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Old
11-04-2010, 03:30 PM
  #76
MiamiScreamingEagles
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There are interesting comments by Andy Van Hellemond within this article

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...ing-games.html


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“I wouldn’t say that it’s (better),” Van Hellemond said when asked about today’s NHL product compared to the game in the 1970s and ’80s. “We had a lot of goals scored in our time. They changed the game to get more goals and (yet) we have these 1-0 and 2-0 and 2-1 games…and if they don’t change the goalie equipment, the game will always be like this.”
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“The excuse of too much hooking and too much holding, that doesn’t wash anymore,” said Van Hellemond, a member of the Hockey Hall of Fame who resigned as director of officiating in 2004 amid reports he borrowed money from the officials he supervised. “That’s what they said was wrong with the game. If you remember rightly, there was too much of that going on, so they had to change and have a big summit because (they) wanted more goals.

“That hasn’t really happened; you don’t hear the league announcing that goals are way up because (games are) more entertaining. So we heard all this B.S. about hooking and holding and that by getting rid of it, we’re going to have higher-scoring games? I don’t see it, but you be the judge.
Quote:
Van Hellemond – who frequently takes his grandchildren to Ontario League games featuring the local Guelph Storm – said the biggest impediment to higher-scoring NHL games is the still-contentious size of goalie equipment.

“It all comes back to that,” he said. “You’ve been to a lot of games and you’ve seen how big some of those goalies are and how they cover the net. The net stays the same size and the equipment – they keep saying they’re going to police it, but I don’t know…you don’t hear about it.

“So the goalies are keeping the games 2-1 and 3-1 – and now they’re athletes, where, way back when, in the late ’60s or early ’70s, the goalie might not have been a great athlete.”

In fairness, the NHL has slowly whittled down the size of goalie equipment in the past couple years. Given that fact, would Van Hellemond be amenable to bigger nets as a solution to stagnant scoring?

“That could be tough – there’s a lot of traditionalists in the game,” Van Hellemond said. “I don’t want to be a critic, don’t get me wrong. A lot of people make their living from the game and it’s hard for me to judge, because first of all, I don’t see a lot of games.

“But when I was involved in (the league), they kept blaming us because we were not calling this and not calling that and now they’ve put in these rules and tried to get more penalties called and nothing much is changing.

“Something has to change.”

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Old
11-04-2010, 03:33 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
There are interesting comments by Andy Van Hellemond within this article

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...ing-games.html
Leave the game alone! A 1-0 game can be just as exciting as a 7-5 game. It's hockey, not basketball.

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Old
11-04-2010, 03:44 PM
  #78
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Leave the game alone! A 1-0 game can be just as exciting as a 7-5 game. It's hockey, not basketball.
Free throws that make the score 4-2? Thrilling.

My main gripe near/around the lockout was that comebacks seemed rare and games too often were, in essence, decided after two periods. We all know the lavish records teams had when leading after two periods, even, it seemed, the mediocre teams. I'm not sure how that compared statistically to the high-scoring eras referenced by Van Hellemond but coaching is an important factor in all this. Also, no one wants to see All-Star Game scores if it includes the style of play to get there.

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11-04-2010, 03:49 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
Free throws that make the score 4-2? Thrilling.

My main gripe near/around the lockout was that comebacks seemed rare and games too often were, in essence, decided after two periods. We all know the lavish records teams had when leading after two periods, even, it seemed, the mediocre teams. I'm not sure how that compared statistically to the high-scoring eras referenced by Van Hellemond but coaching is an important factor in all this. Also, no one wants to see All-Star Game scores if it includes the style of play to get there.
The removal of the two-line pass rule helped counter the trap defenses being run. I think the nets need to be moved back closer to the end boards - more shooting areas. No one scores from behind the net (yes, I know wrap-arounds start there, but they don't need so much room back there). Also, let the goalies play the puck but let them be open to hits. That would work better than the stupid trapezoid.

I also wouldn't mind the blue lines being made twice as wide to make more O zone space.

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11-04-2010, 04:31 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
Free throws that make the score 4-2? Thrilling.

My main gripe near/around the lockout was that comebacks seemed rare and games too often were, in essence, decided after two periods. We all know the lavish records teams had when leading after two periods, even, it seemed, the mediocre teams. I'm not sure how that compared statistically to the high-scoring eras referenced by Van Hellemond but coaching is an important factor in all this. Also, no one wants to see All-Star Game scores if it includes the style of play to get there.
I agree with most everything he said in his article too. I hate the pussification of the rules in the last 5 years that the game has become more often than not....

I think it was last night, or the night before i was watching the Senators game and dating back to sometime last year their record when leading after 2 periods was a perfect 26-0....

