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Doughty cleared to return to full hockey activity, expected to play Thursday

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Old
10-21-2010, 08:38 PM
  #151
RonSwanson*
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Here it is in realtime.



posted mainly to see the time elapsed between the pass and the hit.


Last edited by RonSwanson*: 10-21-2010 at 08:54 PM.
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10-21-2010, 08:49 PM
  #152
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So if Cole wasn't head hunting and was looking at the puck then the hit was intentional because he knew that the puck had clearly left DD's stick and also that he (DD) wasn't facing his direction. It also means that Cole could have changed his course enough to make the hit a clean one.

To me it looks the same way everytime, Cole saw his shot and took it. It was a late hit and while I don't believe that Cole wanted to actually hurt DD, he knew that what he was doing and to me that is intent.

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10-21-2010, 09:06 PM
  #153
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There you have it, according to Jim Fox during tonights broadcast. the league told Lombardi it was an "incidental" contact play. What ever they're calling it, I don't like it.

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10-21-2010, 10:06 PM
  #154
Josh Deitell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
So if Cole wasn't head hunting and was looking at the puck then the hit was intentional because he knew that the puck had clearly left DD's stick and also that he (DD) wasn't facing his direction. It also means that Cole could have changed his course enough to make the hit a clean one.

To me it looks the same way everytime, Cole saw his shot and took it. It was a late hit and while I don't believe that Cole wanted to actually hurt DD, he knew that what he was doing and to me that is intent.
You could also say that Doughty could have changed his course and turned the other way, and no contact would have been made. I think Doughty is equally responsible because he put himself in a bad spot.

Let's say Doughty had seen Cole coming and braced himself the way Cole did and Cole had gone down instead, and was now out with a concussion. I think the league would be calling it the same way, as "incidental" contact.

Where you have to make the decision is as to whether the play is a hit or a collision. If it's a hit, it's illegal, no doubt. If it's a collision, where you can't definitively place the fault, then it's a legal, "**** happens" kind of play.

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10-21-2010, 11:16 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
You could also say that Doughty could have changed his course and turned the other way, and no contact would have been made. I think Doughty is equally responsible because he put himself in a bad spot.

Let's say Doughty had seen Cole coming and braced himself the way Cole did and Cole had gone down instead, and was now out with a concussion. I think the league would be calling it the same way, as "incidental" contact.

Where you have to make the decision is as to whether the play is a hit or a collision. If it's a hit, it's illegal, no doubt. If it's a collision, where you can't definitively place the fault, then it's a legal, "**** happens" kind of play.
It was definitely a hit. Cole saw him all the way, lined him up, and lunged toward him.

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10-22-2010, 12:19 AM
  #156
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Doughty with a concussion....

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10-22-2010, 01:37 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by adevandry View Post
It was definitely a hit. Cole saw him all the way, lined him up, and lunged toward him.
How can you possibly know that Cole saw him and anticipated that?

I saw it as Cole looking at the puck, seeing a turnover, and cutting sharply to rejoin the play. I don't think he was paying attention to Doughty until right before the impact, when he braced himself.

There's no way to know either way what Cole was thinking.

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10-22-2010, 01:39 AM
  #158
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Not sure if this has been posted, but here's the Westgarth collision with Rene Bourque for reference's sake, which did not result in a penalty or disciplinary action.


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10-22-2010, 02:03 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
Not sure if this has been posted, but here's the Westgarth collision with Rene Bourque for reference's sake, which did not result in a penalty or disciplinary action.

Not even remotely close.

Westgarth was already heading that direction, Bourque turned into him, and Westgarth obviously tried to avoid contact (but failed).

In the Cole case, Cole deliberately made a move into Doughty after following him for several seconds.

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10-22-2010, 02:08 AM
  #160
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Originally Posted by adevandry View Post
Not even remotely close.

Westgarth was already heading that direction, Bourque turned into him, and Westgarth obviously tried to avoid contact (but failed).

In the Cole case, Cole deliberately made a move into Doughty after following him for several seconds.
Exactly, Westgarth did exactly what an unsuspecting player would have done. Cole lowered his shoulder because he knew the hit was coming. If you don't know the hit is coming, you do exactly what Westgarth did. You try to AVOID contact.

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10-22-2010, 12:48 PM
  #161
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Exactly, Westgarth did exactly what an unsuspecting player would have done. Cole lowered his shoulder because he knew the hit was coming. If you don't know the hit is coming, you do exactly what Westgarth did. You try to AVOID contact.
Agreed. Even if you don't try and avoid the contact like Westgarth did- i.e. by raising your arms and jumping out of the way- you still don't caulk* your stick back like that and lunge forward into the hit. That is a purely offensive action. I've played hockey (admittedly at low levels) for years and if you want to brace yourself for a last-minute collision you simply tuck your elbows into your chest and raise your shoulder slightly; like you would for a "stiff shoulder." Teammates are forced to do this sometimes if a collision is inevitable, but I've never seen one teammate "incidentally" hit another the way Cole hit Doughty.

