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Old
08-05-2010, 01:01 PM
  #51
vofty
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Originally Posted by I Am Canadian View Post
Alright, the entire league would prefer Luke Schenn to those two but I can see why you wouldn't want him for Neal. I really think you guys are pushing your luck if you want a legit top paring defensemen.
They never said Fistric or Grossman were better, simply that they aren't that far of a step down from Schenn AND Stars don't have to give up assets for them as they are already with the Stars.

You know what you may be right about that last part, which would mean the Stars are perfectly happy hanging onto Neal and watching him become a 30 goal scorer, but bottom line is Toronto doesn't have a package to offer Dallas that truly addresses their needs, so Stars fans will continue to say no to the continued proposals generated by Leafs fans regarding Toronto and Dallas.

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Old
08-05-2010, 01:02 PM
  #52
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I can see why the Leafs would do this however Dallas, not so much.

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Old
08-05-2010, 01:08 PM
  #53
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Unbelievable that Dallas fans say no to this. That is the most blatant over payment in a trade I have seen in a long time. I know it would for sure take Kaberle + to acquire Neal but it wouldn't take a top 4 defenseman, Leafs 2nd [arguable] best prospect (D'Amigo), a potential 2nd/3rd line gritty player who goes hard to the net, and a pick on top of Kaberle.

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Old
08-05-2010, 01:09 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by IrishPaulie View Post
It's not. But as GM you take the safe rout and assume the worst.

Plus there's no incentive for him to sign in Dallas. They have ownership problems, they're working with an internal cap that has about 10m less to spend than TOR, they are also in the middle of "retooling".

Since he's the biggest piece coming back when you're shipping out a very young very talented player that would be on your roster for years to come you really have to keep him not resigning in mind as a back breaker for this deal. Dallas will want known assets and prospects for a known asset, not players that may or may not be around in 1 year.
He's not ****ing signed, please be more biased.

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Old
08-05-2010, 01:16 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ikarn Johal View Post
1. Kessel/Phaneuf/Kadri/Schenn will be Toronto's 1st or 2nd best player for years to come even if Neal joins the team

2. If you seen Gunnarsson play atleast a few games than you can see he is not a bottem pairing defenseman and will only get better

3. D'amigo is probably Toronto's 2nd best prospect (excluding those who already played some nhl games like gunnarsson)

4. Caputi was the pens 3rd best prospect when he got traded to Toronto

5. Taking into account how ***** the Dallas prospect pool is I'm pretty sure they will both crack the Dallas top 3 and I guarantee they will both crack atleast the top 5.

I am not saying the trade that was proposed is fair for Dallas or that Dallas would do it, I am just saying what you said was preposterous and 100% completely bias against Toronto.
P.s. If I was the Dallas GM, I would not accept the trade.
Wow. OK let me clarify what I meant because I guess what I wrote angered some (you).

1- Neal will be Toronto's 1st or second best forward for years to come. Kadri has yet to prove anything so don't even throw his name at me please. Gunnarsson will be Dallas's 3rd or 4th option on the back end, Kaberle is most likely a 1 year rental, and the prospects you gave are going to a team laden with young forwards already.

2- I've seen Plenty of TML games and have seen Gunnarsson play frequently (if you can count a small sample size of 43 games frequently) All that has been said is he is a good player but it's too small of a sample size to risk trading Neal for. Is that an unfair assessment?

3-5 Again look at the team you're trading to that has a bunch of young good LW in the league already that aren't going anywhere. Caputi and D'amigo would get lost in the system and would then be useless to Dallas. Nothing against Toronto prospects just they don't translate to Dallas.

PS Toronto's prospect pool is considered great? That's the pot calling the kettle black.

Why is it anytime someone gives their opinion on a trade involving Toronto they're considered bias? The rest of the TOR posters took this a lot better than you did. No one has been disrespectful! Why is it every thread between Toronto and another team has to be a fight?

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Old
08-05-2010, 01:22 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripe4theSnipe View Post
He's not ****ing signed, please be more biased.
One player can veto a trade and walk away at the end of the year as a UFA at his own choice.

One player is an RFA his contract is owned and can't go anywhere unless traded (where the new team then signs him) or signed by the team he's currently on.

I'd rather an RFA than an impending UFA w/ a full NTC.

Love how if you disagree with proposals now the new term thrown around is : Bias.

I'm not bias, I just don't share you're point of view. Get over yourself.

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:04 PM
  #57
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How exactly is Neal proven in 78 games but Gunnarsson ridiculously unproven in 43?

