HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Souray and Gerber

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
09-30-2010, 05:54 PM
  #76
Joey Moss
Registered User
 
Joey Moss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 23,182
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyToHall View Post
Why Gerber? He was our best goalie......

I guess we are going for Larsson this year.
Because waiving our best pre-season goalie means we're going for the tank?

Joey Moss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 06:05 PM
  #77
Lounge Act*
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Country:
Posts: 4,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reign Nateo View Post
and play in Edmonton
Enough with this **** already. God.

Lounge Act* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 06:06 PM
  #78
OneMoreAstronaut
Reduce chainsaw size
 
OneMoreAstronaut's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,614
vCash: 1360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
Surprising Gerber got waived, but could it be creating the possibility of the Oil loaning him to Europe?
No, the Oilers signed him because they wanted him, not because they wanted to get rid of him.

The ideal place for him right now is OKC. It's just a question of whether he makes it there or not.

OneMoreAstronaut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 06:19 PM
  #79
Spawn
Registered User
 
Spawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 24,295
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felonious Python View Post
Surprising Gerber got waived, but could it be creating the possibility of the Oil loaning him to Europe?
The plan has always been to hopefully sneak him through waivers and have him be a vet goalie on the farm team.

Spawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 06:28 PM
  #80
HemskyToHall*
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,908
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
Because waiving our best pre-season goalie means we're going for the tank?
Regardless of Gerber or not, we should be in the front running if our goalie tandem is JDD and Dubnyk.

HemskyToHall* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 06:53 PM
  #81
BigHabs
#11
 
BigHabs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,908
vCash: 500
I am not going to lie, I would welcome him back to the Habs if he was on re-entry. I would even put something together like....

Maxwell
Hamrlik

for

Souray

Edmonton would get 2 serviceable pieces back. Hamrlik's contract expires, and I think Edmonton is not too worried about the money situation. This just gives them pieces they can use.

If Montreal would off that deal up we would have a legit D. Its not like Souray's game fell off. I know the injury situation, but if he got back to his Montreal ways lights out.

Markov Souray
Spacek Subban
Gorges Gill

ex. O'Byrne, Picard

I know money but we would save 900k in a deal including Hamrlik, but during the offseason, Gill would probably go. I also think of the market next offseason and they money we will have also makes me think we should wait for the market more too.

BigHabs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 07:08 PM
  #82
Highbrow
Alfie, Alfie, Alfie!
 
Highbrow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Toronto, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,676
vCash: 500
WAIVERS QUESTION:

In the off-season, if two teams place a claim for a player, who gets the player? In the regular season, it's standings-based. During the offseason, is it standings-based on the previous year? Or first come, first serve or something?

Highbrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 07:09 PM
  #83
HemskyToHall*
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,908
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by gamblor506 View Post
I am not going to lie, I would welcome him back to the Habs if he was on re-entry. I would even put something together like....

Maxwell
Hamrlik

for

Souray

Edmonton would get 2 serviceable pieces back. Hamrlik's contract expires, and I think Edmonton is not too worried about the money situation. This just gives them pieces they can use.

If Montreal would off that deal up we would have a legit D. Its not like Souray's game fell off. I know the injury situation, but if he got back to his Montreal ways lights out.

Markov Souray
Spacek Subban
Gorges Gill

ex. O'Byrne, Picard

I know money but we would save 900k in a deal including Hamrlik, but during the offseason, Gill would probably go. I also think of the market next offseason and they money we will have also makes me think we should wait for the market more too.
Hell I'd take Hamrlik straight up for Souray, no need to add Maxwell.

HemskyToHall* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 07:12 PM
  #84
Slick Rick 61
Registered User
 
Slick Rick 61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 434
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senataur View Post
WAIVERS QUESTION:

In the off-season, if two teams place a claim for a player, who gets the player? In the regular season, it's standings-based. During the offseason, is it standings-based on the previous year? Or first come, first serve or something?
From 9/25 (beginning of waiver period) to 10/31, the waiver priority goes based on last year's standings. From 11/1 through the rest of the season it goes based on current season record, in which the claiming team with the worst record at that date is awarded the claim.

