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Cody Franson Signs two year $800K per year

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Old
09-10-2010, 11:43 AM
  #126
dulzhok
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I'm not expecting anything from SK. Great if he does something, but I'm not expecting it.

I agree Suter is our best Dman at getting the puck up the ice, however, I don't love his skills on the PP once we're in the zone. He's pretty good, but nothing great, IMO.

Franson has some vision of his own, and he's got a blast. I like the idea of having two major threats from the backend. It would make Weber that much more dangerous.

Now, in terms of real playmaking forward... well, um, not a lot to talk about there. Colin Wilson, you're our only hope. Unless you count the real longshots like SK or Jonas Andersson. Honestly, I'm expecting to be in the lower third on the PP again. We just don't have the top-end talent at forward to have a dangerous PP.

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09-10-2010, 01:02 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by dulzhok View Post
I'm not expecting anything from SK. Great if he does something, but I'm not expecting it.

I agree Suter is our best Dman at getting the puck up the ice, however, I don't love his skills on the PP once we're in the zone. He's pretty good, but nothing great, IMO.

Franson has some vision of his own, and he's got a blast. I like the idea of having two major threats from the backend. It would make Weber that much more dangerous.

Now, in terms of real playmaking forward... well, um, not a lot to talk about there. Colin Wilson, you're our only hope. Unless you count the real longshots like SK or Jonas Andersson. Honestly, I'm expecting to be in the lower third on the PP again. We just don't have the top-end talent at forward to have a dangerous PP.
Montreal doesn't have any more top end talent than we do on the PP yet they rank at the top of the league. How is that?

I think the common misconception with PP's is talent. While talent helps, it's not always the answer. Pittsburgh and Chicago ranked in the middle of the league and last time I checked, they had some pretty good talent. Washington was at the top of the league and their talent level is pretty good last time I checked there as well.

PP's are about letting the puck do the work for you. If the puck is moving slowly or inefficiently or the spacing/positioning is poor, the PP fails. This is where I think we've had the biggest issues in the last few years. We don't move the puck well. Our passing is soft as opposed to crisply. If you're moving the puck well, you will find a seem to get the puck on net for good shots or shots that produce rebounds. You also have to have guys that will go to the net and take a beating. We have one in Hornqvist. If we can find another guy or two to help him out, I think the PP will turn around.

Also, using Sully at the point last year is a waste of an asset to me. He's better along the half boards and goal line to the side of the net. He's much more creative with the puck that way.

We'll see what this years unit does for us.

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09-10-2010, 02:56 PM
  #128
dulzhok
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
I think the common misconception with PP's is talent. While talent helps, it's not always the answer. Pittsburgh and Chicago ranked in the middle of the league and last time I checked, they had some pretty good talent.
NHL leaders in PP points:
http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...iewName=points
This list looks pretty talented to me.

Montreal is an exception, but they do have a some specific PP weapons, and everything aligned for them. Markov and MAB are PP QBs. Gomez is a better playmaker than anyone we have. Camerelli is a better sniper than anyone we have.

Yes, Pittsburgh ranks at the middle of league, and you can bet they aren't happy about it, at all. IMO, their problem is they have too much talent. They had 3 legit PP QBs in Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar. Too many chiefs, not enough indians. They didn't find true chemistry, despite having the talent.

For us to rank towards the top of the league in PP, it's going to take something close to a miracle. We just don't have the talent on the front end. If a coach is able to get us to the top of the league with our forward talent, well, they should be the front runner for the Jack Adams.

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09-10-2010, 07:56 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by dulzhok View Post
NHL leaders in PP points:
http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...iewName=points
This list looks pretty talented to me.

Montreal is an exception, but they do have a some specific PP weapons, and everything aligned for them. Markov and MAB are PP QBs. Gomez is a better playmaker than anyone we have. Camerelli is a better sniper than anyone we have.

Yes, Pittsburgh ranks at the middle of league, and you can bet they aren't happy about it, at all. IMO, their problem is they have too much talent. They had 3 legit PP QBs in Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar. Too many chiefs, not enough indians. They didn't find true chemistry, despite having the talent.

