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Sean Avery a goner?

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Old
09-24-2010, 09:27 PM
  #101
eco's bones
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To be honest I could give two s***s whether Avery puts more money in Dolan's pockets or not. Dolan has more than enough already--or more than he'll ever need anyway. The Rangers existed before Dolan--more than likely they'll exist after him. What I care about is whether Avery helps the team win--which was not a problem at all at least until last year and we can debate any number of reasons for that for whatever that would prove. To be honest I couldn't care less about the squeaky clean image that the NHL wants to portray it's players because they think it's good for marketing. That's all Bettman's BS. And whether the Rangers turn a profit ever again is secondary in my mind to them winning another cup.

Avery if he's playing like he can--can help us. And the fact is the great majority of Rangers fans think he makes the team better--that's why he's a hero to a lot of them. Maybe he's not for all tastes but the team's track record since he's showed up has been real good and the team since he's showed up has played with much more passion. It's up to Tortorella as coach to put him in situations to succeed and help the team. So far he's not been as good at that as Tom Renney.

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09-24-2010, 09:37 PM
  #102
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A-very, A-very, A-very!

Man is legend. Hope he is a NYR until he retires.

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09-24-2010, 10:17 PM
  #103
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Are there any official lines published for tomorrow? It will be interesting to see who Avery is paired with...

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09-24-2010, 11:11 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
Marketable can mean one of two things in this case: Either he is worth a lot in a trade or he adds cash to the organization.

I maintain he is worth near nothing in a trade. Do you disagree?

I maintain that he puts incredibly negligible money into the pockets of Dolan. He has zero effect on attendance, TV revenue, and advertising dollars.

The only thing you could argue he brings in is some Jersey sales. How much do you think gets spent on Avery jerseys and how much of that goes into Dolan's pockets?

If there is another way he is marketable, I'm missing it.
Obviously he is untradeable. It wouldn't have made any sense for me to refer to him as marketable on the trade market given that my point was his marketability is a reason why they wouldn't "dump him" to the minors or whatever unrealistic (at this point) options people are proposing.

No offense but I can't keep arguing something that is so obviously true. He is wildly popular. He is good looking (women care about these things in hockey). He is controversial. He generates much press. He sells jerseys (not nearly as significant for the revenue as much as an indicator). His name is chanted across MSG. His game is very advert friendly. Avery hockey is made for photos and for replays. As I have already stated... and I'm sorry but I just can't believe I have to convince anybody of something so completely undeniable... Avery hockey easily can be marketed to attract new fans. All ages and all genders. While his antics aren't going to discourage a significant share. He's a press machine, a controversy machine, a tabloid presence and a figure that transcends just the hockey side. He's a crossover celebrity. With potential given his play returning to form and the Rangers having success.

Now obviously I'm not talking about any kind of situation were he actually does become some kind of a team cancer. I'm talking about the Rangers version of Avery.


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Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
To be honest I could give two s***s whether Avery puts more money in Dolan's pockets or not.
I think it's safe to say that nobody does. The point was... even though it's irrelevant because there aren't enough forwards to play him off the team... that Avery's fan appeal and the inherent financial consequence also plays a role.


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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Any debate about Sean Avery's marketability need not include vocabulary words such as: substantive discourse - indictment - godspeed - retort - etc. I know what all these words mean, but you don't have to bring them out for the purpose of trying to trump the poster you're debating with.
I did not try to trump anybody with my use of magically eloquent words. I'm just magically eloquent by my nature. God made me that way.

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09-25-2010, 02:35 AM
  #105
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They better not get rid of him. Past history clearly shoes that the Rangers are a much better team with Avery in the lineup.

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09-25-2010, 07:44 AM
  #106
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Fanbase would be torn apart. Probably 60/40 in Avery's favor.

Teammates don't like him though, management has a problem with his antics, and his coach can't seem to favor him in most situations because he cannot find the "right" way to play.

I think Sean will be given every opportunity to play exactly how Torts wants, but if he fails to meet those expectations, Sean is not worth having on the team and will be moved.

My question is just: Where?

