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Old
10-11-2010, 12:35 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Before the draft, the talk was that it was Dallas that was going to be the team that reached for McIlrath. My dream scenario is that we deal a 1st, McIlrath, Rozsival and another prospect. But then again I think McIlrath is going to be a bust. Obviously, this team doesn't.

Maybe they drafted McIlrath just for this purpose.
I like Richards a lot. But I also think guys like Dubinsky, Callahan, Stepan, Anisimov, Kreider and Grachev are starting to resemble a pretty solid cast of young forwards/forward prospects.

It's not Richards that scares me. It's the asking price.

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10-11-2010, 12:45 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Before the draft, the talk was that it was Dallas that was going to be the team that reached for McIlrath. My dream scenario is that we deal a 1st, McIlrath, Rozsival and another prospect. But then again I think McIlrath is going to be a bust. Obviously, this team doesn't.

Maybe they drafted McIlrath just for this purpose.
Actually, I'm thinking McIlrath might be attractive when Chicago has difficulty resigning Seabrook...Staal/Seabrook top pairing, perhaps?

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10-11-2010, 02:27 PM
  #28
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Actually, I'm thinking McIlrath might be attractive when Chicago has difficulty resigning Seabrook...Staal/Seabrook top pairing, perhaps?


not to get off topic but that would be amazing. i would pull the trigger on that type of deal (mcilrath+3rd or something along those lines) in a heartbeat.

on richards, no way should we deal for him at the deadline. like most people have said, i think richards would be good here, but his price will be too much, especially considering we can get him on july 1 with jimmy's money. saying he could potentially put us over the top for a cup challenge is useless as he is not a defenseman. we are not contending even with the King and a better offense. our defense will be exposed time and time again in the playoffs. another reason why i got excited when i saw a name like seabrook in a rangers thread.

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10-11-2010, 05:09 PM
  #29
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At this point the only time we should be interested in brad Richards is on July 1. Besides stepan looks like a "brad Richards" in the making probably better because Richards didn't pot a hatty in his first game

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10-11-2010, 05:19 PM
  #30
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Grachev, Rozsival, 1st for Richards. Thats pretty fair. Id rather get him as a UFA in July though.

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10-11-2010, 08:06 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Before the draft, the talk was that it was Dallas that was going to be the team that reached for McIlrath. My dream scenario is that we deal a 1st, McIlrath, Rozsival and another prospect. But then again I think McIlrath is going to be a bust. Obviously, this team doesn't.

Maybe they drafted McIlrath just for this purpose.
For a less than 1 year rental of Richards? With this D? Shocking really.

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10-11-2010, 08:08 PM
  #32
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Trading for Richards now is not a good move, as i've said before he will be a UFA at seasons end.

Further more, with AA and Stepan looking so good this early in the year. There is no need to go out and burn up picks/prospects ... for now.

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10-11-2010, 08:30 PM
  #33
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could be true, could be that famous Larry Brooks agenda. However, with Dallas at 2-0 right now and Richards looking great, I don't see him on the market right now, or costing way too much
I guess it just depends on the ownership situation and actual money. But I feel like it would cost a package that would include Brando and the way he's playing right now I don't want to do that.

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10-11-2010, 09:22 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
For a less than 1 year rental of Richards? With this D? Shocking really.
Where did I say that? Obviously, not for a rental. What the **** would this team need a rental for? Only if he is resigned.

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10-11-2010, 09:42 PM
  #35
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News Alert:

Brad Richard's coveted.

All I have to do is look at stuff on the internet to feel smarter than I really am.

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10-11-2010, 09:43 PM
  #36
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I don't think it would be wise to part with valuable assets for Richards when he's a UFA next summer.

I think a true #1 C would do wonders for this team, but this team doesn't have enough depth to lose any type of core players.

See ya July 1st Richards (hopefully).

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10-11-2010, 10:35 PM
  #37
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Just throw the bank at him on July 1st.

Remember that Propsal, Eminger, White, Fedotenko all come off the cap and that money should be enough to do it.

If Frolov works out, then that's a good problem, if he doesn't then that $3 million can be spread out to help resign Anisimov, Callahan, and Dubinsky. They can also let either Boyle and or Kennedy go as that shouldn't be a problem with a Hagelin, Horak, or Werek comnig on boards, not to mention if Gilroy really doesn't work out, his salary can come off the books and have one of McD, Valentenko, or even Pashnian take over for him.

