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Old
11-12-2010, 11:41 PM
  #26
Xamboni
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Switch Corey for Katy and its a deal.

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Old
11-13-2010, 12:28 AM
  #27
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9-4-2 start = make a big trade? Makes sense to me! /endsarcasm

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Old
11-13-2010, 12:37 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Yeah, why would we ever want the guy that is a proven playoff performer (32 points in last 37 playoff games) over the guy that has 7 points in 21 playoff games. Why???
Maybe 'cause they guy with 7 points in 21 playoffs games, didn't play with Ryan Getzlaf, Bobby Ryan or Dustin Penner, he played with Kyle Wellwood, Steve Bernier, Ryan Kesler and Mikael Samuelsson. Secondly Perry only scored 2 more goals then Raymond last year playing with Ryan and Getzlaf, while making twice as much in salary. In a straight up trade I would do Perry for Raymonf, if there wasn't a salary cap, but with the cap in place I would rather have Raymond.

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Old
11-13-2010, 12:59 AM
  #29
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As good as Perry is, he doesn't fit with our salary structure and a trade like this takes away any depth we had on D. We will basically be playing Fowler as a top 4 dman after the trade and with virtually no experience as #7. Basically 1 key injury (Hamhuis/Elder) away from last year. Given what happened last year, if we make any trade involving a dman its either Bieksa going away or dmans coming back.

Also if you think Fowler has more value than Ehrhoff, you're kidding yourself. Yes Fowler has a ton of upside but he's a prospect at this point. He can be better than Ehrhoff or end up being a lot worst. You don't trade a 40+ pt dman who is average defensively for a mid 1st round pick (thats how far Fowler dropped in the draft). Basically trading Ehrhoff now hoping Fowler will develop into Ehrhoff in the future... doesn't make a lot of sense does it? More so when the Ducks are in a rebuilding mode and the 'nucks are in a win now mode. Both teams heading in the wrong direction with this trade.

Unless the GM for either team is still Burke, both team laughs and hangs up the phone.

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Old
11-13-2010, 06:28 AM
  #30
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No way you're landing Perry and their upcoming defenceman for a underperforming raymond, a dman on the last year of his contract and a bieksa who people don't think has much of a return.

Not to mention, as many people have mentioned, this is hardly a move a "win now" team does. I don't think Perry really fits on this team, and you're disassembling the blueline for him.

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Old
11-14-2010, 12:48 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCanucks View Post
Hi,Canucks Trade:
Ehrhoff
Bieksa
Raymond
3rd Round draft

Ducks Trade:
Perry
Fowler
Marchant
there are a couple of HUGE problems with the deal

1) Biesla and Ehroff are BOTH UFA's after this season and both with be looking for between 3-4.5
2) Perry has scored 20+ 3 times already and at 6-3 he banging forward and good all around player
3)Both Perry and Fowler are signed long term, Raymon will wont a new contract after 11/12 season

If the nucks want to get both Perry and fowler--my guess is they build a deal around Kesler and something to get him.

I assume Marchant was tossed into even out the contracts for this year

short term and long term the deal does not work for the Ducks. Nucks would be all over the deal.
Raymond and Perry are the same age and Perry has achieved alot more then raymond

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Old
11-14-2010, 02:04 AM
  #32
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Both teams' names rhyme so **** it, why not?

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Old
11-14-2010, 02:06 AM
  #33
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Take Ehrhoff off that list,and I accept

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Old
11-14-2010, 04:13 AM
  #34
serge2k
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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
WTF? Vancouver doesn't do this? What are you talking about. Vancouver does it in a heartbeat.

No way Anaheim does it.

What do you mean, Raymond's style of play? He just skates back and forth, taking 50 feet weak shots. Perry would be dominating with Kesler and Sammy or beastly with the Twins.
and the Canucks would be left with a defense of Edler, Hamhuis, Ballard, Alberts, Rome, Fowler.

Ugly. At best.

edit:
actually it would be
Edler, Hamhuis, Alberts, Rome, Fowler, Parent. AV playing Ballard, ha. Dumb of me to even suggest it.

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Old
11-14-2010, 08:17 AM
  #35
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Perry > Raymond NOW, offense improves immediately

Ehrhoff > Fowler, NOW defense degrades immediately

<Bieksa doesnt have to be part of this deal, he can be gotten rid of separately, so I wont consider him in this>

Downgrading the D to improve the offense. Wont work for the Nucks since they spent a lotta time and effort building a decent durable D corps this off season.

No one knows for sure how well Fowler will develop or how long it'll take.. whereas Hoff is a known quantity now.

