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The 2011 ATD-B Beer League Draft

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Old
01-16-2011, 01:05 AM
  #26
seventieslord
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The merits of Rick Lanz and Dave Lowry were also mentioned in the "undrafteds" thread; they should be included in that list.

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01-16-2011, 02:21 AM
  #27
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alright, all ready to go... shortlist is back up and running, I have more than a team's worth of guys that I kicked around a bit before but never selected. Biggest list is the 17 defenseman, of which I will only end up with 7. With judgments varying so greatly, will the other four teams take the other 10 along the way? I'm thinking no, but we'll see.

looking forward to seeing who all of you had in mind.

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01-16-2011, 02:29 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
The merits of Rick Lanz and Dave Lowry were also mentioned in the "undrafteds" thread; they should be included in that list.
Great. Added. I was thinking of asking you if there are any on the undrafteds thread I missed.

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01-16-2011, 06:01 AM
  #29
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Jonathan Cheechoo



* Rocket Richard Trophy 56 goal season
* four straight 20+ goal seasons (his only years of 16+ minutes per game)
* scored 4,3,4,4 goals in those four season's playoffs
* 35 points in 59 NHL playoff games

Quote:
ASSETS: Owns an excellent shot. Works very hard when on the ice. Has good scoring instincts and knows his way around the offensive zone.

FLAWS: His skating ability prevents him from getting into scoring areas with regularity. Tends to struggle in defensive situations, which cuts into his overall value.

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01-16-2011, 06:10 AM
  #30
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Paul Stastny



* 302 points over 317 NHL games
* 6th in NHL with 59 assists in 09-10 and two other 45+ assist seasons
* a goal and two assists on Silver medal Team USA in 2010 Olympics
* a top line passer in the NHL and in the Olympics
* 8 points over 7 games in the 2007 World Championships

Quote:
ASSETS: Like his father Peter, he owns tremendous playmaking acumen and two-way skills. Plays bigger than his 6-0 frame and displays a mature attitude.

FLAWS: Has the burden of constant comparisons with his father, which can be difficult to deal with. Is not a natural goal-scorer and lacks ideal size for an NHL center.

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01-16-2011, 08:51 AM
  #31
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Wembley selects a 500-goal scoring Jew who even Hitler had to let the team captain play for Germany at the 1936 Olympic Games because of his reputation as one of the best and his role in the nation's winning a medal (Bronze) at the '32 Olympics.

Rudi Ball, scoring right winger



Quote:
A real artist at skating and stick handling.. combined with a 'deadly shot'...
http://www.azhockey.com/Ba.htm

- was voted as the best European ice hockey player in a French Sports Magazine in 1930
- was considered one of the most popular and dreaded European ice hockey players prior to the Second World War.

Quote:
... While reasonably short, Ball was considered extremely fast on the ice and was admired as having much skill and ability.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudi_Ball

Quote:
In 1936, having Jewish heritage, Ball (the 25-year-old captain) was initially overlooked for selection in the German ice hockey team. ... Ball also believed a deal could be struck to save his family in Germany if he returned to play in the games. The German selectors also realized that without Ball.. the team would not stand a chance of winning. Another factor was that the Nazi party could not overlook the fact that Ball was without doubt one of the leading athletes in his sport. With much controversy Ball was included in the German team to play at the 1936 Olympic games. The deal for Ball's family to leave Germany was also agreed. After Ball was injured, the Germans took 5th place in the Olympic tournament. Ball played four matches and scored two goals.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudi_Ball

Olympic Bronze (1932)
World Championship Silver (1930)
European Championship Gold (1930)
World Championship Bronze (1932)
European Championship Bronze (1936 & 1938)
8 German Championships (1928 - 1944)
Spengler Cup (1928-29, 1934-35 & 1935-36)
IIHF Ice Hockey Hall of Fame (2004)

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01-16-2011, 09:05 AM
  #32
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Wembley selects the American player who was the NHL's first ever Calder trophy winner (1933), was 9th in assists the following season and scored the Stanley Cup winning goal (1938), the first ever player signed to contract by Conn Smythe after being the IHL top scorer, all-star and league champion in 1932.

