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Sergei Kostitsyn - how many points do you think he'll get next season?

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Old
08-10-2010, 07:00 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I just remember the stories from when he first came over to the OHL about how everybody just loved his personality, billets, people around the team as well as on it, everybody marvelling at what a jovial and good guy he seemed to be. It's kind of weird how things went so far off the rails in Montreal. It's hard to know what to believe. But one thing's for sure, the people who immediately take the extreme view against SK don't have any credibility to me. They are basing it on what? A mob reaction, basically. None of us actually know him or have been around him.

Good player, though, no doubt about that. If he gets the time and the linemates, and a bit of leeway, he WILL produce. I'm just not sure how to reconcile that with Trotz, though. Leeway is not in huge supply... ?
Great points.

I think there is something to be said for all the off-ice drama SK was a part of (deservedly or not) in Montreal. These guys don't live in a bubble. When your name is linked to organized crime in the hockey-est city on the planet (with apologies to Toronto), it's going to weigh on you. On a similar note, NHL players are rock stars/Hollywood A-listers in Montreal. There's plenty of room for distractions. (I call it the New York Rangers syndrome.) SK will have far fewer of those in Nashville, and it could help his game.

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08-10-2010, 10:29 PM
  #27
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if Joel Ward can score 17 goals, if Adam Hall can score 16 goals--both with limited offensive ability--given the opportunity with the Predators, there's no reason SK can't have a productive year. It's amazing how jaded so many in our fanbase are toward this guy, based on sometimes dubious Montreal media reports.

Gee, I guess we could call up Nick Spaling or Andreas Thuresson to "work hard" and chip in 7 or 8 goals...

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08-10-2010, 10:52 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
if Joel Ward can score 17 goals, if Adam Hall can score 16 goals--both with limited offensive ability--given the opportunity with the Predators, there's no reason SK can't have a productive year. It's amazing how jaded so many in our fanbase are toward this guy, based on sometimes dubious Montreal media reports.

Gee, I guess we could call up Nick Spaling or Andreas Thuresson to "work hard" and chip in 7 or 8 goals...
Yeah, Hall scored 16 therefore Sergei will also... I wish it were that simple.

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08-11-2010, 06:22 AM
  #29
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Yeah, Hall scored 16 therefore Sergei will also... I wish it were that simple.
my point is that we're all so quick to "ehhhh, ten goals..." this guy, when in the same breath we expect the Joel Wards on the team to repeatedly toss in 15-18. What is the basis for putting such low expectations on someone with arguably more skill than anyone on the team? For all the reports from bitter Montreal fans of how awful he is, there's just as many that say that *in every instance* he was actually given a chance to produce and succeed, he did so.

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08-11-2010, 07:28 AM
  #30
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"He was under the microscope a little bit in the Montreal system," Predators assistant GM Paul Fenton said. "I think a new start at a new place like ours where it's a concept of everyone working together is something he will accept."

Fenton has known Kostitsyn since 2003 and continues to be impressed.

"This kid is a really solid, two-way player and he always has been," Fenton said. "He's very responsible on both sides of the puck. His two-way game is very attractive to me."
http://www.tennessean.com/article/20...2/8110379/1028

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08-11-2010, 07:52 AM
  #31
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If he scores more points in the top nine than Smithson did last season, without being a locker room cancer or a defensive liability, then that's a win for Poile IMO. We're not expecting the guy to come in and replace the offense of a superstar. He's just supposed to bump a fourth-line player back down to the fourth line.

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08-11-2010, 09:41 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
my point is that we're all so quick to "ehhhh, ten goals..." this guy, when in the same breath we expect the Joel Wards on the team to repeatedly toss in 15-18. What is the basis for putting such low expectations on someone with arguably more skill than anyone on the team? For all the reports from bitter Montreal fans of how awful he is, there's just as many that say that *in every instance* he was actually given a chance to produce and succeed, he did so.
To me, that's totally the case. When the puck dropped, he was a good player for us. Maybe there were a few isolated cases where he tried something too fancy, or he took some undisciplined/selfish penalties, and the coaches really come down hard on that stuff, but the thing is, his talent always showed. And he does play hard. Doesn't always know the right thing to do, so the efficiency isn't always there, but the desire is. And he was pretty effective as a penalty-killer too in the limited opportunity he had.

