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Philly rivals: Caps going same way as Pens?

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12-07-2010, 10:01 PM
  #1
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Philly rivals: Caps going same way as Pens?

I think Pens and Caps in the East are the main rivals of Philly ( and I also keep a wary eye on Bruins, but that's another story). Here is a theory I have:

Washington has (or perhaps had) a tremendous amount of offensive depth.,, but I think they are of necessity going the way of the Pens.

And what is the Pens main problem? Basically, after paying big money for three forwards (Crosby, Malkin, Staal) .... and also shelling out some cash for a decent defense corps ..... they have no cap left to sign decent wingers. The year they won the Cup, they got decent wingers signed for lesser money (Guerin, a still decent Fedo) .. but since then they havent been able to do so.

Washington's problem the last few years has been lack of hard hitting stay at home defense corps. To address this, they need to shed some offensive depth and acquire the right type of Dmen. Trading Fleischman for Hannan was a step in this direction.

But I think Caps may end up in a situation somewhat like Pens ... three big forwards and little to surround them with. Ovie, Semin, Backstrom... but who else?

Knuble has lost a step and looks like he may not even score 20 goals this year. The only player who can is Brooks Laich. But while Ovie and Backstrom are signed very long term (Backstrom for 6.7 mil per year) ... Semin is in a contract year <and sniping at a 50 plus goal rate>, and the thinking is he'll demand at least as much as Backstrom to stay.

If so they may not even be able to keep Laich who is also UFA and will lilekly want 4 mil.

So they may be with a Huge Three and little else for forwards. That would plunge them into a Pens type situation.

Question: as Flyers fans, should you be cheering for a long term signing of Semin .. reasoning that this will tie the Capitals to an over-concentrated Big Three offense for years?

Is my analysis at all correct?
Discuss,

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12-08-2010, 12:28 AM
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as long as we have jody shelley locked up, i don't care who the caps sign. the cup is as good as ours.

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12-08-2010, 01:16 AM
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As a Philly fan, the best thing that can happen to the Caps is Green (he has a contract coming, right?) and Semin being re-signed to big contracts, and Bruce keeping his job...and he will keep his job as long as they win in the regular season and pull in a crowd.

As far as rivalry goes...I don't really care about them. I'm just indifferent. However, Caps fans seem to have a pretty hard hate-on for Philly.

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12-08-2010, 01:31 AM
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I don't consider them a rival anywhere close to what pitts, rags, and devs, habs are.

Actually, I kinda like washington.

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12-08-2010, 04:41 AM
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Nope, they're more like Tampa back in the 90's, they thought they had a rivalry with us. But, we couldn't give two ***** about them.

Pittsburgh, NY, Jersey, that's it. And the only non-division teams, on and off would be Toronto, Montreal, Boston. Everyone else is irrelevant. Just another game.

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12-08-2010, 04:42 AM
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Washington hate us. Not the other way around. Philly couldn't give a rats ass about OV and his team.

Personally i want to see semin gone from the caps to the western conference. The guy seems to rip us a new ******* everytime we play them, even if he doesn't get on the scoresheet. I think without semin the caps are in trouble, because the minute you contain the top line, they have nothing else to throw at you.

The flyers are in a very lucky position where they can pretty much send out the top two defensive pairs to contain ovy and backstrom, and leave their third pairing to clean the others up. Mez and OD would pretty much be a second pairing on 90% of the teams in the league.

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12-08-2010, 06:21 AM
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I hate their bandwagon fans and over the top goal celebrations. But, that doesn't make it a rivalry.

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12-08-2010, 07:23 AM
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The flyers main rival has been the rangers. It has faded a little over the years. Devils as well but the hatred just isn’t there really. The flyers never had a rivalry with the pens until a few years ago. It was like the dallas/eagles rivalry where dallas could care less about the eagles, much like the flyers towards the pens. Once that “magical” ping pong ball ended up shockingly to the pens then it started, along with the last few playoffs. I despise that organization more and more everyday. I cant wait until they do their rebuild again in 7 years and hear Mario cry again in his soup. I just wonder what the excuse will be then. I would love to hear how Snider really thinks about that mickey mouse operation. Wash isnt even clsoe to a rivalry, leonis is another guy you would like to take a hammer to his head.

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12-08-2010, 07:53 AM
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To answer the proposed question:

I would prefer Semin go elsewhere because then the Caps would have 1 top line and nothing else. They are built to score 5 goals a night and without an elite 2nd line they will fall flat on their face even if they sure up their defensive shortcomings (which will actually never happen since Bruce won't be fired and Green will stay their "#1" dman).

To answer the question of whether or not we are rivals:

No. Currently our top rivals are the Pens because they are competing with us each year for top of the division (and because they are douches), the Rangers (history) and the Habs (last year has seemed to create a pretty big hatred between the players).