Redden will be waived again, and they can always buyout either Rozi or Drury for not a bad cap hit for only two years.

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10-11-2010, 11:02 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by White Plains Batman View Post
Just throw the bank at him on July 1st.

Remember that Propsal, Eminger, White, Fedotenko all come off the cap and that money should be enough to do it.

If Frolov works out, then that's a good problem, if he doesn't then that $3 million can be spread out to help resign Anisimov, Callahan, and Dubinsky. They can also let either Boyle and or Kennedy go as that shouldn't be a problem with a Hagelin, Horak, or Werek comnig on boards, not to mention if Gilroy really doesn't work out, his salary can come off the books and have one of McD, Valentenko, or even Pashnian take over for him.

Redden will be waived again, and they can always buyout either Rozi or Drury for not a bad cap hit for only two years.
Some of Prospal's money is in bonuses, so I doubt those 4 clear up enough space to nab Richards. More likely a Drury buyout and a Roszival trade if the Rangers go that route.

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10-11-2010, 11:39 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Dr. Ogrodnick View Post
Some of Prospal's money is in bonuses, so I doubt those 4 clear up enough space to nab Richards. More likely a Drury buyout and a Roszival trade if the Rangers go that route.
No chance in hell Drury gets bought out.

Obviously, it's preferable to just sign him in July. But his cap hit might be larger at that point than if we deal for him and he agrees to re-sign.

I have no problem trading assets (we're supposed to have a wealth of them, aren't we) for Richards at the deadline if he signs an extension, especially if it would save us the overpayment we'd probably have to supply him with if he gets to July 1st.

If the Kovalchuk deal is an indication of the kind of return Dallas would expect, I'm prepared to part with something like the following:

1st, Dubinsky, Rozsival, and something like Boyle/Hagelin/prospect of equal value

or 1st, Grachev, Rozsival, McDonagh

We're not going to be able to keep every single young player, anyway. Someones going to have get dealt eventually. Might as well do it now if it can guarantee you this guy. You gotta give to get, and Richards is the real deal. You're talking about a 80-90 point playmaking first line center. That's nothing to scoff at. As impressive as Stepan is, it's quite a leap of faith to assume he's going to be as good as a Richards. If he isn't, I don't see any other way we're going to fill that hole in time to not waste the prime of Lundqvist, not to mention Gaborik. I've called for a true rebuild for years, but at this point, it's too late. The only other option is to make the moves to go for it. 90 point centers don't become available very often.

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10-12-2010, 12:02 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
1st, Dubinsky, Rozsival, and something like Boyle/Hagelin/prospect of equal value

or 1st, Grachev, Rozsival, McDonagh


Where do you suspect this team would finish with the void Rozsival would be leaving on our blueline? We can't even round out our 3rd pairing with our current defensive depth. Who is going to fill in for Rozsival's minutes on the 2nd pairing and PP/PK? What happens when we endure an injury on our blueline and one of Staal/Girardi/MDZ is out? In your first proposal, not only do we lose Rozsival but also a potential 20 goal / 40-50 point player in Dubinsky.... How does adding Richards (80-90 points) while losing Dubinsky & Rozsival (20-30 points) greatly improve our chances at accomplishing anything this season? It's addition + subtraction which = less of a difference.

Trading away one of our top 4 defenseman + picks + prospects for a 1 year rental we can have in 9 months is poor asset management and completely short-sighted for an organization who's situation screams "look at the larger picture" (i.e. beyond just this season).


Last edited by wolfgaze: 10-12-2010 at 12:12 AM.
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Old
10-12-2010, 12:17 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post


Where do you suspect this team would finish with the void Rozsival would be leaving on our blueline?

We can't even round out our 3rd pairing with our current defensive depth. Who is going to fill in for Rozsival's minutes on the 2nd pairing and PP/PK? What happens when we endure an injury on our blueline and one of Staal/Girardi/MDZ is out? In your first proposal, not only do we lose Rozsival but also a potential 20 goal / 40-50 point player in Dubinsky.... How does adding Richards (80-90 points) while losing Dubinsky & Rozsival greatly improve our chances at accomplishing anything this season? It's addition + subtraction which = less of a difference.

Trading away one of our top 4 defenseman + picks + prospects for a 1 year rental we can have in 9 months is poor asset management and completely short-sighted for an organization who's situation screams "look at the larger picture" (i.e. beyond just this season).
How is it short-sighted? It's completely a long-term move.