It still all comes back to wondering how this is going to pan out on Trotz's team, though. We question whether Sergei has the humility/coachability to react to Trotz's methods in a way that Trotz will be satisfied with. If SK takes any of his undisciplined runs at a guy, or tries a cute pass that leads to a turnover, and he ends up on the bench, or sits out the next game, then how does he react? Sergei's problem might be that he *knows* he's a good player, and he *knows* he does a lot of good things on the ice. But maybe he doesn't (yet?) have the perspective on what else it takes to be a regular in the NHL. Hard to know if he'll get it or not. That's the main risk to me.

Just a maturity/humility issue. Talent is there. The off-ice stuff I believe was purely a media byproduct - they wanted a big front page splash because they thought they uncovered something huge and salacious, but when it turned out to be nothing and the team and the police just laughed at it all, they tried to at least wring as much drama out of it as they could, and the Kostitsyns were the unfortunate scapegoats of that. Nobody needs to worry about anything on that side of it.

The Trotz relationship is going to be an interesting one, though.

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08-11-2010, 10:12 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
To me, that's totally the case. When the puck dropped, he was a good player for us. Maybe there were a few isolated cases where he tried something too fancy, or he took some undisciplined/selfish penalties, and the coaches really come down hard on that stuff, but the thing is, his talent always showed. And he does play hard. Doesn't always know the right thing to do, so the efficiency isn't always there, but the desire is. And he was pretty effective as a penalty-killer too in the limited opportunity he had.

It still all comes back to wondering how this is going to pan out on Trotz's team, though. We question whether Sergei has the humility/coachability to react to Trotz's methods in a way that Trotz will be satisfied with. If SK takes any of his undisciplined runs at a guy, or tries a cute pass that leads to a turnover, and he ends up on the bench, or sits out the next game, then how does he react? Sergei's problem might be that he *knows* he's a good player, and he *knows* he does a lot of good things on the ice. But maybe he doesn't (yet?) have the perspective on what else it takes to be a regular in the NHL. Hard to know if he'll get it or not. That's the main risk to me.

Just a maturity/humility issue. Talent is there. The off-ice stuff I believe was purely a media byproduct - they wanted a big front page splash because they thought they uncovered something huge and salacious, but when it turned out to be nothing and the team and the police just laughed at it all, they tried to at least wring as much drama out of it as they could, and the Kostitsyns were the unfortunate scapegoats of that. Nobody needs to worry about anything on that side of it.

The Trotz relationship is going to be an interesting one, though.
Just to be clear, Trotz is not of the Hitchcock/Laviolette/Tortorella mold. They are all very regimented coaches with strong philosophies and systems. But the difference is that Trotz treats his players as he would his family and makes sure that they know he cares about them as people first and players second. He doesn't treat players like assets and will nurture when needed and when he raises his voice, it's generally behind closed doors where the player is informed of exactly what is expected and offered whatever assistance is needed to get the job done.

It will really all come down to the maturity level of Kostitsyn. If he is willing to work with Trotz, I think he'll have a long NHL career because adding detail to a players game and refining the talent that is there is what he does best...

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08-11-2010, 11:16 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by SLake View Post
Just to be clear, Trotz is not of the Hitchcock/Laviolette/Tortorella mold. They are all very regimented coaches with strong philosophies and systems. But the difference is that Trotz treats his players as he would his family and makes sure that they know he cares about them as people first and players second. He doesn't treat players like assets and will nurture when needed and when he raises his voice, it's generally behind closed doors where the player is informed of exactly what is expected and offered whatever assistance is needed to get the job done.