The Devils will be back on the list next year, but are fairly irrelevant this year.

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12-08-2010, 08:01 AM
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It's not so much a rivalry as it is just good hockey. They don't really hate each other on the level that some other teams do, but it seems like every game is just a hard fought entertaining hockey game.

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12-08-2010, 08:33 AM
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All I know is I hate that kid who gets the OV jersey in the NHL Christmas commercial. I ought to steal it from him and burn it so I can make sure I'd never have to see him in another commercial jumping and screaming, and jumping and screaming, and jumping screaming. It makes my head want to esplode.

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12-08-2010, 08:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McNasty View Post
It's not so much a rivalry as it is just good hockey. They don't really hate each other on the level that some other teams do, but it seems like every game is just a hard fought entertaining hockey game.
I actually feel pretty certain in saying that the Caps really do hate us. From everything I hear and read about them when they have to play the Flyers, it's never really good. I just love how people make the Caps-Pens "rivalry" out to be the best in the league, when I feel pretty certain in saying that they actually like each other. That's just my two cents though.

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12-08-2010, 08:43 AM
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Not in my book. First of all they aren't in the division so games against Washington "aren't worth as much" (note the quotations, I know all games are worth the same but divisional games are worth more in a rivalry/standings sense). Second of all, they really haven't been good long enough and nothing major has really happened between the two to create a rivalry. There used to be a pretty solid out of division rivalry with Toronto when they were good and there were lots of fights and they played every year in the playoffs it seemed. The Flyers and Caps have only played like once or twice in the last ten years and I don't remember anything of significance happening.

Just being good for a few years doesn't spark a rivalry, or at least a serious rivalry. If they play each other in the playoffs the next five years and there's some bad blood between them, then it could be a good rivalry, but at this moment they are just a good team that the Flyers have to play.

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12-08-2010, 09:45 AM
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Could care less about the capitals mainly because of the knowledge that they will choke in the playoffs every year.

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12-08-2010, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StandingCow View Post
I don't consider them a rival anywhere close to what pitts, rags, and devs, habs are.

Actually, I kinda like washington.
Pathetic, this is like rooting for the Giants or Cowboys, never going to happen.

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12-08-2010, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rban View Post
I think Pens and Caps in the East are the main rivals of Philly ( and I also keep a wary eye on Bruins, but that's another story). Here is a theory I have:

Washington has (or perhaps had) a tremendous amount of offensive depth.,, but I think they are of necessity going the way of the Pens.

And what is the Pens main problem? Basically, after paying big money for three forwards (Crosby, Malkin, Staal) .... and also shelling out some cash for a decent defense corps ..... they have no cap left to sign decent wingers. The year they won the Cup, they got decent wingers signed for lesser money (Guerin, a still decent Fedo) .. but since then they havent been able to do so.

Washington's problem the last few years has been lack of hard hitting stay at home defense corps. To address this, they need to shed some offensive depth and acquire the right type of Dmen. Trading Fleischman for Hannan was a step in this direction.

But I think Caps may end up in a situation somewhat like Pens ... three big forwards and little to surround them with. Ovie, Semin, Backstrom... but who else?

Knuble has lost a step and looks like he may not even score 20 goals this year. The only player who can is Brooks Laich. But while Ovie and Backstrom are signed very long term (Backstrom for 6.7 mil per year) ... Semin is in a contract year <and sniping at a 50 plus goal rate>, and the thinking is he'll demand at least as much as Backstrom to stay.

If so they may not even be able to keep Laich who is also UFA and will lilekly want 4 mil.

So they may be with a Huge Three and little else for forwards. That would plunge them into a Pens type situation.

Question: as Flyers fans, should you be cheering for a long term signing of Semin .. reasoning that this will tie the Capitals to an over-concentrated Big Three offense for years?

Is my analysis at all correct?
Discuss,

----------

The Flyers have outplayed the Penguins and Capitals when it counts--during the playoff run. Performance during the "second season" is more important than during the regular season. All the Flyers have to do is get into the Playoffs.

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12-08-2010, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agrudez View Post
To answer the proposed question:

I would prefer Semin go elsewhere because then the Caps would have 1 top line and nothing else. They are built to score 5 goals a night and without an elite 2nd line they will fall flat on their face even if they sure up their defensive shortcomings (which will actually never happen since Bruce won't be fired and Green will stay their "#1" dman).
Surprisingly this is why I want Semin to stay. If he leaves they have more capspace to go out and spend to build a legitimate second line.

But if he stays they've blown their whole wad on three superstars.

I'm surprised at people's reactions here. I personally dont consider the regular season so much as the POs.

My starting point was: who in the entire East is most likely to beat Flyers ina PO series.

And I put Pens and Caps way ahead of Mtl, NJ, and Rags. And I even put Bruins ahead of those three ...

Just cuz of the superstars Pens and Caps have.

