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Benn being used as bait?

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Old
01-17-2011, 03:22 PM
  #101
SammyTheBull
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Originally Posted by StayThirstyMyFriend View Post
Rundblad (same as Karlsson except bigger) + Zach Smith.
**** that from an Ottawa POV.

Ottawa has enough career second liners.

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01-17-2011, 03:25 PM
  #102
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It only makes sense to a motivated seller who feels moving Benn for a package of veterans will help push the Stars over the top for the playoff run. It obviously doesn't help in the future. But I'm not sure the creditors give a crap about the future - it's there job to bring in the highest possible return.

We'll see how this plays out in the next month. It may be just a carrot from Joe to get other GMs to start ringing his phone. Or might be more made up BS from the internet which is about 99% likely.
The biggest issue is that trading Benn hurts the Stars forward depth. The Stars don't have anyone currently capable of replacing Benn. You trade Benn and you risk hurting the performance of your forwards especially the PK. Dallas's forwards have helped put the team at the top of their divsion. Not sure you want to trade a key component of that group.

Secondly, which defenseman would Benn be used to acquire? Guys like Johnson and Suter won't be available because their teams will be looking to make the postseason. Players like Subban or Karlsson still need to develop to meet their full potential and would be more valuable in future seasons(which as you said the creditors don't really care about). Kaberle is a no go as he won't waive his NTC to go to the Western Conference. That leaves players like McCabe, Kuba, Commodore, maybe Pitkanen available and Benn won't be traded for a player like that.

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Old
01-17-2011, 03:29 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by SammyTheBull View Post
**** that from an Ottawa POV.

Ottawa has enough career second liners.
By the looks of the stats of the entire Ottawa roster is looks like the team is made up of nothing but 2nd, 3rd and 4th liners. Benn would be leading the Senators in scoring...

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01-17-2011, 03:42 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by SammyTheBull View Post
**** that from an Ottawa POV.

Ottawa has enough career second liners.
Benn's only 21 and you're already labeling him a career 2nd liner?

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01-17-2011, 03:43 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Dallas should really be looking at Benn, Eriksson and Neal as untouchables, all 3 are damn good young wingers that are great pieces to build around.
Benn and Eriksson are. Neal would probably be available for the right return. Watch all three game in, game out and this is a fair conclusion to arrive at.
I feel like, to a certain extent, having so many great wingers has spoiled Dallas fans. Neal might not be a franchise player or anything like that, but he's a 23 year old power forward with the offensive talent to play on a 1st line, that's pretty rare and is the kind of player most teams would not consider dealing. Obviously, as I already said, I don't think they should consider dealing Benn or Eriksson either.

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01-17-2011, 03:56 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by glovesave_35 View Post
Nothing worth giving up Benn for. I can't even begin to understand why Stars fans are entertaining the notion. Despite the obvious upside and current production, his current salary makes him absolutely untouchable; the production for his pricetag is through the roof. Beyond that trading the future captain makes zero sense.



Benn and Eriksson are. Neal would probably be available for the right return. Watch all three game in, game out and this is a fair conclusion to arrive at.
What would you want from the Leafs? we're willing to give anything but Schenn. Neal is someone I would want more than anybody

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01-17-2011, 04:01 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by ponder View Post
I feel like, to a certain extent, having so many great wingers has spoiled Dallas fans. Neal might not be a franchise player or anything like that, but he's a 23 year old power forward with the offensive talent to play on a 1st line, that's pretty rare and is the kind of player most teams would not consider dealing. Obviously, as I already said, I don't think they should consider dealing Benn or Eriksson either.
I don't think there are any Dallas fans out ther hoping that Neal gets traded. I think that most Dallas fans believe that the only way to acquire a top pairing defenseman(which we really need) would be to trade one of our young wingers. If that were to happen, most Dallas fans would choose to trade Neal. That's not to say Neal sucks, just that Benn and Eriksson are more valuable to the Stars.

