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Realistically, who should the Habs target now that Markov's gone?

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Old
11-19-2010, 10:21 AM
  #26
Miller Time
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I'm fine with Picard/Weber. Until scared into thinking otherwise. But I didn't get scared into thinking otherwise with the games Markov missed at the start of the season, so I'm not expecting to be scared anytime soon.

This D seems capable of absorbing the loss of Markov.

I mean, you can always watch for bargains, if any show up. But I wouldn't go beating down the doors of teams looking for a good futures return or any of our top prospects in exchange for a rental player. If a team like Vancouver gets desperate to dump somebody cheap (i.e. Bieksa) or if some other risk-laden gamble appears on the radar "for free" (e.g. Souray on re-entry waivers), I would consider such freebie options.

But I wouldn't go shopping with desperation writ large upon my forehead in the immediate wake of a Markov diagnosis.
definitely not time to make any desperation type moves, but i think it's pretty clear that both Spacek and Hamrlik were struggling earlier in the season in large part because, without Markov in the lineup, they were forced to play larger roles than they are able to handle at this stage in their careers.

if Markov is out for months, both will have to pick up the slack and play too many minutes, leaving in the same situation as last year, with two guys falling apart at the absolute worse time (playoffs).

knowing, as we do, that Martin would rather lean on them to the point of excess (regardless of how their play struggles) vs living with the inevitable shortcomings of playing young guys like Picard or Weber, I hope that PG is actively looking for a reasonable solution... a vet that can come in as a bottom 4 guy that Martin will trust enough to help spread the workload out.

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11-19-2010, 10:21 AM
  #27
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We need to find more firepower for our forward lines!!! Our defence isn't bad at all right now....I'm more worried about games like last night when our forwards get shutout. We need more scoring power upfront, we can't have teams like Nashville shutting us out.

We need to put Cammy - Pleks - Kosty back together again and find a true top 6 forward to play with Gomez and Gionta that will hopefully wake those 2 up to give us 2 solid scoring lines with a decently offensive 3rd line and a young, energetic 4th line.

I love Andrei Markov and I think he's a tremendous defencemen, great powerplay quarterback and just a terrific all-round defencemen, but if he can't get healthy and give the Habs at least 75 games a season, then I don't think we should bother re-signing him at the end of the season. There will be many UFA's out there, I think it might be time to go in a different direction. If he takes the rest of this season off and lets his knee heal properly and builds it up stronger, I'd be willing to give him another chance....maybe a 1 year deal for $2-2.5 million to see if he can get back to the player he was, but if he sits a couple months and tries to come back later this season and gets hurt again, he's gone in my eyes.

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11-19-2010, 10:23 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by gifted88 View Post
The habs just got rid of a Bieksa type guy. And if they are keeping Hamrlik and Spacek they'd better target a D who is a good skater.

Any chance Anaheim moves Visnovsky?
When was that?

Guys like Visnovsky, Kaberle would cost a lot because those teams would only move them for equal NHL talent, or big overpayment in terms of picks/prospects.

I don't even think we could get Kaberle for our 2011 and 2012 1sts right now(maybe at the deadline if Toronto is 10-12 pts out). Same for Visnovsky.

Bieksa is not as smooth or skilled as those 2 but he is still above average defensivvely, RH shot and brings an edge...the big PLUS is he may only cost 1/3 to 1/4 of his full value because Vancouver will be in a bind and there are very few teams that can add salary.

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Originally Posted by Pleky Roks View Post
We need to find more firepower for our forward lines!!! Our defence isn't bad at all right now....I'm more worried about games like last night when our forwards get shutout. We need more scoring power upfront, we can't have teams like Nashville shutting us out.

We need to put Cammy - Pleks - Kosty back together again and find a true top 6 forward to play with Gomez and Gionta that will hopefully wake those 2 up to give us 2 solid scoring lines with a decently offensive 3rd line and a young, energetic 4th line.

I love Andrei Markov and I think he's a tremendous defencemen, great powerplay quarterback and just a terrific all-round defencemen, but if he can't get healthy and give the Habs at least 75 games a season, then I don't think we should bother re-signing him at the end of the season. There will be many UFA's out there, I think it might be time to go in a different direction. If he takes the rest of this season off and lets his knee heal properly and builds it up stronger, I'd be willing to give him another chance....maybe a 1 year deal for $2-2.5 million to see if he can get back to the player he was, but if he sits a couple months and tries to come back later this season and gets hurt again, he's gone in my eyes.
A guy like Markov contributes as much if not more to the offense(in terms of GF) than to the defense(in terms of GA) because he is such a good puck mover and distributor on the PP.

