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Maroon is being removed from the organization (Holmgren quoted, post #101)

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10-31-2010, 09:18 PM
  #126
DMadd
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Any body else feel like this is related to his coach. I first heard of his attitude problem in the middle of the last season.
What ever the problem is, I hope he gets a second chance with the Flyers, I think he is going to be a good player.

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10-31-2010, 09:20 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by DMadd View Post
Any body else feel like this is related to his coach. I first heard of his attitude problem in the middle of the last season.
What ever the problem is, I hope he gets a second chance with the Flyers, I think he is going to be a good player.
He will not. That's why everyone here is a little upset about this whole situation regardless of who they're blaming.

That's another quality prospect down the tube at a position where we cannot afford to lose anymore prospects.

We were going with a forward early in the draft this year anyway. Looks like there will be a lot of pressure to get someone really good now.

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10-31-2010, 09:43 PM
  #128
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He will not. That's why everyone here is a little upset about this whole situation regardless of who they're blaming.

That's another quality prospect down the tube at a position where we cannot afford to lose anymore prospects.

We were going with a forward early in the draft this year anyway. Looks like there will be a lot of pressure to get someone really good now.
It's never good to lose a solid prospect, but forward isn't a pressing need for the Flyers organization. Richards, Carter, Giroux, and JVR are all top forwards under 26 years old, plus Nodl seems to be making strides as a solid top nine winger. So even though I agree the Flyers should go forward with their first pick, they'll survive even if that picks turns into the next Alexandre Daigle.

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10-31-2010, 09:48 PM
  #129
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The one good thing going for Holmgren is that the attitude problem is in a 6'4" frame rather than 5'10". I'm confident someone would be willing to take a flyer (so to speak) on Maroon for not too much of an investment, with the old "change of scenery" bit. Maybe it will be a problem for problem deal, or an ECHL player.

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10-31-2010, 09:49 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
It's never good to lose a solid prospect, but forward isn't a pressing need for the Flyers organization. Richards, Carter, Giroux, and JVR are all top forwards under 26 years old, plus Nodl seems to be making strides as a solid top nine winger. So even though I agree the Flyers should go forward with their first pick, they'll survive even if that picks turns into the next Alexandre Daigle.
As we go forward, we are going to need players that can play in the top 9 for cheap EL, contracts. We arent going to be able to keep all the players we have. Just this up and coming season, we are going to have to decide who we are keeping from Carter, Giroux, Leino, Zherdev and even Powe.

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10-31-2010, 09:53 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
As we go forward, we are going to need players that can play in the top 9 for cheap EL, contracts. We arent going to be able to keep all the players we have. Just this up and coming season, we are going to have to decide who we are keeping from Carter, Giroux, Leino, Zherdev and even Powe.
I think its pretty obvious that Zherdev won't be back, and Powe is a dime a dozen player. And I agree we need to develop forwards, but the 2011 Draft isn't exactly make or break, but if the Flyers go two or three years without drafting an NHL capable forward, then we're ****ed.

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10-31-2010, 09:59 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
I think its pretty obvious that Zherdev won't be back, and Powe is a dime a dozen player. And I agree we need to develop forwards, but the 2011 Draft isn't exactly make or break, but if the Flyers go two or three years without drafting an NHL capable forward, then we're ****ed.
Thats fine that Zherdev isnt coming back (thankfully) and Powe is dime a dozen. Who takes their spot next year? Im personally not comfortable with Nodl in a top 9 spot for the next few years. Who takes the other top 9 spot? Carcillo again? What if we lose Leino, how about that spot? Plus if we sign Carter and Giroux, we are going to be in cap hell and not going to be able to sign some 3rd line ufa players. Prospects ussually help there but we dont have any forwards there.

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10-31-2010, 10:01 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
I think its pretty obvious that Zherdev won't be back, and Powe is a dime a dozen player. And I agree we need to develop forwards, but the 2011 Draft isn't exactly make or break, but if the Flyers go two or three years without drafting an NHL capable forward, then we're ****ed.
Erroneous. Erroneous on all accounts.

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10-31-2010, 10:02 PM
  #134
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Erroneous. Erroneous on all accounts.
Yea, those 4th line forecheckers are a real pain in the ass to find. He's a strong PKer though.

