First Witt, now Cote no room for the player with heart...
Before I start, I'm not a fan of goonery by any means. However, living in a world where cap space is king. We are starting to see players like Witt and Cote bought out or forced to retire. There is simply no room for them anymore. If you can't skate and produce, then you can't get a spot on the squad no more.
Here's where the dilemma is; those players bring many things to the table you can't put on a score sheet. Intangibles like grit and determination, heart and good old fashion physical hockey. I'm sure gonna miss those days.
Although poor Witter couldn't skate anymore the last two seasons I still think on a squad (islanders 2009-2010) where he would be seeing 3rd pair minutes he would be able to bring some of that to our young guns. A lot more then the chef last season.
I don't know, maybe I don't like seeing a staple player like Cote (born one year before me) forced to retire because "there is no room for him in the post lock-out NHL". Those days are gone.
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Last edited by Trumanperro: 08-12-2010 at 12:13 PM.
He won't be playing in the NHL because he simply cannot keep up anymore. And thats the way it should be. Forget everything else the primary measuring stick for any player is whether or not he can actually keep up with the game, then you go into the intangibles.
Although poor Witter could skate anymore in the last two seasons I still think on a squad where he would be seeing 3rd pair minutes he would be able to bring some of that to our young guns.
If Witt was a regular part of our defensive rotation this season it would be alarming, to say the least. The buyout's the right thing to do. I actually felt bad for him last season, because he always was such a tough player who played the game the right way, and it was just painfully obvious he was done. It's time to move on.
Before I start, I'm not a fan of goonery by any means. However, living in a world where cap space is king. We are starting to see players like Witt and Cote bought out or forced to retire. There is simply no room for them anymore. If you can't skate and produce, then you can't get a spot on the squad no more.
Here's where the dilemma is; those players bring many things to the table you can't put on a score sheet. Intangibles like grit and determination, heart and good old fashion physical hockey. I'm sure gonna miss those days.
Although poor Witter could skate anymore in the last two seasons I still think on a squad where he would be seeing 3rd pair minutes he would be able to bring some of that to our young guns. A lot more then the chef last season.
I don't know, maybe I don't like seeing a staple player like Cote (born one year before me) forced to retire because "there is no room for him in the post lock-out NHL". Those days are gone.
i definitely agree with you about him bringing intangible things to the ice, but he had to go. sure, he could have been a big help with the younger guys, but we also have other guys that can do that but can also still play (Mark Streit). dont get me wrong i liked brendan witt, he got hit by a car and played later that night....he was tough and gritty but his playin days are over
so long brendan witt,
If Witt was a regular part of our defensive rotation this season it would be alarming, to say the least. The buyout's the right thing to do. I actually felt bad for him last season, because he always was such a tough player who played the game the right way, and it was just painfully obvious he was done. It's time to move on.
I'm just saying we live in a world where a player like Ryle Cote who brings 100% every game can't find a home in the NHL when players like Avery can. Those days of gritty players are done. I know that Cote wasn't exactly a class act and he treaded the lines between dirty and physical often, but he bought it.
I know Witt's done, but I think that at least last year he should've had his spot as a third d pairing and then buy him out. We were embarrassing anyway. Regardless I can't believe that in the last 2 seasons his game took such a nose dive.
I'm just saying we live in a world where a player like Ryle Cote who brings 100% every game can't find a home in the NHL when players like Avery can. Those days of gritty players are done. I know that Cote wasn't exactly a class act and he treaded the lines between dirty and physical often, but he bought it.
I know Witt's done, but I think that at least last year he should've had his spot as a third d pairing and then buy him out. We were embarrassing anyway. Regardless I can't believe that in the last 2 seasons his game took such a nose dive.
So what if he brings a 100% you want guys that can't play to play just because they show some grit? The days of gritty players are not done... at all. There are plenty still in the league. Witt and Cote are no longer playing because they are a liability, its as simple as that.
Avery has a place in the league because he can score, hit and be a general annoyance. I'll take Avery on my team any day, he is a heck of a player who is also plenty gritty (btw).
Both players are retired because they are useless. It has nothing to do with "grit." There are 100 players in the NHL with "grit" and they are also good at hockey.
I'm just saying we live in a world where a player like Ryle Cote who brings 100% every game can't find a home in the NHL when players like Avery can. Those days of gritty players are done. I know that Cote wasn't exactly a class act and he treaded the lines between dirty and physical often, but he bought it.
The ones with actual NHL talent still can. All that's happening is that players who do nothing but fight, but who obviously don't have NHL level skills, no longer have a spot in the league (unless you're a 7'10", 350 lbs monster like the Boogie man).