The fact that Hoff is UFA.... is not that much a problem for Nucks.. they WILL sign him and pay for it thru the turfing of Salo next year and the probable non return on Bieksa. I dont think they'll lose Hoff, so that's not a big fear or risk.

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Old
11-14-2010, 12:51 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serge2k View Post
and the Canucks would be left with a defense of Edler, Hamhuis, Ballard, Alberts, Rome, Fowler.
Ugly. At best.

edit:
actually it would be
Edler, Hamhuis, Alberts, Rome, Fowler, Parent. AV playing Ballard, ha. Dumb of me to even suggest it.
Now do you understand why it's not a good thing that we're paying $3.5M for Sami Salo?

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Old
11-14-2010, 03:20 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serge2k View Post
and the Canucks would be left with a defense of Edler, Hamhuis, Ballard, Alberts, Rome, Fowler.

Ugly. At best.

edit:
actually it would be
Edler, Hamhuis, Alberts, Rome, Fowler, Parent. AV playing Ballard, ha. Dumb of me to even suggest it.

So losing ehrhoff immediately turns us from very good to ugly?

We lose a bit on defense and upgrade big on offense.

On top of that, Perry is a proven playoff performer who knows how to play in front of the opposition's net.

He would draw a lot of attention away from the twins.

This deal is a no-brainer, if it happens I would really start to consider the canucks as one of the favourites in the west.

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Old
11-14-2010, 04:54 PM
  #38
serge2k
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pauser View Post
Now do you understand why it's not a good thing that we're paying $3.5M for Sami Salo?
It's fine paying 3.5 for salo.

But he's still out for a while and having salo means you absolutely have to have guest.

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Old
11-14-2010, 04:55 PM
  #39
serge2k
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmon View Post
So losing ehrhoff immediately turns us from very good to ugly?

We lose a bit on defense and upgrade big on offense.

On top of that, Perry is a proven playoff performer who knows how to play in front of the opposition's net.

He would draw a lot of attention away from the twins.

This deal is a no-brainer, if it happens I would really start to consider the canucks as one of the favourites in the west.
Ehrhoff and Bieksa.

it means the bottom 3 is 2 guys who should be 6/7 and an 18 year old.

Thats terrible. A team with that defense is not going to win a cup.

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Old
11-14-2010, 05:07 PM
  #40
ahmon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serge2k View Post
Ehrhoff and Bieksa.

it means the bottom 3 is 2 guys who should be 6/7 and an 18 year old.

Thats terrible. A team with that defense is not going to win a cup.
losing bieksa means ballard plays, thats not a downgrade imo.

the bottom pairing will always look terrible.

right now we have alberts/rome as our bottom pairing, its not pretty as well.

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Old
11-14-2010, 07:47 PM
  #41
serge2k
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmon View Post
losing bieksa means ballard plays, thats not a downgrade imo.

the bottom pairing will always look terrible.

right now we have alberts/rome as our bottom pairing, its not pretty as well.
No, losing Ehrhoff means Ballard plays.

Losing Bieksa means Alberts, Rome, and Fowler all have to play.

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Old
11-14-2010, 07:52 PM
  #42
chopkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCanucks View Post
Hi, im new to this forum but this trade i've had in mind for the longest time and i was wondering what other people opinions are.

Canucks Trade:
Ehrhoff
Bieksa
Raymond
3rd Round draft

Ducks Trade:
Perry
Fowler
Marchant

cap wise i think it works, i know ehrhoff is one of our better D's right now and he claims he wants to stay in Vancouver, but i dont want to see nucks signing him for over 4 mil this off season. Fowler would be a great because hes young and has great potential to be top pair d. So im just wondering if this trade would be good.

heres wht the line up looks like

sedin sedin samuelsson
burrows kesler perry (such a good line)
torres malhotra hansen
schafer/glass marchant desbien/rypien

edler hamhuis
ballard rome
alberts fowler


salo if he comes back


There's no logical reason for the Canucks to make this trade. They're racking up goals right now despite below-average play by every line but the 3rd. Once the Sedins and the Kesler line find their games they'll be scoring even more. Exchanging 25 goals (Raymond) for 35 goals (Perry) is not worth losing both Ehrhoff and Bieksa for a rookie defenseman. If the Nucks were struggling to score and Luongo was having a Thomas-like year the answer could be different, but this trade just doesn't make sense right now.

At the earliest, I'd make this trade at the deadline if it's known that Ehrhoff has no desire to re-sign to a cap-friendly deal. The Canucks could then flip a pick or something for another 3rd pairing Dman. Right now, though ,Ehrhoff is too important to this team to let go for an asset we don't need.

