HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Kaberle to NYR

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-19-2011, 01:41 PM
  #151
Nedved1*
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 243
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by birddog View Post
He had 28 points in 80 games last year as well and is on the same pace.

What makes you think if Kabs isn't traded to the Rangers for a bunch of mediocre players that the Leafs won't find a better offer or sign him. This is where the Ranger fans are delusional.

Keep Grachev, Gilroy, Christensen - the Leafs aren't interested in trading there best defenceman for any of them.
Then keep Kaberlae and get nothing for him.

What makes you think you guys have the upper hand in these negotiations. The whole league is slowly offering you less and less and now its gotten to the point where they aint offering squat.

What are you going to do about it? Re sign him? He would have already.

He wants to re sign for a lottery team that has fans that trade him in the media 4 times a year for the past 3 years?

Ask Mats Sundin how he felt about it.

Nedved1* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:42 PM
  #152
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,345
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by noBSleafsFAN View Post
NY has a lot of 2nd-3rd line forwards which is something the Leafs don't exactly need (Armstrong,Versteeg,Grabovski,Kulemin,MacArthur). The Leafs need a first line player, something the Rangers have in Gaborik, and he will not be traded.
That may be the case, but the Leafs aren't getting a first line player for Kaberle.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:44 PM
  #153
Retsmra2010*
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 221
vCash: 500
Jesus. People act like Kaberle is holding a gun to Leafs management heads. He's re-iterated time and time again that he wants to remain a leafs until he retires. The only reason there is Kaberle talk is because he is an asset who can garner some value. If the value isn't there you don't trade him. Period.

One 2nd round draft pick is laughable even if he's an impending UFA>

Retsmra2010* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:53 PM
  #154
n8
WAAAAAAA!!!
 
n8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: san francisco
Country: United States
Posts: 7,003
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrophorus View Post
What did Boyle get?
What did Campbell get?

That's your starting point. You're not getting him for nothing.
I'll make it easy though: for your 2011 1st straight up.
If we only still had Sanguinetti

n8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:58 PM
  #155
New Liskeard
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 8,657
vCash: 500
Not sure why this is even being discussed.

Kaberle has a NTC
Kaberle said he wants to stay in Toronto
Burke said he will not ask Kaberle to waive


End of story.

New Liskeard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:58 PM
  #156
RogerRoeper*
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21,694
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedved1 View Post
Why do the Leafs give all these guys NTCs and then ask to trade them?

The leafs should just take what they can get and thank God they got that.

No GM is paying you much for this rental. Kaberlae hasn't played a playoff game in 7 years.

A mid level prospect and second rounder.



Leafs could have got more for him when he still had time on his contract.
The Leafs have an average amount of NTC's on their team. What players the calibre of a Sundin or Kaberle don't have a NTC nowadays?

Ever see the NTCs Lou gives out in New Jersey? The back-up goalie has a NTC clause.

RogerRoeper* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 01:59 PM
  #157
I Am Chariot
One shift at a time
 
I Am Chariot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 14,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForzaZuffa View Post
Yep, that's likely what happened in the offseason and why he won't be moved this season. I see him pulling a Sundin, and leaving us with nothing at all.
and knowing that Burke could decide to take what he can get at the deadline from the 2 teams that Kaberle may "POSSIBLY" waive for..... and if Sather is one of those GMs .....

2nd round pick

I Am Chariot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:00 PM
  #158
RogerRoeper*
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21,694
vCash: 500
Kabs gets the same return as Boyle and Campbell or he's not moving.

RogerRoeper* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:00 PM
  #159
ForzaZuffa
Don't stare at it...
 
ForzaZuffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: Italy
Posts: 9,256
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedved1 View Post
Why do the Leafs give all these guys NTCs and then ask to trade them?
Way off base.

Burke never gave Kaberle his contract nor his NTC.

Quote:
The leafs should just take what they can get and thank God they got that.

No GM is paying you much for this rental. Kaberlae hasn't played a playoff game in 7 years.

A mid level prospect and second rounder.



Leafs could have got more for him when he still had time on his contract
You don't know a thing about what GMs are offering, and what does not playing in the POs for 7 yrs have to do with anything? All of a sudden he forgets how to play hockey once the POs come because he hasn't played in 7 years? Not likely.

ForzaZuffa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:04 PM
  #160
ForzaZuffa
Don't stare at it...
 
ForzaZuffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: Italy
Posts: 9,256
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chariot View Post
and knowing that Burke could decide to take what he can get at the deadline from the 2 teams that Kaberle may "POSSIBLY" waive for..... and if Sather is one of those GMs .....

2nd round pick


How many teams are there in the East?

Burke isn't a "take what he can get" type of GM with players that have any sort of value in his plan. He likes Kaberle, wants to keep him around/resign him, and will not ever give him away for only a lone 2nd round pick, especially if it's not a top 5 in that 2nd round.

