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L.Leblanc, M.Bournival & B.Gallagher Invited to WJC Selection Camp

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Old
11-29-2010, 08:37 PM
  #26
Whitesnake
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Which others also have a shot? Tinordi? Avtsin? Trunev? Nattinen? Bennett? Simila?
As far as the US are concerned, unless they showed tremendous improvement and numbers, I don't see why they would recall somebody they cut or didn't invite in the first place. There's just no way both Tinordi and Bennett makes it.

The only guy I see in that list would be Naatinen.

As far as Canada is concerned, both Gallagher and Bournival would be huge surprises based on who are there. Bournival has already done something great by being invited now without being invited in the summer. I only expect Leblanc to make it....if his injury let him....

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11-29-2010, 08:38 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Leblanc will likely spend next year in the AHL (and perhaps play a few games with the Habs if he does great) then have a real shot the next year. If the Habs try to keep him at center (I hope they do) then there is no rush to bring him up with Eller already on the team and our other centers being locked for years.

There are no clues as to when Bournival or Gallagher will join the Habs. Under 3 years would be surprising.

And obviously anything can happen ; one two or the three of them could never make the NHL for us (lets hope not. unlikely for Leblanc, not so unlikely for the others), one two or the three of them could astonishingly become stars very fast (a la Subban).
I think LeBlanc projects a better gritty winger that can skate and score in the Morrow, Brown, Burrows mold.

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11-29-2010, 08:43 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Which others also have a shot? Tinordi? Avtsin? Trunev? Nattinen? Bennett? Simila?
Tinordi's doubtful after getting sent home early from Team USA's summer evaluation camp.

Will the Habs let Avstin leave the Bulldogs for a few weeks to play for Team Russia?

Trunev played in last year's WJC but is no longer eligible due to his age.

It would be a shocker if Nattinen wouldn't make Team Finland after playing for them the last two WJC's.

I don't know if Bennett is even on Team USA's radar.

Is Simila still eligible? I believe he's too old. Wasn't he born in 1990?

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Old
11-29-2010, 08:49 PM
  #29
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Russia:
Avtsin

Canada:
Leblanc

I say we got only 2 locks for the WJCs (barring injuries). Nattinen didn't play in a long time so he might not be a lock for the Finnish team.

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Old
11-29-2010, 09:26 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Looking at the forwards:

Carter Ashton
Michael Bournival
Brett Conolly
Sean Couturier
Cody Eakin
Marcus Foligno
Brendan Gallagher
Curtis Hamilton
Joey Hishon
Quinton Howden
Ryan Howse
Ryan Johansen
Zach Kassian
Louis Leblanc
Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Brandon Pirri
Brad Ross
Jayden Schwartz
Riley Sheahan
Riley Smith
Linden Vey
Garret Wilson
Casey Czikas

I think the bolded are probably locks, but that's only 6/12 forwards. I think Bournival and Gallagher would be in the "second tier" with guys like Schwartz, Ross, Sheahan, Hishon, Howden and Ashton. It's tough to say, and it also depends on how they want to assemble the team. Usually Team Canada's bottom-six are energy/PK types which might squeeze out Bournival and Gallagher as they strike me as more "top six" types. A lot depends on what kind of camp they have, so we'll see.
While its encouraging that Hockey Canada thinks highly enough of Bournival and Gallagher to invite them to the try-out camp, its highly unlikely either make the final team. While nice prospects, neither has the speed, size and ice presence that Canada will need to challenge for the championship. There is an old expression in hockey that is used when attempting to assemble a winning team: don't get caught slow. It was an adage that last year's selectors of Team Canada forgot when they selected a team that could not compete with a clearly faster American team. Let us hope the same mistake is not repeated this year. Team Canada will be playing in a hostile environment and, assuming they reach the finals, they will probably be facing an experienced and very fast U.S. team. To win, we must have a team that can skate with the Americans. All the grit and intangibles will only take you so far. Skill will generally be the determining factor of who wins and who loses. From this writer's perspective, I hope they choose the biggest and fastest players who have the skill and ability to compete with the Russians, Swedes and Americans in all areas of the rink. To me, I choose the Hamiltons and Howdens types: players that are both large and fast. That's the key to victory. Regardless if they're Montreal prospects or not.

