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Old
12-18-2010, 11:23 PM
  #151
FroFan
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post



Would you consider this trade if Washington offered it? I don't think Dean would do it.
Nope, and the one guy for the Kings that I'd really have a problem including is Scuderi. I think he was a great signing, and will be a critical factor in any playoff success the Kings may have in the next few years.

Even without him, I think 2 blue chip prospects and a first are too much for an impending UFA.

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12-18-2010, 11:25 PM
  #152
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Originally Posted by FroFan View Post
Nope, and the one guy for the Lings that I'd really have a problem including is Scuderi. I think he was great signing, and will be a critical factor in any playoff success the Kings may have in the next few years.

Even without him, I think 2 blue chip prospects and a first are too much for an impending UFA.
I agree, the Kings are giving too much up for an UFA, but I think it was based on Semin signing with LA long term. Washington needs help with their bottom 6 and defense, it would be a great trade for them.

Maybe the Kings can make the conference finals this year and get a high-end UFAs to sign here without having to overpay them.

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Old
12-19-2010, 12:59 AM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Slippery Moses View Post
Here's MY personal pipedream: Daniel Alfredsson. He's still got it and has two more years on a very affordable 4.875 million cap hit. He would be an absolute godsend to this team both in leadership and skill.

Chances are Ottawa stubbornly holds onto him as they relentlessly pursue that #9 spot in the East, but if he is made available at some point we need to be first in line with a lootbag the size of Ken Hitchcock.
My pipedream is Datsyuk


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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post


Would you consider this trade if Washington offered it? I don't think Dean would do it.
I dont think so.

Are we really a team that needs to win now?

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Old
12-19-2010, 01:05 AM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Xtreme1995 View Post
I dont think so.

Are we really a team that needs to win now?
Only if Doughty and Johnson refuse to sign a new contract and join the KHL.

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Old
12-19-2010, 03:14 PM
  #155
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NO to the proposed Semin deal, to much to give up.

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Old
12-19-2010, 04:34 PM
  #156
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My pipedream would be that we give Moller and Loktionov a few more call ups and that one of them stick as our guy and eliminate our need to make a deal. Still, if we are to replace from the outside and I had a choice I would look at a few of the younger guyss.

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Old
12-19-2010, 05:26 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by wabwat View Post
so you agree with Bilikian's post so much so as to feel compelled to bold a specific point to which you go on to later contradict by indicating that Jarret Stoll can play in a shut down role as well as Handzus.

your stuff gets more and more hallucinogenic at every turn.
Well you have to read it correctly............ it's bold because nobody can replace Handzus this year.
My plan for next year isn't to put Stoll into the 3rd line to have a shutdown line.
I want to go back to 3 scoring lines and the 4th line to do what the 3rd is doing right now. I want to use Simmonds and Parse offense skill to create a 3rd scoring line.
In a perfect world Stoll would be the 4th line shutdown center and role player to win important faceoffs.Richrdson would be the 3rd line center for Simmonds and Parse.
Clifford, Stoll and Lewis would be a hell of a shut down line.
Of course i would prefer Lewis as 4th line center but Stoll won't be traded doesn't matter how much i want it.

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12-19-2010, 05:45 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Knight of the Realm View Post
NO to the proposed Semin deal, to much to give up.
I tend to agree. Semin doesn't seem like the kind of guy that would be loyal to the team that traded for him. I don't like the chances of him resigning.

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Old
12-19-2010, 05:49 PM
  #159
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Besides, we all know that DL will just sign Semin this coming summer anyways, why give up anything for him now?


Yummy purple flavored kool aide.

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Old
12-20-2010, 03:08 AM
  #160
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Jason Spezza needs to be looked at with the Senators falling out of contention. Dump Handzus, and put Stoll on the third line. Our face off percentage goes up and add more speed to the lineup. I'm aware of Spezza's contractual numbers...it would be tricky but could be done.

