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Carter close to signing 10-year deal (post #441 and #675); Leino update (# 675)

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Old
11-09-2010, 12:24 PM
  #51
Garbage Goal
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Honestly, if it takes 7 mil to sign him, I'd rather let him walk probably. I'm not even one of those ridiculous Carter haters either.

I think he's only deserving of what he's currently making now, but I think he'll get 6 to 6.5 mil.

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11-09-2010, 12:24 PM
  #52
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His cap hit is 5 million even.
His salary is 5.5.

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11-09-2010, 12:29 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by KimiFerrari View Post
His salary is 5.5.
It's not really relevant. To the player one year's specific salary isn't really relevant when you know exactly how much you're going to get over a longer period of time. To the team the cap hit is what matters in terms of what you can do with the rest of the lineup.

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11-09-2010, 12:34 PM
  #54
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http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...11910/45/31323


This a very interesting article as well.

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Old
11-09-2010, 12:37 PM
  #55
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It's not really relevant. To the player one year's specific salary isn't really relevant when you know exactly how much you're going to get over a longer period of time. To the team the cap hit is what matters in terms of what you can do with the rest of the lineup.
Carters contract break down was as followed.

4.5, 5 and 5.5. It is an obvious upward trend in salary, and this was given before his breakout year. It seems obvious he will continue to get a raise.

The only reason Richards has a good cap hit is because of the extra low years tacked on. Unless we extend Carter out 9 years, he wont be paid like Richards is, and garner a higher cap hit.

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11-09-2010, 12:39 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by KimiFerrari View Post
Carters contract break down was as followed.

4.5, 5 and 5.5. It is an obvious upward trend in salary, and this was given before his breakout year. It seems obvious he will continue to get a raise.

The only reason Richards has a good cap hit is because of the extra low years tacked on. Unless we extend Carter out 9 years, he wont be paid like Richards is, and garner a higher cap hit.
You can't do that. Because a player was paid a certain amount on his last contract SHOULD NOT determine what he makes on his next. You HAVE to pay players based on their play and what you foresee their play to be. In a cap world you can't just give a guy a raise because he made more last year.

He hasn't shown that he's worth more to this team than what he's already being paid and there haven't been the kind of clear indications of continued improvement in consistency and playoff performance you need to justify even $6mil.

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11-09-2010, 12:40 PM
  #57
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I think it'll be 6.75 at worst, and I'm ok with that. Carter's a player who is going to get his no matter what, simply because his game dictates that. At worst, he's probably a 30-30 guy, and that's not going to be a regular occurrence. If they actually let him play center and be our best faceoff guy per usual, along with his defense, it'll be an acceptable deal.

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Old
11-09-2010, 12:43 PM
  #58
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I think it'll be 6.75 at worst, and I'm ok with that. Carter's a player who is going to get his no matter what, simply because his game dictates that. At worst, he's probably a 30-30 guy, and that's not going to be a regular occurrence. If they actually let him play center and be our best faceoff guy per usual, along with his defense, it'll be an acceptable deal.
You cannot pay a player 6.75 per year if there's even a small chance he'll be a 30-30 guy.

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11-09-2010, 12:43 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
You can't do that. Because a player was paid a certain amount on his last contract SHOULD NOT determine what he makes on his next. You HAVE to pay players based on their play and what you foresee their play to be. In a cap world you can't just give a guy a raise because he made more last year.

He hasn't shown that he's worth more to this team than what he's already being paid and there haven't been the kind of clear indications of continued improvement in consistency and playoff performance you need to justify even $6mil.
Ok. I don't care what people think anymore. I'll just wait it out and see what he gets.

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11-09-2010, 12:50 PM
  #60
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Hope it is around 6 per year and please god do not include a NMC

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Old
11-09-2010, 12:52 PM
  #61
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wonder if Richards will pout if it is more $ than his.

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11-09-2010, 12:52 PM
  #62
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Hope it is around 6 per year and please god do not include a NMC
it will w/o question

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11-09-2010, 01:13 PM
  #63
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wonder if Richards will pout if it is more $ than his.
More then Richards total contract is pretty much impossible.

A higher cap hit is VERY possible given Richards signed a cap friendly 12 year contract.

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11-09-2010, 01:33 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KimiFerrari View Post
Carter is getting payed 5.5 now. He is going to get a fair amount more. If you guys think he is getting anything under 6, you will be disappointed.
And he hasnt shown hes worth more that that. Raise him to 6, but anymore than that, let him walk.

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:33 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
You cannot pay a player 6.75 per year if there's even a small chance he'll be a 30-30 guy.
That hell be a 30-30 guy once or twice? Sure you can. It's also highly unlikely to happen. He's going to be in the midst of his prime. The only way he tops out at 30-30 is if the whole team sucks.

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:35 PM
  #66
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You gotta think though, will it really be wise to sign all these players to long contracts. In 3 years, alot of this team will be in the 30s. We arent going to be a young team. JVR will be 25, Giroux 26, Richards, Carter, and Coburn will be turning 30. Carle will be 30. Meszaros will be 29. Pronger will be 39. Timonen will be 38. Even Nodl will be 26-27. After this era is gone, we are going to hit the wall...hard. There will be another 2006-2007 season on its way, maybe even 2 of them.