There's still a lot of players in the league who bring Cote's effort/grit/toughness/character, but they also have something called an ability to actually play the game as well.
Teams still covet tough guys -- they simply want ones that can actually contribute on the ice.
New NHL means skill, talent and speed matters. Thus some of those who might have had grit and some talent, but lacking in certain areas, have had game pass them by. Tough gritty guys are still abound, but the skillset and skating skills are far higher.
Avery is 30, Witt is 35. I would be willing to make a large wager that Avery is out of the league before his 35th birthday.
Did you just compare Sean Avery to Brendan Witt? That's like comparing George W. Bush to Dwight Eisenhower. (Note that I am referencing their military records in this comparison.)
Before I start, I'm not a fan of goonery by any means. However, living in a world where cap space is king. We are starting to see players like Witt and Cote bought out or forced to retire. There is simply no room for them anymore. If you can't skate and produce, then you can't get a spot on the squad no more.
Here's where the dilemma is; those players bring many things to the table you can't put on a score sheet. Intangibles like grit and determination, heart and good old fashion physical hockey. I'm sure gonna miss those days.
Although poor Witter couldn't skate anymore the last two seasons I still think on a squad (islanders 2009-2010) where he would be seeing 3rd pair minutes he would be able to bring some of that to our young guns. A lot more then the chef last season.
I don't know, maybe I don't like seeing a staple player like Cote (born one year before me) forced to retire because "there is no room for him in the post lock-out NHL". Those days are gone.
I guess a counter-point would be the Isles signing Konopka and Gillies.
Cote was a fringe NHL'er, the flyers saw some value in him as a coach and he may have just set himself up for the rest of his life. His choice. Keep in mind, for a guy like Cote, who has to answer the bell every night wether it's game 1 or game 50 and your hand is already broken, this was a smart play.
Witt was finished and you know what, for a guy who wears 32 as a tribute to dale hunter, I won't miss him. Not his job I guess but did this guy ever win a fight?
Before I start, I'm not a fan of goonery by any means. However, living in a world where cap space is king. We are starting to see players like Witt and Cote bought out or forced to retire. There is simply no room for them anymore. If you can't skate and produce, then you can't get a spot on the squad no more.
Here's where the dilemma is; those players bring many things to the table you can't put on a score sheet. Intangibles like grit and determination, heart and good old fashion physical hockey. I'm sure gonna miss those days.
Although poor Witter couldn't skate anymore the last two seasons I still think on a squad (islanders 2009-2010) where he would be seeing 3rd pair minutes he would be able to bring some of that to our young guns. A lot more then the chef last season.
I don't know, maybe I don't like seeing a staple player like Cote (born one year before me) forced to retire because "there is no room for him in the post lock-out NHL". Those days are gone.
Watch Konopka this year and you will see why guys with energy and zero nhl caliber skill don't have a place anymore. Z will provide all the energy and entangables and if put in the right situation 20+ points a year. You mentioned Avery and as annoying as he is and I'm not a fan but he brings a lot of different things to the table. He is almost a half a point a game guy while Cote has 7 pts total in 156 games. Probert changed the game a long time ago and proved that a tough guy could actually play and produce. I liked the old days better myself but change is inevitable so let guys like Z give you something else to get excited about.
Sorry dude but you still live in a world where grit and heart is valued cause Byufuglien is getting paid over 3m a year to score 12-17 goals.
Witt just broke down and plain flat out sucks. Cote always kinda sucked. Grit and heart only take you so far, you need to be able to actually play the game.
Cote wasn't forced to retire. He chose to because he got absolutely rocked every time he fought. Now don't mistake me; I absolutely loved Cote's tenacity. Even though he never won, I would put money that he was one of those players nobody wanted to fight, because he dropped the gloves he was coming out swinging on all cylinders. Even so, can't blame the man for wanting to be the third Lindros*.
*This comparison is in relation to concussions, not theplayers as a whole. So don't fly off the handle as you people are wont to do, and I see have already done in this very thread. Not a personal attack at whoever did that, but players of vastly differing skill levels CAN have comparable aspects.
Cote wasn't forced to retire. He chose to because he got absolutely rocked every time he fought. Now don't mistake me; I absolutely loved Cote's tenacity. Even though he never won, I would put money that he was one of those players nobody wanted to fight, because he dropped the gloves he was coming out swinging on all cylinders. Even so, can't blame the man for wanting to be the third Lindros*.
*This comparison is in relation to concussions, not theplayers as a whole. So don't fly off the handle as you people are wont to do, and I see have already done in this very thread. Not a personal attack at whoever did that, but players of vastly differing skill levels CAN have comparable aspects.