BTW as an aside, Boston bears watching, they have a lotta decent forwards and may be building the sorta hi performing Top 9 depth Philly has.

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12-08-2010, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PuckBoy33 View Post
----------

The Flyers have outplayed the Penguins and Capitals when it counts--during the playoff run. Performance during the "second season" is more important than during the regular season. All the Flyers have to do is get into the Playoffs.
Nice 5th post man.

The Penguins beat the Flyers in the playoffs 2 times in the past 3 years, though.

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12-08-2010, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PuckBoy33 View Post
----------

The Flyers have outplayed the Penguins and Capitals when it counts--during the playoff run. Performance during the "second season" is more important than during the regular season. All the Flyers have to do is get into the Playoffs.
I can agree with outplaying the Caps, but the Pens?? Last time I checked the Pens have ousted the Flyers each time they have met and Crosby has his name on Lord Stanley's Cup.

And just an FYI, do not go on the misnomer that the regular season does not matter, only the post-season matters. Teams do not win the SCF's as the #7 or #8 seed, last year was a fluke. The regular season does matter and results do matter during the regular season in preparation for the playoffs. Home ice is also very important so winning the games you are supposed to win and not leaving points on the table is very important come May.

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12-08-2010, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by rban View Post
Surprisingly this is why I want Semin to stay. If he leaves they have more capspace to go out and spend to build a legitimate second line.

But if he stays they've blown their whole wad on three superstars.

I'm surprised at people's reactions here. I personally dont consider the regular season so much as the POs.

My starting point was: who in the entire East is most likely to beat Flyers ina PO series.

And I put Pens and Caps way ahead of Mtl, NJ, and Rags. And I even put Bruins ahead of those three ...

Just cuz of the superstars Pens and Caps have.

BTW as an aside, Boston bears watching, they have a lotta decent forwards and may be building the sorta hi performing Top 9 depth Philly has.


Honestly who cares. You put your best players on the ice, they put their best players on the ice and you go out and win.

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12-08-2010, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rban View Post
Surprisingly this is why I want Semin to stay. If he leaves they have more capspace to go out and spend to build a legitimate second line.

But if he stays they've blown their whole wad on three superstars.

I'm surprised at people's reactions here. I personally dont consider the regular season so much as the POs.

My starting point was: who in the entire East is most likely to beat Flyers ina PO series.

And I put Pens and Caps way ahead of Mtl, NJ, and Rags. And I even put Bruins ahead of those three ...

Just cuz of the superstars Pens and Caps have.

BTW as an aside, Boston bears watching, they have a lotta decent forwards and may be building the sorta hi performing Top 9 depth Philly has.
Pittsburgh is certainly the team I would fear most in a playoff series, Crosby is playing possessed while Malkin and Staal are both injured. Other then that I would say Boston worries me the most. They are deep at all positions, physical, and Thomas has always given us problems.

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12-08-2010, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by agrudez View Post
Nice 5th post man.

The Penguins beat the Flyers in the playoffs 2 times in the past 3 years, though.
How did you have time to type that? Aren't your hands usually busy j--king off Cindy Crosby?

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12-08-2010, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by StandingCow View Post
I don't consider them a rival anywhere close to what pitts, rags, and devs, habs are.

Actually, I kinda like washington.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyflu View Post
Nope, they're more like Tampa back in the 90's, they thought they had a rivalry with us. But, we couldn't give two ***** about them.

Pittsburgh, NY, Jersey, that's it. And the only non-division teams, on and off would be Toronto, Montreal, Boston. Everyone else is irrelevant. Just another game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
Washington hate us. Not the other way around. Philly couldn't give a rats ass about OV and his team.

Personally i want to see semin gone from the caps to the western conference. The guy seems to rip us a new ******* everytime we play them, even if he doesn't get on the scoresheet. I think without semin the caps are in trouble, because the minute you contain the top line, they have nothing else to throw at you.

The flyers are in a very lucky position where they can pretty much send out the top two defensive pairs to contain ovy and backstrom, and leave their third pairing to clean the others up. Mez and OD would pretty much be a second pairing on 90% of the teams in the league.
all of these. It's a manufactured rivalry because we had an incredible playoff series a couple years ago. We had the same thing with the Leafs in the late 90s-early 00s, with all the fighters (Domi, Belak, McCabe/Marchment vs. Brashear, Fedoruk, McAllister, Richardson). Its also manufactured because we're both good teams in the east.

But no team's rivalry can match the one we have with PIT right now, again fueled by the success of both teams. If the Rangers were doing well, they'd be our primary rival, and so on.

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12-08-2010, 11:42 AM
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Oh man.

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12-08-2010, 11:52 AM
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How did you have time to type that? Aren't your hands usually busy j--king off Cindy Crosby?
I'm sorry, are you trying to insinuate that I am a Penguins fan for correcting your flawed statement?

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