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01-17-2011, 04:13 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by ponder View Post
I feel like, to a certain extent, having so many great wingers has spoiled Dallas fans. Neal might not be a franchise player or anything like that, but he's a 23 year old power forward with the offensive talent to play on a 1st line, that's pretty rare and is the kind of player most teams would not consider dealing. Obviously, as I already said, I don't think they should consider dealing Benn or Eriksson either.
We may be a tad spoiled in that regard but the flip side of the coin is that you have to objectively look at the situation and realize that that area of strength may help solve a problem elsewhere on the team.

Look, I really like Neal's skill and when he's on fire he is an absolute beast to contain. The problem is that he hasn't proven to be a consistent player, at any level. I didn't follow him in junior but the knock on him was that he would show stretches of greatness followed by stretches where he wasn't scoring and wasn't very noticeable beyond that. This is still the case. His overall game isn't close to the level of either Eriksson or Benn and he's really (really) backed off his physical game. To an extent his lack of physical play seems to indicate that he feels that he's "arrived." By no means would I use the label "power forward" to describe him, and that's beside the fact that he doesn't fight (which some people feel is a requisite skill for the label). Neal is a big, skilled winger. I'm not trying to pawn him off for just anything, but while he is a solid young contributor it remains to be seen if he can bring enough to the table consistently (and not just scoring) to be a true "1st line player." I actually think that Neal would be better served in the longterm by a demotion to a line where he could be the alpha dog.


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Originally Posted by pitch154 View Post
What would you want from the Leafs? we're willing to give anything but Schenn. Neal is someone I would want more than anybody
You named the only player the Stars would want from the Leafs in a trade for Neal. Non-starter.

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Old
01-17-2011, 04:14 PM
  #109
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2 proposals from a Carolina fan who has lived in Texas the last 2 years and as, such, been trying to follow Dallas a little:

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Chad LaRose

to Car:
Jamie Benn
2011 4th rd pick/mid level prospect/Segal

Dallas gets the PMD they need in Pitkanen, who can also act as a PPQB if somehow Richards ends up somewhere else, or for the 2nd PP unit. Also get a great character guy in LaRose who can also chip in some points, can fill in on the top 6 if needed, and has a bit of a physical edge to him. Think a younger Ott.

Carolina gets a young winger who would fit into the top 6 right away, taking away the need to throw Samsonov/LaRose in there (nvmd the fact that LaRose would be going back in the trade) when they arent true top 6 talent. With Carolina well on its youth movement, this instantly helps the forward portion of that movement without having to wait for much development.

OR

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Sergei Samsonov
2011 5th

to Car:
James Neal
2011 2nd

Dallas again gets its PMD/PPQB#2 in Joni, and gets a former Calder winner in Samsonov who fits in the top 6 ok, but doesnt put up enough consistent offensive numbers anymore to take a full time spot there. Plays well in the bottom 6, and actually seems to put up MORE offensive numbers on the 4th line for some reason. He is a great dangler, sick stick skills, and can still snipe here and there.

Carolina gets a little older version of Benn who could fit in directly on the top line with Staal. Not quite as high an upside as Benn, IMHO, but has the skill at this point to fit on Carolina's top line with some 2nd line time with line shuffling.

I dont do a lot of proposals so please dont be too rough haha

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Old
01-17-2011, 04:19 PM
  #110
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Honestly I don't think Pitkanen is Dallas bound no matter how you cut it. ESPECIALLY not for Neal or Benn.

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01-17-2011, 04:25 PM
  #111
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Anyone who thinks Benn isn't that great because he only has 29 points so far hasn't watched any Dallas games. The kid shows brilliance in every goal he gets. He's only 21 years old and he shows flashes of the world beater he's going to be. I guarantee you he'll be an 80 point guy in the NHL before his career is over. That's why we value him so much.

