts a smaller contract and then they trade Halak making him the starter, him and his camp would be royally pissed. Not a good thing to do with your starter if in fact you have made the decision to go with him in the future.
I'm shocked people don't seem to be able to grasp this simple concept. It's amazing how many people wanted management to trick Price into signing a cheaper contract.

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08-04-2010, 02:46 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by 11Goat11 View Post
To those that think we should have held on to Halak until Price was signed and then trade Jaro is a perfect example of bargaining under bad faith. If Price accepts a smaller contract and then they trade Halak making him the starter, him and his camp would be royally pissed. Not a good thing to do with your starter if in fact you have made the decision to go with him in the future.

I think managers have to do what they have to do to win but by doing it the way PG has done it clears the air for the team and there is no ambiguity, everyone knows Price will be the starter. Carey will be signed to a reasonable deal and term, he is not going to hold out as this is a big year for him and would destroy his reputation imo. *****ing over $500,000 up or down is kind of pointless as he is now the guy and will have to deliver whether he has earned it yet or not if he wants to become a big money goaltender in the future.
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Originally Posted by the vinyl version View Post
I'm shocked people don't seem to be able to grasp this simple concept. It's amazing how many people wanted management to trick Price into signing a cheaper contract.

Very Good posts. A decision needed to be made. The Canadiens chose the goalie they felt can be cheaper now and as good as the other in the future.

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08-04-2010, 02:47 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Ryan is a good player, but we need a guy like Price in his prime more than we need him. Plus, Ryan will end up costing 5+ mil on his next contract and would leave us without a #1 goalie.
Ryan doesn't have a contract at the moment, but yeah we couldn't afford him as of now. Still, I would do Price for Ryan without thinking too much about it.

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08-04-2010, 02:47 PM
  #44
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I think after the year Price had it would have been in his best interest to sign a short deal to prove what he can do so that he can cash out, regardless of whether or not Halak was there.
I agree with that, the best for Price is to go the Plekanec way, he has nothing to lose doing that, except if he badly injures himself, but it's not like he was refusing a 15 years contract to take 1 year, it's probably more 1 year instead of 3-4 years.

I know about the arbitration, the fact that the two goalies wanted to play more games and all, but, I may be wrong, but usually, the more people need you, the more power you have. So my logic is that with Halak, the habs didn't need Price as much as right now.

He doesn't have enough power to get 3.5-4M a year, but he has enough to get 2.5 for 1 year instead of the 2M per for 2 years he might have gotten if Halak was still here.

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Price ultimately decides whether he signs or not, be it one year, two or three year, whether not Halak is or is not there.
Kind of true, well in Montreal it seems to be the case, but at the same time, if it was that easy, why would the teams even bother to negociate with the players? It all comes down to the power.

Price knows the team can't start the season without him, if he ask something reasonable, he will get it, if he's unreasonable, he might be traded. If the habs had the power (having Halak or any other good goalie) then Price might have to take what he's being offered, or negociate a good deal for both parties, if not, the habs could tell him to try to improve his game at home or in an other league (I know it's exagerated, just showing the extreme).


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08-04-2010, 02:54 PM
  #45
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Kind of true, well in Montreal it seems to be the case, but at the same time, if it was that easy, why would the teams even bother to negociate with the players? It all comes down to the power.

Price knows the team can't start the season without him, if he ask something reasonable, he will get it, if he's unreasonable, he might be traded. If the habs had the power (having Halak or any other good goalie) then Price might have to take what he's being offered, or negociate a good deal for both parties, if not, the habs could tell him to try to improve his game at home or in an other league (I know it's exagerated, just showing the extrem).
That's true I never thought about it that way, but how much could he possibly ask for without looking unreasonable? It only hurts himself in the end to be unreasonable, I think the more bargaining power because of the trade card is wayyyyyyy overplayed especially now that he and his agent are looking for shorter term so they could cash it out in the future. This means that the long-term contract being offered isn't much to begin with probably 2.5-2.75 for 3-4 years. This report by his agent changes the entire dynamics of the way we've been thinking about the negotiating. On a one year deal or two year deal I don't think he'll get more than 2.0-2.25 million.

Of course this all speculation based on nothing, but the whole he can now ask for whatever he wants now that halak is gone is overplayed.

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08-04-2010, 02:55 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by maxpower2010 View Post
You don't know that for certain. Simple moves could of been made, but like I said management's obsession with Price clouded their judgement yet again.
Yes we do know that for certain. Practically everyone grasps that concept that if we sign halak, we dont sign pleks, why cant you understand this? Simple moves could have been made? Its easy to say that simples moves could have been made while your sitting in your chair at home expecting things to just be done. Since you seem to know what your talkin about it, what simple moves could have been done? i want specifics, what would you have done? As for managments ''obsession'' (i think faith is the correct word) with price, they along with many hockey minds have made up their minds and are firm to believe that Price will be the better goalie in the end. I can guarantee that they never had any intentions of getting rid of Price and it was only logical to predict that Halak would be the one to be gone. And im gonna have to agree with the organization. Yes its a shocker to some that the ''playoff hero'' has been traded, but get over it already.


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08-04-2010, 03:33 PM
  #47
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Don't know why it's such a big deal...I know it's summer and we all need something to talk about here...but Price and the Habs are gonna get a deal done at some point before training camp begins.

Just unwind and enjoy the last month of the summer

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08-04-2010, 05:01 PM
  #48
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Yes we do know that for certain. Practically everyone grasps that concept that if we sign halak, we dont sign pleks, why cant you understand this? Simple moves could have been made? Its easy to say that simples moves could have been made while your sitting in your chair at home expecting things to just be done. Since you seem to know what your talkin about it, what simple moves could have been done? i want specifics, what would you have done? As for managments ''obsession'' (i think faith is the correct word) with price, they along with many hockey minds have made up their minds and are firm to believe that Price will be the better goalie in the end. I can guarantee that they never had any intentions of getting rid of Price and it was only logical to predict that Halak would be the one to be gone. And im gonna have to agree with the organization. Yes its a shocker to some that the ''playoff hero'' has been traded, but get over it already.
This is the same organization that put its "faith" into an undersized second line center for close to two decades. We went from having arguably the best goaltending situation in the league three months ago to only having a fringe NHL'er under contract with our only #1 hope being "not necessarily close" to signing a contract.

As for how we could of accommodated both Halak and Price? This has been done. Capgeek has us at around 4.1 million in cap space. Take away Auld's 1 million, and that puts us at 5.1 million. Bury Laraque in the minors rather than buying him out, and that puts us at 5.6 million. Then take away Eller's 1.3 million at that puts us with 6.9 million to sign both goalies and a bottom-6 center.

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08-04-2010, 05:09 PM
  #49
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lol. Stormin Normand Marshall call into Tony Marinaro's show and said that Price Camp wants 5 year deal and its getting interesting. Wow he looks stupid now. That whole hour looks stupid now with people calling in and saying how we need to trade price because he doesnt want to be here anymore.

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08-04-2010, 05:51 PM
  #50
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This is the same organization that put its "faith" into an undersized second line center for close to two decades. We went from having arguably the best goaltending situation in the league three months ago to only having a fringe NHL'er under contract with our only #1 hope being "not necessarily close" to signing a contract.
Alex Auld is not as bad as what some thinks... And Price will be signed. We are 6 weeks away from training camps. Plenty of time to negociate.

We lost Halak but we gain a valuable asset in Eller.

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