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Bieksa to Tampa Bay

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Old
08-04-2010, 01:36 PM
  #51
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mg is no holmgren

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Old
08-04-2010, 01:44 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Stone Phillips View Post
Deal. Where do I sign?
It was a joke. Remember how Simek got into the TB organization? The Krajicek + Simek / Obrien - Oulette deal?

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Old
08-04-2010, 02:09 PM
  #53
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this is a silly thread
starts off w a TB fan asking what his value is, then proceeds with more TB fans saying it is zero. So why are you asking?

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Old
08-04-2010, 02:31 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
this is a silly thread
starts off w a TB fan asking what his value is, then proceeds with more TB fans saying it is zero. So why are you asking?
That's what I don't get.

You say you want Bieksa because he's a serviceable Top 4 D-man (very serviceable) and then turn around and say that you don't want to give up anything of value for him.

Guess what? Bieksa is a valued part of the Canucks. We've had him since he was drafted and he's a pretty good D-man, just doesn't fit into our plans right now and we need the cap space.

This is very 'Leafish' of the Tampa Bay fanbase here. I honestly expected better from my second favourite team. ('s fans)

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Old
08-04-2010, 02:33 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
this is a silly thread
starts off w a TB fan asking what his value is, then proceeds with more TB fans saying it is zero. So why are you asking?
Just because we are all Lightning fans does not mean we all share the same opinion on anything hockey related.

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Old
08-04-2010, 02:34 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by CSampson View Post
Don't get me wrong, I think Bieska is a good D. As with most fanbases though, the majority of you are overrating your player. I actually think Bieska would make a nice fit on Tampa, but to think you're going to get much in return is somewhat misleading given the recent trades we've seen. Even think back as far as Phaneuf. Anyone posting that trade on the message board before it happened would of been laughed at. Look at Gagne. When dealing with cap space, which Vancouver doesn't have much of (and honestly they would, in my opinion, only move Bieska to free up some space), you can never expect fair value back.

With that said, I would trade up to the value of a 2nd for Bieska.

You think the Phaneuf and Gagne trades are good comparables?

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Old
08-04-2010, 04:02 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
I'm sorry if this has been discussed, or if I'm out of the loop, but what whole Yzerman/Gillis thing?
No loop to be out of! Just a comment from myself. Can't see those two GMs making a deal. It would be like a 25 year old Chuck Norris vs. a 25 year old Steven Seagal street fight. The world might explode.

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Old
08-04-2010, 04:04 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Bobsled Gainey View Post
Its not Lundins second year... but yeah, not good partners.

Whoa totally missed the 07-08 season where he played 81 games! My bad, didn't realize he was already 25. Definitely not someone I would be content with on any top pairing! Wow.

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Old
08-04-2010, 04:07 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
Whoa totally missed the 07-08 season where he played 81 games! My bad, didn't realize he was already 25. Definitely not someone I would be content with on any top pairing! Wow.
Lundin was our best defenseman last year.

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Old
08-04-2010, 04:15 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by The Yzerman effect View Post
Just because we are all Lightning fans does not mean we all share the same opinion on anything hockey related.
That was one of the most retarded questions I've ever seen (that you answered quite nicely I might add).

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Originally Posted by Sandlak View Post
You think the Phaneuf and Gagne trades are good comparables?
I'm saying don't get your hopes up, or you might be sorely disappointed. I'm also saying you have a skewed perception of what Bieska could get back if he were traded, given the situation.

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Old
08-04-2010, 04:59 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by The Yzerman effect View Post
Lundin was our best defenseman last year.
I actually watched a lot of Tampa games last year. Lundin was good, but he played 49 games, hard to say a guy playing half the season was the best defender on the team. You have Mattias Ohlund playing more minutes and for a bigger chunk of the season. Ohlund was the reason I took as many Bolts games in as I did, although I admit Lundin was pretty solid last year from what I saw. Just didn't realize he had been around so long.

I like the changes made to the back-end, and Yzerman is a God in my world, but saying a team that is counting on a guy like Mike Lundin as their top pairing guy has no use for Bieksa is just plain ignorant.

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Old
08-04-2010, 05:14 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by CSampson View Post
That was one of the most retarded questions I've ever seen (that you answered quite nicely I might add).



I'm saying don't get your hopes up, or you might be sorely disappointed. I'm also saying you have a skewed perception of what Bieska could get back if he were traded, given the situation.
Or you might be shocked right out of your britches! Most Canucks fans agree on Bieksa's value. Something close to Meszaros probably. Most Canucks fans would consider a 2nd and a long-shot prospect, or a grinder and a 3rd is pretty good value for Bieksa.