But he definitely will make the team and have at least a dozen games or so to prove himself before anything irrational occurs.

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Old
09-25-2010, 08:00 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by DrurysWeekend View Post
A-very, A-very, A-very!

Man is legend. Hope he is a NYR until he retires.
Hells yeah!

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09-25-2010, 08:54 AM
  #108
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For here, at this early juncture, a 16-player roster -- consisting of goaltenders Henrik Lundqvist and Martin Biron; defensemen Marc Staal, Dan Girardi, Michal Rozsival and Michael Del Zotto; and forwards Marian Gaborik, Alex Frolov, Ryan Callahan, Brandon Dubinsky, Chris Drury, Artem Anisimov, Vinny Prospal, Brandon Prust, Sean Avery and Derek Boogaard -- accounts for approximately $48.8 million of cap space.
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...#ixzz10Y5sQfc8

So now Brooks has Avery on the team. You can say that it's just him speculating... just like he did the other day when he wondered if Avery wouldn't make the team.

These writers need a story. There are none right now. We are talking about the 4th line spots of a borderline playoff team in the NHL. This is the least interesting line in the least interesting segment of the least interesting sport (according to America). And by talking about the ever marketable Avery, Brooks and others are increasing the hits on their ad revenue generating webpages. That's it guys. Avery, when he plays his game which he did far too infrequently last season, is a good player that somehow makes other players better. You don't take things like that for granted.

Avery is on this team until his play dictates he doesn't stay. He's had a great camp and even if he didn't he would still gets some regular season games to come around. Maybe he won't get until December like Roszival every year, but he'll get something. This was the same exact concern over Nedved last year and he actually should have made the team on merit, but he didn't because he was another redundant part that needed another NHL contract. Fedetenko will be sent on his merry way in a week or so and we can move on.

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Old
09-25-2010, 09:21 AM
  #109
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For the good of the hockey club Sean Avery will not be on the team. Some of you must understand that Avery is not liked in the Rangers locker room by a large majority of the team. The Rangers PR spins the stories and wants fans to believe he is beloved by his team, when in fact he is not. This is coming from my personal connections to a former Ranger player as well as a prospect(was a call-up last season, and currently in camp) who have confirmed this as being true.

When Avery was providing his game on the ice, the team sort of dealt with him. When a guy like Avery is in your room, this is just me talking but it creates a cloud over the team. It is counterproductive to have a head case in the room, even if he is playing well. Did you guys know, that Avery sits in the hallways during intermissions? This guy is not a leader. He will give the media some quotes here and there, but don't be fooled.

It's possible that he may make the team, but if Torts has "his" way Avery will not be on the team come the beginning of the season.

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09-25-2010, 09:34 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by TrueBlueJoe89 View Post
For the good of the hockey club Sean Avery will not be on the team. Some of you must understand that Avery is not liked in the Rangers locker room by a large majority of the team.
LOL. Nonsense.

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09-25-2010, 09:53 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by LoFFeN View Post
LOL. Nonsense.
Who was it that said he is liked in the locker room, is very cool, and is not like he is on the ice at all? Anisimov? Maybe Christensen?

I love how people just spout this "Avery is a locker room cancer zomg errbody hates him" crap as if it's fact.

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09-25-2010, 10:02 AM
  #112
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Remember when this guy was supposed to be Avery's replacement? lol



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09-25-2010, 11:01 AM
  #113
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I'm not an Avery hater nor am I an Avery lover. He is what he is and can be an incredibly effective player so the baggage and stupidity I can hack...

...but was he just called a legend?

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09-25-2010, 11:22 AM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueBlueJoe89 View Post
For the good of the hockey club Sean Avery will not be on the team.
Care to make it interesting?

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Old
09-25-2010, 11:43 AM
  #115
eco's bones
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Originally Posted by HockeyBurd View Post
Obviously he is untradeable. It wouldn't have made any sense for me to refer to him as marketable on the trade market given that my point was his marketability is a reason why they wouldn't "dump him" to the minors or whatever unrealistic (at this point) options people are proposing.