ForzaZuffa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:13 PM
  #161
birddog*
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toronto
Posts: 5,988
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Why are you trying to compare Staal's situation to Kaberle's?
Why are Ranger fans offering Drury, Gilroy (soon to walk due to qualifier), Christensen (an offensive third line center), Grachev ( a prospect that gets 28 points in 80 games).

Staal is putting some perspective into the conversation. We couldn't get your best dman for a pile of crap - don't think you are getting Kaberle for that.

Leaf fans dont care that hes 32 and a UFA - he's stated recently he wants to play his entire career in Toronto and is on pace for 56 points again.

Trading him would leave a huge gap. Where do you think the Leafs will find another 56 point dman? So why do Ranger's fans think they can get one from their list of expendable assets?

Think about it. You wouldn't trade Staal for anything less then some premier players. Toronto won't move Kaberle unless there is at least one coveted piece coming back.

birddog* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:20 PM
  #162
ecemleafs
Registered User
 
ecemleafs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 9,457
vCash: 500
how on earth are staal and kaberle similar in value? staal is a better dman right now, is about 9 years younger and has a contract for 4.5 more years.

ecemleafs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:21 PM
  #163
CM Lundqvist
Best In The World
 
CM Lundqvist's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 8,115
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by youngbloodhockey View Post
Yes, it does.
No, it doesn't.

When have you ever seen a prospect the likes of a Kreider traded at the deadline like that for a puck moving defender that's 33 years old and a UFA to be?

CM Lundqvist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:29 PM
  #164
pld459666
Registered User
 
pld459666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Danbury, CT
Country: United States
Posts: 15,230
vCash: 500
.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForzaZuffa View Post
This is funny, and a common consensus with most non-Leaf fans. Fact of the matter is that Kaberle would be an extremely valuable PMD for any contending team. He certainly would not be of much value to a non-contender, but a team like the Rangers who have offensive stiffs like Eminger, Sauer, and Gilroy (not including Staal or Girardi, who are solid all around), Kaberle would be an amazing complement to either Staal or Girardi's shot on the PP. He would also pair well with on the 2nd unit with someone like Sauer who's defensively responsible.

It's laughable if anyone suggests Kaberle is only worth a 2nd, or a 2nd+ Christensen.

Further, most of this is all moot because Kaberle will very likely only waive if an extension is in place before he waives, otherwise he won't. And I could see it being in the neighbourhood of 5/25m which is good value for the offensive output. This would only dramatically increase his value....

Put Kaberle with a strong offensive team, with a good PP setup, this guy is gold. He has flaws, but he's more sound than people think.
Of this I will not argue. (bolded and enlarged part)

I will argue that the Rangers as currently constructed (inclusive of Kaberle) is not a contending team therefore moving assets for him doesn't make sense for the Rangers at this juncture.

pld459666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:29 PM
  #165
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,056
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Kabs gets the same return as Boyle and Campbell or he's not moving.
Campbell, yes. Both were pending UFAs. Boyle had multiply years left on his contract when he was moved and is a better defenseman then Kaberle.

Campbell returned: Steve Bernier and a first-round pick. So a former 1st round pick that scored at ~0.5 ppg and a 1st.

EDIT: Also, Campbell did not have a NTC, so Buffalo could move him to the highest bidder. Kaberle has a NTC and can control where he wants to go. Simon Gagne?

8BostonRocker24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:31 PM
  #166
RogerRoeper*
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21,694
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
how on earth are staal and kaberle similar in value? staal is a better dman right now, is about 9 years younger and has a contract for 4.5 more years.
Very arguable.

RogerRoeper* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:32 PM
  #167
RogerRoeper*
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21,694
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8BostonRocker24 View Post
Campbell, yes. Both were pending UFAs. Boyle had multiply years left on his contract when he was moved and is a better defenseman then Kaberle.

Campbell returned: Steve Bernier and a first-round pick. So a former 1st round pick that scored at ~0.5 ppg and a 1st.

EDIT: Also, Campbell did not have a NTC, so Buffalo could move him to the highest bidder. Kaberle has a NTC and can control where he wants to go. Simon Gagne?
Nope. Right now Kabs is clearly better. And Boyle did have a massive contract that took his value down.

RogerRoeper* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:33 PM
  #168
dashripdot
Registered User
 
dashripdot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 259
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForzaZuffa View Post
Well, as a matter of fact, Burke, nor any other GM is to be taken at their word. They are business men in it for themselves and their families.

I never said Staal was average.

Solid doesn't mean great, therefore no one said Girardi's offensively skilled, I simply said he and Staal are solid all-around Dmen. Girardi is capable of offering some offense, he's only 26 and is well on pace to beat his career high for points. He's certainly no Kaberle or Letang, or whatever PMD you can name. Same story for Staal. Neither are the type to carry the puck end-to-end and game change from an offensive stand point. But they aren't offensive stiffs like say, Beauchemin or Komisarek.