You let Carter get to free agency. He doesnt take 6 milor less you let him walk for the 2 firsts or whatever. That means in the next 3 drafts we have 5 first round picks. We restock the prospects and in a few years have a few young guys ready to come in and take the spot of the older guys.

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:36 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
You gotta think though, will it really be wise to sign all these players to long contracts. In 3 years, alot of this team will be in the 30s. We arent going to be a young team. JVR will be 25, Giroux 26, Richards, Carter, and Coburn will be turning 30. Carle will be 30. Pronger will be 39. Timonen will be 38. Even Nodl will be 26-27. After this era is gone, we are going to hit the wall...hard. There will be another 2006-2007 season on its way, maybe even 2 of them.
What happened that year? I don't recall.....

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11-09-2010, 01:39 PM
  #68
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What happened that year? I don't recall.....
I see during that season you may have...

had a lot to drink,
hit your head against a lot of walls,
enjoyed quite a bit of therapy, or
been born.

Whichever it is, 2004-05 was more enjoyable than that season. Well, almost.

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:40 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
It's not really relevant. To the player one year's specific salary isn't really relevant when you know exactly how much you're going to get over a longer period of time. To the team the cap hit is what matters in terms of what you can do with the rest of the lineup.
I agree with your general premise. Salary is worthless, it's cap hit that matters (see my signature). But salary does matter to the player. A front loaded deal is better, because money now is better than money later.

All said, who cares that his salary is 5.5 now? It was below 5 a couple years ago. The discussion started when someone wished for a 5 mill cap hit. You can acheive a 5 mill cap hit while paying MORE than 5.5 mil early on (which was Kimi's point). So further proof, that salary is completely, and utterly worthless.

Disclaimer: I don't actually think Carter will get a 5 mill cap hit. Not even close in fact.

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:40 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrHockey1982 View Post
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...11910/45/31323


This a very interesting article as well.
Interesting, I'm glad he sees the need for Leino, hopefully he's right on about the team prioirtizing him

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:41 PM
  #71
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What happened that year? I don't recall.....
You know the year when Darren Reid, Boyd Kain, David Printz, and Eric Meloche all somehow played 15 games for this team

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Old
11-09-2010, 01:44 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
You gotta think though, will it really be wise to sign all these players to long contracts. In 3 years, alot of this team will be in the 30s. We arent going to be a young team. JVR will be 25, Giroux 26, Richards, Carter, and Coburn will be turning 30. Carle will be 30. Meszaros will be 29. Pronger will be 39. Timonen will be 38. Even Nodl will be 26-27. After this era is gone, we are going to hit the wall...hard. There will be another 2006-2007 season on its way, maybe even 2 of them.

You let Carter get to free agency. He doesnt take 6 milor less you let him walk for the 2 firsts or whatever. That means in the next 3 drafts we have 5 first round picks. We restock the prospects and in a few years have a few young guys ready to come in and take the spot of the older guys.
Good point, thats what ive been saying all along. Flyers have depth at center (richards, briere, giroux, etc) and it wouldnt hurt to flip Carter for some picks/prospects. Carter because, Giroux andRichards arent gong anywhere, no one is taking Brieres contract without screwing us over in the process, and we need wingers, so JvR, leino, etc shouldnt be moved.

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Old
11-09-2010, 02:05 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
You gotta think though, will it really be wise to sign all these players to long contracts. In 3 years, alot of this team will be in the 30s. We arent going to be a young team. JVR will be 25, Giroux 26, Richards, Carter, and Coburn will be turning 30. Carle will be 30. Meszaros will be 29. Pronger will be 39. Timonen will be 38. Even Nodl will be 26-27. After this era is gone, we are going to hit the wall...hard. There will be another 2006-2007 season on its way, maybe even 2 of them.

You let Carter get to free agency. He doesnt take 6 milor less you let him walk for the 2 firsts or whatever. That means in the next 3 drafts we have 5 first round picks. We restock the prospects and in a few years have a few young guys ready to come in and take the spot of the older guys.
I've felt this way alot and agree we need prospects, and those 1st rounders would be great, but I think we have a really good chance at winning multiple cups in the next 3-4 years. I'd be happy with one of course, but I think we're capable of repeating with the core we have, including Carter...and I really dont even like him that much. But I think we need him now.

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Old
11-09-2010, 02:08 PM
  #74
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Carter is a bloody enigma, i really dont know what I would personally pay him per year...

We all know what hes capable of, since he's done it before, but i just dont see it day in day out.

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11-09-2010, 02:11 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
You gotta think though, will it really be wise to sign all these players to long contracts. In 3 years, alot of this team will be in the 30s. We arent going to be a young team. JVR will be 25, Giroux 26, Richards, Carter, and Coburn will be turning 30. Carle will be 30. Meszaros will be 29. Pronger will be 39. Timonen will be 38. Even Nodl will be 26-27. After this era is gone, we are going to hit the wall...hard. There will be another 2006-2007 season on its way, maybe even 2 of them.

You let Carter get to free agency. He doesnt take 6 milor less you let him walk for the 2 firsts or whatever. That means in the next 3 drafts we have 5 first round picks. We restock the prospects and in a few years have a few young guys ready to come in and take the spot of the older guys.
As long as we stop trading first at this point we should be okay in 3 years. Its not like Richards and Carter will be washed up at 29

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