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01-17-2011, 04:25 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozen Failure View Post
Honestly I don't think Pitkanen is Dallas bound no matter how you cut it. ESPECIALLY not for Neal or Benn.
well i dont think any of this will happen at all, but curious why you personally dont think it would happen? youg uys need a PMD right? Joni is becoming one of the best young PMD around. Granted he can be lazy sometimes, but his skill set is way up there. he puts up points. he can wheel and deal on the PP like crazy. Canes fans have watched him on many occasions take an offensive zone shift and pretty much completely set up the whole thing himself and score, or get a point shot off basically only his own actions, the whole time carrying the puck.

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01-17-2011, 04:29 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Anton Skinner View Post
well i dont think any of this will happen at all, but curious why you personally dont think it would happen? youg uys need a PMD right? Joni is becoming one of the best young PMD around. Granted he can be lazy sometimes, but his skill set is way up there. he puts up points. he can wheel and deal on the PP like crazy. Canes fans have watched him on many occasions take an offensive zone shift and pretty much completely set up the whole thing himself and score, or get a point shot off basically only his own actions, the whole time carrying the puck.
What was the knock on Pitkanen prior to him being picked up by Carolina?

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01-17-2011, 04:39 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Sony Eriksson View Post
What was the knock on Pitkanen prior to him being picked up by Carolina?
im not too sure, honestly, I didnt know much about him. but whatever it was, it seemed to be enough of a knock for us to trade Erik Cole, a declining forward with little offensive skill left that able to trranslate to actual goal scoring at the time, straight up for Joni, a young PMD who was supposed to be the next best thing on ther blueline as a PPQB. hasnt quite panned out there yet, but is slowly making his way towards that.

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01-17-2011, 04:46 PM
  #115
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Would Dallas have any interest acquiring Regehr for Benn (not necessarily straight up).

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01-17-2011, 04:59 PM
  #116
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Would Dallas have any interest acquiring Regehr for Benn (not necessarily straight up).
Could not help bit smile at that.

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01-17-2011, 05:05 PM
  #117
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Would Dallas have any interest acquiring Regehr for Benn (not necessarily straight up).
Short answer is no.

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01-17-2011, 05:24 PM
  #118
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Don't see Benn being "trade bait" Kid is on his ELC and hasn't even scraped the surface of what's he capable of from what I've seen of him.

Goligoski + for Neal just makes all sorts of sense. Of course it probably wouldn't happen until the off-season if it ever did in the first place as both teams need those current players for the playoffs. Not sure what the + would be however... maybe Dustin Jeffrey and a draft pick?

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01-17-2011, 06:42 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Rico Fata View Post
Don't see Benn being "trade bait" Kid is on his ELC and hasn't even scraped the surface of what's he capable of from what I've seen of him.

Goligoski + for Neal just makes all sorts of sense. Of course it probably wouldn't happen until the off-season if it ever did in the first place as both teams need those current players for the playoffs. Not sure what the + would be however... maybe Dustin Jeffrey and a draft pick?
I'd love to get Neal from a Pittsburgh POV. I think a lot of Dallas fans and for that matter, fans of teams in general, really underrate Goligoski. I'd hate to lose him but the fact is we have to deal from our strength. Similarly with the Dallas Stars, who need to deal from one of their strengths. Goligoski makes sense to deal because of his contract and that he would fetch something good.

I think people assume that because the Penguins fans put Goligoski in trade rumors that he is an awful player. It's actually quite the opposite, he can play and he's in those rumors because he's one of the few players/prospects we have that can fetch us a decent winger.

How about:
Goligoski and a 1st round pick

for

Neal

I think we may overpay slightly and 1st round picks are obviously valued. However, we finally can get a long term solution in the top 6. Neal is the type of player that I believe you can overpay for because he can finally fit a need for a fair price and he's an RFA at the end of the contract. This will give the Penguins a player who is ready now for either Crosby or Geno.

