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Old
12-11-2010, 01:12 PM
  #26
GoFlames
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Originally Posted by cgychieffan View Post
I posted this a few weeka ago..

TO CALGARY:
Evander Kane (900 K)
Johnny Oduya (4 M)
Spencer Machachuk (AHL)
2011 2nd.. **EDIT: 1ST ROUND** ..pick

TO ATLANTA:
Jarome Iginla (7 M)
Robyn Regher( 4 M)
I would say take out Reggie OR Iginla. Reason is I think the Flames can get more return by trading individually to two teams and throw in some muckers as well.

For example, that Iginla to Boston idea for Toronto's 1st, Colborne plus is solid. Then if Reggie is moved, ideally to a non elite team who desperately needs to bolster their D. I say non elite as I would want a first (high) as well as a prospect etc. If the Flames they can get lucky and throw in Olli and also get a third rounder as well Regehr would doubtfully waive the NMC to go to a bototm feeder... but the ideal would be a playoff bubble team (7-10th in their conference). FOr the Flames the ideal would be for that team to tank down teh stretch leading to another high first rounder. The Flames could have 3 high firsts (Toronto) (bubble team if lucky) and their own should the trends continue.

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Old
12-11-2010, 01:41 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by GoFlames View Post
I would say take out Reggie OR Iginla. Reason is I think the Flames can get more return by trading individually to two teams and throw in some muckers as well.

For example, that Iginla to Boston idea for Toronto's 1st, Colborne plus is solid. Then if Reggie is moved, ideally to a non elite team who desperately needs to bolster their D. I say non elite as I would want a first (high) as well as a prospect etc. If the Flames they can get lucky and throw in Olli and also get a third rounder as well Regehr would doubtfully waive the NMC to go to a bototm feeder... but the ideal would be a playoff bubble team (7-10th in their conference). FOr the Flames the ideal would be for that team to tank down teh stretch leading to another high first rounder. The Flames could have 3 high firsts (Toronto) (bubble team if lucky) and their own should the trends continue.
What do you think about the three way deal I proposed in the sellers thread? It's based on that Colborne + Torontos' first proposal from Coach Parker.

To Boston:

Jarome Iginla (7,000,000)

To LA:

Michael Ryder (4,000,000)
Alex Tanguay (1,700,000)

To Calgary:

Andrew Ference (2,250,000)
Joe Colborne (1,100,000)
2011 1st (Toronto)
2011 1st (Kings)

Basically we take that package from Boston for Iggy and flip Ryder with Tanguay for LA's 1st.

The Kings get a sniping winger and a playmaking winger, both who are UFA's at the end of the year so they aren't tied down, but still have the option of trying to extend either one of them (or both). They don't lose anything from their current roster, and strengthen their forward group. They have the cap space to add $5.7 million as well.

The Bruins get one of the best RWers in the game to potentially put them over the top, and clear out the salary needed to fit him in.

The Flames have to eat Ference for two more years, but he can fill in on our top 4 which would help fill the hole left by Regehr (as we would probably have to move him in the off-season - doubt he wants to remain with a rebuilding team). Ference could help eat up minutes while our young defenseman try to find their game at the NHL level.

We also get Colborne, and a potential lotto pick in the upcoming draft. Plus having LA's pick might give us some leverage if we want to try and move up and draft in the top 5 twice next spring. (EG - Say TO's pick is 2nd, the Flames pick is 6th and LA's is 23rd. Maybe trade the 6th & 23rd overall for the 3rd or 4th overall). Would give us more options.

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Old
12-11-2010, 02:20 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by DJ Doublecheese View Post
Why do people want to move JBO? He has been our best defenseman this year, and yes that includes Gio. He has been a better shut down D-Man then Regher and is jumping up in the play more, all while logging the 4th highest TOI in the league. Oh, and he is a +7.
You are right on all points, he has been our best D, he's shut guys down, and he is +7

BUT, he's still a HORRENDOUS value for money. Just horrendous. And that's not his fault.

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Old
12-11-2010, 03:08 PM
  #29
Johnny Hoxville
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Originally Posted by canadajazz View Post
You are right on all points, he has been our best D, he's shut guys down, and he is +7

BUT, he's still a HORRENDOUS value for money. Just horrendous. And that's not his fault.
This, I like Bouw...alot! But his contract is not market value sadly. I am not sure that I would trade him, but in a rebuild scenerio I would listen to see what offers were out there. If you can move him for a trade that benefits you in the long run, then it may make sense to pull the trigger.