It isn't about this season. It's about the future. It's making sure you get this guy and lock him up before he hits free agency. Who cares about this season? We aren't going to accomplish anything this season anyway, and I highly doubt Rozsival has a future with this team after his contract ends. I don't see him as much of an asset.

Staal, Del Zotto, Sauer, Valentenko, Girardi...that's five defensemen that will all make this team next season. McD is the most likely to get dealt at some point, because he isn't going to displace Staal or DZ on the left side. Then we got the McIlrath kid, who hopefully isn't a huge bust.

We've accumulated all these solid pieces. More than we need, in fact. We've got Kreider, Werek, Thomas, Horak on the way. Hopefully MZA, as well. Obviously I'd prefer to trade Grachev than Dubinsky, but if Dubinsky is what it takes...sure, I'd do it. Dubinsky is a nice player who I like, but he's never going to give you what a Richards can.

And again, like I said 50 times already. If you can definitely get him in the summer without a jacked up cap hit, then fine. Wait.

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10-12-2010, 12:19 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How is it short-sighted? It's completely a long-term move.

It isn't about this season. It's about the future. It's making sure you get this guy and lock him up before he hits free agency.
So If Richards wants to play in New York and under Tortorella, why is it that he needs to be locked up before July 1st? He won't sign here in July? How much money do you actually think we'd be saving signing him to an extension? He's already got a $7.8 mil cap hit with his current contract. What incentive would the player even have to sign a new contract before July 1st when he can just wait and use the market as leverage for his asking price? Were the Devils able to get Kovalchuk to sign an extension prior to July 1st? Nope, instead they lost assets for a rental and a 1st round bust in the playoffs...

It's certainly not a move for the long term if you're hurting the organization's depth trading away assets like Dubinsky, McDonagh, 1st round pick(s) for a player you can have in 9 months at the expense of one season (this season) where we don't even have the defensive depth to do any damage anyway.

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Old
10-12-2010, 03:21 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
So If Richards wants to play in New York and under Tortorella, why is it that he needs to be locked up before July 1st? He won't sign here in July? How much money do you actually think we'd be saving signing him to an extension? He's already got a $7.8 mil cap hit with his current contract. What incentive would the player even have to sign a new contract before July 1st when he can just wait and use the market as leverage for his asking price? Were the Devils able to get Kovalchuk to sign an extension prior to July 1st? Nope, instead they lost assets for a rental and a 1st round bust in the playoffs...

It's certainly not a move for the long term if you're hurting the organization's depth trading away assets like Dubinsky, McDonagh, 1st round pick(s) for a player you can have in 9 months at the expense of one season (this season) where we don't even have the defensive depth to do any damage anyway.
If we aren't doing any damage anyway, then it shouldn't be an issue. You keep ignoring my tidbit about how this isn't something worth doing if they feel super confident about signing him.

As for Kovalchuk, at least the Devils got him. There's some sentiment that they don't feel they would have had a chance to sign him if they hadn't had the opportunity to show off for a few months.

Not saying the Rangers need to do that, but the bonds created during that final stretch of the season and possibly a playoff birth, coupled with becoming accustomed to the way of life as an employee of Dolan's could sway the balance in our favor if there is any serious competition. Perhaps it could even cause someone to take a discount. Any discount on a contract like that is nice, because you're paying a guy big money pretty far past his prime.

We're never going to keep all of your young players. The cap will prevent that. It just doesn't work that way. So if, at some point, we're going to have to trade them anyway (and we are, unless we prefer to lose them to free agency), why not use it to get something that fixes easily the biggest on-ice issue facing this team? Just think this is a guy you don't pass on. Richards is the anti-Gomez. Smart, efficient playmaker. Turns the puck over a tad much, but not nearly as often as Blomez. He's also a good locker room guy, a leader, and a Conn Smythe winner that captained a Cup team. Guaranteed PPG in the playoffs.

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Old
10-12-2010, 03:32 AM
  #44
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I can't see the rangers making a deal for Richards unless they can dump Drury as part of the deal(the fact Drury makes only 5M next year should make it easier to unload his salary closer to the end of the season, assuming Drury waives his NMC)

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10-12-2010, 06:11 AM
  #45
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Larry was a guest of Maloney's yesterday after the first intermission,he told Dave the Rangers are looking for a defenseman and could make a move this week. Of course,he has been saying that for the last week. No names. SS is not close to playing and teams will want to see him play some games.