For Penguins fans who may not like this trade, our top 4 wingers next year could be:
Malkin
Kunitz
Neal
Tangradi

or if you don't want Geno on the wing:

Neal
Kunitz
Tangradi
Kennedy/Jefferey/Dupuis

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Old
01-17-2011, 06:49 PM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton Skinner View Post
2 proposals from a Carolina fan who has lived in Texas the last 2 years and as, such, been trying to follow Dallas a little:

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Chad LaRose

to Car:
Jamie Benn
2011 4th rd pick/mid level prospect/Segal

Dallas gets the PMD they need in Pitkanen, who can also act as a PPQB if somehow Richards ends up somewhere else, or for the 2nd PP unit. Also get a great character guy in LaRose who can also chip in some points, can fill in on the top 6 if needed, and has a bit of a physical edge to him. Think a younger Ott.

Carolina gets a young winger who would fit into the top 6 right away, taking away the need to throw Samsonov/LaRose in there (nvmd the fact that LaRose would be going back in the trade) when they arent true top 6 talent. With Carolina well on its youth movement, this instantly helps the forward portion of that movement without having to wait for much development.

OR

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Sergei Samsonov
2011 5th

to Car:
James Neal
2011 2nd

Dallas again gets its PMD/PPQB#2 in Joni, and gets a former Calder winner in Samsonov who fits in the top 6 ok, but doesnt put up enough consistent offensive numbers anymore to take a full time spot there. Plays well in the bottom 6, and actually seems to put up MORE offensive numbers on the 4th line for some reason. He is a great dangler, sick stick skills, and can still snipe here and there.

Carolina gets a little older version of Benn who could fit in directly on the top line with Staal. Not quite as high an upside as Benn, IMHO, but has the skill at this point to fit on Carolina's top line with some 2nd line time with line shuffling.

I dont do a lot of proposals so please dont be too rough haha
Pitkanen's a pending UFA....not someone I'd want Dallas to trade one of Neal or Benn for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andyg26 View Post
I'd love to get Neal from a Pittsburgh POV. I think a lot of Dallas fans and for that matter, fans of teams in general, really underrate Goligoski. I'd hate to lose him but the fact is we have to deal from our strength. Similarly with the Dallas Stars, who need to deal from one of their strengths. Goligoski makes sense to deal because of his contract and that he would fetch something good.

I think people assume that because the Penguins fans put Goligoski in trade rumors that he is an awful player. It's actually quite the opposite, he can play and he's in those rumors because he's one of the few players/prospects we have that can fetch us a decent winger.

How about:
Goligoski and a 1st round pick

for

Neal

I think we may overpay slightly and 1st round picks are obviously valued. However, we finally can get a long term solution in the top 6. Neal is the type of player that I believe you can overpay for because he can finally fit a need for a fair price and he's an RFA at the end of the contract. This will give the Penguins a player who is ready now for either Crosby or Geno.

For Penguins fans who may not like this trade, our top 4 wingers next year could be:
Malkin
Kunitz
Neal
Tangradi

or if you don't want Geno on the wing:

Neal
Kunitz
Tangradi
Kennedy/Jefferey/Dupuis
Not a bad offer at all...would really need to think it over but I think this would work. Hopefully Gogo and Richards would share the stage on the PP and click offensively the way he does with Sid.

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01-17-2011, 06:53 PM
  #121
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I'd give you Hemsky + Petry which fills two holes for Dallas. How much more do I need to add?

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01-17-2011, 06:56 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Modo View Post



Not a bad offer at all...would really need to think it over but I think this would work. Hopefully Gogo and Richards would share the stage on the PP and click offensively the way he does with Sid.
Gogo does defer a lot on the Powerplay to our other options. He has no problem with that.

Goligoski is a really good young defenseman. His problem since he's been in the NHL has been his consistency, which is an issue for almost any young defenseman. However, he really has it together this season and he plays with either Lovejoy or Engelland. At even strength, he probably will be in Dallas's top 4 with a better defensive d-man then he plays with now.

He has excellent puck poise, a good accurate wrister from the point, a decent slapper and great vision on the powerplay. He can really rush the puck too. The problem is he we have this younger defenseman who is better named Kris Letang and 3 other defenseman who are better than Goligoski at the time being on longer contracts. If it wasn't for our top 4 essentially being locked in place for awhile due to contract status or that they are better, I'd love to keep Goligoski. But we have an overabundance of puck movers and he's the one who is most movable.

