HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Habs should have kept Guy Boucher

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-18-2010, 12:34 PM
  #76
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 31,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
There's an interesting point of view from John Grigg of The Hockey News. He argues the Habs should have given the head coach job to Guy Boucher, instead of losing him. He says :



Not a bad argument at all...
Coaching in the NHL is enough of a pressure cooker without throwing a young coach in the fire like that...and in the Montreal fishbowl to boot. You'd be putting the guy in a no win situation.

Monctonscout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 12:41 PM
  #77
shutehinside
Registered User
 
shutehinside's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,929
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTL-rules View Post
Never settle for what we have when we can improve, period.
How exactly is replacing an experienced coach with a completely unproven one an improvement?

It MAY be an improvement in theory but definately not in fact.

shutehinside is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 12:42 PM
  #78
Habiton
Registered User
 
Habiton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 906
vCash: 500
I am sick of these Boucher threads. He was with us for one season and he didnt even win us a championship. He had one of the best rosters in the AHL, what did he really do?

Did anyone stop and think, maybe Subbans progression came from who Subban is vs who developed him?

He has what, 1 season of AHL experience? Martin has ~1000 NHL Games experience.

The writer is an i***t

Let this guy prove himself, then hire him. The last thing we need is inexperience.


Last edited by Habs 4 Life: 10-18-2010 at 12:48 PM.
Habiton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 12:49 PM
  #79
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 17,055
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThaDevilGirl View Post
Only on HF you'll take potential over proven commodity.
Apparently, so does the Hockey News (for what it's worth; that magazine has been, uh, less than great recently).

Besides, that depends on your opinion of what it is exactly that Martin has "proven" last season. There are many here, I'd say, who are hoping for better from here this year.

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 12:54 PM
  #80
King Woodballs
MVP! MVP! MVP!
 
King Woodballs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Your Mind
Posts: 32,751
vCash: 500
really who cares
let him go
that is the business of hockey
everyone acts like Boucher is the second coming of Jack Adams or something

King Woodballs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 12:54 PM
  #81
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 17,055
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CastroLeRobot View Post
Boucher is good but he was outcoached by Martin when we played the bolts, IMO. Yes we lost the game, but that was because of errors on the ice.
The coach whose team outshot and outchanced the other one 2-to-1 was outcoached.

Yeah, with criteria like that, I can see why people imagine that Martin outcoached Boudreau too.

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:05 PM
  #82
CrAzYNiNe
Registered User
 
CrAzYNiNe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,040
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to CrAzYNiNe
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
The coach whose team outshot and outchanced the other one 2-to-1 was outcoached.

Yeah, with criteria like that, I can see why people imagine that Martin outcoached Boudreau too.
Because the coach shoots the puck... Not saying that their criteria is better then yours, but talking about shot counts... Not proof of anything

CrAzYNiNe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:07 PM
  #83
Habs
Registered User
 
Habs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by la25ecoupe View Post
Detroit let Yzerman go too..
You think Yzerman was going to replace the best GM in the NHL? How can you compare the two situations?

Habs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:08 PM
  #84
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 17,055
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzYNiNe View Post
Because the coach shoots the puck... Not saying that their criteria is better then yours, but talking about shot counts... Not proof of anything
How about scoring chances?

In what way was Montreal actually better than Tampa Bay that night, outside of the crease?

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:08 PM
  #85
otto bond
Registered User
 
otto bond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,935
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzYNiNe View Post
Because the coach shoots the puck... Not saying that their criteria is better then yours, but talking about shot counts... Not proof of anything
mathman says shoots total= better coached team

otto bond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:11 PM
  #86
Analyzer
#WeAreBoston
 
Analyzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Renfrew, ON.
Country: Canada
Posts: 42,301
vCash: 500
While Mike Cammalleri had 13 goals for the habs this past post-season, Montréal decided to keep him, instead of dumping him and trying to finish last to get Adam Larsson, Sean Coutourier, or Ryan Nugen-Hopkins. Terrible mistake.

So, where can I sign up to write terrible articles, get paid to do so and have the ability to watch hab games at the bell centre for free ? You know what, if I truly want to be like most of the journalists nowadays I'll show up, but spend 3/4ths of the game making stupid twitter updates.