Carl Voss, center



NHL best years:
Tied team lead in assists on the Red Wings in 1933 (moved up to centre top line in the playoffs, between Herbie Lewis and Larry Aurie)
Tied team 2nd in assists on the Senators in 1934
Top point getter on NHL's St. Louis Eagles in 1935
Scored 3 goals, 5 points in playoffs in 1938 Blawkhawks cup win (the cup winning goal was his last ever, due to career-ending knee injury)

Quote:
... Born in Chelsea, Massachusetts, Voss moved to Canada as a teenager. Equally gifted on the ice and the gridiron, he helped the Kingston Frontenacs reach the Memorial Cup final in 1926 and played halfback at Queen's University in Kingston. In 1927, he turned professional by becoming the first player signed by Conn Smythe, the owner of the newly-christened Toronto Maple Leafs.

Although he saw limited action with the blue and white, Voss was a leading performer on the club's affiliated minor pro squads during the next five years. He suited up for the Toronto Falcons and London Panthers of the CanPro League and the Buffalo Bisons of the International Hockey League. When Voss led the Bisons to the league championship in 1932 he was the top scorer in the IHL and a first-team all-star.

Voss eventually earned a full time NHL roster spot with the New York Rangers in 1932-33. Early in the season he was sold to Detroit where he excelled and was the inaugural recipient of the Calder trophy as rookie-of-the-year. Before retiring he played with five more teams and finished with 104 points in 261 career games. Voss went out on a high note in 1938 when he was credited with the Stanley Cup clinching goal when Chicago won its second Stanley Cup. A serious knee injury in that year lingered and was too much to overcome when Voss tried to play at training camp in the fall of 1938.
http://www.legendsofhockey.net:8080/...t=ByName#photo
http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.ph...ecrates_aurie/

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01-16-2011, 10:50 AM
  #33
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The China Sharks select C Ab Demarco Sr.



2x Top 10 Goals (9, 9)
2x Top 10 Assists (4, 7)
2x Top 10 Points (5, 7)
165 points in 209 career NHL games
606 points in 471 career AHL games
1x AHL 1st-Team All Star
1x AHL 2nd-Team All Star
1x AHL MVP
1x AHL Leading Scorer

Quote:
Albert George "Ab" DeMarco played four of his seven NHL seasons as a member of the New York Rangers. He began his route to the NHL through Baltimore, where in 1937-38, he played in 56 games with the Baltimore Orioles of the Eastern Hockey League, scoring 25 goals and 27 assists for 52 points.

After playing most of the 1938-39 season with the Providence Reds of the IAHL, DeMarco received the call-up to the Chicago Blackhawks where he played two games.

In 1939-40, DeMarco played in 18 games with the Blackhawks, picking up five assists. He had a four-game stint with the Toronto Maple Leafs in 1942-43. Later that year he played in three games with the Boston Bruins. He played in three more games with the Bruins the following year before moving on to the New York Rangers where he played out the balance of his NHL career. His best year was 1944-45 when he had 24 goals and 30 assists for 54 points in 50 games.

DeMarco went on to play professional hockey until 1952 in the American Hockey, and won a scoring title with Buffalo (37g 76a 113pts.) in the 1950-51 season, scoring 37 goals and 76 assists for 113 points.
-loh.net

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01-16-2011, 10:54 AM
  #34
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D Barry Long



2x 2nd-Team All WHA
49th all-time Assists in WHA
78th all-time Points in WHA
79 points in 280 career NHL games
222 points in 387 career WHA games

Quote:
Defenceman Barry Long was a competent playmaker who could fill a physical role in his own zone. His five year NHL tenure was split by a half decade spent in the WHA where he played a more offensive role.

Long played junior with the Moose Jaw Canucks of the WCJHL. He spent his first four years as a pro toiling in the CHL and WHL before playing two years on the L.A. Kings' defence beginning in 1972-73. In 1974, he opted to sign with the WHA's Edmonton Oilers and was picked as an alternate for that year's Summit Series versus the USSR.