Slick Rick 61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 08:40 PM
  #85
Rover*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 13,845
vCash: 500
If a team picks Souray off re-entry waivers and trades him, would the team that traded for Souray be on hook for 1/2 the cap hit/salary or all of it?

Rover* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 09:10 PM
  #86
nexttothemoon
The Drive for Nine
 
nexttothemoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Northern Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyze View Post
If a team picks Souray off re-entry waivers and trades him, would the team that traded for Souray be on hook for 1/2 the cap hit/salary or all of it?
From the FAQ's section at Capgeek.com...

"What are reentry waivers or recall waivers?

Waiver-eligible players on minor-league assignments are subject to reentry waivers if they are recalled and their minor-league salary is greater than $105,000 in 2009-10 and beyond.

If the player is not claimed on reentry waivers, he joins the parent club. If he is claimed, the acquiring team is only responsible for half of the player's salary and cap hit. The player's former team is responsible for the other half of the player's salary and cap hit for the duration of the contract.

The most well-known example of reentry waivers is Sean Avery, who the New York Rangers claimed off reentry waivers from the Dallas Stars in the first year of a four-year, $15.5-million contract.

If a player subject to recall waivers is assigned to the minors by Team A and claimed on recall by Team B, then both A and B split the salary and cap hit. If B then waives the player for assignment but Team C claims the player, then both A and C split the salary and cap hit. If B successfully waives the player and assigns him to the minors (A and B split his salary, but he carries no cap hit unless he has a 35-plus contract) and then B recalls the player and he's claimed by Team C, then B and C will split the salary and cap hit and A has no further obligation.

Skaters who have played 320 or more professional games in North America (NHL, AHL, or ECHL) or goalies who have played 180 or more professional games in North America (NHL, AHL, or ECHL) and (a) who have not been on an NHL roster for 80 or more games over the last two seasons or (b) who have not spent more than 40 games on an NHL roster in the immediately prior season, are exempt from recall waivers.
CBA reference: Section 50.9 a-g (P. 222-224)"


That doesn't directly answer the question in the case of a subsequent trade but I assume in that situation the Oilers would pay half his salary (and take half the cap hit) and the new team (team C) would pay the other half of his salary (and take half the cap hit). I assume the only way the Oilers would get completely off the hook for both his salary and cap hit is for another team to successfully put him through waivers... recall him and then have him claimed by another team (like the scenario outlined in the example above).

nexttothemoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 10:31 PM
  #87
Roof Daddy
Registered User
 
Roof Daddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 8,219
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by lcarnegie View Post
I can't see the oilers doing this. I think they would rather him sit in the minors whether their team or loaned to another rather then them having to foot half the bill. It's not even about the money but principle. They'll let him sit till someone wants him.
I'll bet you Katz has a much different opinion than you. To put it in context, if you're assets/worth are 25,000 and you paid someone to (as an example) cut grass for 90 bucks, but they told you to eat a dick, BUT you could get half you're money back if you let that person cut the neighbours grass instead, you'd rather have that person sit on their ass and do nothing because you're proving a point? 45 bucks isn't huge money, but would you burn it just to prove a point if all you had to your name was 25,000? Because that's what 4.5mil is in context to 2.5 billion (I think thats what Katz is worth).

Roof Daddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 10:44 PM
  #88
Pinkfloyd
Registered User
 
Pinkfloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Roseville
Country: United States
Posts: 33,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof Daddy View Post
I'll bet you Katz has a much different opinion than you. To put it in context, if you're assets/worth are 25,000 and you paid someone to (as an example) cut grass for 90 bucks, but they told you to eat a dick, BUT you could get half you're money back if you let that person cut the neighbours grass instead, you'd rather have that person sit on their ass and do nothing because you're proving a point? 45 bucks isn't huge money, but would you burn it just to prove a point if all you had to your name was 25,000? Because that's what 4.5mil is in context to 2.5 billion (I think thats what Katz is worth).
I would hope that Katz and Tambellini are smart enough to get rid of him before too long. There's simply no need to prove a point to Souray. He doesn't really want to play there and they don't want him to play there. Keeping him in limbo is only asking for trouble and a needless distraction.