For us to rank towards the top of the league in PP, it's going to take something close to a miracle. We just don't have the talent on the front end. If a coach is able to get us to the top of the league with our forward talent, well, they should be the front runner for the Jack Adams.
The point of you showing me the players with a lot of PP points was? Great players will usually score a lot of points on the PP. I get that.

Markov and MAB were injured for a good portion of the year last year and Montreal still had good numbers. Gomez is a 60 point a year guy, that's not top tier talent. Camallieri is a solid player too but is not an elite player either. That is my point, that teams without elite talent can still have an effective PP. They have lost great PP weapons the last few years in Streit and Souray yet still continue to do well.

We have a monster weapon in Weber and Suter isn't shabby as his partner on the back end. This is not a talent issue but an execution issue.

101 and I went back and forth on this about 2 months ago and we did some stat searching. For a good portion of the year they were either on or off. When we were on, we were pretty solid but when we were off we were horrible. If I remember correctly we had a 9 game and 7 game drought on the PP. We also had a 9 game stretch where we scored once in the middle of it and went 4 games on both sides without a goal. Teams go thru bad stretches but if we only take the 9 and 7 game stretches that's 20% of our games that we went scoreless on the PP.

So all that said, is it talent, execution, a little bit of both, the system? Could be lots of things but NHL players don't get to this level without having something going for them. It could also be a chemistry issue of who's on the ice that has been the biggest problem. I remember when we first got Sully and the damage that he and Walker caused on the PP. Those two teamed with Zidlicky on the PP caused nightmares for teams because we had three right handed shots on the team and most teams don't use that type of personnel on the ice at any one time. Maybe we'll see a little bit of Sully, Weber and Hornqvist out there to cause this type of mismatch this coming season.

I think the talent is there to be successful. I think it's a matter of execution that will help matters more than anything. We are waaaaay too tentative with the puck. Move it quickly and that should help as well. If guys are taking too long to make decisions with the puck then they need to sit on the bench and get guys out there who will move the puck better.

Also having guys like Lombardi, SK and Wilson who are relatively agile might do some good as opposed to a guy like Arnott who doesn't move very well and really looks for his shot more often than not and doesn't bring much else to the unit.

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Old
09-10-2010, 08:37 PM
  #130
dulzhok
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
The point of you showing me the players with a lot of PP points was?
You said "I think the common misconception with PP's is talent."

I was saying yes, I think talent has a HUGE part of the PP. Out of the top 30 PP point producers last year, only one played on a team that ranked in the lower third PP percentage (Daniel Alferddsson).

Montreal is the only example of a team that doesn't have top end talent, yet still managed to have a really good PP. However, when you look at it closer, they have a lot of people who are skilled on the PP, though not necessarily elite talent. Markov is a great PP QB, way better than anyone we have. We don't have any great playmakers. Gomez is a great playmaker. No, he doesn't put up a ton of goals, but yeah, he would instantly be our best PP playmaker. Camerelli would instantly be our best goalscorer. MAB is PP specialist. Gionta and Plenakec are good on the PP too. No they don't have Ovechkin, but the have better PP pieces that us, and apparently they had a great chemsitry too.

We have Weber and we have Hornqvist. A shot and a body. We don't have any great playermakers or snipers. We have some 2nd line PP players (erat, sullivan, dumont), but lack the true top-end talent. If you're hoping coaching can fix everything, I think you will be disappointed. Simply put, Steve Sullivan can't compare Alex Ovechkin on the PP, not even Mike Camerelli. Lombardi can't compare to Backstrom, and not even Gomez.

Out of the top 30 PP point producers last year, only one played on a team that ranked in the lower third PP percentage. I think that drives home the point that top end talents plays a HUGE part on having a good PP.

Is is possible we could have a top 10 PP? I suppose, if the stars align right. Am I expecting it? Not at all.