Just look at New Jersey, their offense has gone in the crapper, mostly because they have little skill and PMD's on the blueline so they can't attack with speed.

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Old
11-19-2010, 10:38 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
A guy like Markov contributes as much if not more to the offense(in terms of GF) than to the defense(in terms of GA) because he is such a good puck mover and distributor on the PP.

Just look at New Jersey, their offense has gone in the crapper, mostly because they have little skill and PMD's on the blueline so they can't attack with speed.

I understand that, but how does he produce when he's in the press box for 30+ games a season with an injury???

We need help up front. Yes, it would be nice to have another defencemen like Markov, but at this point, I'd rather see us get more depth upfront....we could aquire a hell of a forward for Markov's $5 million and give Weber a chance to provide the offence for Markov in his absence.

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11-19-2010, 11:01 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Pleky Roks View Post
I understand that, but how does he produce when he's in the press box for 30+ games a season with an injury???

We need help up front. Yes, it would be nice to have another defencemen like Markov, but at this point, I'd rather see us get more depth upfront....we could aquire a hell of a forward for Markov's $5 million and give Weber a chance to provide the offence for Markov in his absence.
He doesn't but before his recent streak of bad luck he's been very durable. Plus, there are no guys like him on the UFA market, it's not like it's the same recurring injury that can't get better.

What's the point of having more depth up front if your defendse gets run down and you spend all night not being able to get out of your end?

Weber is not ready to be anymore than a #6 guy and PP specialist(12-16 min a night), that doesn't help take minutes off Hamrlik Spacek Gorges and Subban. We need another 20 minute guy that can help on PP and PK.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:14 AM
  #31
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If we are going for Bieksa I want something good coming back aswell. To me Bieksa has negative value so maybe we can throw in something and get a decent forward in a package.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:19 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I'm fine with Picard/Weber. Until scared into thinking otherwise. But I didn't get scared into thinking otherwise with the games Markov missed at the start of the season, so I'm not expecting to be scared anytime soon.

This D seems capable of absorbing the loss of Markov.

I mean, you can always watch for bargains, if any show up. But I wouldn't go beating down the doors of teams looking for a good futures return or any of our top prospects in exchange for a rental player. If a team like Vancouver gets desperate to dump somebody cheap (i.e. Bieksa) or if some other risk-laden gamble appears on the radar "for free" (e.g. Souray on re-entry waivers), I would consider such freebie options.

But I wouldn't go shopping with desperation writ large upon my forehead in the immediate wake of a Markov diagnosis.
That's true, but it's much easier to play when you know a guy will be back in a month than it is knowing a guy will not be back.

I don't like Hamr/Spacek Gorges/Gill logging top minutes. Especially over the season. We'll see games like last night where Hamr and Spacek looked old.

But I'd wait till Weber played a bit just to see if he's ready to make the leap. Regardless, Habs need a top paring D-man and I felt like this even with Markov in the lineup. We have a lot of 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th d-men but no 1st, 2nd or 3rd (I won't count Subban and Markov is done).

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:20 AM
  #33
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Brad Richards. Seems they won't be able to sign him. Time for Bob to call Dallas and tell them it's time to repay that favor. Then sign MAB. Then I wake up and realize Gomez is still our 2nd line center

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:21 AM
  #34
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i really hope burke signs kabby long term, I cant imagine our team without him.. o god im seeing pictures of Lebda running the PP and skating with the puck through the netural zone, it HURTS.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:26 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
If we are going for Bieksa I want something good coming back aswell. To me Bieksa has negative value so maybe we can throw in something and get a decent forward in a package.
I'd be happy just getting him for a 3rd or 4th.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JackZap View Post
Brad Richards. Seems they won't be able to sign him. Time for Bob to call Dallas and tell them it's time to repay that favor. Then sign MAB. Then I wake up and realize Gomez is still our 2nd line center
Richards probably isn't abailable until the deadline. They are in the playoff race and he is one of their best players, we'd have to pay through the nose to get him right now.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:36 AM
  #36
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I'm interested in Ed Jovonavski.

I would watch his performance as the year goes on... playing well this year. The Yotes are in a strange place with no owners in sight. Most likely no contract talks for him and he might not want to sign-on over the long term with PHX due to instability.

Pending our performance and such, he could be a good target. He also might be a guy we could sign-on for longer term. Maybe a treplacement for Hamrlik... if all went well (he's not as good in his own end but is an upgrade offensively).

That's my go thought. He's still a nice skater, good transition guy and could help out on our special teams. Also, he's pretty tough (although he hardly ever gets asked to demonstrate that).