During his first year in the league, Long scored 20 goals and provided grit in his own end. His solid year earned him a place on the WHA's second all-star team. He played another year in Edmonton before he was sent to the Winnipeg Jets for future considerations during the first week of the 1976-7 schedule. Long was excellent at both ends for the Jets and was named to the league's second all-star team in 1978.

In June 1979, the veteran blueliner was reclaimed by the Detroit Red Wings prior to the Expansion Draft. He played all 80 games for the Wings in 1979-80 then was sent to the Jets for cash the next fall. Long scored 23 points and was a team leader on Winnipeg then joined Canada at the 1981 World Championships. Injuries forced the steady veteran to retire after playing only five games in 1981-82.
-loh.net

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Old
01-16-2011, 01:21 PM
  #35
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G Fred Chittick

Why:
- 1896 Retro Vezina (2.0 GAA, next best 2.9)
- 1897 Retro Vezina (2.3 GAA, next best 3.3)
- Captain of the Ottawa Senators, 1896-1997

Why not:
- Only played 7 seasons, only 2 great ones
- Questions about the quality of 1890s goaltending
- 1899, Chittick quit the Ottawas over a series of events. On January 21, Chittick was refereeing a game between Quebec and Montreal when the Montreal team quit the game, incensed at the rough play of Quebec and the fact that Chittick was allowing the rough play. After the game, allegations were made by the Montreal players that Chittick was drunk. Chittick was mad enough to threaten the Montreal players with defamation lawsuits. A month later, on February 11 in Montreal, Chittick gave up 16 goals, the worst showing by a senior goaltender to that date. Chittick was replaced for the next game and he quit in anger. He later spoke to the press about the club paying its players to pay, causing a scandal. He would not be the club's regular goaltender again, although he did play a game for the club as a replacement in 1900.
- The game of February 12, 1898 between Ottawa and the Victorias was notable because Fred Chittick, the regular goal-keeper of Ottawa staged a one-man strike because he had not received his share of complimentary tickets.

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01-16-2011, 01:22 PM
  #36
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LW/D Gustav Jaenecke

Why:
- International Hockey Legends:
Quote:
While modern fans will know the name of Erich Kuhnhackl, many hockey historians will tell you Gustav Jaenecke is the greatest German hockey player of all time. Jaenecke was a pretty good skater in his own right. He enjoyed a lengthy career from 1924 through 1951. In that time he played for Berliner SC (Germany) and SC Riessersee. He established himself as a good all-round player who played both as a forward and, in later years, as a defenseman.

Jaenecke, along with sidekick Rudi Ball, carried the German National team from 1927 through 1939. He participated in three Olympic Games, winning a bronze medal in 1932, and at eight World championships, winning silver in 1930 and bronze in 1932 and 1934. He also won gold at the European Championships in 1930 and 1934, and bronze in 1927, 1933, 1936, 1938 and 1939. He scored 43 goals in 82 international games, which represented one quarter of his team's output.

Also an excellent tennis player, represented Germany in the Davis Cup five times and won the German tennis title in 1932.
- Member of IIHF Hall of Fame

Why not:
- Questions about how good German hockey was during his career

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Old
01-16-2011, 05:54 PM
  #37
VanIslander
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Nice picks so far. All were arguably 9's with minuses (except Stastny unless his career points per game average was top-20 or something).

- Ball and Jaenecke were stars with international success but lower level of competition
- Cheechoo and Chittick were arguably the best for a short time but poor play otherwise with a lack of sustained career
- Voss and Demarco were stars of lesser leagues with several decent seasons at the highest level of competition, one's career hampered by injury and the other by limited opportunities in the top league
- Long was occasionally a star of a rival but lesser league
- Stastny a consistent producer over a short career with few real peaks

Note: Chittick and Long were high on my list!! Demarco and Cheechoo should have been. I'd be real interested in learning more about Jaenecke, especially since I'd just drafted his captain.