No suspension, fine. No penalty, whatever, I didn't see the hit live either. But to watch the video and say two players simply collided with each other is asinine.

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10-22-2010, 02:52 PM
  #162
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Teammates are forced to do this sometimes if a collision is inevitable, but I've never seen one teammate "incidentally" hit another the way Cole hit Doughty.
Interesting observation.

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10-22-2010, 03:44 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by King Doughty8 View Post
Doughty with a concussion....
Yep ...

http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_16407946

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrian Dater
L.A., which will be without a top player of its own against the Avs defenseman Drew Doughty. He, too, has a concussion.

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10-22-2010, 03:50 PM
  #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Deitell View Post
Not sure if this has been posted, but here's the Westgarth collision with Rene Bourque for reference's sake, which did not result in a penalty or disciplinary action.

The Doan hit is a better example than that of what happened.

No fine, no suspension, no action at all...

Colin's Dart Board-O-Judgement strikes again...

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10-22-2010, 03:55 PM
  #165
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So a reporter in Denver knows more than a reporter that travels with the team... interesting

I'll believe when I hear a report from a little closer to home.

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10-22-2010, 04:34 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by tigermask48 View Post
So a reporter in Denver knows more than a reporter that travels with the team... interesting

I'll believe when I hear a report from a little closer to home.
A reporter in Denver is reporting what everyone else already knows... and what the Kings' team mouthpiece is reluctant to report.

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10-22-2010, 04:35 PM
  #167
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The thing that pisses me off the most is that no one from the Kings answered the bell. Murray? Brown? Anyone?

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10-22-2010, 04:42 PM
  #168
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The thing that pisses me off the most is that no one from the Kings answered the bell. Murray? Brown? Anyone?
No one Knew at the time ...

Hammond & Fox talked about that during the 2nd break, that Doughty skated back to the Bench and seemed OK at the time, and then just didn't return for the 2nd period, or the rest of the game. So it wasn't like an obvious situation where retaliation would have been expected, at least at the time. This makes you think the players on the ice just took it as an everyday open ice hit that happens, granted it was late, but nothing that doesn't happen during the normal course of a game.

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10-22-2010, 05:15 PM
  #169
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Well, the injury might not be a concussion. Could be a broken jaw - looked like he took that shoulder right in the chops.

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10-22-2010, 05:54 PM
  #170
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Well, the injury might not be a concussion. Could be a broken jaw - looked like he took that shoulder right in the chops.
If it was a broken jaw, would he have skated right back to the bench and join his teammates? (pure speculation)

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10-22-2010, 06:15 PM
  #171
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If it was a broken jaw, would he have skated right back to the bench and join his teammates? (pure speculation)
Boxers have kept fighting with broken jaws before.

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10-22-2010, 07:32 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
The thing that pisses me off the most is that no one from the Kings answered the bell. Murray? Brown? Anyone?
Exactly! This happened time and time again when that other Murray coached the team. Our guys got run numerous times and nothing happened. Particularly Palffy. The only player man enough that would have done something went to Philly and now we are stuck with a bunch of P*ssies. Lokti got run by Jovo yesterday, sure it was a clean hit, but on one of our smaller skilled players and well nothing happened. Talk about frustrating.

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10-22-2010, 08:07 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by tigermask48 View Post
So a reporter in Denver knows more than a reporter that travels with the team... interesting
I'll believe when I hear a report from a little closer to home.
to be fair ... Adrian Dater, is the Avalanche's version of Hammond

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10-23-2010, 03:32 AM
  #174
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Originally Posted by Puck U View Post
No one Knew at the time ...

Hammond & Fox talked about that during the 2nd break, that Doughty skated back to the Bench and seemed OK at the time, and then just didn't return for the 2nd period, or the rest of the game. So it wasn't like an obvious situation where retaliation would have been expected, at least at the time. This makes you think the players on the ice just took it as an everyday open ice hit that happens, granted it was late, but nothing that doesn't happen during the normal course of a game.

Please don't be naive. The media didn't know yet.

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10-23-2010, 03:33 AM
  #175
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Originally Posted by ru4reals View Post
Exactly! This happened time and time again when that other Murray coached the team. Our guys got run numerous times and nothing happened. Particularly Palffy. The only player man enough that would have done something went to Philly and now we are stuck with a bunch of P*ssies. Lokti got run by Jovo yesterday, sure it was a clean hit, but on one of our smaller skilled players and well nothing happened. Talk about frustrating.
Yes! Exactly! That was how all the injuries started!

And we've already seen almost every team taking runs at Doughty. And no response? Really?

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