HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Paging Dr. Gabby...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-16-2010, 11:42 PM
  #26
Florida Ranger
Bring back Torts!
 
Florida Ranger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Tampa, FLA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaqup View Post
Le sigh.

Last year we complained about no secondary scoring.

This year we have secondary scoring and we're complaining of no primary scoring.

At least we're still winning games. Last season if Gabby didn't score, no one did.
We have primary scoring (definitely hurts losing Cally) and secondary scoring, in my opinion.

Gaborik is not just the primary scorer right now. He's a part of it, but just not contributing when he's needed.

Like you said, we're still winning games. That's what it really comes down to.

Florida Ranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:00 AM
  #27
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,693
vCash: 500
It's funny how no one says "who cares? we're still winning games" whenever anyone complains about Frolov, Boogaard, or any other player that isn't playing well or performing up to expectations.

I know Gaborik is a fan favorite and people don't want to see him criticized, but I don't think these observations are unfounded. It's silly to label the posters in this thread as "complainers" when so many threads on this board involve some sort of complaint or gripe, whether it be "Drury is a horrible captain" or "the PP sucks."

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:08 AM
  #28
Puckface NYR*
R.I.P. Boogyman
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Long Island
Posts: 8,167
vCash: 500
I could care less as long as the team is winning. Gabby opens up the ice for everyone else on the team because the top opposing guys are ALWAYS on him.

This means more space for our supporting cast to score, which they have been doing.

Gabby will get his goals and seemingly so will everyone else. Lets calm down this is Gaborik not Gomez, he's an elite sniper whose mired in a little slump that we as Rangers fans didn't really experience last year.

Also, Frolov has been better for a handful of games and as much as i was bothered by his play for most of the season he may have found his role on this squad as a 3rd line supporter. This team is rounding out nicely.

Puckface NYR* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:16 AM
  #29
Kel Varnsen
Below: Nash's Heart
 
Kel Varnsen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,108
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
I posted this in a similar thread a month ago. i think this is still pretty clearly the case.




In Minny, they played a system designed to send their forwards back into the offensive zone with numbers, time and space. That's when Gaborik is at his best. If you don't give him time and space, it becomes very difficult for him to be a factor offensively.
By now I know you're pessimistic about the team by nature but come on this is a crock of ****. Here are all the reasons why:

1. He had multiple very successful scoring years in the West. Why didn't they ever figure this out?
2. The Wild played a very defensive system when Gaborik was there. The talks were how under a Torts system he might go crazy, because he's finally given a chance to go play offense.
3. When a guy ends up scoring 42 goals in a year, and is a vet who's done that before the idea that no east coach managed to get a hold of some game film from his days in the West is absurd. If the correction was as simple as "don't give him time and space" they would have figured that out a lot quicker than this.
4. Going on that strategy, is there an elite scorer in the league that you should give time and space to? It seems like that's what you try to limit with any prolific scorer, not really something that you need to look into.
5. For all these complaints about his scoring touch, he's still on pace for a 37 goal per 82 game pace! He's not getting completely shut down at all. He's just a sneaky scorer, and I don't have the numbers in front of me to check, but some have suggested a streaky scorer.

Kel Varnsen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:18 AM
  #30
wolfgaze
Interesting Cat
 
wolfgaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,094
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
I posted this in a similar thread a month ago. i think this is still pretty clearly the case.

In Minny, they played a system designed to send their forwards back into the offensive zone with numbers, time and space. That's when Gaborik is at his best. If you don't give him time and space, it becomes very difficult for him to be a factor offensively.
Isnt that a bit of a cliche sometimes? "Don't give the guy any space"... We always hear that from our announcers when our defensemen effectively play good games against top forwards, and heard it last night with Staal playing against Crosby... Elite players will find ways to create and make that space, and that's what makes them so effective... You can't take that ability away from them on a nightly (and consistent) basis...... It's certainly not as if all these teams can simply decide they won't give him any space when they play us and that's that, he's negated.... I'd find it pretty hard to believe that teams couldn't figure out how to utilize this strategy last season when he was putting up a ton of points.. It's not like Gaborik was the first speedy forward in the conference.... He'll simply need to be more creative and find ways to get himself into scoring positions on the ice in these games where he's not producing much offense...