All of then have a shot of holding their own if called up for a few games to the MLD/AAA/AA levels. But, of course, there's reason to believe they would eventually, or on a bad day, perform subpar and be sent down. Lottery tickets, lightning in a bottle, all of them have shown flashes of greatness. But question marks hold back rational GMs from drafting them in the other drafts. Could Cheechoo have sustained his goal scoring if he'd remained on the same line with Thornton for longer or if his offseason training had been more consistent? Could German league superstars have succeeded in the NHL? Etcetera.


Last edited by VanIslander: 01-16-2011 at 06:02 PM.
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01-16-2011, 07:00 PM
  #38
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Is hockey reference's power play not working for anyone else?

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01-16-2011, 07:21 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
Is hockey reference's power play not working for anyone else?
It wasn't working for me yesterday.

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Old
01-16-2011, 10:05 PM
  #40
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
It wasn't working for me yesterday.
same.

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01-16-2011, 10:26 PM
  #41
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Melville selects Josef Cerny, LW.



Cerny played in the Czech league from 1957 to 1978, and was a national team staple from 1959-1972. He was already 29 when the Golden hockey stick was introduced, but placed 2nd and 4th in voting in his two best seasons.

Cerny has an impressive array of scoring finishes in the Czech league: 1, 2, 4, 4, 7, 7.

He also has the best international record of any available Czech from the 60s-80s: 64 points in 85 games. In all, he snagged 5 Silvers and 6 Bronzes.

During the 10 seasons in which Cerny and Nedomansky both played in the Czech league,
Cerny scored 371 points to Ned's 494. (Cerny was 25-35 and Ned was 20-30, and this cuts off Cerny's scoring title from 1964)

Why not draft Cerny? Good question. He excelled at a level of competition that was more than acceptable for guys like Jirik and Golonka to be drafted a long time ago. Of course, those guys have a lot of grit to go with their scoring exploits. I considered Cerny a long time ago, when looking for an offensive ringer in the AAA. Ultimately, I liked Lala and Golikov better, and took Golikov. Then I totally forgot about Cerny. My bad. He's probably a better offensive player than any RW I took in the AA or the A.

edit: Cerny is a LW, not a RW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kings Of the Ice
From his very first games, he began to assert himself as a scorer... a very fast skater... From 1959, he had a regular place on the national team. He even became team captain... stayed on top of the overall GP list for a long time... througout his career, he grabbed every opportunity that came along to compete at a higher level...


Last edited by seventieslord: 01-24-2011 at 09:01 AM.
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01-16-2011, 10:38 PM
  #42
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Melville selects Luke Richardson, D



Richardson has some definite redeeming qualities that make you wonder what he'd do at the next level. For one thing, he was remarkable resilient: The guy played over 1400 NHL games, easily the most among undrafteds, over 300 more than the next guy. He was known as a good leader, even when he wasn't serving as Columbus' captain for most of two seasons. He had great size - 6'3, 208 lbs. And he was a tough customer.

He was never known as a top pairing guy but you can do a lot worse than average 18.3 minutes a game for 1400 games. He was definitely considered valuable in his prime. You may recall in 1997, he was one of those rare "Group IV" free agents; 10-year veterans earning less than the league average. He cashed in that summer as it seemed half the league wanted his services.

Richardson's career looks a lot more impressive if you cut off his three season Leafs apprenticeship, when he was not ready, and his post-lockout career, when teams signed him to be a #7 and locker room presence. This is still a period of over 1000 NHL games with 19.5 minutes a game.

Why not take Richardson? Well, he was slow of foot. And as relied upon as he was, it was often for poor teams. He played in the playoffs just 8 times, getting out of round one just three times. His best moment was likely getting the 3rd-most minutes on a strong Flyers squad in 2000 that got to game 7 of the conference finals.

He averaged a minute a game more than Marc Bergevin, for 200 more games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Scouting Report 1997-98
Richardson is the kind of player you hate to play against but love to have on your side. He hits to hurt and is an imposing presence on the ice. He scares people. He separates the puck carrier from teh puck down low... When he is on the ice, his teammates play a bit bigger and braver. Richardson plays hurt... you can seldom fault his effort.


