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Old
11-17-2010, 05:18 PM
  #26
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****ing ay!

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Old
11-17-2010, 05:26 PM
  #27
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future Brayden Schenn

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:24 AM
  #28
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One thing I've been thinking about when it comes to starting Schenn's ELC now is that there are potentially some benefits to it. I know that it will give Schenn UFA eligibility at age 26 instead of 27 but I think it's possible that we can turn that into an advantage.

Looking at Philly, they have their top 2 centers signed now for the next 11 years, effectively making them Flyers for life. We can argue about the risk of these contracts, but that's not really what I care to discuss. Carter came into the league at 19, same age as Schenn now and scored 146 goals in his first 5 seasons before signing an 11 year contract with an AAV of 5.273 Mil. Now, if you were to go back in time and send him back to juniors for one more year so that he'd enter the league at 20 I imagine he'd still be relatively the same player he is now and Philly would still intend on signing him long term and Carter would still want a long term deal. The major difference is he'd be a year older in each of those 5 seasons, and probably would have scored a few more goals. It's an assumption, but I think its safe to think that if Carter as a 19 year old rookie making the jump from juniors to the NHL scored 23 goals, Carter as a 20 year old rookie making the jump from Juniors to the NHL might have scored 25 goals (same player, same lack of pro experience but slightly stronger, more training, older/smarter). So where as Carter went into contract negotiations as a 5 year pro with 146 goals to his name after burning a year of his ELC, had he returned to Juniors one more season Carter might be going into negotiations next year as a 5 year pro with a few more goals to his name (155? 160?) Those few extra goals probably add a few hundred thousand to his AAV. Small difference and assumption laden, but I think in this situation burning a year off of Carter's ELC worked out in Philly's favor.

So in short, although burning a year off an ELC starts the UFA clock, it also means that the players accomplish less in those first 7 seasons. It'll be 5-7 years before any of this is really relevant, but with all the "culture of winning" and "king's tattoo" stuff Lombardi's feeding us, starting the ELC's of Simmonds, Moller, Schenn, Doughty, Clifford will work out in our favor for the players who we intend to keep around during their UFA years and who want to be here for the majority of their careers, and be irrelevant for the guys who will be moved/won't have a spot/want out anyway at some point over the next 5-7 years anyway.

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:10 AM
  #29
Andrew Knoll
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I just don't see burning his first ELC year as wise, if they want to try and lock him down early they can do that through an extension at whatever point they see fit.

As of now I don't think the Kings are comfortable with him in a top six role and it's a waste for him to be centering the fourth line and just getting power-play time. He gets a taste of the AHL with this assignment then he goes back to Brandon where he can play in the WJC, always a great experience, and also take a serious run at the Memorial Cup again this year.

If he stays up it's not only a personnel-wise waste, it's a financial waste, too. With bonuses his cap hit will be over $2M, that is money the Kings need for trade flexibility.

It's just too soon for him to spend an entire year with the big club. Even though it seems like he has done all there is to do at the junior level, that really is not true because of the unique opportunities he has to achieve at the VERY highest level of international junior and CHL competition. More and more I am seeing the virtue is his returning to junior but I like that the Kings are in absolutely no rush to make that move. Stretch it out until December or so, then do it.

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Old
11-19-2010, 01:57 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Danny Duberstein View Post
With bonuses his cap hit will be over $2M, that is money the Kings need for trade flexibility.
But if he's up with the big club this year he doesn't come close to hitting any of those bonus's. His base salary is only $900,000K.

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Old
11-21-2010, 09:26 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Mr Irreverent View Post
If Schenn for Iginla happens I'm turning into an Avalanche fan.
If the Kings are serious about winning now they would have to think about this move hard. Know different than how Iginla ended up in Calgary from Dallas they trade for Niewendyk and won a cup. It is even harder with the salary cap to keep all the young players and stay within the cap dollars.

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11-21-2010, 10:49 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by MBJets View Post
If the Kings are serious about winning now they would have to think about this move hard. Know different than how Iginla ended up in Calgary from Dallas they trade for Niewendyk and won a cup. It is even harder with the salary cap to keep all the young players and stay within the cap dollars.
With the exception that Iginla is now 33 years old and appears to be slowing down a little and while still great and an elite player is also a right wing which we have enough of and in order to get Iginla we would have to force the flames to take back Williams which might be fine but he happens to be playing well enough for us to where his cap hit of 3.5m for the rest is of the season is nothing close to the massive overpayment that Iginla is getting at $7+ for the next three years Oh and not to mention that Schenn is actually a player that is being groomed to fill an actual need of ours.