Last edited by wolfgaze: 12-17-2010 at 12:23 AM.
wolfgaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:22 AM
  #31
Puckface NYR*
R.I.P. Boogyman
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Long Island
Posts: 8,167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Isnt that a bit of a cliche sometimes? "Don't give the guy any space"... We always hear that from our announcers when our defensemen effectively play good games against top forwards, and heard it last night with Staal playing against Crosby... Elite players will find ways to create and make that space, and that's what makes them so effective... It's certainly not as if all these teams can simply decide they won't give him any space when they play us and that's that, he's negated.... I'd find it pretty hard to believe that teams couldn't figure out how to utilize this strategy last season when he was putting up a ton of points.. It's not like Gaborik was the first speedy forward in the conference.... He'll simply need to be more creative and find ways to get himself into scoring positions on the ice in these games where he's not producing much offense...
I heard the gameplan to shutdown gretzky was to not give him any space either

Puckface NYR* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:24 AM
  #32
haohmaru
#bdwyblueshirts
 
haohmaru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Fleming Island, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 5,388
vCash: 500
We're 20-13-1 without Gaborik being Gaborik. He will be sooner or later. Be happy.

haohmaru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:27 AM
  #33
Balej20*
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 11,045
vCash: 500
He's invisible and he doesn't really fit the mold of this team but he takes a ton of pressure off everyone else. Once the Rangers finally add a second top flight forward, gaborik will look great.

Balej20* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:42 AM
  #34
Blatant
Formerly NYRFan1823
 
Blatant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: @blatantlacrosse
Posts: 2,264
vCash: 500
Guys, I think that everyone is used to last years team. Last year if Gaborik didn't score a big goal, we lose that game. We complain about gaborik. NOW, we have different players every night that come through in the clutch. It will help Gaborik in the long run. Do not be alarmed this is an amazing talent and will score much more this season. He was hurt early in the yeah and will be great the rest of the season. We gotta just calm down, and enjoy the wins WITHOUT our best scorer scoring.

Blatant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 12:56 AM
  #35
NYR Sting
Heart and Soul
 
NYR Sting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 9,506
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by genericnyrusername View Post
By now I know you're pessimistic about the team by nature but come on this is a crock of ****. Here are all the reasons why:

Quote:
1. He had multiple very successful scoring years in the West. Why didn't they ever figure this out?
2. The Wild played a very defensive system when Gaborik was there. The talks were how under a Torts system he might go crazy, because he's finally given a chance to go play offense.
"The talks?" From who, people who don't understand the sport's tactics? The Wild's very defensive system was DESIGNED to take advantage of Gaborik's strengths. Perfect for Gaborik. Quick turnovers in the neutral zone that give you quick odd man rushes. Everyone figured it out, that doesn't mean they were capable of stopping it. That's why Lemaire's system worked for Gaborik.

Quote:
3. When a guy ends up scoring 42 goals in a year, and is a vet who's done that before the idea that no east coach managed to get a hold of some game film from his days in the West is absurd. If the correction was as simple as "don't give him time and space" they would have figured that out a lot quicker than this.
Everyone figured it out on paper. It's another thing to execute it, and execution becomes easier with experience. It's one thing to watch it on film and to plan it out, it's another thing to have to play and coach against it. It's plain as day how much more attention he's getting defensively this season. Hell, it was already happening towards the end of last season.

Quote:
4. Going on that strategy, is there an elite scorer in the league that you should give time and space to? It seems like that's what you try to limit with any prolific scorer, not really something that you need to look into.
Of course, not. But I already made this point: some players don't need a lot of time and space, they're strong enough and talented enough to be able to create time and space for themselves. Gaborik isn't among them.

Quote:
5. For all these complaints about his scoring touch, he's still on pace for a 37 goal per 82 game pace! He's not getting completely shut down at all. He's just a sneaky scorer, and I don't have the numbers in front of me to check, but some have suggested a streaky scorer.
Sneaky scorer? LOL. What does that even mean? The guy has 9 goals in 20 games, and SIX of those 9 have come in two games (three against the league's worst team, the Islanders, and 3 against Edmonton, who at the time of that game, were 4-8-3 and full of young players with a month of NHL experience). Of the remaining three, one came in the game against a Washington team that didn't even show up to play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Isnt that a bit of a cliche sometimes? "Don't give the guy any space"... We always hear that from our announcers when our defensemen effectively play good games against top forwards, and heard it last night with Staal playing against Crosby... Elite players will find ways to create and make that space, and that's what makes them so effective...
Some elite players will.

Quote:
You can't take that ability away from them on a nightly (and consistent) basis...... It's certainly not as if all these teams can simply decide they won't give him any space when they play us and that's that, he's negated.... I'd find it pretty hard to believe that teams couldn't figure out how to utilize this strategy last season when he was putting up a ton of points.. It's not like Gaborik was the first speedy forward in the conference....
On a nightly basis? No. That's why he'll continue to take advantage of poor teams and weak teams, as he's done so far this season. No one can play perfectly at all times. But if you watch how teams treat him, they isolate him, they double up on him, they're playing the angles differently on him now. Last season, he was able to get behind the D with a lot more ease than he has this year, because teams are more weary of it now.