That is all.

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11-29-2010, 09:37 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
While its encouraging that Hockey Canada thinks highly enough of Bournival and Gallagher to invite them to the try-out camp, its highly unlikely either make the final team. While nice prospects, neither has the speed, size and ice presence that Canada will need to challenge for the championship. There is an old expression in hockey that is used when attempting to assemble a winning team: don't get caught slow. It was an adage that last year's selectors of Team Canada forgot when they selected a team that could not compete with a clearly faster American team. Let us hope the same mistake is not repeated this year. Team Canada will be playing in a hostile environment and, assuming they reach the finals, they will probably be facing an experienced and very fast U.S. team. To win, we must have a team that can skate with the Americans. All the grit and intangibles will only take you so far. Skill will generally be the determining factor of who wins and who loses. From this writer's perspective, I hope they choose the biggest and fastest players who have the skill and ability to compete with the Russians, Swedes and Americans in all areas of the rink. To me, I choose the Hamiltons and Howdens types: players that are both large and fast. That's the key to victory. Regardless if they're Montreal prospects or not.

That is all.
I could be wrong but isn't Michael Bournival supposed to be a speed demon that is pretty good defensively? I read people were impressed with his speed during the Q vs Russia challenge (can't comment as I never saw the games). I agree that Gallagher won't and probably shouldn't make the team but Bournival can be valuable as a PK/defensively responsible speedster for the bottom 6.

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Old
11-29-2010, 10:40 PM
  #32
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wasn't eberle not the fastest skater?

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Old
11-29-2010, 11:47 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
I could be wrong but isn't Michael Bournival supposed to be a speed demon that is pretty good defensively? I read people were impressed with his speed during the Q vs Russia challenge (can't comment as I never saw the games). I agree that Gallagher won't and probably shouldn't make the team but Bournival can be valuable as a PK/defensively responsible speedster for the bottom 6.
Bournival is undoubtedly a fine prospect who will, one day, play effectively in the NHL. The fact that he was even selected for Team Canada's try out camp provides confirmation of his skill levels and, hopefully, for Montreal's sake, his overall potential. But we're talking about a tournament that starts within 4 weeks and from this writer's perspective Bournival does not yet possess the skating skills to compete with Kreider, Morin, Etem, Zucker, Watson, Shore, etc. who, playing before their home fans, will be attacking us at 100 mph. The mantra of the Team Canada selectors must be: Don't get caught slow. Don't get caught slow. Deviate from this simple premise, and Canada may well be embarrassed. Canada has the players to compete with the pace that the U.S. team will try to impose. We just have to be smart enough to choose them.

That is all.

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11-30-2010, 12:21 AM
  #34
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I would be surprised if Brett Conolly is healthy enough to make the team, or good enough. Seriously think he was rated way too highly.

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11-30-2010, 08:19 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
I could be wrong but isn't Michael Bournival supposed to be a speed demon that is pretty good defensively? I read people were impressed with his speed during the Q vs Russia challenge (can't comment as I never saw the games). I agree that Gallagher won't and probably shouldn't make the team but Bournival can be valuable as a PK/defensively responsible speedster for the bottom 6.
I don't know if Bournival is a "speed demon", really. He looked mobile enough, but not a pure burner. He may hustle more than most players, which may give him the impression of extra speed?

Anyway, I think Bournival will just have to have an incredible camp performance if he wants to make the team as an energy line player. He probably starts as a serious underdog, but his conditioning and work ethic has got him this much notice so far, and maybe he can pull off an upset in camp.

Hopefully both he and Gallagher can build on this experience for next year, at the very least.

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I would be surprised if Brett Conolly is healthy enough to make the team, or good enough. Seriously think he was rated way too highly.
I thought he looked awesome in the Subway series, clearly to me the best player in the West, and a legit top-5 draft type of player. I would look for him to be one of the leaders and key players for Team Canada. If we don't get Schenn (or Seguin?!) back from the NHL, then Connolly may be the team's best forward IMHO.

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11-30-2010, 08:46 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
As far as the US are concerned, unless they showed tremendous improvement and numbers, I don't see why they would recall somebody they cut or didn't invite in the first place. There's just no way both Tinordi and Bennett makes it.