I mean if Iginla was 28 then game on done deal but he isn't and while he is still a great player we have to consider his age AND his position along with his Massive cap hit.

It just wouldn't be close to being a good idea for us for more than this season and then, its still a little bit of a gamble.

Now if we could get Iginla for a couple of PMD's that we have on the farm and could work out a salary dump then that might be another thing.

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Old
11-21-2010, 11:09 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by DickArmy View Post
Or Terry Murray could just play him over Westgarth
this

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Old
11-22-2010, 07:29 PM
  #34
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any word on whats the deal with Schenn?


(wheat king fan here)

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Old
11-22-2010, 07:31 PM
  #35
Chazz Reinhold
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Originally Posted by deangamblin View Post
any word on whats the deal with Schenn?


(wheat king fan here)
He'll be in Manchester for the next 10 days or so on his "conditioning assignment." I would imagine the Kings will be much closer to making an ultimate decision at that point as to whether or not they will be returning him to junior.

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Old
11-22-2010, 11:59 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Danny Duberstein View Post
I just don't see burning his first ELC year as wise.....As of now I don't think the Kings are comfortable with him in a top six role and it's a waste for him to be centering the fourth line and just getting power-play time. If he stays up it's not only a personnel-wise waste, it's a financial waste, too. With bonuses his cap hit will be over $2M, that is money the Kings need for trade flexibility.
At the same time having him skate on the 4th line gives him the chance to become adjusted to the faster, bigger league. More importantly it would give him the chance to work on and learn the defensive assignments and priorities TMu will expect from him. Everyone knows he has the offensive talent, let him work on his defense and get adjusted.

Everyone is in agreement that him returning to the WHL is essentially a waste and not doing much for his development. The kid needs to be moved up either to MAN or to LA, he needs to take the next step. To essentially burn a year leaves the kid in limbo - develop the kid. The worst part imo at this point is that they have let it go this long. He needs a permanent home for the year.

Financially I agree with you. The $2M cap hit would/could handcuff DL when it comes to plans he may have in store by late Feb at the deadline.

It's a strange dilemma, but sending him to Brandon won't do anything when it comes his development.

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Old
11-23-2010, 03:50 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
At the same time having him skate on the 4th line gives him the chance to become adjusted to the faster, bigger league. More importantly it would give him the chance to work on and learn the defensive assignments and priorities TMu will expect from him. Everyone knows he has the offensive talent, let him work on his defense and get adjusted.

Everyone is in agreement that him returning to the WHL is essentially a waste and not doing much for his development. The kid needs to be moved up either to MAN or to LA, he needs to take the next step. To essentially burn a year leaves the kid in limbo - develop the kid. The worst part imo at this point is that they have let it go this long. He needs a permanent home for the year.

Financially I agree with you. The $2M cap hit would/could handcuff DL when it comes to plans he may have in store by late Feb at the deadline.

It's a strange dilemma, but sending him to Brandon won't do anything when it comes his development.
The biggest difference is he's not going to be playing on the 4th line with a $2+ mil cap hit. If he's on the 4th line he's not going to achieve many of his bonuses, and his actual cap hit will be much closer to his 900k base salary. If he does achieve his bonus's, it's because he's playing in a bigger role on a scoring line, scoring goals, at which point we will be okay with a higher cap hit as we won't need to spend as much on a deadline acquisition. Financially, his contract works in his favor as far as staying with the team.

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Old
11-23-2010, 12:29 PM
  #38
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Hey guys,

Just wanted to pop in to let y'all know that Schenn is looking GREAT in Manchester. He's easily one of the best players on the ice against AHL competition, and he set up Manchester's only goal on Sunday - found Oscar Moller through a crowd in the slot, and Moller got off a nice, quick shot. Gotta think that if he gets sent back to Juniors, he'll be whaling on players in the WHL who are far below his skill level - can't really be too great for development.

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Old
11-23-2010, 12:38 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by PBruinsfan10 View Post
Hey guys,

Just wanted to pop in to let y'all know that Schenn is looking GREAT in Manchester. He's easily one of the best players on the ice against AHL competition, and he set up Manchester's only goal on Sunday - found Oscar Moller through a crowd in the slot, and Moller got off a nice, quick shot. Gotta think that if he gets sent back to Juniors, he'll be whaling on players in the WHL who are far below his skill level - can't really be too great for development.
Thanks For the input..its great to hear. Hopefully he turns into a beast.

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