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Old
12-11-2010, 03:52 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by MVW View Post
This, I like Bouw...alot! But his contract is not market value sadly. I am not sure that I would trade him, but in a rebuild scenerio I would listen to see what offers were out there. If you can move him for a trade that benefits you in the long run, then it may make sense to pull the trigger.
clearly you don't understand what market value is... you can not look at a contract signed over a year ago and say its not market value... market value is the value on the market when the player was going to be a UFA... and judging by the reactions when we signed Bouwmeester it was below market value... had Bouwmeester hit the open market he would have gotten a Campbell type contract

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Old
12-11-2010, 03:57 PM
  #31
StreakingRed
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
clearly you don't understand what market value is... you can not look at a contract signed over a year ago and say its not market value... market value is the value on the market when the player was going to be a UFA... and judging by the reactions when we signed Bouwmeester it was below market value... had Bouwmeester hit the open market he would have gotten a Campbell type contract

Absolutely.

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Old
12-11-2010, 06:52 PM
  #32
cgychieffan
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Originally Posted by canadajazz View Post
You are right on all points, he has been our best D, he's shut guys down, and he is +7

BUT, he's still a HORRENDOUS value for money. Just horrendous. And that's not his fault.
Regardless.. I think hes worth more to us than any of the returns ur gonna get for that contract.. u have to think a team taking on that salary is gonna use it as leverage in what they're giving up.. in essence.. "Cap space" is just as much of a factor as the number/type of players u get back... keep him and his 'value' will only rise when he gets that scoring touch back.. trade him in 2 yrs time with less left on the contract.. Jay-bo is here for a while!

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Old
12-11-2010, 06:59 PM
  #33
cgychieffan
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Originally Posted by BurnEmUp View Post
To Boston:

Jarome Iginla (7,000,000)

To LA:

Michael Ryder (4,000,000)
Alex Tanguay (1,700,000)

To Calgary:

Andrew Ference (2,250,000)
Joe Colborne (1,100,000)
2011 1st (Toronto)
2011 1st (Kings)

Basically we take that package from Boston for Iggy and flip Ryder with Tanguay for LA's 1st.
Sweet deal for Calgary.. but do you think Boston will give up-
a 1st rd pick, Joe Colborne, Michael Ryder and Andrew Ference for Iggy? I have a feeling they'd think they're losing more in assets than what they are gettin back.. but who knows, they'd probably overpay if they felt that's the missing piece

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Old
12-11-2010, 07:06 PM
  #34
Johnny Hoxville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
clearly you don't understand what market value is... you can not look at a contract signed over a year ago and say its not market value... market value is the value on the market when the player was going to be a UFA... and judging by the reactions when we signed Bouwmeester it was below market value... had Bouwmeester hit the open market he would have gotten a Campbell type contract
I won't argue this point because its true, but if you think Bouwmeester is worth every penny of the money he is getting paid, then I want more of that good stuff that you are smoking. Sutter even admitted that he overpaid for Bouw because of the FA market. There is no question that the FA market dictates what a player will make, but equally to that equation so does that players play. Bouwmeester today is not worth his contract, period. I am not trying to say that he is not a top defenceman in the NHL because he is, and I am glad that we have a player like him on the Flames. But in my estimation he is somewhere in the neighborhood of being 1-1.5 million dollars overpaid. FA may of dictated his market value at the time of his signing, but his play suggests that he is not worth that.

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Old
12-11-2010, 08:06 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by MVW View Post
I won't argue this point because its true, but if you think Bouwmeester is worth every penny of the money he is getting paid, then I want more of that good stuff that you are smoking. Sutter even admitted that he overpaid for Bouw because of the FA market. There is no question that the FA market dictates what a player will make, but equally to that equation so does that players play. Bouwmeester today is not worth his contract, period. I am not trying to say that he is not a top defenceman in the NHL because he is, and I am glad that we have a player like him on the Flames. But in my estimation he is somewhere in the neighborhood of being 1-1.5 million dollars overpaid. FA may of dictated his market value at the time of his signing, but his play suggests that he is not worth that.
no player in the NHL is worth what they are making... but market value is the amount you would make on the open market... plain and simple... if Bouwmeester was a UFA this summer he's still get a Campbell type contract... is he a young elite shutdown defenseman who can play in all situations... he doesn't play a physical game and since the Flames couldnt score in a brothel he can go unnoticed some nights... but thats not a bad thing

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