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Old
01-21-2011, 01:21 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
I really wish Pronger would drop em. He was supposed to be a big fighter, but he hasn't yet. I realize it'd be stupid for him to fight because we can't miss him for 5 minutes, but a 6-2 game would have been a perfect opportunity.
That is a myth, he may drop them once or twice a season. He fought once last season against Willie Mitchell.

http://www.hockeyfights.com/players/395

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01-21-2011, 01:54 PM
  #27
Subject Orange
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Man, if you don't think Richards is the true captain of this team, then I don't know what you are watching. I love Pronger, but make no mistake, this is Richie's team. Ask anyone.
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Richards is the captain, but Pronger is the backbone to this team, period. And I am a fan of Richards, but Pronger takes on all the additional BS that comes with being a team leader, he is the master puppeteer.
Both are true. Pronger is the power vet who knows how to take **** and dish it back at the slingers. Just like in the Finals when he picked up the two pucks before the Hawks could.

Take the focus off the loss and put it on his "antics". Keeps the media pressure off the team.

Richards captaincy is legitimized everytime he steps on the ice. His quiet demeanor during and after the game speaks volumes to his steadfast nature and his second goal last night is just a shining example of his ability to take care of business. It was almost a no look goal. He was staring off in Prongers direction and with a simple turn of his body the puck was in the back of the net before he was even looking at it. His celebration...a wave of his stick and a pat on the back. He knows he's the captain and he's got the team behind him. He doesn't need to prove it to anyone.

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01-21-2011, 01:55 PM
  #28
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ftfy
If he dies, he dies.

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01-21-2011, 02:49 PM
  #29
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Agree. Richards is the captain of the team, he was given that with the expectation that he was the next Bobby Clarke. I think Richards can lead this team in certain ways, but Pronger is the leader of the team.
If Pronger was the "captain" it would be his team. Since he is not, it is an insult to say he is the "real leader" when Richards walks out on the ice with the "C" on his chest everynight and the weight of the team on his shoulders. They said he would be the best captain Philly has had since Bobby Clarke. They were right!

In many ways Timonen is a great leader, Pronger is a great leader, Briere is a good leader. However - everyone knows it is Richies team! To say anyone other than him is the "true leader" is an insult to Richards. And I can't think of anyway you can insult his leadership at this point in his career.

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01-21-2011, 03:00 PM
  #30
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Fair enough, but ECF's are not winning the Cup, that is the bottom line. This franchise is not about winning division titles, and last year was an embarrassment up until the playoffs.

Fighting and standing up for your teammate is part of the sport and as much as we do not want to see any of those players go down with an injury at some point the guys on the roster as a whole have to take a stand, even if it means risking an injury. It is the emotion of playing a competitive sport.

As far as Pronger, it is obvious how he handles the media and how his leadership on this team has taken them from young guys who want to go out and club to being focused as a team. It was never more evident when he came in last year and said the one thing he wanted to bring to this team was to not get accustomed to losing two games in a row, that was the mentality he had in Anaheim and I believe a big reason why Pronger had management sign O'Donnell. We all love the new guys and what they bring, but let's not get carried away here when Pronger or Timonen speak in the locker room it carries a ton more weight that Captain Mike.

And as far as the last bit, please, you have no clue where "I am at". Carter can be a lazy player who has a ton of talent, that is my opinion. And until he shows up in the playoffs all the 40 goal seasons in the world will not help him unless they win Lord Stanley's Cup. Just because I do not wear the O&B rose tinted glasses regarding every player does not mean you know who I am as a fan of this team, that is quite condescending and very homerlike.

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01-21-2011, 03:10 PM
  #31
Terence Peterman
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Holy ****. I'm sorry, but I just cannot imagine Bob fighting. It would probably be hilarious though.
It would be ****ing badass.

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Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
I can. It'd look like this.
Hey, bite your tongue. Russian goalies have their **** together, he'd open up some full-on hhhwoopass!

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Comrade Goaltender will do anything for Mother Team.
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ftfy
Dying over these two.

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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
I really wish Pronger would drop em. He was supposed to be a big fighter, but he hasn't yet. I realize it'd be stupid for him to fight because we can't miss him for 5 minutes, but a 6-2 game would have been a perfect opportunity.
I'm pretty sure Pronger's never, ever been billed as a big fighter. It goes along with the misconception he's this huge hitter. He's neither...he's just genius when he does do stuff (and, no, this doesn't assume legal).

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01-21-2011, 03:14 PM
  #32
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That is the best retort you have, Dennis Green?

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01-21-2011, 03:21 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by phillyfanatic View Post
If Pronger was the "captain" it would be his team. Since he is not, it is an insult to say he is the "real leader" when Richards walks out on the ice with the "C" on his chest everynight and the weight of the team on his shoulders. They said he would be the best captain Philly has had since Bobby Clarke. They were right!

In many ways Timonen is a great leader, Pronger is a great leader, Briere is a good leader. However - everyone knows it is Richies team! To say anyone other than him is the "true leader" is an insult to Richards. And I can't think of anyway you can insult his leadership at this point in his career.
No insult to Richards, I still think he was too young to be crowned the next Bobby Clarke as far as a leader, but overall I have no gripe with him as the captain. We do differ as far as the next bit which is Pronger walks into a room and commands respect, and this was some of the problems that brewed last season IMO.