I don't even like Martin.

Analyzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:18 PM
  #87
La Grosse Tendresse
Registered User
 
La Grosse Tendresse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Rouyn-Noranda
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,481
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onice View Post
Why doesn't Rejean & his minions write about that? Can you imagine what a field day the ultra-nationalists would have had if the Canadiens had convinced Boucher to stay as coach in the AHL?


FEDERALISTS REFUSE TO RELEASE QUEBECOIS COACH FOR A NHL. JOB.

Gauthier was in a no win situation. He acted decently. I respect him for that.
My God, what does this have to do with anything? Why do some people always feel the need to bring in language/Quebec into every single conversation. You are just as bad as the people you despise (Rejean et cie.).

La Grosse Tendresse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:23 PM
  #88
uiCk
GrEmelins
 
uiCk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MTL
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,363
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by La Grosse Tendresse View Post
My God, what does this have to do with anything? Why do some people always feel the need to bring in language/Quebec into every single conversation. You are just as bad as the people you despise (Rejean et cie.).
well logicaly, there was already the Price vs Halak element AND the Boucher/Tampa element, imo all that was missing to make this a perfect article was the French-Canadian nationalist element.
Maybe pepper it all down with some Fatendress/Ribero trade opinions and news media is gonna have an orgasm

uiCk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:33 PM
  #89
Ice Poutine
Photoshop Nut
 
Ice Poutine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: ____
Country: Martinique
Posts: 11,663
vCash: 500
There... now we know how it would have looked with Boucher coaching.


Ice Poutine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:44 PM
  #90
Jedrik
Registered User
 
Jedrik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,819
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Habs Go View Post
lol

Well..its not like JM is doing a terrible job. The team was successful in the playoffs and we did decent last year with several key injuries. So far this year, the team is doign well with our best player still out of the lineup.

Can Boucher get more out of the Habs? Maybe.. Its also quite possible that he would've folded as a rookie NHL coach under the Montreal pressure. Its pretty much pointless to think of "What ifs" when it comes to Boucher.
LOL what? I wasn't reccommending that he be fired. The timing simply wasn't right to hire Boucher since there was no coaching vacancy, and the org did the right thing in letting him begin an NHL coaching career somewhere, tough as it is for some people to swallow.

My point is that if you're going to slap a guy in the face by re-assigning him to a sidekick role in the front office, after investing in him as a coach and him delivering quite decently on that investment, then you might as well just have the balls to sack him.

Jedrik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 01:46 PM
  #91
CrAzYNiNe
Registered User
 
CrAzYNiNe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,040
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to CrAzYNiNe
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
How about scoring chances?

In what way was Montreal actually better than Tampa Bay that night, outside of the crease?
Didn't say we were. More shots on net doesn't mean more scoring chances. More shots on net doesn't mean a better game plan either.

Who out coached who when TB and MTL played, I couldn't tell you. But looking at shot totals doesn't tell you either (because i don't believe, as a lot of people do, that shot totals mean more scoring chances(it can though))

CrAzYNiNe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 02:04 PM
  #92
JrHockeyFan
Registered User
 
JrHockeyFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,520
vCash: 500
Guy Boucher might turn out to be really great. Too early to start wringing hands about the great coach that got away just yet

JrHockeyFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 02:34 PM
  #93
Hackett
HF Needs Feeny
 
Hackett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,832
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
Lamoriello did something similar to Julien. The coaches know their job is never guaranteed. It's not like we should fear that no other coach will ever want to sign with us...
Julien lost the room. Some veterans had a confrontation with him and eventually, lou pulled the trigger. That is why he got fired.

The timing didnt work out for mtl in regards to keeping Boucher. Martin got a 4yr deal and boucher became a hot commodity the following off season. There's no way you could keep him unless you fire martin, and that wouldn't have go over well in the coach's fraternity in the long run, or with the Molson family.

Anyways, 3-4 years are an eternity in the coaching ranks. Martin may be out favour in mtl and boucher could be in the same boat too. There's no reason to think that the timing wouldn't work out better down the road if the habs brass thinks he's the right guy.