The only guy I see in that list would be Naatinen.

As far as Canada is concerned, both Gallagher and Bournival would be huge surprises based on who are there. Bournival has already done something great by being invited now without being invited in the summer. I only expect Leblanc to make it....if his injury let him....
Tinordi was at their summer camp...but he's not putting up any numbers in the OHL though. He was captain of their U18 team so I'd be surprised if he wasn't invited to December camp, but he may not make the team.

Bournival wouldn't be a surprise at all, he's a guy with skill who can also play a checking/energy role so that gives him more opportunity than a one dimensional offensive guy. Gallagher is putting up big numbers, he'll likely battle for one of 6-7 offensive spots, I don't think they'd keep him as a 3rd or 4th liner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
While its encouraging that Hockey Canada thinks highly enough of Bournival and Gallagher to invite them to the try-out camp, its highly unlikely either make the final team. While nice prospects, neither has the speed, size and ice presence that Canada will need to challenge for the championship. There is an old expression in hockey that is used when attempting to assemble a winning team: don't get caught slow. It was an adage that last year's selectors of Team Canada forgot when they selected a team that could not compete with a clearly faster American team. Let us hope the same mistake is not repeated this year. Team Canada will be playing in a hostile environment and, assuming they reach the finals, they will probably be facing an experienced and very fast U.S. team. To win, we must have a team that can skate with the Americans. All the grit and intangibles will only take you so far. Skill will generally be the determining factor of who wins and who loses. From this writer's perspective, I hope they choose the biggest and fastest players who have the skill and ability to compete with the Russians, Swedes and Americans in all areas of the rink. To me, I choose the Hamiltons and Howdens types: players that are both large and fast. That's the key to victory. Regardless if they're Montreal prospects or not.

That is all.
So while US was faster than Canada they still needed Campbell to badly outplay Allen to win the Gold medal game and lost in the preliminary?

That game could have easily gone the other way, in fact, we missed a great chance just seconds before Carlson went down and scored.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
While its encouraging that Hockey Canada thinks highly enough of Bournival and Gallagher to invite them to the try-out camp, its highly unlikely either make the final team. While nice prospects, neither has the speed, size and ice presence that Canada will need to challenge for the championship. There is an old expression in hockey that is used when attempting to assemble a winning team: don't get caught slow. It was an adage that last year's selectors of Team Canada forgot when they selected a team that could not compete with a clearly faster American team. Let us hope the same mistake is not repeated this year. Team Canada will be playing in a hostile environment and, assuming they reach the finals, they will probably be facing an experienced and very fast U.S. team. To win, we must have a team that can skate with the Americans. All the grit and intangibles will only take you so far. Skill will generally be the determining factor of who wins and who loses. From this writer's perspective, I hope they choose the biggest and fastest players who have the skill and ability to compete with the Russians, Swedes and Americans in all areas of the rink. To me, I choose the Hamiltons and Howdens types: players that are both large and fast. That's the key to victory. Regardless if they're Montreal prospects or not.

That is all.
Skating is an issue with Gallagher but he can really finish and plays with an edge...a la Cammalleri.

Bournival is a good skater in the Q, probably average for the WJHC.

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Old
11-30-2010, 08:55 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Skating is an issue with Gallagher but he can really finish and plays with an edge...a la Cammalleri.

Bournival is a good skater in the Q, probably average for the WJHC.
his skating technique is good its just his speed thats a problem, which you can improve for sure, its the offense that he has that you cant teach

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Old
11-30-2010, 08:58 AM
  #38
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his skating technique is good its just his speed thats a problem, which you can improve for sure, its the offense that he has that you cant teach
Wait. We are not talking about Latendresse, mate.

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11-30-2010, 09:16 AM
  #39
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Wait. We are not talking about Latendresse, mate.
But in comparison to the skaters he will competing against at the WJHC, he may well seem 'Latendresse-like.' The issue here is not a long-term forecast as to any player's ultimate ability. We are talking about a competition that will be starting in less than 30 days. If one has to discuss any player's projected improvement in any phase of that player's skating ability, that player should be removed from consideration. Only players that can skate and compete at an elite level - today- should be chosen. Bournival, at least in this writer's perspective, cannot yet skate at this level. That is why the WJHC is called a 19 year tournament, with only those exceptional players who are younger, ever having an impact in the tournament. Just look at Subban - a fringe player in his first tournament and dominant in his second one. Pick the biggest, fastest players. We will sorely need them in 30 days.