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Samuelsson-Kesler-Perry
Torres-Malhotra-Hansen
Does-Not-Matter

Edler-Salo
Hamhuis-Ballard
Fowler-*somebody*


Last edited by chopkins: 11-14-2010 at 07:57 PM.
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Old
11-14-2010, 08:03 PM
  #43
Catamarca Livin
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Perry >>>>>>> Raymond
The problem is that Anaheim is winning. I am all for trading Raymond, Bieksa, draft pick and prospect(anyone but Hodgson) for Perry. I would also trade combinations for Morrow also and for Doan as well. One of the three. The cap hit works as long as you keep Salo on IR. You would even have room for a good fourth line player. Raymond will not be a playoff scorer. If you are trying to win the cup Perry, Morrow and less so Doan would give the team more grit and playoff scoring.

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Old
11-14-2010, 10:53 PM
  #44
ahmon
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Originally Posted by serge2k View Post
No, losing Ehrhoff means Ballard plays.

Losing Bieksa means Alberts, Rome, and Fowler all have to play.
So?

whats wrong with playing those 3, when 2 of them are already playing?

both rome/alberts are already playing, we are essentially swapping bieksa/ehrhoff for ballard/fowler.

Fowler is young, so its a downgrade in defense(short-term). But thats only part of the equation, we are getting a star forward that has been able to produce in the playoffs.

And if salo comes back:

hamhuis edler
ballard salo
alberts rome
fowler

That doesn't look worse than what we have now, if salo is out then we have capspace to acquire a top 4 dman at the deadline.

People overrate our offense. Our forward corps lacks slot presence, and many times it becomes perimeter play. Adding a player like perry will make our team way more dangerous.
And thats more valuable than the downgrade in defense, which is not catastrophic by any means.

We win this trade present and future, doubt the ducks will even consider this, but baffled how canucks fan will not want this deal.

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Old
11-15-2010, 02:09 AM
  #45
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I was actually thinking the other day about a

Raymond + Bieksa + 1st

FOR

Perry.

It would SUCK so much to lose Raymond but damn that would be a nice trade.

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Old
11-15-2010, 09:29 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmon View Post
So?

whats wrong with playing those 3, when 2 of them are already playing?

both rome/alberts are already playing, we are essentially swapping bieksa/ehrhoff for ballard/fowler.

Fowler is young, so its a downgrade in defense(short-term). But thats only part of the equation, we are getting a star forward that has been able to produce in the playoffs.

And if salo comes back:

hamhuis edler
ballard salo
alberts rome
fowler

That doesn't look worse than what we have now, if salo is out then we have capspace to acquire a top 4 dman at the deadline.


WHICH top 4 is available??? Salo will be gone next year, and there may not be an equivalent available at a decent price.



People overrate our offense. Our forward corps lacks slot presence, and many times it becomes perimeter play. Adding a player like perry will make our team way more dangerous.
.
This last bit I agree with. If there's one factor that will prevent PO success for the Nucks, that would be a lack of tough hard hitting slot players who stand on top of the netminder, take punishment, and bang in dirty goals.

Nucks could use a player like Knuble for this. Perry is very high-end and not available or affordable... not without possibly killing defense depth.

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Old
11-15-2010, 09:45 AM
  #47
serge2k
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Originally Posted by rban View Post
This last bit I agree with. If there's one factor that will prevent PO success for the Nucks, that would be a lack of tough hard hitting slot players who stand on top of the netminder, take punishment, and bang in dirty goals.

Nucks could use a player like Knuble for this. Perry is very high-end and not available or affordable... not without possibly killing defense depth.
That or a crappy thin defense.

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Old
11-15-2010, 09:56 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by YogiCanucks View Post
I was actually thinking the other day about a

Raymond + Bieksa + 1st

FOR

Perry.

It would SUCK so much to lose Raymond but damn that would be a nice trade.
this is the only thing in here that might remotely make sense
the Ducks are very deep ast RW and thin at LW, Canucks are the opposite
Ducks really need D and could use Bieksa.
The 1st MIGHT be enough in the package for them to part with Perry, but in truth, with Bieksa unsigned ...likely not (and it's not like the Ducks are against the cap and need to move salary.)
If I'm the Ducks I say no thanks, I'll keep my 25-YO, 80-pt, cup winning Olympian, thanks all the same.
Including Fowler is insane -- there's no way they're giving him up.

This might get it done, again, if the Ducks were interested in moving Perry..
Raymond, Bieksa (signed), Hodgson
don't know much about Holland or Bonino (who seem to be theri top Cs in the system), but guessing they could use a guy like Coho
not sure I'd do that though

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