Last edited by seventieslord: 01-23-2011 at 02:05 AM.
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01-16-2011, 11:19 PM
  #43
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I think Luke Richardson is more than worthy of a selection this deep in the draft.

I remember how highly sought-after he was. Not a star by any means, but the kind of "pretty good" defenseman that many GMs were trying to add to their teams.

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01-17-2011, 08:06 AM
  #44
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Brooks Orpik



* 6'2, 219 lbs., 489 NHL games, 62 playoff games
* top-3 minutes on a Stanley Cup championship team (2009)
* top duo minutes on an Olympic Silver medalist team (2010)
* 2nd most minutes defender on Stanley Cup finalist team (2008)

Quote:
ASSETS: Has excellent recovery speed and leadership ability. Plays a punishing brand of hockey, is good at keeping the game simple and adept at blocking shots. Can be used in a shutdown role.

FLAWS: Lacks offensive ability and struggles when he has to handle the puck a lot. Doesn't shoot the puck enough. Can get himself out of position when lining opponents up for a big hit.

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01-17-2011, 08:23 AM
  #45
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John-Michael Liles



* scored 260 NHL points including four 10+ goal seasons
* had a 9-game point streak early in his 7th NHL season
* scored 9 points in 9 games in the 2009 World Championships
* played on Team USA in the 2004 World Cup and 2006 Olympics

Quote:
ASSETS: Has plenty of speed, mobility and offensive acumen. Plays with supreme confidence when in possession of the puck. Is an asset on the power play.

FLAWS: His smallish frame will always be an issue at the NHL level. Needs to prove he can raise his level of play in key game situations.

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01-17-2011, 09:13 AM
  #46
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Good picks, ZM, there is a lot to like about both guys. With just a little more longevity, Liles becomes a much better "offensive specialist" option than a guy like Jason Woolley. And Orpik has clearly been relied on heavily for some very good teams at the highest levels. Very underappreciated.

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01-17-2011, 09:29 AM
  #47
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Melville selects Bob Pulford, Coach



There's little to suggest Pulford wouldn't be a passable coach at the MLD level. He has NHL longevity, a winning record, and won a Jack Adams award.

Pulford coached 829 NHL games, with a 364-329-136 record and a .521 win%. He made the playoffs in 10 of 12 seasons, winning a round six times, and another round two times. His 28-43 playoff record isn't stellar, but he's coached more NHL playoff games than all other AAA/AA/A coaches except Hartley, Wilson, Francis, Sutter, Martin, Crawford, and Murray.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1974
serious, intense coach who approaches game from a scientific standpoint...sound believer in physical conditioning, statistical evaluation and constant stress on fundamentals.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1975
Like Philadelphia's Fred Shero, he's receptive to new coaching ideas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Complete Handbook Of Pro Hockey 1977
Uses playbooks and films... frequently swaps ideas with Fred Shero


Last edited by seventieslord: 01-23-2011 at 02:12 AM.
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01-17-2011, 10:16 AM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamboni Mania View Post
Brooks Orpik



* 6'2, 219 lbs., 489 NHL games, 62 playoff games
* top-3 minutes on a Stanley Cup championship team (2009)
* top duo minutes on an Olympic Silver medalist team (2010)
* 2nd most minutes defender on Stanley Cup finalist team (2008)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamboni Mania View Post
John-Michael Liles



* scored 260 NHL points including four 10+ goal seasons
* had a 9-game point streak early in his 7th NHL season
* scored 9 points in 9 games in the 2009 World Championships
* played on Team USA in the 2004 World Cup and 2006 Olympics
You've taken 3 of 4 guys that I've wanted. I had Stastny, Orpik, and Liles high on my lists.

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01-17-2011, 10:20 AM
  #49
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RW Andrei Lomakin



1x Olympic Gold Medalist
1x WJC Gold Medalist
1x Canada Cup Silver Medalist
3x Soviet League Champion
114 goals, 122 assists for 236 points in 326 games in Russian league
18 points(6G, 12A) in Senior Soviet national games
104 points in 215 NHL games

Quote:
Right-winger Andrei Lomakin played parts of four seasons with the Philadelphia Flyers and Florida Panthers in the 90s. Prior to this he was an established domestic and international star in the USSR.