No offense but I can't keep arguing something that is so obviously true. He is wildly popular. He is good looking (women care about these things in hockey). He is controversial. He generates much press. He sells jerseys (not nearly as significant for the revenue as much as an indicator). His name is chanted across MSG. His game is very advert friendly. Avery hockey is made for photos and for replays. As I have already stated... and I'm sorry but I just can't believe I have to convince anybody of something so completely undeniable... Avery hockey easily can be marketed to attract new fans. All ages and all genders. While his antics aren't going to discourage a significant share. He's a press machine, a controversy machine, a tabloid presence and a figure that transcends just the hockey side. He's a crossover celebrity. With potential given his play returning to form and the Rangers having success.

Now obviously I'm not talking about any kind of situation were he actually does become some kind of a team cancer. I'm talking about the Rangers version of Avery.


I think it's safe to say that nobody does. The point was... even though it's irrelevant because there aren't enough forwards to play him off the team... that Avery's fan appeal and the inherent financial consequence also plays a role.




I did not try to trump anybody with my use of magically eloquent words. I'm just magically eloquent by my nature. God made me that way.
Just for the record--Sean can play on my Rangers team any day and every day.

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09-25-2010, 11:55 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueBlueJoe89 View Post
For the good of the hockey club Sean Avery will not be on the team. Some of you must understand that Avery is not liked in the Rangers locker room by a large majority of the team. The Rangers PR spins the stories and wants fans to believe he is beloved by his team, when in fact he is not. This is coming from my personal connections to a former Ranger player as well as a prospect(was a call-up last season, and currently in camp) who have confirmed this as being true.

When Avery was providing his game on the ice, the team sort of dealt with him. When a guy like Avery is in your room, this is just me talking but it creates a cloud over the team. It is counterproductive to have a head case in the room, even if he is playing well. Did you guys know, that Avery sits in the hallways during intermissions? This guy is not a leader. He will give the media some quotes here and there, but don't be fooled.

It's possible that he may make the team, but if Torts has "his" way Avery will not be on the team come the beginning of the season.
I have a really hard time believing this. You know a former player and Byers or PA from the sound of it and their stories are an indication of how well Avery is liked in the locker room? A player who isn't on the team anymore and a guy who has been in the Rangers locker room during game time a whopping 2 or 3 times? Even if you do know them - and you very well may, I'm just a little apprehensive about anybody's "I know a player who..." stories, we're talking about two guys who aren't Rangers at the end of the day.

I'll trust Henrik, who is constantly with Avery outside of team activities. I'll trust all the players who spend their free time in his bar with him. I'll trust the players who said he's a great guy and I'll trust the report of him and Hank calling a team meeting last year when the boys most needed it.

These aren't products of "PR" these are observations and quotes from players who are with the guy in the locker room every single day. You're talking about stuff you've heard. I'm talking about stuff that I've seen and/or read from players directly.

And what is with this idea that he isn't bringing his game on the ice anymore!? Has anyone looked at his stats before going off about it?

This argument hurts my brain.

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Old
09-25-2010, 12:15 PM
  #117
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Avery is the type of guy that can steal a handful of games with his antagonizing. I want Sean on the team and he is not getting waived so he will be on the team

his role. not sure. May be 3rd line, may be 4th line

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09-25-2010, 12:29 PM
  #118
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Shannahan was supposed to be completely fed up with Avery according to posters and beat writers but there he is at Avery's bar hanging out... unless he was soley there to hear Lundqvist's band play, who must have only been there to scrap together some extra cash. No way anyone was there as a friend or because they happen to like him.

And I thought we went over this when he came back, this team doesn't deserve to be happy in the lockerroom. They were terrible when they were all buddy buddy and bff's. They play like garbage, have no accountability, don't call anyone out OR lead by example when it's all hunky dory. I'd rather have a Ranger team that was miserable and winning than the losers they are now and happy. The Flyers are too busy hating each other and sleeping around with the wrong people to lose. Granted they only had 1 more point than us but they can win when it counts, something these guys forget when they got their alleged wish to ditch Avery.