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:42 AM
  #37
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If markov is gone for the year they can go get a bigger name because that guy can take hammers money next year. Once the final diagnoses is in they will have more direction on what to do.

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11-19-2010, 12:06 PM
  #38
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The way things are looking, they could probably contact Florida regarding Wideman or Allen; NY Islanders about Wisniewski; Phoenix about Jovo; Vancouver about Bieksa. I personally would like to see them contact Nashville about Suter or Weber or maybe Seabrook in Chicago. The only reason I'm even suggesting these 3 is becuase they are either RFA or UFA, and it would improve defensive talent, but the cost to acquire would be HUGE, plus re-signing would be expensive. Guess one can always dream. As for forwards, no question secondary scoring is needed. I'm just not sure who will get Gomez going?

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11-19-2010, 12:18 PM
  #39
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They traded O'Byrne too early.... (of course nobody knew that Markov would brake up the next game)

Just taking Spācek out of the line up is already a big plus.


MAB would solve two problems: Spacek and PP.

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11-19-2010, 12:28 PM
  #40
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we'll never beat the Bruins, be sure of that, but I think we're able to finish 5th and starts the playoff in a good position

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
Because Kaberle is twice the player bieksa is.
KABERLE IS SOFT

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:35 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boris Le Tigre View Post
I'm interested in Ed Jovonavski.

I would watch his performance as the year goes on... playing well this year. The Yotes are in a strange place with no owners in sight. Most likely no contract talks for him and he might not want to sign-on over the long term with PHX due to instability.

Pending our performance and such, he could be a good target. He also might be a guy we could sign-on for longer term. Maybe a treplacement for Hamrlik... if all went well (he's not as good in his own end but is an upgrade offensively).

That's my go thought. He's still a nice skater, good transition guy and could help out on our special teams. Also, he's pretty tough (although he hardly ever gets asked to demonstrate that).
yes; hes past his prime, but if hes cheap, hes a (much) better version of MAB (right?)

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:36 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackZap View Post
Brad Richards. Seems they won't be able to sign him. Time for Bob to call Dallas and tell them it's time to repay that favor. Then sign MAB. Then I wake up and realize Gomez is still our 2nd line center
Mr. Gauthier is the GM

Bieksa would have to be babysat by Hamrlik, so then who babysits Spacek ?
Islanders would want a gain out of Wisniewski.
Vishovsky, if available would cost a lot.
Vancouver is still working on signing Ehrhoff, plus they're a contender. They're not going to trade him so stupid fans will say "At least we got something for him", if they lose.
Marc-Andre Bergeron is ****in' terrible. On top of that, he's hurt
Why would we want a rental in Kaberle ? We give a divisional rival picks/prospects for a player who has been underperforming this year ?
Brad Richards won't be moved until the deadline, but we still have Scott Gomez...
Ed Jovanoski won't be traded until the deadline if traded at all.

This thread further proves most of you don't even watch hockey.

You people do know other teams are trying to win too, you know ?

And why in the sweet flying **** would Gauthier trade Eller for a ****in' rental in Kaberle ?

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:41 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
They traded O'Byrne too early.... (of course nobody knew that Markov would brake up the next game)

Just taking Spācek out of the line up is already a big plus.


MAB would solve two problems: Spacek and PP.
OB couldn't even beat out Picard and this team is struggling on the PP something which he can't help.

And MAB solves the problem of Spacek? The guy is much more of a liability defensively regardless of his PP production.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sampollock View Post
KABERLE IS SOFT
Kaberle would be great for this team. Smart, great puck mover and would help our PP tremendously. Don't think it would be worth the gross overpayment since he plays for Burke and a division rival.

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:54 PM
  #45
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Unfortunately I have a feeling we're gonna see MAB back with the Habs before Xmas instead of trading for someone..

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:00 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by holyhabs87 View Post
OB couldn't even beat out Picard and this team is struggling on the PP something which he can't help.

And MAB solves the problem of Spacek? The guy is much more of a liability defensively regardless of his PP production.
Not from what I have seen from Spacek most of this year

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:02 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackZap View Post
Brad Richards. Seems they won't be able to sign him. Time for Bob to call Dallas and tell them it's time to repay that favor. Then sign MAB. Then I wake up and realize Gomez is still our 2nd line center
Gomez for Richards at the deadline straight up

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:09 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sampollock View Post
KABERLE IS SOFT
so is your forwards? whats your point you dont need to be "Hard" to be an effective hockey player

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:28 PM
  #49
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radek martinek.

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Old
11-19-2010, 02:05 PM
  #50
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Kaberle... MAB... Bieka... Jovo....


Sometimes Im embarrassed to be a Habs fan, ' most knowledgeable' Ha, right.

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