I dont think the new rules did much to increase scoring, all they did was make fan bases rabid for wanting a Penalty called every time a player falls or so much gets pushed by an opposing player in a weird way. Most of the games where the refs get PP happy have absolutely no flow to them as its a trade off of PP's watching one zone after another and the transition game is killed.

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11-04-2010, 04:43 PM
  #81
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I want them to cut down the goalie chest pad size etc further. The equipments purpose should be to protect the goalie from getting hurt from pucks, sticks etc, not to prevent pucks from going past him.

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11-04-2010, 05:00 PM
  #82
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I actually disagree with some of the comments here. While the 70s and 80s were fine, the era from about 97 to 04 (give or take a couple on the 97 side) was just brutal as far as the clutching/grabbing/interference etc.

I mean, I always enjoy watching Flyers PO games from the 04 run, but I can totally understand that if you were a neutral or a casual fan, that's hard to watch.

The goalie equipment is still a problem, but as an on-ice product, the game has improved exponentially compared to 10 years ago.

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Old
11-04-2010, 05:34 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
I actually disagree with some of the comments here. While the 70s and 80s were fine, the era from about 97 to 04 (give or take a couple on the 97 side) was just brutal as far as the clutching/grabbing/interference etc.

I mean, I always enjoy watching Flyers PO games from the 04 run, but I can totally understand that if you were a neutral or a casual fan, that's hard to watch.

The goalie equipment is still a problem, but as an on-ice product, the game has improved exponentially compared to 10 years ago.
I'd agree to a certain extent sure. You used to be able to quite literally latch on to a guy in the neutral zone and hang on for a free ride. But the way they call obstruction in my opinion simply is laughable on some nights. I just have a fundamental issue with the way in which they police the game in that regards. That type of stuff needed to go, but in my opinion again, not at the expense of the somewhat organic flow that i absolutely grew to love about hockey. While hockey is for sure much better off than it was during the dead puck era, I still firmly believe that there's room for some improvement.
But as far as the NHL trying to solves its scoring issues by adjusting the rules is futile, just look at the pads and goalie styles from 20 years back and its glaringly obvious why scoring is down. unless of course you're NHL brass that is...

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11-04-2010, 07:39 PM
  #84
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the game has improved, but i wouldnt mind smaller goalie equipment...even though it means people can't "Leighton" their way to success. it's getting to be ridiculous now.

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Old
11-04-2010, 10:04 PM
  #85
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Thornton's hit, tonight (Nov. 4):


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11-05-2010, 01:15 AM
  #86
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After 5 wins in a row, we're sitting on top of the East with 17 points. However, the Caps and Bolts both got 16 with one game less played, and the Habs also got a game good on us with 15 points. What scares me the most though are the Bruins who have 14 points and only 9 games played.

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11-05-2010, 01:18 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by chaosof99 View Post
After 5 wins in a row, we're sitting on top of the East with 17 points. However, the Caps and Bolts both got 16 with one game less played, and the Habs also got a game good on us with 15 points. However, what scares me more are the Bruins who have 14 points and only 9 games played.
I thought Boston were contenders going into the season. I can't think of any team that has a better goalie duo (they have two number one goalies, one of which is one of the best young goalies in the league and the other won a Vezina two seasons ago). That defense core is pretty damn solid all-around and their center depth is sick. Only area where they're weak at is wing and Horton helps that a bit.

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Old
11-05-2010, 01:32 AM
  #88
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Anybody see this video yet? I hadn't and thought it was pretty funny given the pass Giroux just made.


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Old
11-05-2010, 03:24 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
Thornton's hit, tonight (Nov. 4):

I don't mind that hit. Thornton comes from the side but is clearly in front of Perron. One of the most dangerous areas to be on the ice is around that opening door when the penalty is over, should've kept his head up.

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11-05-2010, 05:27 AM
  #90
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I don't like it simply because it didn't look like the puck wasn't anywhere near the play. You aren't expecting to get hit like that when you don't have the puck.

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11-05-2010, 05:43 AM
  #91
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Is this trade worthy of being vetoed?

Parise
Conditional drop of Latendresse to free agency

for

Arnott
Doan

It's a one-year league. If both Parise and Latendresse weren't injured then I'd veto this in a second. As it is...I don't know. Latendresse is kind of a non-factor. I think it's stupid to just drop him when we have multiple IR spots (three or four I think), but since he's injured and being dropped to free agency I don't care.

Arnott seems like the kind of guy you can pick up off of waivers and Doan is playing like crap so far and even if he wasn't he'd still only be a 60 point guy.

Really not sure what to do here. Doesn't help that the guy getting Parise is probably my biggest competition.

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11-05-2010, 05:46 AM
  #92
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Kind of iffy on that Thornton hit. One one hand, Perron should have kept his head up (although, kind of hard to fault him for not looking out for the guy in the penalty box). On the other hand, that seemed like a blindside and possible head-hunting. So, just the type of hit the league is trying to do something about.

