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Old
10-27-2010, 12:31 PM
  #76
GKJ
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Lindros was probably the most dominant player of his day when healthy. But Clarke is still the best Flyer.

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Old
10-27-2010, 12:46 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Kerr in his prime was a great hockey player. He along with Cam Neely changed the fwd position.

Here are just some numbers to look at:
79GP; 54-39-93pts
74GP; 54-44-98pts
76GP; 58-26-84pts
75GP; 58-37-95pts
69GP; 48-40-88pts
458pts

And:
61GP; 41-34-75pts
65GP; 44-53-97pts
73GP; 47-68-115pts
63GP; 30-41-71pts
71GP; 40-53-93pts
451pts

So I took each players five best seasons and just totaled the numbers, looks pretty even just from a numbers standpoint.
Might look even from numbers, lindros was head and shoulders more talented and a better hockey player than Kerr. Played in much diff era's as well.

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10-27-2010, 12:56 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Kerr in his prime was a great hockey player. He along with Cam Neely changed the fwd position.

Here are just some numbers to look at:
79GP; 54-39-93pts
74GP; 54-44-98pts
76GP; 58-26-84pts
75GP; 58-37-95pts
69GP; 48-40-88pts
458pts

And:
61GP; 41-34-75pts
65GP; 44-53-97pts
73GP; 47-68-115pts
63GP; 30-41-71pts
71GP; 40-53-93pts
451pts

So I took each players five best seasons and just totaled the numbers, looks pretty even just from a numbers standpoint.
Look at them on a per game basis... Kerr's (and he was my favorite player growing up) best season was a 1.32 PPG. Lindros strung together 1.49, 1.52, 1.58, 1.52.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
Might look even from numbers, lindros was head and shoulders more talented and a better hockey player than Kerr. Played in much diff era's as well.
Cannot be stressed enough. If you threw Lindros out there in the wide open 80s with his combo of size and speed, he would have been putting up 160 pts a season.

I mean, hell, Paul Coffey put up 138 pts as a D... that's ridiculous.

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10-27-2010, 01:07 PM
  #79
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Lindros was incredibly dominant, but those saying his peak is far and away the beat ever in a Flyers uniform would be mistaken.

Clarke's 73-76 run, is way underrated. Three Hart trophies, top 5 offensive player and also the best defensive forward in be game. Two Stanley Cups. Just insane esga numbers. Durability.

Parent's 73-74 and 74-75 seasons are perhaps the best ever two year run for a goalie. Vezina, wins record, two Stanley Cups, two Conn Smythe's.

1. Clarke
2. Parent
3. Lindros
4. Howe
5. Desjardins
6. Propp
7. Barber
8. MacLeish

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Old
10-27-2010, 01:08 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Look at them on a per game basis... Kerr's (and he was my favorite player growing up) best season was a 1.32 PPG. Lindros strung together 1.49, 1.52, 1.58, 1.52.



Cannot be stressed enough. If you threw Lindros out there in the wide open 80s with his combo of size and speed, he would have been putting up 160 pts a season.

I mean, hell, Paul Coffey put up 138 pts as a D... that's ridiculous.
the 80's were the best. Up and down play, while alos of very good quliaty. The quality of officiating was 100% better. fights and policing were much better lol. The product itself was just 100% better.

One thing about Kerr though, when he fought, he beat people down. Was a tough sob

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Old
10-27-2010, 01:15 PM
  #81
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Best Flyer - Meaning Best Performance while they’re a Flyer

Best Career – Bobby Clarke
Most Dominant Player – Eric Lindros
Best Shooter – Rick MacLeish (all props to Barber but he had better linemates, Leach not here long enough)
Best Defenseman – Mark Howe (props to Van Impe and Desjardin)
Best Goalie – Bernie Parent (no one close – Lindbergh was a heart-breaker, Hextall to brief)
Best 2-Way Player – Rod Brind’amour

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Old
10-27-2010, 01:20 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
the 80's were the best. Up and down play, while alos of very good quliaty. The quality of officiating was 100% better. fights and policing were much better lol. The product itself was just 100% better.