That is all.

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11-30-2010, 09:44 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
But in comparison to the skaters he will competing against at the WJHC, he may well seem 'Latendresse-like.' The issue here is not a long-term forecast as to any player's ultimate ability. We are talking about a competition that will be starting in less than 30 days. If one has to discuss any player's projected improvement in any phase of that player's skating ability, that player should be removed from consideration. Only players that can skate and compete at an elite level - today- should be chosen. Bournival, at least in this writer's perspective, cannot yet skate at this level. That is why the WJHC is called a 19 year tournament, with only those exceptional players who are younger, ever having an impact in the tournament. Just look at Subban - a fringe player in his first tournament and dominant in his second one. Pick the biggest, fastest players. We will sorely need them in 30 days.

That is all.
Grit and hockey sense is as important if not more than just speed. Give me a smart guy with average speed over a burner with below average hockey sense any day. I don't see where Bournival's skating is below average.

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11-30-2010, 09:55 AM
  #41
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Grit and hockey sense is as important if not more than just speed. Give me a smart guy with average speed over a burner with below average hockey sense any day. I don't see where Bournival's skating is below average.
Agree 100%. One of the best Team Canada lines in recent memory was the Nigel Dawes-Mike Richards-Anthony Stewart line. None of them were exceptionally fast.

Speed and mobility will be important for our D but for our forwards I'd rather see the focus put on guys who play with passion, character and smarts, with obviously a skill threshold needing to be met. There's nothing more frustrating than watching a forward who skates like the wind but has mediocre hockey sense (e.g. Lapierre).

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11-30-2010, 10:11 AM
  #42
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Is Kristo playing for Team USA again?

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Old
11-30-2010, 10:15 AM
  #43
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Is Kristo playing for Team USA again?
Nope that's it for him

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11-30-2010, 10:15 AM
  #44
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I thought he looked awesome in the Subway series, clearly to me the best player in the West, and a legit top-5 draft type of player. I would look for him to be one of the leaders and key players for Team Canada. If we don't get Schenn (or Seguin?!) back from the NHL, then Connolly may be the team's best forward IMHO.
I don't know what it is about him I find alarming, but he does nothing for me as a player. I hope he does well, I cheer for the Cougars but B.C would shock me if he makes any impact in the NHL.

I'll probably eat those words, but whatever.... just my feeling about the kid.

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11-30-2010, 10:15 AM
  #45
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Grit and hockey sense is as important if not more than just speed. Give me a smart guy with average speed over a burner with below average hockey sense any day. I don't see where Bournival's skating is below average.
You're presupposing that the U.S. team's 'burners' have below average hockey sense. Trust me: the team that they will be fielding will be both skilled and fast. All I'm saying is if a good 'big' player will usually beat a good 'smaller' player then a superior skating player with good hockey sense will usually beat an inferior skating player with good hockey sense. With having watched and coached hockey for over 50 years I have come to one seminal conclusion: a superior skating team will usually (not always) beat a lesser skating team. Skating ability distinguishes and separates players at all levels: the proficiency in skating is what separates house league players from Rep players; AHL players from NHL players and NHL players from NHL superstars. While grit; size; desire and hockey sense all play a role it determining the strength of a particular player and a team, if one team is markedly inferior to another in skating ability, the weaker team will generally lose. The Russians have an expression that has stood them in good stead in the development of their country's hockey program: if you can skate, anything is possible; if you can't, nothing is. Let us hope that the selectors of Team Canada have the wisdom to assemble a team that can accomplish the possible.

That is all.

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11-30-2010, 11:31 AM
  #46
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My take on a depth chart for forwards (with only a slight bias to Habs prospects):

LW
[B]Sean Couturier
Carter Ashton
Brad Ross
Michael Bournival[B]

Curtis Hamilton
Cody Eakin
Marcus Foligno
Ryan Howse
Garret Wilson

RW
Brett Conolly
Brendan Gallagher
Zach Kassian
Linden Vey


Ryan Nugent-Hopkins

C
Louis Leblanc
Jayden Schwartz
Ryan Johansen
Quinton Howden


Joey Hishon
Casey Czikas
Riley Sheahan
Brandon Pirri
Riley Smith

The real danger to Gallagher/Bournivals chances are if they move Leblanc or Howden to the wing.

