HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Brooks "Sean Avery out of the picture?", "What if Wade Redden"...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-08-2010, 11:24 AM
  #26
SupersonicMonkey*
DROP THE PUCK
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Country: United States
Posts: 16,229
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
i don't understand people like you.

argue against the point I made, don't give me the "yea, but look at....." nonsense. that's how children argue.
Excuse me?

What i posted was directly related to what you posted.

You essentially argued that Avery is a waste of roster spot due to his cap hit and his role on the roster.

I argued that Avery can actually play hockey.

And then gave an example of a player that really is a waste of roster spot.

SupersonicMonkey* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:28 AM
  #27
Puckface NYR*
R.I.P. Boogyman
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Long Island
Posts: 8,167
vCash: 500
avery will be on the roster opening night

redden will not....

book it

Puckface NYR* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:31 AM
  #28
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,777
vCash: 500
Brooks is just trying to get a rise out of the fanbase. It is highly unlikely that Redden plays "assertive, sharp hockey" at a consistent level and "outplays just about every defenseman in camp." It's not just about motivation with Redden... his body has deteriorated and I don't think it's physically possible for Redden to play at such a high level as Brooks has speculated.

Also, Brooks assumes that White will automatically have a spot on the team, grouping him with Christensen and Anisimov as one of the team's top 3 centers and penciling in Drury at right wing. White will have to fight for a spot on this team in training camp - 3rd line center will not be handed to him, and I still think there's a strong possibility that Drury will play at center. He had the best faceoff percentage on the team last year.

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:31 AM
  #29
BOXPLAY
Registered User
 
BOXPLAY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 94
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to BOXPLAY
Avery Will be on the roster he is much more valuable than a consistently declining Chris Drury

BOXPLAY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:36 AM
  #30
Komarov47
Registered User
 
Komarov47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Helsinki
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,766
vCash: 500
I love Avery, but i would hate to see him centering Boyle or Boogard... I think a line with Avery and MZA could be dynamite.

Komarov47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:41 AM
  #31
FOXHOUND*
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Woodside, Queens
Country: United States
Posts: 3,507
vCash: 500
such a bunch of sensationalist ******** - slow news week brooks?

FOXHOUND* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 11:56 AM
  #32
TheHotRock
Registered User
 
TheHotRock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: nyc
Country: United States
Posts: 2,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Excuse me?

What i posted was directly related to what you posted.

You essentially argued that Avery is a waste of roster spot due to his cap hit and his role on the roster.

I argued that Avery can actually play hockey.

And then gave an example of a player that really is a waste of roster spot.
didn't mean to come off with "fighting words" but look...


i hate the boogard signing. he's nor worth the money, but he's a 4th liner who fights. that's a defined role.

avery is a third liner, we have enough of those and we don't need to be paying 1.9 mil for one.

we have plenty of guys who can do what avery does on the ice.

i personally enjoy most of his antics, but i don't see room for him on this team. torts obviously isn't his biggest fan and he's not a special teams guy. we'd be better off preserving the cap space in case we need to make a deadline deal.

don't you think?

(yes, i agree with you, avery can play hockey...you'll find no argument from me on that point)

TheHotRock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:07 PM
  #33
FutureGM97
Registered User
 
FutureGM97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Connecticut, USA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,833
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to FutureGM97
Avery is going to be on the team. Outside of him doing either really terrible in camp or doing something stupid he will be there. Whether he crosses the line or not he is one of the few guys who consistently shows some heart and passion out there and is a physical guy which is something we don't have alot of. If i remember correctly, I think he was one of the most fit guys in camp last season. I'm too lazy to go back and check so if someone wants to verify that go ahead but this guy loves playing here and is better served playing here than in HFD.

As someone said, a tandem of him and MZA could be beneficial with a guy like Drury in the middle. We don't know what is going to happen yet but I can bet Avery will be there.

FutureGM97 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:13 PM
  #34
jniklast
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: Germany
Posts: 4,787
vCash: 500
Avery won't be sent down simply because of his contract. Once we assign him to the ahl, we have to pay the full 3.9 million, and have that as the cap hit on the summer cap. And if we plan to send down redden that is the important number. So even if Avery won't be in the lineup, he will be on the roster, because he's cheaper on the cap.

jniklast is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:27 PM
  #35
I Am Chariot
One shift at a time
 
I Am Chariot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 14,526
vCash: 500
Barring injury Avery is a lock for the opening night roster.

a. he will outwork 90% of the players in camp

b. he will show some snarl and that pesky energy that is contagious

c. Granted its not ideal, but he can play any forward position if asked to do so.

__________________
Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man
I Am Chariot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:27 PM
  #36
RMcDonagh
New York Rangers Cup
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 6,267
vCash: 500
Basically he's saying what we've all been saying and this article just screams logjam. Basically, he's being a pest by pointing out how many people we have nowadays.

Sather's summer has been good, don't get me wrong. But at this point, like everyone else, I'm interested to see what the hell is going to happen. There is a complete logjam at forward and like 4 question marks on defense with Staal still not signed.

Definitely excited for this upcoming season.


