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09-10-2010, 09:09 PM
  #131
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Franson improved every season in Milwaukee. He should do the same, although at slower rate in the NHL. Remember that the fastest AHL skaters are only average speed in the NHL. He needs to adjust to the faster pace in the NHL. Pekka saw him play in Milwaukee, so he knows what to expect.

Blum needs another year Milwaukee to develop. He is smart but needs to add a few pounds. If you think Franson doesn't check enough, you will be tearing your hair out when Blum is on the NHL ice. He hardly hits anybody in the AHL, usually it is a nudge.

Wilson could stand another 1/2 season in Milwaukee. I expect big things from him!

Is Josi really that good to jump to the NHL now? I haven't seen him play.

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09-10-2010, 09:13 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by adsfan View Post
Franson improved every season in Milwaukee. He should do the same, although at slower rate in the NHL. Remember that the fastest AHL skaters are only average speed in the NHL. He needs to adjust to the faster pace in the NHL. Pekka saw him play in Milwaukee, so he knows what to expect.

Blum needs another year Milwaukee to develop. He is smart but needs to add a few pounds. If you think Franson doesn't check enough, you will be tearing your hair out when Blum is on the NHL ice. He hardly hits anybody in the AHL, usually it is a nudge.

Wilson could stand another 1/2 season in Milwaukee. I expect big things from him!

Is Josi really that good to jump to the NHL now? I haven't seen him play.
Josi will start in Milwaukee. Blum will too. I tend to disagree on Wilson though, he's physically mature enough to compete in the NHL and if brought along slowly (3rd line/2nd scoring line center/power play time) I think he'll reach his potential faster than playing against competition that plays a step slower...

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09-10-2010, 09:26 PM
  #133
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Josi will start in Milwaukee. Blum will too. I tend to disagree on Wilson though, he's physically mature enough to compete in the NHL and if brought along slowly (3rd line/2nd scoring line center/power play time) I think he'll reach his potential faster than playing against competition that plays a step slower...
SLake: Thanks for your ideas. I think Wilson will improve playing all the time in Milwaukee versus less time in Nashville. A call up in December or January could be timely, especially if there is an injury for the Preds. Then I would follow your slow NHL path for the rest of the season if he sticks with the Preds.

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09-10-2010, 10:11 PM
  #134
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SLake: Thanks for your ideas. I think Wilson will improve playing all the time in Milwaukee versus less time in Nashville. A call up in December or January could be timely, especially if there is an injury for the Preds. Then I would follow your slow NHL path for the rest of the season if he sticks with the Preds.
I appreciate that view, but in my seven seasons of watching AHL hockey in Hartford I learned that despite that more traditional approach to development...sometimes players simply show that there is little left for them to learn at that level and need to be challenged in order to reach their full potential.

I just feel Wilson is that type of player and needs top level competition to take the next step in his development. In every viewing I've had of Wilson this summer he has exuded confidence. Unless that confidence disappears...I think his time in the AHL is over.

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09-12-2010, 12:11 AM
  #135
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I agree with Slake. Wilson needs NHL competition to make the next step.

If Wilson has to go back to Milwaukee it will be a very bad sign

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09-12-2010, 04:47 PM
  #136
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I think the very thought that he would ever play in the AHL barring injury is silly. He's an NHLer. The other big point is if he goes, the Preds are a worse team. So why would they do that? They need Wilson. He'll get fulltime minutes too, so I don't know how that would be any different, except maybe playing the penalty kill at the AHL level or something, but who cares about his penalty kill.

Wilson seemed resigned to be in the AHL last season. He said all the right things about how excited he was to be playing in the AHL as a pro, and working to improve, but when he'd score an AHL goal it was like ho-hum, but when he scored an NHL goal it was pure excitement. He played well but said he wanted to make it tough on the Preds not to call him up. So, if his heart isn't in the AHL, and it wouldn't be, he wouldn't learn much. He needs to be challenged. He said he learned last year that the NHL was a big challenge, especially in the playoffs it is much tougher.

Besides, he's one of the Preds best players. You don't send your best players off somewhere else.

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