But Hishon/Schwartz are competing for one spot and Howden/Sheahan/Cizikas for another, with Howden having the edge and being so good at faceoffs.

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11-30-2010, 12:23 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
You're presupposing that the U.S. team's 'burners' have below average hockey sense. Trust me: the team that they will be fielding will be both skilled and fast. All I'm saying is if a good 'big' player will usually beat a good 'smaller' player then a superior skating player with good hockey sense will usually beat an inferior skating player with good hockey sense. With having watched and coached hockey for over 50 years I have come to one seminal conclusion: a superior skating team will usually (not always) beat a lesser skating team. Skating ability distinguishes and separates players at all levels: the proficiency in skating is what separates house league players from Rep players; AHL players from NHL players and NHL players from NHL superstars. While grit; size; desire and hockey sense all play a role it determining the strength of a particular player and a team, if one team is markedly inferior to another in skating ability, the weaker team will generally lose. The Russians have an expression that has stood them in good stead in the development of their country's hockey program: if you can skate, anything is possible; if you can't, nothing is. Let us hope that the selectors of Team Canada have the wisdom to assemble a team that can accomplish the possible.

That is all.
I'd rather have a Mike Richards type that's neither big nor fast, than a Lapierre or Kilger who are big and skate well but not that smart or skilled. Kreider is an example for US, he's very fast but questionable hockey sense.

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11-30-2010, 12:26 PM
  #48
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My take on a depth chart for forwards (with only a slight bias to Habs prospects):

LW
[B]Sean Couturier
Carter Ashton
Brad Ross
Michael Bournival[B]

Curtis Hamilton
Cody Eakin
Marcus Foligno
Ryan Howse
Garret Wilson

RW
Brett Conolly
Brendan Gallagher
Zach Kassian
Linden Vey


Ryan Nugent-Hopkins

C
Louis Leblanc
Jayden Schwartz
Ryan Johansen
Quinton Howden


Joey Hishon
Casey Czikas
Riley Sheahan
Brandon Pirri
Riley Smith

The real danger to Gallagher/Bournivals chances are if they move Leblanc or Howden to the wing.

But Hishon/Schwartz are competing for one spot and Howden/Sheahan/Cizikas for another, with Howden having the edge and being so good at faceoffs.
I think Pirri and Hishon will make it, Leblanc to me is as good or better on the wing, especially on a scoring line. I think Hishon could play LW. I don't see Ashton cracking the team.

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11-30-2010, 12:48 PM
  #49
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Leblanc will likely spend next year in the AHL (and perhaps play a few games with the Habs if he does great) then have a real shot the next year. If the Habs try to keep him at center (I hope they do) then there is no rush to bring him up with Eller already on the team and our other centers being locked for years.

There are no clues as to when Bournival or Gallagher will join the Habs. Under 3 years would be surprising.

And obviously anything can happen ; one two or the three of them could never make the NHL for us (lets hope not. unlikely for Leblanc, not so unlikely for the others), one two or the three of them could astonishingly become stars very fast (a la Subban).
Halpern is hardly locked for years, but I don't mind having that Moore/Halpern/Metro type vet playing center on the 4th line.

Gomez's salary drops to an average of 5 mill per over the final 2 years, so after next season I could see us moving him if Eller and Leblanc are ready.

Then our center situation in 2012/2013 and beyond would be:

Plekanec
Eller
Leblanc

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Old
11-30-2010, 01:00 PM
  #50
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Halpern is hardly locked for years, but I don't mind having that Moore/Halpern/Metro type vet playing center on the 4th line.

Gomez's salary drops to an average of 5 mill per over the final 2 years, so after next season I could see us moving him if Eller and Leblanc are ready.

Then our center situation in 2012/2013 and beyond would be:

Plekanec
Eller
Leblanc
I think we might see LeBlanc on RW if he arrives with Gomez still here. To me his game translates well to wing in the Morrow, Burrows and D.Brown type style he plays.

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