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Old
09-16-2010, 01:25 PM
  #1
SeasonTicket
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Hyman

http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey...-hockey-empire

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09-16-2010, 01:41 PM
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that is scary.

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09-16-2010, 01:43 PM
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At the time of a Star investigation into Hyman's transformation from hockey dad to minor hockey mogul in 2004, basic player fees on some of his teams were double the typical league rates leading to concerns he could be using non-profit kids' hockey teams as money-making enterprises. It's an allegation Hyman vigorously denies, saying he personally sponsored young players who couldn't afford to play and provided better equipment and training for his teams.

In the aftermath of the Star investigation, and vigorous public reaction that followed, the GTHL imposed strict new rules over ownership and corporate transparency.
Uhm. Seems to me it's as much a passion as a business for him.

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09-16-2010, 01:46 PM
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that is scary.
Indication? The FLORIDA PANTHERS SELECT.....

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09-16-2010, 01:48 PM
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CHGoalie27
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...hey, when he gets hit, will the commentator say "Hyman just got popped?"

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09-16-2010, 02:19 PM
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Who cares. So he bought a bunch of teams for his kids to play on. It's no different than the politics that go on in any youth league for any sport. It sucks for the kids that don't make the team, but it's great to be on a high caliber team when you do make it on that team.

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09-16-2010, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by CHGoalie27 View Post
...hey, when he gets hit, will the commentator say "Hyman just got popped?"
Or, in his 1st NHL game and his first goal - "Buster Hyman finally popped his cherry!"

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09-16-2010, 02:23 PM
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When Don Cherry interviews Hyman...

Funny if his name was Buster...in school and official papers : Hyman, Buster

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09-16-2010, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Weiwuer View Post
Uhm. Seems to me it's as much a passion as a business for him.
If you bothered to finish the article you would have seen:

Quote:
It's an allegation Hyman vigorously denies, saying he personally sponsored young players who couldn't afford to play and provided better equipment and training for his teams.
and
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It remains a sore spot for Hyman.

“I have probably helped more kids get to the NHL level than anyone else in the GTHL, period,” he says. “Because I'm different than other people doesn't mean anything else is going on other than I have a big heart.”

Hyman says his ownership of hockey organizations has only made his sons' hockey paths more challenging. “They played under tremendous pressure and were given the shaft a lot of times because their dad was the owner. It hurts you. It doesn't help you. You have to be twice as good because people recognize your name.”

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09-16-2010, 02:39 PM
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Could we have a new owner of the FL Panthers soon?

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09-16-2010, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Great8Cam View Post
Who cares. So he bought a bunch of teams for his kids to play on. It's no different than the politics that go on in any youth league for any sport. It sucks for the kids that don't make the team, but it's great to be on a high caliber team when you do make it on that team.
and he bought ISS. he was 120 on ISS and not among the top 210 on the NHL's list. hmm. there's a lot of smoke there. even if his intentions were the best (and i'm not saying they aren't or weren't), it's still really, really odd. why would anyone want to do that to their kid? buy up everything your kid is involved in? that's truly crazy.

i haven't seen him play but this story really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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09-16-2010, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by panthertod View Post
Could we have a new owner of the FL Panthers soon?
we have a winner!

DT, meet your new overlord.

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09-16-2010, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
and he bought ISS. he was 120 on ISS and not among the top 210 on the NHL's list. hmm. there's a lot of smoke there. even if his intentions were the best (and i'm not saying they aren't or weren't), it's still really, really odd. why would anyone want to do that to their kid? buy up everything your kid is involved in? that's truly crazy.

i haven't seen him play but this story really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
If a team drafts strictly on ISS rankings then they are in big trouble. Like Luce said, they did their due diligence and actually tracked the kid.

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09-16-2010, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Great8Cam View Post
If a team drafts strictly on ISS rankings then they are in big trouble. Like Luce said, they did their due diligence and actually tracked the kid.
of course that's what luce says. and he might believe it. and perhaps it had no influence. it would be very difficult to prove not, though, and the scary match between their ranking and where we selected him bothers me. i'd only be able to put it out of my mind if another team that has drafted well had him that high on their board. or if he becomes a player.

and of course hyman says he "just wanted to help all those kids".

do you believe everything you hear?