Quote:
He'll simply need to be more creative and find ways to get himself into scoring positions on the ice in these games where he's not producing much offense...
Or he'll continue to struggle to score goals against tough defense until the Rangers give him a real playmaker to play with. It's really not as simple as you make it out to be, and I'm going to guess that this trend will continue throughout the season. Some part of it is the struggles that Del Zotto is experiencing. He was the only player on the team capable of threading passes last season, and he hasn't really done that with any kind of consistency this season.

NYR Sting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 01:12 AM
  #36
Scooter17
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 483
vCash: 500
Gaborik racks up his points against the weak teams. He's a great talent but when he isn't scoring he doesn't do much to help the team win. He's not physical, he doesn't really block shots or kill penalties, and he's not a center so he isn't winning any faceoffs. He seems to float around a lot, which I even noticed last year when he was scoring like a mad man early in the season.

EDIT: but even though he seems to be invisible at times, he is still basically on the same pace scoring-wise as he was last year.

Scooter17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 02:54 AM
  #37
TriFF51
USA Hockey
 
TriFF51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 739
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chariot View Post
In the Pitts game Orpik really stood out as a great player. That guy was on Gabby every second... he did an outstanding job, even made a few saves for Johnson.

And every team gameplans gabby like that.... thank god the other lines are scoring
Do you happen to know where I can find a large version of your avatar?

TriFF51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 04:22 AM
  #38
SomebodySaveKreider
Registered User
 
SomebodySaveKreider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 2,518
vCash: 500
I think he really misses Prospal this year. Theres been a real struggle this year to find him linemates with our current crop.

Gaborik CAN create chances on his own, but I think a real playmaker would really help his production be more consistent.

I know there are issues with the cap, but I think him and Richards would be a highlight reel night after night.

SomebodySaveKreider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 06:42 AM
  #39
Crease
Registered User
 
Crease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,833
vCash: 500
Dr. Gabby has been a podiatrist this season.

Crease is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 07:14 AM
  #40
Miller Time NYR
Wrong^
 
Miller Time NYR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 4,793
vCash: 500
Gaborik has been getting SHUTDOWN I understand he's been playin good defenseman but he has the dominant skill to make things happen against a good defense and he hasn't been plain and simple.

Miller Time NYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 08:07 AM
  #41
CHGoalie27
GWAAARRRRRRR
 
CHGoalie27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SoFLA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,615
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
I didnt want to mention this amongst the Gabby love last year, but...

The guy gets his goals in streaks, first and foremost, like many other players but...

They are very rarely clutch goals. Of his 42 goals last year, only 4 were game winners, and of 9 this year, only one is a game winner.

He is a dangerous player, no doubt, but not the kind of guy you can count on, especially in the playoffs.
Exactly. He and Frolov for Nash and I'm happy.

CHGoalie27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 08:11 AM
  #42
JimmyStart*
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,569
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
[B]

"The talks?" From who, people who don't understand the sport's tactics? The Wild's very defensive system was DESIGNED to take advantage of Gaborik's strengths. Perfect for Gaborik. Quick turnovers in the neutral zone that give you quick odd man rushes. Everyone figured it out, that doesn't mean they were capable of stopping it. That's why Lemaire's system worked for Gaborik.



Everyone figured it out on paper. It's another thing to execute it, and execution becomes easier with experience. It's one thing to watch it on film and to plan it out, it's another thing to have to play and coach against it. It's plain as day how much more attention he's getting defensively this season. Hell, it was already happening towards the end of last season.



Of course, not. But I already made this point: some players don't need a lot of time and space, they're strong enough and talented enough to be able to create time and space for themselves. Gaborik isn't among them.



Sneaky scorer? LOL. What does that even mean? The guy has 9 goals in 20 games, and SIX of those 9 have come in two games (three against the league's worst team, the Islanders, and 3 against Edmonton, who at the time of that game, were 4-8-3 and full of young players with a month of NHL experience). Of the remaining three, one came in the game against a Washington team that didn't even show up to play.



Some elite players will.



On a nightly basis? No. That's why he'll continue to take advantage of poor teams and weak teams, as he's done so far this season. No one can play perfectly at all times. But if you watch how teams treat him, they isolate him, they double up on him, they're playing the angles differently on him now. Last season, he was able to get behind the D with a lot more ease than he has this year, because teams are more weary of it now.



Or he'll continue to struggle to score goals against tough defense until the Rangers give him a real playmaker to play with. It's really not as simple as you make it out to be, and I'm going to guess that this trend will continue throughout the season. Some part of it is the struggles that Del Zotto is experiencing. He was the only player on the team capable of threading passes last season, and he hasn't really done that with any kind of consistency this season.