One thing about Kerr though, when he fought, he beat people down. Was a tough sob
I disagree there... go watch those games today and it's quite clear that the depth of talent in the league was really weak, largely because the guys weren't all that athletic. Sure, the increased training and athleticism has bogged the game down considerably, but that's because 3rd and 4th lines are competitive.

That's without getting into the pylons that some of the weaker D were in the league.

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Old
10-27-2010, 01:27 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
I disagree there... go watch those games today and it's quite clear that the depth of talent in the league was really weak, largely because the guys weren't all that athletic. Sure, the increased training and athleticism has bogged the game down considerably, but that's because 3rd and 4th lines are competitive.

That's without getting into the pylons that some of the weaker D were in the league.
true what your saying, the quality of the play was better imo, cant explain it but just better times to me. I dont think the talent was that bad, though today it is better. Then your 4th line really did consist of a legit goon or 2, not these pansies today, though the player on the 4th lien today is better than the 4th lien then.

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10-27-2010, 01:28 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
Lindros was incredibly dominant, but those saying his peak is far and away the beat ever in a Flyers uniform would be mistaken.

Clarke's 73-76 run, is way underrated. Three Hart trophies, top 5 offensive player and also the best defensive forward in be game. Two Stanley Cups. Just insane esga numbers. Durability.

Parent's 73-74 and 74-75 seasons are perhaps the best ever two year run for a goalie. Vezina, wins record, two Stanley Cups, two Conn Smythe's.

1. Clarke
2. Parent
3. Lindros
4. Howe
5. Desjardins
6. Propp
7. Barber
8. MacLeish
Clarke's best season he registered 1.57 PPG, and his 2nd and 3rd are 1.45, and 1.33 respectively. Excellent seasons, but not on par with what we saw from early Lindros... especially when accounting for the respective time periods.

Flyers had 348 goals for that year, and 4 other teams registered 300+ out of 18 teams.

In Lindros' best season, the Flyers scored 282 goals as a team, with only 3 teams breaking 300 goals out of 26 teams.

There's little question that Clarke had a significantly better career than Lindros, but he also wasn't the physical force of nature that Lindros was either. What really separates Lindros was that he was quite capable of being the team's enforcer when he felt like it on top of scoring all of those points... dangerous combo when the best player on the ice can also physically destroy the other team at the same time (also why he had such durability problems).

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Old
10-27-2010, 01:31 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
true what your saying, the quality of the play was better imo, cant explain it but just better times to me. I dont think the talent was that bad, though today it is better. Then your 4th line really did consist of a legit goon or 2, not these pansies today, though the player on the 4th lien today is better than the 4th lien then.
It goes further up than that even... 3rd lines are significantly more competitive today. That's why a guy like Crosby, who would have absolutely torn up the league 25+ years ago is putting up low 100's point totals. You stick Gretzky out there today and he doesn't come close to the point totals he managed... and it isn't because the officiating is different or anything else, it's because the competition is better.

Now, watching elite guys tool on scrubs may be a bit more entertaining/highlight reel worthy... but I (personally) enjoy the more competitive play we see today (which is also a product of significant advances in coaching since the 80s - my GOD were those teams sloppy).

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10-27-2010, 01:39 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
It goes further up than that even... 3rd lines are significantly more competitive today. That's why a guy like Crosby, who would have absolutely torn up the league 25+ years ago is putting up low 100's point totals. You stick Gretzky out there today and he doesn't come close to the point totals he managed... and it isn't because the officiating is different or anything else, it's because the competition is better.

Now, watching elite guys tool on scrubs may be a bit more entertaining/highlight reel worthy... but I (personally) enjoy the more competitive play we see today (which is also a product of significant advances in coaching since the 80s - my GOD were those teams sloppy).
well a guy like crosby can play in any era, however he would have been hti much more and players would not have put up with the crap he does lol. 3rd lines then were fine from my recollection. The product itself was much better. Take the players today and let them play the way the game was played and called then would be awesome. The game has been bastardized so bad in 25 years.

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10-27-2010, 01:42 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
well a guy like crosby can play in any era, however he would have been hti much more and players would not have put up with the crap he does lol. 3rd lines then were fine from my recollection. The product itself was much better. Take the players today and let them play the way the game was played and called then would be awesome. The game has been bastardized so bad in 25 years.
incorrect

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10-27-2010, 01:44 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Babbage View Post
incorrect
thanks for shedding some light on it.