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10-31-2010, 10:08 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Thats fine that Zherdev isnt coming back (thankfully) and Powe is dime a dozen. Who takes their spot next year? Im personally not comfortable with Nodl in a top 9 spot for the next few years. Who takes the other top 9 spot? Carcillo again? What if we lose Leino, how about that spot? Plus if we sign Carter and Giroux, we are going to be in cap hell and not going to be able to sign some 3rd line ufa players. Prospects ussually help there but we dont have any forwards there.
Luckily the Flyers have defensive depth. Trade Matt Carle and let Sean O'Donnell walk at the end of the year and we have 4.4 million dollars freed up for UFA and resigning. Also, if you want offensive depth trade Jeff Carter.

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10-31-2010, 10:12 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
Luckily the Flyers have defensive depth. Trade Matt Carle and let Sean O'Donnell walk at the end of the year and we have 4.4 million dollars freed up for UFA and resigning. Also, if you want offensive depth trade Jeff Carter.
See, if we did have forward prospects though, we wouldnt have to do all that.

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10-31-2010, 10:14 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
Yea, those 4th line forecheckers are a real pain in the ass to find. He's a strong PKer though.
Guys that willingly embrace that role and are happy to do it with the spunk and versatility Powe brings to the table?

Harder to find than you seem to think.

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10-31-2010, 10:18 PM
  #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
I think its pretty obvious that Zherdev won't be back, and Powe is a dime a dozen player. And I agree we need to develop forwards, but the 2011 Draft isn't exactly make or break, but if the Flyers go two or three years without drafting an NHL capable forward, then we're ****ed.
Nodl is a player in our top 9 next year unless something drastic happens between now and then. That's pretty much set in stone regardless of how many people here complain about him.

That said:

xxxxxxxxxx - Richards (5.75) - xxxxxxxxxx
Hartnell (4.20) - Briere (6.50) - xxxxxxxxxx
vanRiemsdyk (0.88) - xxxxxxxxxx - xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx - Betts (0.70) - Shelley (1.10)
xxxxxxxxxx

Pronger (4.92) - Carle (3.44)
Timonen (6.33) - Coburn (3.20)
Meszaros (4.00) - xxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxx

Bobrovsky (0.90)
xxxxxxxxxx

Total: 41.92
Cap: 59.40
Space: 17.48

So then we re-sign or call-up specific players (bold indicates re-signed player/underline indicates call-up):

Powe (1.00) - Richards (5.75) - xxxxxxxxxx
Hartnell (4.20) - Briere (6.50) - xxxxxxxxxx
vanRiemsdyk (0.88) - xxxxxxxxxx - Nodl (1.00)
Kalinski (0.70) - Betts (0.70) - Shelley (1.10)
xxxxxxxxxx

Pronger (4.92) - Carle (3.44)
Timonen (6.33) - Coburn (3.20)
Meszaros (4.00) - Gustafsson/Lehtivuori (0.90)
xxxxxxxxxx

Bobrovsky (0.90)
xxxxxxxxxx

Total: 45.52
Cap: 59.40
Space: 13.88

That leaves 13.88 for Giroux, Carter, Leino, and extra players (13th F, 7th D, back-up).

So let's say we get best case scenario: Carter for a Richards-esque contract, Giroux at under 4.00m, and Leino comes just under that.

Powe (1.00) - Richards (5.75) - Giroux (3.50)
Hartnell (4.20) - Briere (6.50) - Leino (3.00)
vanRiemsdyk (0.88) - Carter (5.75) - Nodl (1.00)
Kalinski (0.70) - Betts (0.70) - Shelley (1.10)
xxxxxxxxxx

Pronger (4.92) - Carle (3.44)
Timonen (6.33) - Coburn (3.20)
Meszaros (4.00) - Gustafsson/Lehtivuori (0.90)
xxxxxxxxxx

Bobrovsky (0.90)
xxxxxxxxxx

Total: 57.77
Cap: 59.40
Space: 1.63

If the cap does not go up, that leaves 1.63m for two or three players. That's not perfect, but it's doable I guess.

The reason I did this little experiment is because, we can have the EXACT SAME LINEUP as we had in the last couple of games going into next year with the exception of Gustafsson for O'Donnell and Kalinski for Carcillo.

Dealing with Walker and Leighton's contracts is another matter, but we're not in desperate need just yet.

So, no this draft is not make-it/break-it. We have a lot of strong defensive prospects working towards the NHL, and we have our forward core set up long-term.

In a few years, when Hartnell and Timonen's contracts are ready to expire, if we don't have a little something close to ready in the pool, then we might be in trouble.

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10-31-2010, 10:18 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Guys that willingly embrace that role and are happy to do it with the spunk and versatility Powe brings to the table?