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Old
12-20-2010, 05:23 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by BerniernextRoy View Post
Jason Spezza needs to be looked at with the Senators falling out of contention. Dump Handzus, and put Stoll on the third line. Our face off percentage goes up and add more speed to the lineup. I'm aware of Spezza's contractual numbers...it would be tricky but could be done.
What would be a fair offer for Spezza?

I am assuming something like,

Simmonds, Moller, a D prospect (Muzzin, Voynov, Hickey, Teubert, etc), and LA 1st might get it done?

Let's assume it does,

Spezza has a 7 million cap hit until 2015-2016,

In that time, we have to re-sign,

Doughty, Johnson, Bernier, Quick again, Brown, Williams, Stoll, Handzus, Sturm, Richardson, Clifford, Lewis, Scuderi, Greene, Martinez, Schenn, etc,

You get the picture lol, obviously not all will come back etc, but let's just look at 2011-2012.

23.7 million in cap space

Assuming we re-sign the following.

Doughty (7m), Johnson (4m), Williams (3M), Ponikarovsky (2.5M), Sturm (3M) , Lewis (1m), Martinez (1m), Harrold (1m),

So add another 22.5M

You would have to somehow get rid of Smyth, to fit Spezza in, or you let Williams, Sturm, and Harold go, then our lineup is,

Sturm - Kopitar - Brown
Smyth - Spezza - Ponikarovsky
Handzus - Stoll - Clifford
Richardson - Lewis - Parse

Doughty - Scuderi
Mitchell - Johnson
Greene - Martinez

Quick, Bernier.

Not sure how adding Spezza helps really....

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Old
12-20-2010, 05:25 AM
  #162
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Poni isn't coming back, and doubt Sturm does. That said, Spezza makes to much for a second line center....not to mention the drop in numbers.

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12-20-2010, 06:07 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
Poni isn't coming back, and doubt Sturm does. That said, Spezza makes to much for a second line center....not to mention the drop in numbers.
I can see Sturm signing for cheaper to stay with a situation, DL would definitely look to bring him back for one more year if he feels that Lotkiniov needs more time in Manchester.

Lotkinov did not look good when he was up here, so yea, he might bring back Sturm to cover his bases.

Also, Ponikarovsky 3rd liner, with Simmonds "gone" in any trade etc, you still need to field 4 lines, who in Manchester would you move up to fill Ponikarovsky's role.

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Old
12-20-2010, 04:47 PM
  #164
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Signing Brad Richards and letting Zeus walk, or resigning him and dealing Stoll, is becoming an appealing course of action to me.

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Old
12-20-2010, 04:57 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
What would be a fair offer for Spezza?

I am assuming something like,

Simmonds, Moller, a D prospect (Muzzin, Voynov, Hickey, Teubert, etc), and LA 1st might get it done?

Let's assume it does,

Spezza has a 7 million cap hit until 2015-2016,

In that time, we have to re-sign,

Doughty, Johnson, Bernier, Quick again, Brown, Williams, Stoll, Handzus, Sturm, Richardson, Clifford, Lewis, Scuderi, Greene, Martinez, Schenn, etc,

You get the picture lol, obviously not all will come back etc, but let's just look at 2011-2012.

23.7 million in cap space

Assuming we re-sign the following.

Doughty (7m), Johnson (4m), Williams (3M), Ponikarovsky (2.5M), Sturm (3M) , Lewis (1m), Martinez (1m), Harrold (1m),

So add another 22.5M

You would have to somehow get rid of Smyth, to fit Spezza in, or you let Williams, Sturm, and Harold go, then our lineup is,

Sturm - Kopitar - Brown
Smyth - Spezza - Ponikarovsky
Handzus - Stoll - Clifford
Richardson - Lewis - Parse

Doughty - Scuderi
Mitchell - Johnson
Greene - Martinez

Quick, Bernier.

Not sure how adding Spezza helps really....
Well I didn't say it was an easy task to work on a deal like that. The one thing the Kings have in their favor is that contract, it would mean less bidders and lots of teams would shy away from it.

Senators would get variety of pick, prospect, and Smyth or Handzus. Those two are overpaid and far as the future is concerned...The Kings were ready to fork over some significant cash to Kovalchuk. I am sure Solomon and Dean ran the numbers and felt confident they can take on a contract of that size and keep the important assets they want to resign.