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10-27-2010, 02:29 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Babbage View Post
incorrect
Wrong!

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Old
10-27-2010, 02:32 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
well a guy like crosby can play in any era, however he would have been hti much more and players would not have put up with the crap he does lol. 3rd lines then were fine from my recollection. The product itself was much better. Take the players today and let them play the way the game was played and called then would be awesome. The game has been bastardized so bad in 25 years.
Your blaming it on the refs is misguided. The real change is in coaching. Those teams were playing glorified pond hockey in comparison to how the teams play today.

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10-27-2010, 02:37 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Your blaming it on the refs is misguided. The real change is in coaching. Those teams were playing glorified pond hockey in comparison to how the teams play today.
Standup goalies were also the rule of the day. Now it is the era of the butterfly goalie.

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10-27-2010, 02:41 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyskippy View Post
Standup goalies were also the rule of the day. Now it is the era of the butterfly goalie.
Goaltending is another issue... and technique is one part of that equation. The other is that goalies are simply bigger and better athletes covering the same net.

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10-27-2010, 02:46 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Clarke's best season he registered 1.57 PPG, and his 2nd and 3rd are 1.45, and 1.33 respectively. Excellent seasons, but not on par with what we saw from early Lindros... especially when accounting for the respective time periods.

Flyers had 348 goals for that year, and 4 other teams registered 300+ out of 18 teams.

In Lindros' best season, the Flyers scored 282 goals as a team, with only 3 teams breaking 300 goals out of 26 teams.

There's little question that Clarke had a significantly better career than Lindros, but he also wasn't the physical force of nature that Lindros was either. What really separates Lindros was that he was quite capable of being the team's enforcer when he felt like it on top of scoring all of those points... dangerous combo when the best player on the ice can also physically destroy the other team at the same time (also why he had such durability problems).
Lindros was a better offensive player, but in his best seasons he missed 20 games. Clarke was far more durable, and arguably the best defensive center of all-time. His esga numbers are beyond mind boggling.

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10-27-2010, 02:51 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Your blaming it on the refs is misguided. The real change is in coaching. Those teams were playing glorified pond hockey in comparison to how the teams play today.
Blame it on Jacques Lemaire and the NJ Devils in the mid-late 1990's.

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10-27-2010, 02:52 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyskippy View Post
Standup goalies were also the rule of the day. Now it is the era of the butterfly goalie.
And mattresses for goalie pads.

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Old
10-27-2010, 02:54 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWO View Post
the 80's were the best. Up and down play, while alos of very good quliaty. The quality of officiating was 100% better. fights and policing were much better lol. The product itself was just 100% better.

One thing about Kerr though, when he fought, he beat people down. Was a tough sob
He also paid the price for doing his job much like LeClair, his back was toast by the time he retired.

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Old
10-27-2010, 03:08 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Blame it on Jacques Lemaire and the NJ Devils in the mid-late 1990's.
The Devs weren't the problem... the Devs scored goals.

Florida was the problem.

However, focusing just on the trap overlooks the advances made across the board... as well as the attention to detail. In the era of video review/breakdown, it's hard for players to hide their stupid from the coach.

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10-27-2010, 03:10 PM
  #98
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Lindros was a better offensive player, but in his best seasons he missed 20 games. Clarke was far more durable, and arguably the best defensive center of all-time. His esga numbers are beyond mind boggling.
No doubt, but he also wasn't the physical force that Lindros was... (who was?). That's really where Lindros separates himself from the pack, in my mind... and that's even in relation to his own era. I mean, I still vividly remember watching Lindros come in on the forecheck and the D just scatter... they wanted no part of the puck.

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10-27-2010, 03:31 PM
  #99
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There are so many ways to interpret this question:

The best players to ever play for the Flyers from a career standpoint:

Pronger
Clarke
Parent
Coffey
Lindros

The most talented players to ever play for the Flyers:

Lindros
Parent
Clarke
Pronger
Lindbergh

The players with the best careers as a Flyer:

Clarke
Parent
Lindros
Howe
Hextall

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Old
10-27-2010, 06:36 PM
  #100
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clarke and hextall come to mind right away.

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