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Old
09-25-2010, 12:35 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
Avery is the type of guy that can steal a handful of games with his antagonizing. I want Sean on the team and he is not getting waived so he will be on the team

his role. not sure. May be 3rd line, may be 4th line

he can lose as many games as he can steal.

i'm not pro or anti. he's funny, i am entertained by his antics, but the rational me doesn't think we need to be paying a third liner 1.9 mil if he doesn't play on the pp or kill penalties.

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09-25-2010, 12:40 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by TheHotRock View Post
he can lose as many games as he can steal.

i'm not pro or anti. he's funny, i am entertained by his antics, but the rational me doesn't think we need to be paying a third liner 1.9 mil if he doesn't play on the pp or kill penalties.
who is going to take him? No one else will take the chance. All I have heard is he is working real hard in camp. He can be an affective player. Rangers have too many Forwards right now but injuries happen. Avery can be affective in many roles.

Bottom line is he wont be waived and he wont be traded so he will have a place in the lineup unless he pulls another sloppy seconds comment

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09-25-2010, 12:45 PM
  #121
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who is going to take him? No one else will take the chance. All I have heard is he is working real hard in camp. He can be an affective player. Rangers have too many Forwards right now but injuries happen. Avery can be affective in many roles.

Bottom line is he wont be waived and he wont be traded so he will have a place in the lineup unless he pulls another sloppy seconds comment
nobody has a "place in the lineup" because "nobody will take them on".

if he makes the team, great. if he gets outplayed, he's getting waived and sent down.

again, i feel 1.9 mil is way too much for a 8-10 minutes a night with no special teams. we'll see what happens, though.

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09-25-2010, 12:46 PM
  #122
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Avery marches to his own drum, that will always get him in trouble playing a team game. Coaches, players and management eventually give up cause he doesn't listen. NYR are his last shot or he wouldve acted out big time when Torts was playing bad cop with him.

He's a good player, works hard, makes a difference every now and then with his agitating ways, I just think that eventually having him here is not the be all end all to winning and his antics will get him to Europe sooner rather than later.

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09-25-2010, 12:54 PM
  #123
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Fanbase would be torn apart. Probably 60/40 in Avery's favor.

Teammates don't like him though, management has a problem with his antics, and his coach can't seem to favor him in most situations because he cannot find the "right" way to play.

I think Sean will be given every opportunity to play exactly how Torts wants, but if he fails to meet those expectations, Sean is not worth having on the team and will be moved.

My question is just: Where?

But he definitely will make the team and have at least a dozen games or so to prove himself before anything irrational occurs.
Who said players don't care...Hank is a close friend...Avery is vital...and Boogey and Prust have to play as close to 82 games possible.

Kennedy and Cally can not be on the same lime.

Frolov-Stepan-Gabby...that line will give you a great first 40 games...
Dubi-AA-Cally...alot of youth and a little bit of everything...
Avery-Christensen-Prospal...scoring ability there...
Prust-Boyle/Kenndey-Boogie...whoever shows more at center

Then when Drury comes back he takes either Kennedy, Christensen or Boyle's spot.

Staal-MDZ - youth shall be served...Staal anchors and MDZ explores.
Giradi-Gilroy/MCD - Danny boy wanted the contract...let him teach the ways.
Rozy-Sauer - Limit Rozy and tell him 12 minutes of capable defense...not sure he has it in him...Sauer deserves a look.

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09-25-2010, 02:05 PM
  #124
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The fact is Avery is exactly like Tortorella, that's why they may hate each others, can we explain them?

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09-25-2010, 02:23 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
Staal-MDZ - youth shall be served...Staal anchors and MDZ explores.
Giradi-Gilroy/MCD - Danny boy wanted the contract...let him teach the ways.
Rozy-Sauer - Limit Rozy and tell him 12 minutes of capable defense...not sure he has it in him...Sauer deserves a look.
Marc and MDZ are LD.
Girardi and Rozy are RD.

Not sure why anyone would want to see Gilroy instead of Rozsival playing in our top-4.

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