Harder to find than you seem to think.
And Powe is finally being recognized for it. Powe is a system guy who does the little things well.

If he put up 15 goals in a season people would be freaking out. Instead, he puts his head down, carries the lunch pail, and goes to work.

A few of us (Valhoun, Jester, myself) have been saying this for over a year. Teams need players like Powe, and he should be embraced.

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10-31-2010, 10:20 PM
  #140
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And Shafer, don't forget Bartulis as a 7th dman. Can't get much cheaper than him.

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10-31-2010, 10:22 PM
  #141
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And Shafer, don't forget Bartulis as a 7th dman. Can't get much cheaper than him.
Yep, but I purposely left out the 13th, 7th, and back-up.

We're in good shape for a few years to come, especially on the blueline...I mean:

Coburn - Carle
Meszaros - Lehtivuori
Marshall - Gustafsson
Bartulis - Bourdon

Not too shabby when you think about the fact that Coburn, Meszaros, and Carle are still getting better. You throw in a strong vet on the blueline, and we still have a fairly strong defense even without Pronger/Timonen in a few years. Not best in the NHL, but pretty damn good.

Now we need to go back to drafting forwards.

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10-31-2010, 10:25 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Guys that willingly embrace that role and are happy to do it with the spunk and versatility Powe brings to the table?

Harder to find than you seem to think.
Mike Testwuide or Stefan Legein can serve Powe's role.

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10-31-2010, 10:30 PM
  #143
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See, if we did have forward prospects though, we wouldnt have to do all that.
Hey guess what? That's what happens directly following a trade for a HOF defenseman and after two of hockey's top offensive prospects move to your NHL club.

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10-31-2010, 10:31 PM
  #144
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....and another top prospect under Gilbert's watchful eye that is ruined. Honest to goodness, I'm sick of this organization and it's management staff and the complete ineptitude of hockey people running the show.

It's funny how they talk about Maroon's behaviour over the past year, but Idiot Stick gets a walk after he picks a fight with two players last year (Garrett Stephenson being one and funny enough, Maroon being the other). If Maroon developed a bit of a problem in the locker room, I can certainly understand why.

Ed Snider needs to wake the hell up and fire the entire management group in Philadelphia. It's time to cut out that god damn rotten core of ex-Flyers who work in the front office and it's time to bring in an entirely new set of fresh eyes to evaluate everything.

This is year two now that Idiot Stick has been here and just look at the path of destruction the man has left with our AHL affiliate. The good news is that guys like Lehtivuori and Gustaffson are progressing in spite of Idiot Stick, not because of Idiot Stick.

Hopefully at the end of the year, everyone in management gets canned and Hextall comes in and cleans house. And before anyone says that Ronnie is an ex-Flyer, the fact is, he's done his work in L.A. under Dean Lombardi's watchful eye and Ron has been outstanding.

So sick of this crap watching talented players being cast to the wayside while morons like Idiot Stick continue to be sheltered and protected by this organization

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10-31-2010, 10:33 PM
  #145
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Hey guess what? That's what happens directly following a trade for a HOF defenseman and after two of hockey's top offensive prospects move to your NHL club.
??? Also the reason we have had 0 2nd round picks in like the last 4 years?

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10-31-2010, 10:33 PM
  #146
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Mike Testwuide or Stefan Legein can serve Powe's role.
If they could, as players with much better scoring abilities than Powe, then they would already be in our top 9.

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10-31-2010, 10:34 PM
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??? Also the reason we have had 0 2nd round picks in like the last 4 years?
We've gone 3 straight years without a 1st + the trades of Sbisa and Downie.
We will have gone 5 straight years without a 2nd.

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10-31-2010, 10:37 PM
  #148
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If they could, as players with much better scoring abilities than Powe, then they would already be in our top 9.
There was really no need for them this year, but if we need cheap cap relief players they're the guys, no?

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10-31-2010, 10:40 PM
  #149
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Regardless if any toolbag thinks Powe is a dime-a-dozen player, he's our dime-a-dozen player. He knows the system, the team, and the environment, and that's not something I'm willing to wait for someone else to figure out or try to understand. He's a key part of the team because he's part of the team, regardless of whether he could theoretically be replaced by numerous others.

Hating on him is like hating on peanut butter and jelly because it's a run of the mill sandwich.

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10-31-2010, 10:41 PM
  #150
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There was really no need for them this year, but if we need cheap cap relief players they're the guys, no?
As evidenced by what?

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