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what about ironman?

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01-07-2011, 10:10 AM
  #1
the edler
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what about ironman?

so i thought about jay bouwmeester, he's the nhl ironman as for now, and he doesn't play a very physical game, henrik sedin is behind him as the second ironman in the nhl as for now, and he too doesn't play a very physical game

steve larmer played 884 consecutive games in the league, and he wasn't known as a very physical player, with 79 pims as the most in a season

now i know it's probably good to have your best players play every game, but is ironman overrated as a concept? is it something only for players who are shy of contact? i mean it's pretty easy to never get hurt if you're never even into those kind of situations where you potentially can get hurt

a lot of anti ironman players were great players who made difference, like forsberg, lindros, bure

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01-07-2011, 12:02 PM
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LeBlondeDemon10
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You make it sound like ironmen are kept in the lineup for their streak even if they are a liability. I think its the opposite in most cases. Jarvis was a tenacious checker most nights. I can't speak for Bowman or the coaches after him, but I would think that they wanted Jarvis in the lineup every night. Ironman streaks just sort of happen too. At least until they start to approach a record. They require some luck, but mostly a certain level of play on the part of the player. Or they would be in the press box. I don't think any player sets a goal to go out and beat Unger's record or Jarvis' record. There are too many variables out of their control.

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01-07-2011, 12:15 PM
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seventieslord
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There is some merit to what you're saying. But to keep an ironman streak going you have to play through some nagging pains. That takes toughness, just of a different kind.

If you credit ironman streaks partially to uninvolved play, then Pat Boutette's streak should really impress you. He didn't miss a game for 7+ seasons and was balls to the wall every game.

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01-07-2011, 01:27 PM
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the edler
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it's not that i think it's negative to have your best player, or players, play every game, but perhaps it says something about the player

i know sundin for example when he played for quebec and toronto played every game of the season most of the time, with no really ups and downs as from ppg, and perhaps that was the problem, no downs but also no ups

me thinks that perhaps if he tried to forsberg his game a little he would definitely have missed more games, but he would also have played a more deadly game with an extra dimension to it

but it wasn't his style so perhaps it's moot

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01-07-2011, 01:54 PM
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When Trevor Linden was the ironman a friend of mine wasn't impressed as he always thought a guy of his size ought to hit more often and harder than he does.

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01-07-2011, 02:17 PM
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Hockey, even for soft players, is still a ridiculous physical sport. Sure, they might no lay out center ice hits, but even the hacking & whacking that occurs during board play takes its toll.

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01-07-2011, 02:20 PM
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seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
When Trevor Linden was the ironman a friend of mine wasn't impressed as he always thought a guy of his size ought to hit more often and harder than he does.
I dunno, Linden played a robust enough game to "buck the trend" so to speak.

Other ironmen from around the same time were Mark Recchi (with his size and pinball mentality, that is amazing) and Rod Brind'Amour (with all the big, strong centers he took hundreds of faceoffs against and the shots he was blocking you'd think he'd get injured more than he did)

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01-07-2011, 02:50 PM
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I believe Glenn Hall has some ridiculous amount of consecutive starts. I believe he reached 502 games. None of the players are soft.

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01-07-2011, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrx View Post
I believe Glenn Hall has some ridiculous amount of consecutive starts. I believe he reached 502 games. None of the players are soft.
I don't think anyone who makes it to the NHL is "soft", but once you're there, your softness is judged relative to that standard, and some players do emerge as being soft.

I would not call J-Bo, Henrik, or Linden soft.

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01-07-2011, 06:35 PM
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During Unger's streak he scored 30+ goals in nine seasons, while playing on mostly bad teams that had losing seasons 7 times during the run.

The physical aspect has some injury avoidance fortune tied into it, but the mental toughness to not only play but excel when losing that much is impressive.

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01-08-2011, 10:31 AM
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Big Phil
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I know that I wouldn't put a guy like Larmer in the lineup just so his streak can go on. Larmer made the team because he was a very good player and while not overly physical I would certainly call him tough.

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01-09-2011, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrx View Post
I believe Glenn Hall has some ridiculous amount of consecutive starts. I believe he reached 502 games. None of the players are soft.
Especially Hall. I mean come on, 502 straight games in goal without a mask. Can't get much tougher than that.

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01-09-2011, 10:56 AM
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Tim Horton went over six straight seasons without missing a game, and he was as physical as they come.

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01-09-2011, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Shibby1984 View Post
Especially Hall. I mean come on, 502 straight games in goal without a mask. Can't get much tougher than that.
502 without a cup but thats probably it.

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01-09-2011, 08:45 PM
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I disagree with larmer not being a physical player--he was a smart player who stayed away from taking bad PMS

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01-09-2011, 09:11 PM
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Ironman of hockey is Brodeur

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01-10-2011, 08:10 AM
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Shibby1984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrx View Post
502 without a cup but thats probably it.
Not quite. He did win a cup in 1961, as well as the Calder Trophy in 1956. Both of which were during his streak.

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01-10-2011, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Shibby1984 View Post
Not quite. He did win a cup in 1961, as well as the Calder Trophy in 1956. Both of which were during his streak.
I meant cup as in a jockstrap.

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01-10-2011, 09:47 AM
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I meant cup as in a jockstrap.
Sorry, my mistake.

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01-10-2011, 10:09 AM
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Gordie Howe might not have played in the most consecutive games, but he's the NHL's all time Iron man for obvious reasons as far as I'm concerned.

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01-10-2011, 12:40 PM
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the edler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustOneOfTheGuys View Post
When Trevor Linden was the ironman a friend of mine wasn't impressed as he always thought a guy of his size ought to hit more often and harder than he does.
i don't know how linden was with the islanders, except that he probably wasn't great, but in his first years with vancouver he was a very physical player who would hit and play the boards rough

he was definitely a more physical player than steve larmer

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01-10-2011, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
I know that I wouldn't put a guy like Larmer in the lineup just so his streak can go on. Larmer made the team because he was a very good player and while not overly physical I would certainly call him tough.
Yeah, Larmer was no creampuff at all - he was tough.

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01-10-2011, 03:17 PM
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Yeah, Larmer was no creampuff at all - he was tough.
How many pieces of gum did Larmer inadvertently swallow on the ice throught his career?

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