Mezsaros - 2nd (Philly) He's younger than Bieksa, their offence is probably equal, Bieksa is much more aggressive. Both suck in their own zones. I'd say this is pretty fair value for Bieksa. Bieksa probably garners a touch more because he is cheaper and more proven. Mezsaros fell off the map once he was taken away from Chara.

Wisneiwski - 3rd (NYI), this is basically a low 2nd in the Ducks eyes. We'll see what NYI does. He's probably valued a little less than Bieksa and Mezsaros. Just based on upside alone.

This is a 40 point guy that is as fiery as they come. He's got his warts, but he's also had a bunch of rotten luck and will have a chip on his shoulder the size of a house. He'll have a good season, be it Tampa or somewhere else.

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Old
08-04-2010, 05:29 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
Or you might be shocked right out of your britches! Most Canucks fans agree on Bieksa's value. Something close to Meszaros probably. Most Canucks fans would consider a 2nd and a long-shot prospect, or a grinder and a 3rd is pretty good value for Bieksa.

Mezsaros - 2nd (Philly) He's younger than Bieksa, their offence is probably equal, Bieksa is much more aggressive. Both suck in their own zones. I'd say this is pretty fair value for Bieksa. Bieksa probably garners a touch more because he is cheaper and more proven. Mezsaros fell off the map once he was taken away from Chara.

Wisneiwski - 3rd (NYI), this is basically a low 2nd in the Ducks eyes. We'll see what NYI does. He's probably valued a little less than Bieksa and Mezsaros. Just based on upside alone.

This is a 40 point guy that is as fiery as they come. He's got his warts, but he's also had a bunch of rotten luck and will have a chip on his shoulder the size of a house. He'll have a good season, be it Tampa or somewhere else.
We can agree on his value then, but do yourself a favour and do NOT compare him to Meszaros. Bieska is much better then that.

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Old
08-04-2010, 05:49 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
don't see why the Canucks would have any interest at all in Thompson.

Seems like just another fringe 4th line forward, who has yet to crack the NHL fulltime... the Canucks are already loaded with such players and chances are that he'd end up on waivers anyways.

What the Canucks need in return are players that are waiver ineligible.. young guys that can play on the farm and be call-ups when needed... or they need established NHLers that will fill full-time roles on their team - which Thompson wouldn't.

Either that, or draft picks.
This. Exactly.


The Canucks don't need more fringe 4th liners, or d-men who won't be in the top-8 and need to clear waivers.

What the Canucks really need, is a young d-man who can ride the shuttle to and from Manitoba as needed without running through waivers. A guy who can step into the NHL and be competent. Doesn't have to be a spectacular player necessarily, just someone who can be counted on to fill some minutes without making a huge hash of it.

Our lineup just simply has too many NHL d-men who need to clear waivers, all fighting for those 8 (or 8.5) roster spots. And after those 8 roster spots, it gets a little dicey if there are 3+ injuries at any given time. Really depends on how some of the Moose newcomers adjust though, Sauve, et al.

I don't see anyone the Lightning could offer in that vein, unless you want to start talking Bieksa+ for Wishart or something. lol.

James Wright is intriguing, but i don't see why the Lightning would be willing to give him up, and i'm not convinced he'd be a perfect fit for us. But i could still see a deal centered around Bieksa for Wright working with a fair bit of tweaking/adjustments.


anyway, to me...this thread basically looks like:

Lightning fan: 'how much for Bieksa'
Canuck fan: 'exactly this much'
Lightnigng fan: 'how about some garbage instead?'
Canuck fan: 'no. exactly this much'
Lightning fan: 'oh. you want useful players/prospects/picks to fill organizational needs. no deal'.

not that this is an unusual pattern mind you.

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Old
08-04-2010, 09:27 PM
  #65
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Both teams are looking to stock up on draft picks and for bottem 6 players... I don't see this trade happening.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:16 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by biturbo19 View Post
This. Exactly.


The Canucks don't need more fringe 4th liners, or d-men who won't be in the top-8 and need to clear waivers.

What the Canucks really need, is a young d-man who can ride the shuttle to and from Manitoba as needed without running through waivers. A guy who can step into the NHL and be competent. Doesn't have to be a spectacular player necessarily, just someone who can be counted on to fill some minutes without making a huge hash of it.