....but only if Redden is gone

RMcDonagh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:40 PM
  #37
SupersonicMonkey*
DROP THE PUCK
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Country: United States
Posts: 16,229
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
didn't mean to come off with "fighting words" but look...


i hate the boogard signing. he's nor worth the money, but he's a 4th liner who fights. that's a defined role.

avery is a third liner, we have enough of those and we don't need to be paying 1.9 mil for one.

we have plenty of guys who can do what avery does on the ice.

i personally enjoy most of his antics, but i don't see room for him on this team. torts obviously isn't his biggest fan and he's not a special teams guy. we'd be better off preserving the cap space in case we need to make a deadline deal.

don't you think?

(yes, i agree with you, avery can play hockey...you'll find no argument from me on that point)
It's OK.

I'm not a big fan of Avery's, either. I like him, but i won't be upset if we replace him. Because IMO we have a couple of ready players in Hartford that need a chance to play at the NHL level now. Byers and Weise both produced on a bad team last year. Both play a game that Tortorella loves. A simple straight forward game. Big bodies. Physical. And can score.

1.9 isn't that high of a cap hit. Callahan is making more then Avery, and he's also a third line player, granted Callahan is a better player.

I don't disagree with you that Avery can be replaced. Because he can be. And like i mentioned we do have two guys who are ready now that can fill that 3rd/4th line role.

Boogaard is a waste no matter what role he is given. I think the guy is going to be a liability every time he is on the ice. And his fights will be staged against other team's designated goon. I just don't see the point.

SupersonicMonkey* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:57 PM
  #38
TheHotRock
Registered User
 
TheHotRock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: nyc
Country: United States
Posts: 2,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
It's OK.

I'm not a big fan of Avery's, either. I like him, but i won't be upset if we replace him. Because IMO we have a couple of ready players in Hartford that need a chance to play at the NHL level now. Byers and Weise both produced on a bad team last year. Both play a game that Tortorella loves. A simple straight forward game. Big bodies. Physical. And can score.

1.9 isn't that high of a cap hit. Callahan is making more then Avery, and he's also a third line player, granted Callahan is a better player.

I don't disagree with you that Avery can be replaced. Because he can be. And like i mentioned we do have two guys who are ready now that can fill that 3rd/4th line role.

Boogaard is a waste no matter what role he is given. I think the guy is going to be a liability every time he is on the ice. And his fights will be staged against other team's designated goon. I just don't see the point.
boogard would be fine by me if you took a million off of his salary. i don't mind a guy on the roster who plays 5 minutes or less but can literally destroy anyone on the opposing team. it doesn't hurt to have a dude like that on your team....but to pay him 1.65 mil is outrageous.

and callahan and avery are very different animals. cally is an above average to good penalty killer and a good shot blocker. he also picks his spots much better as far as throwing hits than avery.

1.9 isn't that high for a guy like avery if he's gonna be playing 12-15 minutes a night, but i don't see it here. if he makes the team he's probably gonna spend most of the season on the 4th line.

i think we're better off preserving the cap space.

TheHotRock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:05 PM
  #39
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
 
Tawnos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Charlotte, NC
Country: United States
Posts: 12,174
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
i think we're better off preserving the cap space.
For what? Day one of the season comes with the roster set and with the team under the cap and it really doesn't matter if we have $10k in cap space or $10m. Any trade possibility would involve salary going back and salary can be moved through waivers or to the minors, if it's absolutely necessary.

Tawnos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:13 PM
  #40
TheHotRock
Registered User
 
TheHotRock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: nyc
Country: United States
Posts: 2,177
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
For what? Day one of the season comes with the roster set and with the team under the cap and it really doesn't matter if we have $10k in cap space or $10m. Any trade possibility would involve salary going back and salary can be moved through waivers or to the minors, if it's absolutely necessary.
this is not the NBA, you should educate yourself as to how the salary cap works.

TheHotRock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:21 PM
  #41
Black Tank
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: a NYer in England
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 1,170
vCash: 500
An earlier poster nailed it. Redden is not going to get any better. He had 2 years of massive decline in Ott and now 2 years of awful play (the last year against the weakest opposing lines) for NY. He's sucked for 4 years in a row.

He's going to miraculously find his game as much as Brashear will....

They are old and wealthy; age and money have robbed both of them skill and desire. Everyone is glad that we got rid of Brashear and now it's Redden's turn.

Black Tank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:24 PM
  #42
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,887
vCash: 500
With using bonus cushion

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Alexander Frolov ($3.000m) / Vaclav Prospal ($2.100m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m) / Erik Christensen ($0.925m) / Mats Zuccarello-Aasen ($1.750m)
Sean Avery ($1.937m) / Chris Drury ($7.050m) / Ryan Callahan ($2.300m)
Derek Boogaard ($1.625m) / Artem Anisimov ($0.821m) / Brandon Prust ($0.800m)
/ Brian Boyle ($0.525m)

DEFENSEMEN
Marc Staal ($4.500m) / Michal Rozsival ($5.000m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m) / Daniel Girardi ($3.325m)
Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
/ Steve Eminger ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) /Martin Biron ($0.875m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $58,021,667; BONUSES: $2,587,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $3,965,833