Born in Voskresensk, USSR, Lomakin played five years with Khimik and helped his country win the gold medal at the 1984 World Junior Championships. Beginning in 1986-87, the talented forward spent many years with Moscow Dynamo and contributed to three straight championships between 1990-92.

Internationally, Lomakin impressed as a 23 year old at the 1987 Canada Cup and helped the USSR win the gold medal at the 1988 Calgary Olympics. He also became familiar to North American fans during Dynamo's tours of the NHL in 1989, 1990 and 1991. In 1991 Lomakin won a bronze medal with the USSR at the World Championships and participated at the Canada Cup a few months later.

The Flyers chose the skillful winger 138th overall in 1991 and brought him to North America part way through the next season. He registered 30 points in 57 games while getting used to the smaller ice surface in the NHL. In 1992-93, Lomakin was a fine defensive role player on the club and recorded a solid plus/minus rating of +15 on a team that missed the playoffs.

In June, 1993, Lomakin was picked by the Florida Panthers at the Expansion Draft to add offense and generate fan interest. He scored 19 goals and helped the club set an expansion team record with 83 points.

Andrea Lomakin passed away on December 9th, 2006. Lomakin will forever be remembered as an international star in the USSR.
-loh.net


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01-17-2011, 10:25 AM
  #50
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Melville selects Harry Smith, D



Smith is the furthest on the left.

I've been waiting for the right chance to draft this guy for over a year now, and just don't know where to place him. Very interested to see what you guys think. Is he just a guy who topped out at lower levels and had some good international moments? Or did he choose a different path that just didn't include the NHL? He was a star everywhere he went.

At 6'0" and 200 pounds, Smith was one of the larger players of his time, particularly at the minor league and international levels in which he starred. In a career of recorded games that spans from 1953 to 1971, Smith scored 654 points and 1301 PIM in 614 games.

He played two seasons as a junior in the WCJHL, losing the Memorial Cup final to St. Catherine's with the Edmonton Oil Kings. From there he moved to the WIHL and the Trail Smoke Eaters, with whom he would have a long and storied career. He played the 1958 and 1959 seasons in the Okanagan Senior League with the Kelowna Packers, finishing 3rd and 1st in league defense scoring, and earning a 2nd team all-star nod. He then joined the Vernon Canadians to compete for the Allan Cup and lost to the Whitby Dunlops.

Smith rejoined Trail for the 1960-1963 seasons, competing for the Allan Cup in 1960 and winning in 1963. He was a 1960 1st all-star team member, leading all defensemen in scoring. In 1961 he more than doubled any other defenseman in scoring and came 2nd in scoring on Trail, behind Bobby Kromm. In 1962 he was the 2nd highest-scoring defenseman, despite not playing a full season.

For the 1964 and 1965 seasons, Smith moved to the Nelson Maple Leafs. In 1964 he was the highest-scoring blueliner and 4th in the league in PIMs. In 1965 he was again an Allan Cup finalist.

In 1966, Smith rejoined Trail, was again the league's highest-scooring blueliner twice, (and another time easily the per-game leader) and was a league all-star in 1966. Finally, in the 1969-1971 seasons, Smith started to fade. He played one last season in Switzerland but little is known about that season there.

So far, looks like your average minor/senior star, right? I would agree. But I left out some important information: Between 1961 and 1963, Harry Smith played in 3 World Championships, winning a gold and two silvers, scoring 20 points in 21 games, and was named a tournament all-star every time. His partner on the 1963 all-star squad was Alexander Ragulin. In 1962 the Soviets did not participate so it was a weaker tournament, but in 1961 Smith beat out Ragulin, Sologubov, Tregubov, Sidorenkov, plus Sweden's Bjorn and Stoltz (whom he also beat out in 1962) for this honour.

I always wondered why, when shawnmullin put together his MLD9 team full of players with Trail and BC connections, he didn't include Smith.


Last edited by seventieslord: 12-29-2011 at 02:57 PM.
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