Our lineup just simply has too many NHL d-men who need to clear waivers, all fighting for those 8 (or 8.5) roster spots. And after those 8 roster spots, it gets a little dicey if there are 3+ injuries at any given time. Really depends on how some of the Moose newcomers adjust though, Sauve, et al.

I don't see anyone the Lightning could offer in that vein, unless you want to start talking Bieksa+ for Wishart or something. lol.

James Wright is intriguing, but i don't see why the Lightning would be willing to give him up, and i'm not convinced he'd be a perfect fit for us. But i could still see a deal centered around Bieksa for Wright working with a fair bit of tweaking/adjustments.


anyway, to me...this thread basically looks like:

Lightning fan: 'how much for Bieksa'
Canuck fan: 'exactly this much'
Lightnigng fan: 'how about some garbage instead?'
Canuck fan: 'no. exactly this much'
Lightning fan: 'oh. you want useful players/prospects/picks to fill organizational needs. no deal'.

not that this is an unusual pattern mind you.
Different people share different opinions regardless of their favorite team. This is apparently new

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:25 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by biturbo19 View Post
This. Exactly.



anyway, to me...this thread basically looks like:

Lightning fan: 'how much for Bieksa'
Canuck fan: 'exactly this much'
Lightnigng fan: 'how about some garbage instead?'
Canuck fan: 'no. exactly this much'
Lightning fan: 'oh. you want useful players/prospects/picks to fill organizational needs. no deal'.

not that this is an unusual pattern mind you.
Ha this guy has no idea who is the GM of our team now.

Biturbo, 3 words.... Steve f**kin Yzerman.


Remember that.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:36 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by BoltzBalla View Post
Ha this guy has no idea who is the GM of our team now.

Biturbo, 3 words.... Steve f**kin Yzerman.


Remember that.
And Mike Gillis is no idiot either, so what's your point? Gillis is not going to take Yzerman's garbage and waiver wire pickups for Bieksa considering we can keep him under the cap right now. Remember that.

I don't think any of our fanbase are under any delusions. Bieksa is pretty comparable in value to Wiz and Meszaros. I think we'd all be quite happy with a 2nd round pick for Bieksa, and the most any of us realistically expect is a 2nd/3rd + mid-level prospect, no more.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:39 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Red View Post
And Mike Gillis is no idiot either, so what's your point? Gillis is not going to take Yzerman's garbage and waiver wire pickups for Bieksa considering we can keep him under the cap right now. Remember that.

I don't think any of our fanbase are under any delusions. Bieksa is pretty comparable in value to Wiz and Meszaros. I think we'd all be quite happy with a 2nd round pick for Bieksa, and the most any of us realistically expect is a 2nd/3rd + mid-level prospect, no more.
Point is easy. SFY. Simple as that.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:40 PM
  #70
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I'd be happy with a deuce in next years draft.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:41 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by BoltzBalla View Post
Ha this guy has no idea who is the GM of our team now.

Biturbo, 3 words.... Steve f**kin Yzerman.


Remember that.
Have you heard of Mike Gillis?

He would **** Yzerman in a cage match.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:42 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by BoltzBalla View Post
Point is easy. SFY. Simple as that.
I really have no idea what that's supposed to be informing all of us of.

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Old
08-04-2010, 10:42 PM
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TB_FANATIC View Post
Different people share different opinions regardless of their favorite team. This is apparently new
and in fairness...it seems plenty of Canucks fans want to trade Bieksa for garbage as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoltzBalla View Post
Ha this guy has no idea who is the GM of our team now.

Biturbo, 3 words.... Steve f**kin Yzerman.


Remember that.
what on earth does that have to do with anything? that comment was about fans of teams on the internet, not about GMs sitting around talking trades.

are you trying to imply that because your GM is Stevie Y now, you can automatically trade various assorted useless players to whichever team you want for whoever you want?

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Old
08-05-2010, 12:06 AM
  #74
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Bieksa, Hordichuk

for

Ty Wishart & Thompson

or

Bieksa, Hordichuk, 3rd

for

Mihalik, Wright, 2nd

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Old
08-05-2010, 12:12 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by BoltzBalla View Post
Point is easy. SFY. Simple as that.
This is true. If Steve Yzerman asks me for Kevin Bieksa, I give him Kevin Bieksa -- and thank him for anything he might throw my way.

Seriously though, I don't get why these threads continue. Bolts fans kicked the tires, no one agreed on anything. Nothing to see here, folks; walk away.

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