We obviously aren't moving Letang. We aren't moving Martin due to being a solid contributor and that he just signed with us. We aren't moving Michalek because he's been awesome for us and fills a need that we don't have (he also just signed with us). We won't trade Orpik because of his contract and his physicality/leadership. So it has to be Goli.... and I really think he will be a consistent 50 point defenseman throughout the rest of his career.

If I have one complaint about Ray Shero, who I really think is an excellent GM, is that he could be a little more aggressive with the winger situation. He does get wingers, but he never really seems to get the right winger outside of Kunitz and Hossa. Obviously we lost Hossa but Kunitz has been a solid acquisition for Shero. The problem is we could use one or two more Kunitz's or a long term solution to the winger problem.

In this scenario, you can overpay a little (at least IMO) and get that solution. A lot of people will complain about it being a first round pick, but who are you going to draft? A player that you hope ends up being James Neal. In this scenario you get the finished product.


Last edited by hctopcheds11: 01-17-2011 at 07:05 PM.
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01-17-2011, 06:57 PM
  #123
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Smid and Cogliano for Benn, your missing your Italian Stallion

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Old
01-17-2011, 07:15 PM
  #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Remember2004 View Post
So out of Benn, Neal, Eriksson who has the most trade value?

Would you be interested in Regher++ for Eriksonn? Or Regher+ for Neal?
I was thinking something around a prospect not named Backlund and a high end pick not our 1st, maybe 2 seconds next year?
Also just out of curiosity what would it take to get RIchards out?

Dal: Regher, Stajan,3rd rnd 2011, Niemesz
Cgy: Brad Richards (Dallas Conditional 2nd if he doesnt resign)
TJ Brodie is coming back

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton Skinner View Post
2 proposals from a Carolina fan who has lived in Texas the last 2 years and as, such, been trying to follow Dallas a little:

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Chad LaRose

to Car:
Jamie Benn
2011 4th rd pick/mid level prospect/Segal

Dallas gets the PMD they need in Pitkanen, who can also act as a PPQB if somehow Richards ends up somewhere else, or for the 2nd PP unit. Also get a great character guy in LaRose who can also chip in some points, can fill in on the top 6 if needed, and has a bit of a physical edge to him. Think a younger Ott.

Carolina gets a young winger who would fit into the top 6 right away, taking away the need to throw Samsonov/LaRose in there (nvmd the fact that LaRose would be going back in the trade) when they arent true top 6 talent. With Carolina well on its youth movement, this instantly helps the forward portion of that movement without having to wait for much development.

OR

to Dal:
Joni Pitkanen
Sergei Samsonov
2011 5th

to Car:
James Neal
2011 2nd

Dallas again gets its PMD/PPQB#2 in Joni, and gets a former Calder winner in Samsonov who fits in the top 6 ok, but doesnt put up enough consistent offensive numbers anymore to take a full time spot there. Plays well in the bottom 6, and actually seems to put up MORE offensive numbers on the 4th line for some reason. He is a great dangler, sick stick skills, and can still snipe here and there.

Carolina gets a little older version of Benn who could fit in directly on the top line with Staal. Not quite as high an upside as Benn, IMHO, but has the skill at this point to fit on Carolina's top line with some 2nd line time with line shuffling.

I dont do a lot of proposals so please dont be too rough haha
Jamie McBain is coming our way if you want Neal

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Old
01-17-2011, 07:22 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andyg26 View Post
Goligoski and a 1st round pick

for

Neal
I'm interested to hear what other Penguins fans think about this. Too much to give up for Neal? About right? Swap out the 1st for a prospect, maybe Jefferey? If something in this range were actually offered I think the Stars would have to pull the trigger. Personally I'd rather we get a closer prospect like Jefferey in return than the pick, but either way it's solid.

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