But the West never figured it out?

Far as the rest I can't argue with that. Jagr was better than gabs no doubt. As far as your reasoning for why gabs isn't producing regularly I also disagree a little. i just think he got injured and he isn't playing the way he was last year as a result. I think he's holding himself back. It's no coincidence he was injured and came back as less than what he was both last year and this year and it's also no coincidence that when he plays good teams that can key in on him he does poorly. There's evidence for both opinions it could be a mix of both to be honest. Although with the doubling up and whatnot that's likely (and I know you've said this many people have 1000 times including myself) the lack of support on his line. Some support on his line will result in more chances for gabs in a variety of ways. Other lines are performing well but gabs still draws some shutdown lines. Until he gets help on his line specifically everyone on the ice can key on him.

Still I honestly think he's holding himself back more than anything.

JimmyStart* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 08:29 AM
  #43
Gatorade*
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,579
vCash: 500
I think he has scored 6 of his 9 in two games. Good thing he scored against the worst team in the league or his stats would not be so good.

Outside of the numbers he hasn't been all that great as far as I am concerned. Certainly not this teams best player. He has quietly made some plays and has assists on a few goals so I will give him that. Would rather be talking about him making game breaking plays however.

Gatorade* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 08:41 AM
  #44
NYRangers77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by gravey9 View Post
Nobody seems to notice his shot is totally off since he got back from the shoulder injury. It doesn't have the same accuracy or velocity. Thus, he's not as much of a threat from the perimeter. As a result, opponents are keeping him to the outside ice and he's struggling. Bottom line - he might not be hurting, but the strength he lost because of the injury is STILL affecting him. A lot.
Reminds me of Jagr

NYRangers77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:04 AM
  #45
MugatuNYR
so hot right now
 
MugatuNYR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 3,898
vCash: 500
NYR PPG:

1) Gaborik .905
2) Dubinsky .794
3) Callahan .719

Not bad for a guy that's coming back from a separated shoulder. I separated my shoulder and it took about a year for it to feel 100% again. The shoulder is a very sensitive joint. A lot of moving parts.

MugatuNYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:10 AM
  #46
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,895
vCash: 500
Awards:
I was looking to Gaborik to really carry the team last night. He didn't.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:10 AM
  #47
Miller Time NYR
Wrong^
 
Miller Time NYR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 4,793
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple McIlwraath View Post
NYR PPG:

1) Gaborik .905
2) Dubinsky .794
3) Callahan .719

Not bad for a guy that's coming back from a separated shoulder. I separated my shoulder and it took about a year for it to feel 100% again. The shoulder is a very sensitive joint. A lot of moving parts.
keep in mind gabbys got 19 pts in only 21 games whereas dubi has 23 in 32 games. Not saying gabbys would have been much lower but it would probably be marginally lower had he played the whole year, the way hes playing now. either those numbers are good to see from dubi and cali who were .637 and .480 respectivly.

Miller Time NYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:11 AM
  #48
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,895
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerdanger20 View Post
keep in mind gabbys got 19 pts in only 21 games whereas dubi has 23 in 32 games. Not saying gabbys would have been much lower but it would probably be marginally lower had he played the whole year, the way hes playing now. either those numbers are good to see from dubi and cali who were .637 and .480 respectivly.
Gaborik's points have also come in few games — in that he's had hattrick against the Islanders.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:14 AM
  #49
kennglin13
Registered User
 
kennglin13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 240
vCash: 500
He forces the opponent for focus on him, opening up the ice for other players, and though he is not scoring alot of goals he is setting up alot of plays.

The fact that other guys are scoring is HUGE and a great feeling. With players stepping up it is nice to see, not to mention we are doing this without a #1 center and have a rookie center learning the game. Just imagine if Gaborik molds Stepan into the kinda guy Gabby needs

kennglin13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-17-2010, 09:17 AM
  #50
ak10r
HFBoards Sponsor
 
ak10r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fairbanks Alaska
Posts: 849
vCash: 500
He’s not playing up to his potential and/or expectation…. Any other player on the team would be moved off of the first line. He is an elite player so he stays, I can see that. But what does the coach need to do to get some production?

DZ gets benched for a game… DZ was blowing some plays not just being mediocre.

He is still clearly above the rest of the team with his puck handling, is he not shooting enough? Too much passing? He seems to score more when we are already leading in the game. He should be our clutch scorer.

Maybe dropping him to the third or forth line would shake things up. Let’s see EC and the Fro on the third/fourth line…. I guess that was the first line a while back.

I don’t see how the old Gabby will be back when the tan man returns….

Tort’s needs to do something different… Doing nothing does not seem to be working.

ak10r is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:47 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.