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09-16-2010, 06:15 PM
  #15
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Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
of course that's what luce says. and he might believe it. and perhaps it had no influence. it would be very difficult to prove not, though, and the scary match between their ranking and where we selected him bothers me. i'd only be able to put it out of my mind if another team that has drafted well had him that high on their board. or if he becomes a player.

and of course hyman says he "just wanted to help all those kids".

do you believe everything you hear?
It's just a coincidence, man. I can say very confidently that no team cares how independent scouting services rank a player. For some teams(Atlanta I think did mostly video scouting one year?) that have severely cut back on their scouting departments recently and do a lot of video scouting, it might have more significance but for us it doesn't have any.

I've also noticed we have been foraging a lot into the USHS and Junior A ranks in middle/western Canada the past few years, so I really don't have a second thought about this. Also, like a recent article said, Hyman 2-3 years ago was on the same level as kids like Seguin and Toffoli. If an independent scouting service identifies potential big talents a few years down the road, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that that info got back to our org. as well.

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09-17-2010, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
and he bought ISS. he was 120 on ISS and not among the top 210 on the NHL's list. hmm. there's a lot of smoke there. even if his intentions were the best (and i'm not saying they aren't or weren't), it's still really, really odd. why would anyone want to do that to their kid? buy up everything your kid is involved in? that's truly crazy.

i haven't seen him play but this story really leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
How?

This is just a retarded conspiracy theory. ISS is completely independent from NHL teams. An NHL team isn't going to draft a player based on ISS, or because the owner of ISS has a son and has somehow bribed or influenced the selection. Its an absurd logic.

It's definitely unique and odd. But none of us know him, and to be quite frank, why would you care? It won't affect his son's development from what i can see, and his previous history had no direct bearing on our selection of his son.

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09-17-2010, 06:00 AM
  #17
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Whoa. I've heard of this before. Didn't realize it was Hyman, though.

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09-17-2010, 08:24 AM
  #18
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Originally Posted by J17 Vs Proclamation View Post
How?

This is just a retarded conspiracy theory. ISS is completely independent from NHL teams. An NHL team isn't going to draft a player based on ISS, or because the owner of ISS has a son and has somehow bribed or influenced the selection. Its an absurd logic.

It's definitely unique and odd. But none of us know him, and to be quite frank, why would you care? It won't affect his son's development from what i can see, and his previous history had no direct bearing on our selection of his son.
correct, completely retarded.

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09-17-2010, 09:28 AM
  #19
zeroG
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Originally Posted by Markstrom Rules View Post
It's just a coincidence, man. I can say very confidently that no team cares how independent scouting services rank a player. For some teams(Atlanta I think did mostly video scouting one year?) that have severely cut back on their scouting departments recently and do a lot of video scouting, it might have more significance but for us it doesn't have any.

I've also noticed we have been foraging a lot into the USHS and Junior A ranks in middle/western Canada the past few years, so I really don't have a second thought about this. Also, like a recent article said, Hyman 2-3 years ago was on the same level as kids like Seguin and Toffoli. If an independent scouting service identifies potential big talents a few years down the road, it's not beyond the realm of possibility that that info got back to our org. as well.
ok, i know you like him and remember mention of that article comparing him to seguin (though that was a bit ago).

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Originally Posted by J17 Vs Proclamation View Post
How?

This is just a retarded conspiracy theory. ISS is completely independent from NHL teams. An NHL team isn't going to draft a player based on ISS, or because the owner of ISS has a son and has somehow bribed or influenced the selection. Its an absurd logic.

It's definitely unique and odd. But none of us know him, and to be quite frank, why would you care? It won't affect his son's development from what i can see, and his previous history had no direct bearing on our selection of his son.
well, it's not a retarded conspiracy theory. certainly not mine at least. the article is suggesting that his father is buying influence and it certainly looks like it from the outside. maybe he's just buying stuff he gets exposed to as his kids grow up and doesn't realize he's doing it.

the author isn't saying that the panthers drafted him because he was the owner of ISS's son, or that his father bribed them, just that his ranking on ISS might have influenced in some small way how the panthers perceived him and that the huge gap between how his father's company ranked him versus the NHL's central scouting service is odd. perhaps it didn't influence the panthers. it's not absurd logic though or retarded though. **** like this happens all the time.

i know some folks around here don't care much for ISS's rankings but they are known and referenced. are you guys really saying that *no* team gives any weight to ISS rankings? it's a serious question; i don't follow prospects or the process that closely.

i don't really care as long as there was no influence, but it's kinda disgusting. not kinda, actually.