Last edited by Hackett: 10-18-2010 at 02:47 PM.
Hackett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 02:35 PM
  #94
CastroLeRobot
Hab-a-bouille
 
CastroLeRobot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 729
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
The coach whose team outshot and outchanced the other one 2-to-1 was outcoached.

Yeah, with criteria like that, I can see why people imagine that Martin outcoached Boudreau too.
I felt TB was playing like headless chickens for a while, their D was disorganized and their big guns were shut off for most of the game. Had it not been for Spacek's brain farts and Lappy's/PK dumb penalties, there was no chance in hell they could've won. I was expecting some kind of system from Guy Boucher, all I saw was a PP line that could be Team Canada's no 1 pp...Boucher has hardly any credit in that.

But then again, like I stated in my first post, this is IMO, not a fact, just an opinion

CastroLeRobot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 04:16 PM
  #95
Turboflex*
 
Turboflex*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,152
vCash: 500
lol what an idiotic point comparing martin to halak, and boucher to price.

There should be rules here against linking articles that are worse than most posts here (so basically no more THN, Gazette, Tremblay, etc.).

Turboflex* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 05:08 PM
  #96
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 17,055
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzYNiNe View Post
Didn't say we were. More shots on net doesn't mean more scoring chances. More shots on net doesn't mean a better game plan either.
However, in this case, the side with the most shots also had the most and highest-quality scoring chances by far. We don't need to speculate; people have been counting these.

I recommend, once again, enattendantlesnordiques.blogspot.com -- not only is it a fantastic blog in general if you read French, Olivier counts the scoring chances for every game that they show on TV, and his numbers for those games are pretty damning. (And, incidentally, Montreal crushed Ottawa on Saturday.)

behindthenethockey.com also had a series of articles on the Habs' playoffs while they were happening. Not the most heartening of reading for a Habs fan, but very instructive.

However, it's actually quite rare that you'll see a 2-to-1 shot differential and not see a scoring chance differential of roughly that proportion.

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 05:11 PM
  #97
MathMan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 17,055
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CastroLeRobot View Post
I felt TB was playing like headless chickens for a while, their D was disorganized and their big guns were shut off for most of the game.
Olivier had the Bolts outchancing the Habs 6-13 in the first, and 16-31 overall. The numbers at even-strength were slightly less lopsided however (6-9, 15-22) but not favorable at all.

If the Bolts were playing like headless chickens, then the Habs got beat fair and square by headless chickens.

MathMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 05:13 PM
  #98
Hackett
HF Needs Feeny
 
Hackett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,832
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CastroLeRobot View Post
I felt TB was playing like headless chickens for a while, their D was disorganized and their big guns were shut off for most of the game. Had it not been for Spacek's brain farts and Lappy's/PK dumb penalties, there was no chance in hell they could've won. I was expecting some kind of system from Guy Boucher, all I saw was a PP line that could be Team Canada's no 1 pp...Boucher has hardly any credit in that.

But then again, like I stated in my first post, this is IMO, not a fact, just an opinion
I'm sure the lightning are still getting acquainted to what Boucher wants from them. I noticed that they really arent afraid to activate their D, even though the habs did a decent job turning some of them into odd man rushes the other way.

Hackett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 05:22 PM
  #99
No Team Needed
Registered User
 
No Team Needed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: essex
Posts: 3,627
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimCareyPrice View Post
Halak got the team to the ECF, not Martin
The team got the team to the ECF.

No Team Needed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-18-2010, 05:26 PM
  #100
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,438
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
There's an interesting point of view from John Grigg of The Hockey News. He argues the Habs should have given the head coach job to Guy Boucher, instead of losing him. He says :

Not a bad argument at all...
It's a bad argument, a true sophistry.

Comparing apples and oranges as goalies fall under the cap, hence the reason why they couldn't keep both and both wanted to be #1.

The argument completely changes the true reason why we didn't keep both, it wasn't because Price was the better of the two, but because he was the most affordable of the two.

Halak was drafted more than half a decade ago. Both Boucher and Martin were signed a year ago.

Boucher had no NHL experience whatsoever, whereas Price already had one similar season to Halak's under his belt.


It's an overly simplistic and feeble argument.

Ozymandias is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:18 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.