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:09 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by htpwn View Post
How exactly is Neal proven in 78 games but Gunnarsson ridiculously unproven in 43?
Neal had 78 games in 09-10 and 77 games in 08-09 for a total of 155 games. I'd say that is more proven.

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:17 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by DoesURchickenFLY View Post
Neal had 78 games in 09-10 and 77 games in 08-09 for a total of 155 games. I'd say that is more proven.
My bad. Misread his stat line.

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:20 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishPaulie View Post
One player can veto a trade and walk away at the end of the year as a UFA at his own choice.

One player is an RFA his contract is owned and can't go anywhere unless traded (where the new team then signs him) or signed by the team he's currently on.

I'd rather an RFA than an impending UFA w/ a full NTC.

Love how if you disagree with proposals now the new term thrown around is : Bias.

I'm not bias, I just don't share you're point of view. Get over yourself.
If Neal isn't signed by a certain date he becomes a UFA as well, I believe. I think it's in December or something like that.

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:41 PM
  #61
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If Neal isn't signed by December 1st he has to sit out the entire season.

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Old
08-05-2010, 02:51 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoesURchickenFLY View Post
If Neal isn't signed by December 1st he has to sit out the entire season.
And that goes for any team. Neal can't sit out until Dec 2, get traded to the Oilers and then play out the season. If he's unsigned after Dec 1 he's not allowed to play in the NHL until the next season.

The only way he would become a UFA would be to wait until he is 27 years old.

Edit: Not saying I think it'll happen, just clarifying the rules.


Last edited by hatterson: 08-05-2010 at 03:21 PM.
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Old
08-05-2010, 03:05 PM
  #63
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This will just never happen.

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Old
08-05-2010, 03:10 PM
  #64
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Ten more days, and then Kaberle's NTC kicks back in.

Hopefully that will mean a decrease in his ever-constant presence on the trade board.

(By the way, wouldn't make this deal from a Stars P.O.V.)

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Old
08-05-2010, 03:40 PM
  #65
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Kaberle
Gunarssonn
Caputi
D'amigo
Slaney
4th Round pick

FOR

Richards
Neal
Fistric
5th Round pick .

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Old
08-05-2010, 03:44 PM
  #66
Karitimes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TyBOZAK View Post
Kaberle
Gunarssonn
Caputi
D'amigo
Slaney
4th Round pick

FOR

Richards
Neal
Fistric
5th Round pick .
Throw in Loiselle, A #81 jersey personalized with Nieuwendyk (big fan of Phil's) and we'll add Charlie Huddy and a conditional Dallas Stars Ice girl.

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Old
08-05-2010, 08:24 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Jon Casey 91 View Post
Throw in Loiselle, A #81 jersey personalized with Nieuwendyk (big fan of Phil's) and we'll add Charlie Huddy and a conditional Dallas Stars Ice girl.
GTFO. Chuck Huddy and that one extra-hot Ice Girl are both worth more to the organization than Caputi, D'amigo, Slaney or the 4th would be. Terrible, terrible, terrible ...

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Old
08-06-2010, 01:18 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMLeafs4ever View Post
Honestly, the Stars need badly a good defensman. That's what we have to trade.
True, but we need a good defenseman for more than just one season.

There is very little risk with Neal. He put up a great rookie season, then improved on that last year. He fits our system, he will be less expensive than Kaberle, and his rights are controlled for years.

There is more risk with Kaberle. He is older, more expensive, can walk after next season, and has indicated that he doesn't want to play in the West.

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Old
08-06-2010, 01:28 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schenn View Post
Unbelievable that Dallas fans say no to this. That is the most blatant over payment in a trade I have seen in a long time. I know it would for sure take Kaberle + to acquire Neal but it wouldn't take a top 4 defenseman, Leafs 2nd [arguable] best prospect (D'Amigo), a potential 2nd/3rd line gritty player who goes hard to the net, and a pick on top of Kaberle.
D'Amigo and Caputi have no value to Dallas. We have plenty of young wingers of various styles in our system already.

If they're so great, then go flip them for a solid D or Center prospect, then come ask us about Neal..

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Old
08-06-2010, 03:07 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Lobstertainment View Post
Dallas says no.

Quality>Quantity
It worked in the Calgary deal

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Old
08-06-2010, 03:50 PM
  #71
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If Kaberle's deal was for a few more years his value would be so much higher.

As it stands, he's only really useful to teams making a run this year. And most of those are working through cap issues or have fairly set rosters and wouldn't want to trade away key pieces of them.

Thus, Kaberle is still a Leaf.

As much a Leaf fans want to avoid the "1 year" talk, or try to explain why Kaberle wouldn't want to sign with a team of his choice instead of the team he was forced to, it's a reality and greatly affects his trade value.

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