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09-17-2010, 10:44 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
ok, i know you like him and remember mention of that article comparing him to seguin (though that was a bit ago).



well, it's not a retarded conspiracy theory. certainly not mine at least. the article is suggesting that his father is buying influence and it certainly looks like it from the outside. maybe he's just buying stuff he gets exposed to as his kids grow up and doesn't realize he's doing it.

the author isn't saying that the panthers drafted him because he was the owner of ISS's son, or that his father bribed them, just that his ranking on ISS might have influenced in some small way how the panthers perceived him and that the huge gap between how his father's company ranked him versus the NHL's central scouting service is odd. perhaps it didn't influence the panthers. it's not absurd logic though or retarded though. **** like this happens all the time.

i know some folks around here don't care much for ISS's rankings but they are known and referenced. are you guys really saying that *no* team gives any weight to ISS rankings? it's a serious question; i don't follow prospects or the process that closely.

i don't really care as long as there was no influence, but it's kinda disgusting. not kinda, actually.
It is a retarded conspiracy. Once again, this had no bearing on our decision to select him at all. Teams may observe ISS rankings to look at rankings and gauge an idea on how to check out more, but then that doesn't matter ; a team is only going to select a player base on if the viewings were successful (there are rare incidents where players from Europe get taken on basically one view or sometimes never having been seen).

ISS will also not have bumped up his ranking because his father happens to own the service. Its not going to happen. He was ranked there on merit ; they felt he was 122nd (?) best player available on potential.

There is no influence there at all in measurement. Stop making a cheat out of a hooker.

And how it is disgusting, i don't know. You're a weird fellow if you atcually are annoyed about this.

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09-17-2010, 11:00 AM
  #21
zeroG
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Originally Posted by J17 Vs Proclamation View Post
It is a retarded conspiracy. Once again, this had no bearing on our decision to select him at all. Teams may observe ISS rankings to look at rankings and gauge an idea on how to check out more, but then that doesn't matter ; a team is only going to select a player base on if the viewings were successful (there are rare incidents where players from Europe get taken on basically one view or sometimes never having been seen).

ISS will also not have bumped up his ranking because his father happens to own the service. Its not going to happen. He was ranked there on merit ; they felt he was 122nd (?) best player available on potential.

There is no influence there at all in measurement. Stop making a cheat out of a hooker.

And how it is disgusting, i don't know. You're a weird fellow if you atcually are annoyed about this.
that's it precisely. and if you don't think that kinda stuff has some impact, you're being naive. companies spend billions on sly marketing just to plant seeds. this is not conspiracy theory, this is how the world works. again, i'm not saying we picked him because of that but you are not in a position to definitely say that his ranking had absolutely no impact.

and how do YOU know ISS didn't bump up his ranking? everyone thought the pentagon's intelligence was completely unbiased but we've come to understand that when the top dogs are looking over your shoulder, you tend to tell them what they want to hear. this happens all the time.

anyhow, we don't have to discuss further. i'm not holding it against the kid but it's very odd and personally, i find spending money like that to control your child's environment creepy. clearly, based on other comments here and the story itself, others do as well.

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09-17-2010, 11:12 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroG View Post
that's it precisely. and if you don't think that kinda stuff has some impact, you're being naive. companies spend billions on sly marketing just to plant seeds. this is not conspiracy theory, this is how the world works. again, i'm not saying we picked him because of that but you are not in a position to definitely say that his ranking had absolutely no impact.

and how do YOU know ISS didn't bump up his ranking? everyone thought the pentagon's intelligence was completely unbiased but we've come to understand that when the top dogs are looking over your shoulder, you tend to tell them what they want to hear. this happens all the time.

anyhow, we don't have to discuss further. i'm not holding it against the kid but it's very odd and personally, i find spending money like that to control your child's environment creepy. clearly, based on other comments here and the story itself, others do as well.
I wonder how much of your material is on lamebook or failbook?

I have no idea if Florida even use ISS, and if thats how they decided to view Hymann, but i very much doubt it. Secondly, even if this was the source that discovered him for us, we drafted him based on him, not some artificial ranking by one independant scouting service.

How do you know that ISS did bump his ranking? Yes i can play pointless idiotic games too. You're just using baseless conjecture to validify a retarded conspiracy plot.

You just compared the ISS to the pentagon. Dead on. Im also pretty sure Pete DeBoer is actually part of the taliban. How else do you explain the internal terrorism and our failings.

Next time you eat toast, be cautious. You don't know who its really working for.

You're a weird fellow.

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09-17-2010, 11:14 AM
  #23
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whatever

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