I don't think every prospect is going to stay with the Kings and we're getting to that point where the Kings may start to add some pieces for prospects and picks.

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Old
12-20-2010, 05:12 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Slippery Moses View Post
Signing Brad Richards and letting Zeus walk, or resigning him and dealing Stoll, is becoming an appealing course of action to me.
just becoming?

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Old
12-20-2010, 05:20 PM
  #167
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Pass on Spezza.

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Old
12-20-2010, 06:10 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Kurrilino View Post
I agree with that.
My concern is that he won't be able to do that next year.
And i stay away from extending contract because of what a player has done in the past.
This year it looks that he lost a step. If that continues with Parse back on his side i would stay away from resigning it. At this point he can't show something that Lewis or Stoll can't.
IMO Stoll would be the perfect 3rd line center. He wins the faceoff in critical moments and can play in a shut down role as good as Handzus can.
As long as we keep Stoll away from the PP i prefer him over HAndzus from next season on
Stoll is no Handzus, my friend.

Handzus is our best penalty killer. Better than Stoll and Lewis. He blocks shots, he wins faceoffs, he scores goals (not so much this season, I know), he is clutch in the shootout, and he is respected by every player on the team. Hell, even if Handzus isn't scoring, he's being effective every single night. If Stoll isn't scoring, just what the hell is he doing? Yes, he wins faceoffs, but the guy just doesn't make plays in the offensive zone. Also, when you're playing against the oppositions best line every night, it helps to be 6'4 and 218 lbs.

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Old
12-20-2010, 08:03 PM
  #169
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You won't get Spezza out of Ottawa. He and Karlsson are all they really have left at this point. The loss of either of those players would probably hurt ticket sales too much for too long.

That said, you are more than welcome to Michalek or Kovalev.

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Old
12-20-2010, 08:06 PM
  #170
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Drewiske for Carkner. I'd rather the Kings #6 defenseman play physical.

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Old
12-20-2010, 10:21 PM
  #171
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Sturm needs to go a long way to proving that he is ready and capable of being a top 6 center in my opinion before I even consider him as a viable option as an offseason free agent signing. I liked his play prior to his injuries but once he got to Boston and really had to buckle down his game into being a two way player he got injured and when he was healthy he was clearly not as dynamic. He can be solid enough for a suitable second line LW when healthy and firing on all cylinders but his game is definitely falling off. I hope he proves me wrong and easily could but I will wait and see.

If Poni signs for half his current salary then he could be a good player to bring back since we will be proving that he is of little use as an offencive threat and that whatever he contributes in as far as point production will be icing. Maybe a bonus salary based on point production.

Zues will obviously be looking for less money and that can make him someone to retain but if not we are going to have to make the call on where we are going sooner or later, why not give Stoll the 3rd line and call it done?

With Schenn, Lewis Richardson and Loktionov all ready or close to being ready and all being cheap we have other options. I would rather spend our money on having a truly exception top 6 then having too many better than average middle of the road centers.

We have the assets in our prospect depth and can clear the cap space while possibly strengthening our team by letting a couple of vets move on and if we did so we would likely be bringing in one or two players who have already established themselves so it wouldn't be like we where throwing a bunch of kids out there and saying "hope it works".

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12-20-2010, 11:57 PM
  #172
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Originally Posted by Blikian29 View Post
Stoll is no Handzus, my friend.

Handzus is our best penalty killer. Better than Stoll and Lewis. He blocks shots, he wins faceoffs, he scores goals (not so much this season, I know), he is clutch in the shootout, and he is respected by every player on the team. Hell, even if Handzus isn't scoring, he's being effective every single night. If Stoll isn't scoring, just what the hell is he doing? Yes, he wins faceoffs, but the guy just doesn't make plays in the offensive zone. Also, when you're playing against the oppositions best line every night, it helps to be 6'4 and 218 lbs.
Hes blocking shots, winning faceoffs and playing physical as well. Stolls 4th on the team in scoring but somehow hes making plays in the offensive zone. The only thing Handzus has on Stoll is size.