Kind of reminded me of Richards hit on Booth a bit.

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Old
11-05-2010, 06:08 AM
  #93
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I don't like it simply because it didn't look like the puck wasn't anywhere near the play. You aren't expecting to get hit like that when you don't have the puck.
Johnson or Pietrangelo passed it right in the moment Thornton steps on the ice and it was right by Perron (not sure if he touched it) when Thornton stopped skating and drove in him, that's not even late.

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11-05-2010, 08:48 AM
  #94
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That one is a tough one because it is from the blindside, but how is Thornton to know he's not going to have had the puck? The player should know Thornton is coming out of the box, and it doesn't look like a very good pass because Perron has to find the puck. It was a blindside hit on a suicide pass.


New DGB today, maybe not his best but:

http://www.downgoesbrown.com/2010/11...to-booing.html

Quote:
Finally, hockey fans should boo center Mattias Ritola of the Tampa Bay Lightning every time he touches the puck. This isn't really a rule; I just think it would be funny if we all started doing it at once for no reason. If he gets confused and asks what's going on, just yell "You know what you did!" and then boo even louder. Let's make this happen.

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11-05-2010, 10:03 AM
  #95
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I'd like to point out than Jonathan "God's gift to hockey" Toews is on pace for a whooping 55 points this year.
While I know that that's likely going to change - and probably sooner than later - it's still satisfying to say it.

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11-05-2010, 10:44 AM
  #96
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I'd like to point out than Jonathan "God's gift to hockey" Toews is on pace for a whooping 55 points this year.
While I know that that's likely going to change - and probably sooner than later - it's still satisfying to say it.
3rd best forward in the NHL?

Claude Giroux would like some words.

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11-05-2010, 12:12 PM
  #97
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I'd like to point out than Jonathan "God's gift to hockey" Toews is on pace for a whooping 55 points this year.
While I know that that's likely going to change - and probably sooner than later - it's still satisfying to say it.
Actually, he is only slightly off pace to match last year's point totals.

The only way anyone can justify him being the best forward on Chicago (ahead of Hossa) is the fact that he plays center, is absurdly good at faceoffs and is solid defensively. However, there is no way to justify him sniffing the top 50 forwards in the NHL, let alone top 5, and I think most knowledgeable hockey fans knew this.

I know I giggled in my fantasy drafts when everyone rushed to take him in the first round, anyway.

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3rd best forward in the NHL?

Claude Giroux would like some words.
ummmm.... there are at least 20 other forwards in the NHL that I can think of off the top of my head that deserve words before Claude Giroux.... including one on our team (Richards)

While I will never go as far as Jester has, I still think people should let Giroux prove a little more before we label him a superstar. He is currently in the "up and coming star" phase, which if all goes well (he maintains close to a PPG) will be completed by the end of the year. Then, if he puts up close to a PPG again next season we can label him a superstar, top 10 forward in the NHL going into the 2012-2013 season.


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Old
11-05-2010, 12:31 PM
  #98
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ummmm.... there are at least 20 other forwards in the NHL that I can think of off the top of my head that deserve words before Claude Giroux.... including one on our team (Richards)

While I will never go as far as Jester has, I still think people should let Giroux prove a little more before we label him a superstar. He is currently in the "up and coming star" phase, which if all goes well (he maintains close to a PPG) will be completed by the end of the year. Then, if he puts up close to a PPG again next season we can label him a superstar, top 10 forward in the NHL going into the 2012-2013 season.
I wasn't insinuating that Giroux was the 3rd best forward in the NHL.

I was referencing a recent "ranking" that put Toews as the third best player in the NHL behind Ovechkin and Crosby.

That said, Giroux is pushing much closer to Richards than I expected. He's been that good.

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11-05-2010, 12:35 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I wasn't insinuating that Giroux was the 3rd best forward in the NHL.

I was referencing a recent "ranking" that put Toews as the third best player in the NHL behind Ovechkin and Crosby.

That said, Giroux is pushing much closer to Richards than I expected. He's been that good.
I know what you were referencing, but you still used Giroux's name. I, for one, believe that consistency is a pretty important factor when players are ranked. I am sure that Carter was a top 10 forward going into last season after finishing 2nd in scoring, for instance, and where would he be now? Low 40s I would assume. As of right now, Giroux's body of work does not compare to Richard's body of work, simple as that. (not that this is an indictment of Giroux, he simply has not had the same time in the league as Richards)

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11-05-2010, 12:35 PM
  #100
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What people need to realize about Giroux's fantastic start is he's shooting at nearly 26% (25.9). He'll probably be lucky to shoot at 12% over the course of the season.

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