Getting to Richards,the trade deadline is five/six months months away. March 2. The Stars are in the process of being sold. Hicks and his creditors want more money than the NHL team is worth. The sale could be completed by January. Joe Nieuwendyk wants to re-sign Richards who wants to stay with the Stars. Texas has no state income tax. They don't tax employee wages. $7 million there is $8 plus million in NY. Besides how are the Rangers adding another huge cap hit in the summer Dubinsky,Callahan and AA are group II free agents? AA is looking at close to $2 million per in a 1-2 year deal as a group II with no arb rights. The other 2 are arbitration eligible. The cap isn't expected to increase very much if at all. No guarantee the NHLPA votes for the 5% bump. No bonus cushion for 11-12 because the CBA expires after that season.

If Stepan and AA continue to develop,what sense does it make to sign Richards?One of the kids is destined for the 3rd line for infinity giving Richards a free agent contract or Richards becomes the 3rd line center making $8 million with Drury is the 4th line center with a $7 million cap hit. Priceless.

Why would Richards agree to terms with the team in a sign and trade? That never happens. When has the last time that happened in the NHL? Never. We went the same nonsense with Kovalchuk last winter. Waddell wouldn't give a window to complete a trade and Grossman wanted to go to July 1.

And the borderline playoff team Rangers should trade #1 picks and young assets for a rental?Priceless.

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10-12-2010, 06:15 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
So If Richards wants to play in New York and under Tortorella, why is it that he needs to be locked up before July 1st? He won't sign here in July? How much money do you actually think we'd be saving signing him to an extension? He's already got a $7.8 mil cap hit with his current contract. What incentive would the player even have to sign a new contract before July 1st when he can just wait and use the market as leverage for his asking price? Were the Devils able to get Kovalchuk to sign an extension prior to July 1st? Nope, instead they lost assets for a rental and a 1st round bust in the playoffs...

It's certainly not a move for the long term if you're hurting the organization's depth trading away assets like Dubinsky, McDonagh, 1st round pick(s) for a player you can have in 9 months at the expense of one season (this season) where we don't even have the defensive depth to do any damage anyway.
Richards can take Drury's place as contract albatross.

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10-12-2010, 07:50 AM
  #47
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They are interested in Malkin too!

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10-12-2010, 09:01 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Korpicowski View Post
Grachev, Rozsival, 1st for Richards. Thats pretty fair. Id rather get him as a UFA in July though.
I agree with this. As long as they sign Richards I am ok with picking him up., Dealing Grachev and not signing him would be terrible though

Rozy would have only one year left on his deal at what 3 million? Big deal on the cap hit for the last year because Dallas wont be close to the cap

I would rather give up a 2nd for a rental in taht package instead of the first too

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10-12-2010, 09:10 AM
  #49
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If Dubinsky has a good year, this teams RFA raises between Dubinsky, Callahan, and Anisimov could amount to an extra 3 million or so between them.

So i'm bit caddy on our UFA situation as of right now. Frolov, Prospal and Fedotenko expire and that gives us an extra 3 mil or so after the raises, hopefully Sauer will be good enough by then that we can deal Rozsival and open up 2-3 more mil, but that is still scraping to find cash to sign a guy like Brad Richards, who is probably going into the downswing of his career.

You want my opinion, we should keep Stepan-Anisimov-Drury as the center line next year, and maybe make a bid on Semin if his price drops.

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10-12-2010, 09:49 AM
  #50
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Quote:
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I agree with this. As long as they sign Richards I am ok with picking him up., Dealing Grachev and not signing him would be terrible though

Rozy would have only one year left on his deal at what 3 million? Big deal on the cap hit for the last year because Dallas wont be close to the cap

I would rather give up a 2nd for a rental in taht package instead of the first too
So we trade that to rent richards for what a miraculous cup run? bc imho richards deffinitally does not put us over the top. And he wont sign mid season hes going to test the market hed be stupid not too. And say we did that what does our defense look like
Staal-(.......)
Girardi-del zotto
Eminger-sauer

Do you really think del zotto is ready for first line minutes? And even if so who takes rosivals spot, we can barely fill out our third pairing who's going to fill in our first after that trade?
That's a HUGE risk with what reward loosing a series in 7 not 4?

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