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Old
12-21-2010, 12:57 AM
  #173
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Zues will obviously be looking for less money and that can make him someone to retain but if not we are going to have to make the call on where we are going sooner or later, why not give Stoll the 3rd line and call it done?

With Schenn, Lewis Richardson and Loktionov all ready or close to being ready and all being cheap we have other options. I would rather spend our money on having a truly exception top 6 then having too many better than average middle of the road centers.

We have the assets in our prospect depth and can clear the cap space while possibly strengthening our team by letting a couple of vets move on and if we did so we would likely be bringing in one or two players who have already established themselves so it wouldn't be like we where throwing a bunch of kids out there and saying "hope it works".
Exactly. We got too many middle of the road hockey players in the top six. We need more speed to add to the top six.

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12-21-2010, 01:18 AM
  #174
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Hes blocking shots, winning faceoffs and playing physical as well. Stolls 4th on the team in scoring but somehow hes making plays in the offensive zone. The only thing Handzus has on Stoll is size.
I think we will have to agree to disagree with this statement. Stolls D awareness is not on the same level as Zues. There is a reason why Zues is always on the ice for critical moments (5-3 PKs etc) Size also does mean alot when dealing with the big centers in the league now. His patience and cool demeanor is part of what keeps the kings in every game. I dont think its a reach that Zues has been a big part in Simmonds and Cliffords development.

Im not jumping in the argument that Stoll isnt a good 2nd line center, because i think he is. But, on a championship contender i feel that we do need a upgrade. Both Stoll and Zues are good at what they do, but neither have great playmaking skills, which is part of the issue. Is Stoll/Zues at the same level of a Kesler, Briere, Giroux, Staal, Malkin, Sharp, (or the glut of Detroit centermen)? These teams i beleive are the ones that are the real contenders this season, and all of them have great 2nd line centers (even going 3 deep).

This is why im a big advocate in trying for Richards because he can serve multiple purposes. He can/did play Wing before. He can teach Schenn and Kopitar at the same time. Dean loves his Bridge pieces, and Richards would be a perfect fit for a 3 year stint. (probably not realistic that he would go for a 3 year contract since it will be his last decent sized contract) But i can dream...

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12-21-2010, 01:29 AM
  #175
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I think we will have to agree to disagree with this statement. Stolls D awareness is not on the same level as Zues. There is a reason why Zues is always on the ice for critical moments (5-3 PKs etc) Size also does mean alot when dealing with the big centers in the league now. His patience and cool demeanor is part of what keeps the kings in every game. I dont think its a reach that Zues has been a big part in Simmonds and Cliffords development.

Im not jumping in the argument that Stoll isnt a good 2nd line center, because i think he is. But, on a championship contender i feel that we do need a upgrade. Both Stoll and Zues are good at what they do, but neither have great playmaking skills, which is part of the issue. Is Stoll/Zues at the same level of a Kesler, Briere, Giroux, Staal, Malkin, Sharp, (or the glut of Detroit centermen)? These teams i beleive are the ones that are the real contenders this season, and all of them have great 2nd line centers (even going 3 deep).

This is why im a big advocate in trying for Richards because he can serve multiple purposes. He can/did play Wing before. He can teach Schenn and Kopitar at the same time. Dean loves his Bridge pieces, and Richards would be a perfect fit for a 3 year stint. (probably not realistic that he would go for a 3 year contract since it will be his last decent sized contract) But i can dream...
You talking about Brad Richards? I don't think he is leaving Dallas and he isn't coming cheap.

If it is Mike Richards, he has a long term contract with the Flyers. I don't see him leaving Philly but I agree with your point about looking at other elite teams and seeing their Centres are a powerful 1-2 punch, in some cases 1-2-3 deep with legit centres and they are cup contenders. I think Dean recognizes the need for a second line centre. He's talked about it a lot, and I don't see Schenn stepping into that second line role for a couple years and see him being more of a Jordan Staal type in the meantime.

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