It will really all come down to the maturity level of Kostitsyn. If he is willing to work with Trotz, I think he'll have a long NHL career because adding detail to a players game and refining the talent that is there is what he does best...
To expand on this, he's definitely not a "yeller" in the Torts model...in most instances, I've seen him classified as a "players' coach." Most recently, Matthew Lombardi went as far as to say Trotz was one of the main reason he chose the Preds over some of the other suitors.

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08-11-2010, 11:51 AM
  #35
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Jacques Martin seemed to have trouble accepting SKostitsyn too. He seems like a structured/regimented guy who is also non-emotional(-ish - at least on the scale of the yelling Tortorellas). If Trotz can nurture, and get through to Sergei, it will be great for the Preds.

None of us has any insight into how the relationship between Martin and Sergei went, but it seemed like communication wasn't much of a part of it. Mistake - you sit. Up to the player to figure it out. Kirk Muller to pat the guys on the back and take care of the nurturing. SK's frustrations in Montreal would be understandable if he was getting all stick, no carrot, and no explanations... at least, no explanations at a level that he was mature enough to interpret. Who knows. Sergei does think he's pretty good, and he is. I'll be super-impressed (but not surprised) if Trotz finds a way to turn him into a steal for the Preds.

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08-11-2010, 12:39 PM
  #36
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SKs biggest issue is he doesn't take to discipline well even a behind closed doors approach I am afraid won't work. He does see himself as an enigma and larger than the parts he is put with. I saw it all over the place primarilay in London and moreso after he got to the show. He can be very childish and demanding and very very selfish when it comes to other things like icetime and such. I wish you luck with him.

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08-11-2010, 04:31 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by 29dryden29 View Post
SKs biggest issue is he doesn't take to discipline well even a behind closed doors approach I am afraid won't work. He does see himself as an enigma and larger than the parts he is put with. I saw it all over the place primarilay in London and moreso after he got to the show. He can be very childish and demanding and very very selfish when it comes to other things like icetime and such. I wish you luck with him.
And the Gnashie for Best Broken Record Poster of 2010 goes to...!

Seriously, I respect your opinion, but why do you feel the need to so aggressively try to drive it into our heads that you don't see SK ever working out? Wishing us luck with him doesn't do a lot to mask the overall negativity that seems to drip from your posts on the matter. As I said, your opinion is fine, but I, for one, get it.

Maybe Trotz won't get through to him. Maybe the kid is a head case just waiting to ruin his NA hockey career. Maybe he gets angry at behind-closed-doors disciplinary actions and hops the next plane to Russia. Maybe he isn't a locker room problem, but he just doesn't pan out. Or maybe a change of scenery coupled with a new approach and a sense of anonymity in public will be exactly what this kid needed to begin reaching his potential. If any of those things work out we are only on the hook for a little over half of a million dollars. Either we cheaply lose out, he earns exactly what we're paying, or we score one of the best off season transactions of 2010. I don't think luck is what we need. I think a few months of hockey is what we need.

Oh, and I'm not one for individual stat predictions, but screw it. I can see him getting consistent top line minutes by December and netting somewhere in the neighborhood of 17g 26a for 43pts.

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08-11-2010, 04:42 PM
  #38
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hey preds fans, i am from montreal and have seen a lot of sergei the last 3 seasons. He definitly has some talent, i was very impressed sometimes with his hockey sense, the passes he could make, he has a very good vision. I don't think Jacques Martin gave him a chance to proove himself this year and the fact that he started in hamilton sure didnt help. If coach Trotz can give him good ice time I'm sure Sergei could bounce back.

I will say 40pts for this season (14-26-40) but he sure has the potential to have 60 pts in this league if he wants to

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08-11-2010, 05:00 PM
  #39
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I know it's ultimately Trotz's decision to allot ice time, but SK will have every opportunity here to earn as much time as he can play. Guys like Wilson, Radulov, Hornqvist, Weber, Suter, Ellis, Rinne have all come in, worked hard, and ended up getting top minutes (Rads obviously doesn't now, but did). Even roleplayers like Fiddler, Nichol, Smithson, Ward, etc have been given slots on lines due to good work ethic and lack of forward depth. We don't lack that depth now so SK can't be lazy, he can't stop working on his game, and he can't take it personally if things seem to be going longer. He'll have a good shot to impress at camp, and if he uses competition among teammates to rise to the next level he'll be happy with the amount of playing time he sees.