No bonus cushion with the Rangers having room to pay all the potential bonuses within the $59.4 million cap

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Alexander Frolov ($3.000m) / Vaclav Prospal ($2.100m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m) / Erik Christensen ($0.925m) / Mats Zuccarello-Aasen ($1.750m)
Sean Avery ($1.937m) / Chris Drury ($7.050m) / Ryan Callahan ($2.300m)
Derek Boogaard ($1.625m) / Artem Anisimov ($0.821m) / Brandon Prust ($0.800m)
/ Brian Boyle ($0.525m)

DEFENSEMEN
Marc Staal ($4.500m) / Michal Rozsival ($5.000m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m) / Daniel Girardi ($3.325m)
Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
/ Steve Eminger ($1.125m)

GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) /Martin Biron ($0.875m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $58,021,667; BONUSES: $2,587,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $1,378,333

Redden and White are assigned to the AHL. A loan to European teams are options.

White is coming off shoulder surgery to repair a torn tabrum and shoulder dislocation. Suffered two knee injuries. 35 years old. White will collect his $2.6 million salary and he'll be looking for work in Europe next summer. If Atlanta didn't take Brashear's 35 plus contract and Rissmiller off the Rangers hands,White is not a Ranger.

RangerBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:36 PM
  #43
eco's bones
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Elmira NY
Country: United States
Posts: 12,746
vCash: 500
There's a bunch of questions about our lineup that aren't going to be answered until training camp is done.

Forget Redden. If they don't dump him into the minors our season is ****ed right from the beginning. Paying at best a bottom pairing d-man $6.5 mil to play 15-17 minutes a night would be insane. He has to go no matter how well he does in training camp. He can't live up to his job description. He has to go.

As for the forwards--if Christensen is a 1st-2nd line center then the Rangers have some serious holes. Without doubt Torts does not like Avery and would like to squeeze him out however trading him is very unlikely. Sending him down more likely but likely as well to backfire because at least you know that he's a pretty decent player and when you have questions about a plethora of other players--whether they'll fade?--Drury, Prospal, Christensen, White or not do much of anything at all?--Boyle then it's better to stick with someone you can depend on at the end of the day.

eco's bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:46 PM
  #44
haveandare
Registered User
 
haveandare's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 6,452
vCash: 500
This is bad, even for Brooks. What if Redden outplays almost everybody? Is that a serious question? Even if he gets A LOT better than he was during last season, he still wouldn't be able to outplay Staal, MDZ or Rozy. McD is too young to put into the picture seriously yet, but he's a young monster of a D man who is looking to prove himself as well. I'd be surprised if Redden could outplay him either, especially with Torts as the one making the decisions. Knowing Torts, he'll be looking for snarl or "jam" and endurance from his players. Redden may be better than some others (maybe MDZ and/or McD) at defensive hockey but he's sure as hell not going to out skate or outwork them.

This is just more idiocy from Brooks.

haveandare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:52 PM
  #45
broadwayblue
Registered User
 
broadwayblue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 15,762
vCash: 500
Avery isn't going anywhere. He'll be on the roster opening night. He's a more valuable player than the freaking captain for crying out loud.

broadwayblue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:57 PM
  #46
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,327
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
I'm under the impression Todd White isn't going to be healthy by training camp. I doubt he'll be the reason Avery is the odd man out, Brooks is just trying to rile people up and keep them interested in his column.

As for Redden being the best d-man in camp, or one of, who cares? It's training camp. Grachev made people look silly in camp and pre-season games then scored 28 points in the AHL. Not that I'm jumping to conclusions about Grachev's career, but imagine if we had kept Grachev on the roster?

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 01:57 PM
  #47
nyrleetch
Registered User
 
nyrleetch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 3,834
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
Avery isn't going anywhere. He'll be on the roster opening night. He's a more valuable player than the freaking captain for crying out loud.

nyrleetch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 02:01 PM
  #48
KingWantsCup
Super Saiyan Hank
 
KingWantsCup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 5,422
vCash: 350
Frolov - Christensen - Gaborik
Dubinsky - Anisimov - MZA
Prospal - Drury - Callahan
Prust - Avery? - Boogaard

Drury's contract continues to hurt us. Not that Avery is the difference between us contending or not, but there's also no room for Stepan to get decent ice time because of him, unless Drury is on the fourth line. And if Drury is on the fourth line then Avery is definitely out of the picture. I'm mostly concerned about getting our key kids into our lineup now because the way things are shaping up our best shot at winning a cup will be in around 2013-2014. Gaborik and Lundqist's primes won't last forever the kids need the experience.

KingWantsCup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 02:07 PM
  #49
KingWantsCup
Super Saiyan Hank
 
KingWantsCup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 5,422
vCash: 350
And on Redden it won't matter if he's the best defenseman at camp (never gonna happen, he's the worst). We have to bury him to make room for Frolov and Staal. End of story.

KingWantsCup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 02:08 PM
  #50
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,327
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
this is not the NBA, you should educate yourself as to how the salary cap works.
Maybe you should educate him if you want to go around a message board feeling like a genius because you think you know a thing or two about the NHL's CBA

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:07 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.