If they put him on re-entry, someone will pick him up and it's unlikely Souray would even get past Tampa Bay. Since cap space and salary is not an issue for the Oilers, why would you worry about any team between Toronto and Tampa on the waiver wire claim him?

They're likely trying to get a trade done but nobody's biting.

Pinkfloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 10:58 PM
  #89
hillbillypriest
Registered User
 
hillbillypriest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: there there
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,128
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
I would hope that Katz and Tambellini are smart enough to get rid of him before too long. There's simply no need to prove a point to Souray. He doesn't really want to play there and they don't want him to play there. Keeping him in limbo is only asking for trouble and a needless distraction.

If they put him on re-entry, someone will pick him up and it's unlikely Souray would even get past Tampa Bay. Since cap space and salary is not an issue for the Oilers, why would you worry about any team between Toronto and Tampa on the waiver wire claim him?

They're likely trying to get a trade done but nobody's biting.
I don't think it's about proving a point, delaying assignment may be about keeping options open and hopefully saving money. If Souray wouldn't pass through re-entry this year, that's probably true next year too. However, it has been speculated that some teams that might bite on Souray if he had only one year left, won't touch him at full price with two. So if the Oilers don't assign Souray right away and can waive him next summer or next fall without having to pick up 1/2 his salary, they are dollars ahead compared to waiving, assigning and recalling right now.

hillbillypriest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 11:06 PM
  #90
Hawksfan12*
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,563
vCash: 500
I think Souray Makes it to re entry and the Sharks grab em

Or they work out a Deal with the Oil (probally not interested in Greiss though) saying Huskins/Wallin for Souray

Hawksfan12* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 11:20 PM
  #91
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 10,763
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawksfan12 View Post
I think Souray Makes it to re entry and the Sharks grab em

Or they work out a Deal with the Oil (probally not interested in Greiss though) saying Huskins/Wallin for Souray
If he goes to re-entry, I think there are a lot of teams that would take him before the Sharks even had a chance. NYI, Columbus, etc..

Duck Off is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 11:37 PM
  #92
Pinkfloyd
Registered User
 
Pinkfloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Roseville
Country: United States
Posts: 33,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillbillypriest View Post
I don't think it's about proving a point, delaying assignment may be about keeping options open and hopefully saving money. If Souray wouldn't pass through re-entry this year, that's probably true next year too. However, it has been speculated that some teams that might bite on Souray if he had only one year left, won't touch him at full price with two. So if the Oilers don't assign Souray right away and can waive him next summer or next fall without having to pick up 1/2 his salary, they are dollars ahead compared to waiving, assigning and recalling right now.
There is absolutely no way that Souray and the PA will simply let the Oilers keep Souray in limbo. If they can actually force something to happen is another issue but just them making a stink about it is something they don't need right now with a lot of young players growing. They need to focus on hockey and having outside stuff come in, which it will via the media, will only bring negatives to the team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawksfan12 View Post
I think Souray Makes it to re entry and the Sharks grab em

Or they work out a Deal with the Oil (probally not interested in Greiss though) saying Huskins/Wallin for Souray
I doubt Souray makes it to San Jose on re-entry. I'm fairly confident that the Lightning would pick him up if the Islanders or Blue Jackets don't. And past that, there are a lot of others that would consider it too before even getting to the number 29 spot in the waiver standings.

Pinkfloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-30-2010, 11:59 PM
  #93
CBJSprague24
"Scoreboard, son."
 
CBJSprague24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 52mi from the Nat
Country: United States
Posts: 6,825
vCash: 500
Just to make sure I understand the pecking order correctly, the waiver claim priority (for the first few teams anyway) would be:

-Toronto
-Florida
-Columbus
-NY Islanders
-Tampa

...and so on?

CBJSprague24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 12:06 AM
  #94
Vitto79
Registered User
 
Vitto79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sarnia
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,632
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBJSprague24 View Post
Just to make sure I understand the pecking order correctly, the waiver claim priority (for the first few teams anyway) would be:

-Toronto
-Florida
-Columbus
-NY Islanders
-Tampa

...and so on?
if true CLB would take him then Isles. Half the price is worth it to someone no?