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08-12-2010, 11:54 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by rocketxav9 View Post
hey preds fans, i am from montreal and have seen a lot of sergei the last 3 seasons. He definitly has some talent, i was very impressed sometimes with his hockey sense, the passes he could make, he has a very good vision. I don't think Jacques Martin gave him a chance to proove himself this year and the fact that he started in hamilton sure didnt help. If coach Trotz can give him good ice time I'm sure Sergei could bounce back.

I will say 40pts for this season (14-26-40) but he sure has the potential to have 60 pts in this league if he wants to

Wow, a Montreal fan that didn't feel the need to tell us about how bad SK will be.

I'd say 35-40 points. Anything over 40 for SK should earn Poile/Trotz major kudos

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08-12-2010, 10:58 PM
  #41
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He had 130+ points in the OHL. You dont get that many points and stink sorry.
To be fair he was playing on a line with Sam Gagner and Patrick Kane on a London Knights offensive juggernaut team. I think he can become a 50-60 point guy if he's given the right opportunities and doesn't mess around like he was in Montreal. I'm really interested to see how a guy like Trotz handles Kostitsyn. That being said he is a very big work in progress.

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08-13-2010, 09:30 AM
  #42
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To be fair he was playing on a line with Sam Gagner and Patrick Kane on a London Knights offensive juggernaut team. I think he can become a 50-60 point guy if he's given the right opportunities and doesn't mess around like he was in Montreal. I'm really interested to see how a guy like Trotz handles Kostitsyn. That being said he is a very big work in progress.
Good points indeed and he played on a team that was pretty much offence first we will worry about the rest later. Look how many points Kane and Gagne had that season along with pretty much the rest of the team and you easily see how his linemates made him much better than he was. The goaltending in JR hockey is also not quite what it is in the NHL either. I think the Knights also averaged in teh neighbourhood of 45 shots a game on net which will also help your numbers that doesn't happen all that often in the NHL unless you are playing against the HAbS lol

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08-13-2010, 11:48 AM
  #43
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08-16-2010, 06:41 PM
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08-23-2010, 10:07 AM
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Good points indeed and he played on a team that was pretty much offence first we will worry about the rest later. Look how many points Kane and Gagne had that season along with pretty much the rest of the team and you easily see how his linemates made him much better than he was. The goaltending in JR hockey is also not quite what it is in the NHL either. I think the Knights also averaged in teh neighbourhood of 45 shots a game on net which will also help your numbers that doesn't happen all that often in the NHL unless you are playing against the HAbS lol
And where was Kane and Gagner when Sergei got 78 points in is rookie years in London?

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08-24-2010, 01:18 PM
  #46
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And where was Kane and Gagner when Sergei got 78 points in is rookie years in London?
LOL my point exactly they are more Role players and Kane I could care less about I hope he falls flat on his face.

In other news Sergei has apparently been practicing and playing pre season games in Belarus I think he is making backup plans for when he gets sent home packing from the NHL lol.

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08-24-2010, 05:31 PM
  #47
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This thread has run it's course, therefore I'm locking it. If you have a legitimate reason why you believe this thread should stay open...please PM either BFC or myself and we will consider re-opening the thread.

Thanks!

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09-22-2010, 01:22 PM
  #48
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Sergei Kostitsyn

What are your opinions on Sergei?
I only went to training camp Saturday and Sunday (work got in the way during the week) but the times I was there he was not impressive at all. I see him being about as productive as Cal O'rielly and hopefully spending more time in Milwaukee than Gnashville.

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09-22-2010, 02:13 PM
  #49
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