I consider a 24 or 26yo Dman who can put up 30 points a season while playing the role of a shut-down defenseman a solid all-around defenseman.



Did you read my entire point instead of deeming it "wrong from the outset"?

I said Kaberle doesn't get traded unless it's a sign and trade.
Neither Staal nor Girardi has a shot from the point. That was one of my points. The other was that there will be no sign and trade, so the Leafs aren't getting anything of value for him. That ship sailed before this season started.

dashripdot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:33 PM
  #169
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,056
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Nope. Right now Kabs is clearly better. And Boyle did have a massive contract that took his value down.
Nope. Boyle was a better defenseman back then, and is still a better defenseman today.


I will give you the point about the contract, that did play a factor. Tampa wasn't looking to take salary back and Boyle's cap number was 6.66/year.

8BostonRocker24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:34 PM
  #170
Jim Morrison
Registered User
 
Jim Morrison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,163
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by noBSleafsFAN View Post
NY has a lot of 2nd-3rd line forwards which is something the Leafs don't exactly need (Armstrong,Versteeg,Grabovski,Kulemin,MacArthur). The Leafs need a first line player, something the Rangers have in Gaborik, and he will not be traded.
Yes, but the Leafs won't get a first line player for upcoming UFA Kaberle.

It seems like Leaf fans will be disappointed any way it plays out. They either lose him, undoubtedly, for let's say a 2nd round pick and or a prospect. Or they lose him for nothing when he becomes an UFA.

Jim Morrison is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:35 PM
  #171
ForzaZuffa
Don't stare at it...
 
ForzaZuffa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: Italy
Posts: 9,256
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
Of this I will not argue. (bolded and enlarged part)

I will argue that the Rangers as currently constructed (inclusive of Kaberle) is not a contending team therefore moving assets for him doesn't make sense for the Rangers at this juncture.
Dude, as a Leaf fan, I'd love to have your team and mine fully switch rosters- and the standings positions that go with it. Your Rangers are 7th in the East, 10 pts clear of 10th, 5 of 9th, and a slew of good young players/prospects that at least equal what the Leafs have. Oh, and one of the best goalies in the world on a good contract. The Rangers are contenders and you guys could definitely use Kaberle as such.

ForzaZuffa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:36 PM
  #172
RogerRoeper*
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 21,694
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8BostonRocker24 View Post
Nope. Boyle was a better defenseman back then, and is still a better defenseman today.


I will give you the point about the contract, that did play a factor. Tampa wasn't looking to take salary back and Boyle's cap number was 6.66/year.
That's your opinion. Kabs beats him in every statistical category the last few years.

And Boyle is brutal defensively, but because he's played in Tampa and San Jose he's been left alone.

RogerRoeper* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:38 PM
  #173
glucker
Registered User
 
glucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: London, ON
Posts: 4,770
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForzaZuffa View Post
Absolutely not, we all wish that were so. There was a period in the offseason if the Leafs missed the playoffs, from Entry Draft 12AM until Aug. 15th for the Leafs to move him to a list of 10 teams of Kabs' choosing. But after Aug 15, that NTC would be placed back in effect, full board.
incorrect.

During the offseason, if the Leafs missed the playoffs in the prior season, he could be moved to ANY team between the dates you mentioned.


During the season, if the Leafs want to deal Kaberle, they can ask him for a list of 10 teams he'd be willing to be traded to. Burke's first season, Kaberle gave him the list.

glucker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:38 PM
  #174
jmart21
MISC!!!
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: All Over The Place
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,439
vCash: 500
It's not a conventional "he'll walk on July 1st" UFA type deal. Kabs won't waive his NTC unless it's to a team he feels he can agree on an extension with.

Also, Burke will not trade him for a 2nd+prospect(s). He had a few "futures packages" offered this summer and refused to budge on his demand for skilled roster player(s) in return. He's probably more of a "stick to my guns" GM than anyone else. HE WILL NOT TAKE PICK(S)+PROSPECT(S).

jmart21 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2011, 02:40 PM
  #175
GeneralSwell
Registered User
 
GeneralSwell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 661
vCash: 500
Where on earth are some of you guys getting this idea that the Leafs should take the scraps you are offering for Kaberle or else we will lose him as a UFA? The man has said time and time again that he wants to remain a Toronto Maple Leaf. He has nixxed a trade that would have returned Jeff Carter and a 1st (1000x better than anything being offered in here) and who knows if any others.

Fact of the matter is Tomas Kaberle is one of the premier PMD in the league. Regardless if some of the Leaf haters are willing to admit it or not, his stats back it up. Him and Schenn have combined for an outstanding duo for the Leafs this year. The only reason he is constantly rumored to being on the move is because he is a Toronto Maple Leaf. I would much rather hold onto Kaberle and take my chances on him resigning (and he has given every indication he wants to do so) than ship him out for scraps.

GeneralSwell is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:23 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.