Vitto79 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 01:11 AM
  #95
hillbillypriest
Registered User
 
hillbillypriest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: there there
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,128
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
There is absolutely no way that Souray and the PA will simply let the Oilers keep Souray in limbo. If they can actually force something to happen is another issue but just them making a stink about it is something they don't need right now with a lot of young players growing. They need to focus on hockey and having outside stuff come in, which it will via the media, will only bring negatives to the team.
How are the Oilers keeping him in limbo? They've made him available to the entire NHL at no cost - twice. I'm sure that if Souray wanted to terminate his contract to make things happen, the Oilers won't stand in his way. If he'd rather collect his money, he can do that too, but the Oilers have no obligation to waive him and recall him to enable him to play in the NHL and still collect his salary.

hillbillypriest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 01:42 AM
  #96
kdb209
Global Moderator
 
kdb209's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,591
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyze View Post
If a team picks Souray off re-entry waivers and trades him, would the team that traded for Souray be on hook for 1/2 the cap hit/salary or all of it?
If a team claims Souray on Waivers (Regular Waivers or Re-Entry Waivers) they cannot trade him for the remainder of the season without first offering him at waiver price to any team which put in an unsuccessful (lower priority) claim when Souray was originally claimed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBA Article 13.20(b)
(b) A Player who has been acquired by Waiver claim shall not be Traded to
another Club until the termination of Playoffs of the season in which he was acquired
unless he is first offered on the same terms to the Club(s) that entered a claim when
Waivers were requested originally and the offer has been refused.
In the unlikely event that Souray was claimed on Re-Entry Waivers by Team A and traded to Team B (if no other teams had put in a waiver claim or they refused when offered under 13.20(b)), then team B would pick up the salary & cap obligations of Team A - ie. 50% of Souray's remaining salary and cap hit, with the remainder still the responsibility of the Oilers.

kdb209 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 02:45 AM
  #97
MerryJ99
Registered User
 
MerryJ99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,151
vCash: 500
So if Souray was waived and is "not" Assigned to the minors, then he is not subject to re-call waivers or is he?

MerryJ99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 03:00 AM
  #98
nexttothemoon
The Drive for Nine
 
nexttothemoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Northern Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
So if Souray was waived and is "not" Assigned to the minors, then he is not subject to re-call waivers or is he?
Yes, that's my understanding of the waiver process. If a player is waived and actually isn't assigned to anywhere else... he can still play with the team/be traded away etc and of course he isn't subject to recall waivers because he hasn't actually gone anywhere to be "recalled" from.

For all intents and purposes... waiving a player simply allows any other NHL team to claim him and if no team does... that frees up the waiving team to assign/loan that player to somewhere... but there is nothing saying the team actually has to do so. The player still remains on that teams roster until an assignment is actually made.

nexttothemoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 04:01 AM
  #99
Pinkfloyd
Registered User
 
Pinkfloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Roseville
Country: United States
Posts: 33,560
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillbillypriest View Post
How are the Oilers keeping him in limbo? They've made him available to the entire NHL at no cost - twice. I'm sure that if Souray wanted to terminate his contract to make things happen, the Oilers won't stand in his way. If he'd rather collect his money, he can do that too, but the Oilers have no obligation to waive him and recall him to enable him to play in the NHL and still collect his salary.
They're keeping him in limbo by not assigning him to a place to play. In order for Souray to even attempt to terminate his contract, they'd have to assign him to the farm. If they don't even do that, they're not even giving him that option.

Like I said, whether the PA could actually accomplish something in this situation is a different story. However, they're not going to just let Souray sit at home and do nothing if he wants to play. They can file a grievance for damn near anything they feel like...it's just whether an arbiter would agree with them that's another story.

Saying the team isn't obligated to play him somewhere is like saying the player isn't obligated to play for the team. Both sides signed the contract. Both sides are obligated in some form to live up to certain duties and paying him isn't the entire thing either. There's more to it than that if they want to push it. I doubt they do for now.

Pinkfloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-01-2010, 04:17 AM
  #100
The Chef*
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,809
vCash: 500
7 hours 42 minutes until they clear.

The Chef* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.