He came in and is the type of player who immediately will step in and say what is on his mind, Richards is more of the quiet leader. Richards can be the captain, but Pronger is the leader. It can be Richards team, as it should be, he is the most tenured Flyer and the FO gave him the reigns, but without Pronger this team is still trying to find their way through the woods IMO. The result of where they are is a direct result to two moves: 1) Sign Pronger, and 2) Fire Stevens and bring in Laviolette who made players accountable.

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01-21-2011, 06:03 PM
  #34
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Showing teams you are not going to get run by a bottom feeder >>>> 2pts at this time of the season at the top of the standings IMO

Teams like the Sens have nothing to lose, they cannot win by talent, so they will run around and target your players. Read Prongers quote, this is how you handle getting run.

This is not some schmo on a forum, it is the designated team leader who performs by example. Richards can take the C, the real leader of this team has been Pronger since he arrived and especially after last seasons post-season performance.


“There was an awful lot of them [fights] out there,” Pronger said. “They wanted to run around and we answered the bell.”
Just because you have a big mouth it doesn't make you a leader. Richards is quieter, more serious and the heart and soul of the team.

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01-21-2011, 06:31 PM
  #35
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ftfy
Lol. Nice.

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Old
01-22-2011, 02:40 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by JVR21 View Post
I really wish Pronger would drop em. He was supposed to be a big fighter, but he hasn't yet. I realize it'd be stupid for him to fight because we can't miss him for 5 minutes, but a 6-2 game would have been a perfect opportunity.
Did pretty well without him for 13 games.

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01-22-2011, 07:46 PM
  #37
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That is the best retort you have, Dennis Green?
KimiCitroën, er Ferrari> you

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01-24-2011, 08:13 AM
  #38
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Just because you have a big mouth it doesn't make you a leader. Richards is quieter, more serious and the heart and soul of the team.
Richards is captain, Pronger is leader. Even the guys on the NBC broadcast took note on Pronger and how outspoken he is on the bench talking to guys, being and additional coach. This is Richards team with the C but Pronger is leading this team to the promised land.


Take Pronger off the roster and I doubt this team is where they are right now. This is not a shot at Richards, he is a different kind of leader, but Pronger is a natural and people just follow his example.

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01-24-2011, 10:18 AM
  #39
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Richards is captain, Pronger is leader. Even the guys on the NBC broadcast took note on Pronger and how outspoken he is on the bench talking to guys, being and additional coach. This is Richards team with the C but Pronger is leading this team to the promised land.


Take Pronger off the roster and I doubt this team is where they are right now. This is not a shot at Richards, he is a different kind of leader, but Pronger is a natural and people just follow his example.
They did just fine without Pronger when he was off, and most of those games were on the road. If Richards was gone for 13 games you'd have to put Carter in his place and replace Carter with Carcillo on Giroux's wing. That would be a recipe for disaster. I also don't think much of any of NBC's people as they're getting their info from media notes more than anything.
If you think being loud makes you a good leader, take a look at Burke and Wilson in Toronto, 2 loudmouths who haven't accomplished a thing except getting attention on themselves.

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01-24-2011, 10:34 AM
  #40
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KimiCitroën, er Ferrari> you
I have vowed not to change my name until Ferrari wins a new title, sadly Kimi is sucking it up in rally and I want to punch Alonso in the nuts.

I always loved Vettel though. I remember Vettel holding up Hamilton for 10+ laps in a severely outmatched car during Hamlton's title run.

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01-24-2011, 10:43 AM
  #41
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They did just fine without Pronger when he was off, and most of those games were on the road. If Richards was gone for 13 games you'd have to put Carter in his place and replace Carter with Carcillo on Giroux's wing. That would be a recipe for disaster. I also don't think much of any of NBC's people as they're getting their info from media notes more than anything.
If you think being loud makes you a good leader, take a look at Burke and Wilson in Toronto, 2 loudmouths who haven't accomplished a thing except getting attention on themselves.
Ummmm, this is what Pronger brings that Richards does not have....both players are important pieces, but if this team did not have Pronger in last years playoffs you are talking about a team who would have lost to the Devils, not made the SCF's. Again, like Richards and think he is still learning, but reality is that Chris Pronger brought to this team a leadership ability that was missing.




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01-24-2011, 10:47 AM
  #42
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Ummmm, this is what Pronger brings that Richards does not have....both players are important pieces, but if this team did not have Pronger in last years playoffs you are talking about a team who would have lost to the Devils, not made the SCF's. Again, like Richards and think he is still learning, but reality is that Chris Pronger brought to this team a leadership ability that was missing.



Interesting I see an A on his Jersey there. Does that stand for Alpha dog?

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01-24-2011, 10:49 AM
  #43
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Why do people bother arguing about Richards vs Pronger?

A team can have 2 ****ing leaders


Last edited by HoverCarle*: 01-24-2011 at 11:16 AM.
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01-24-2011, 11:00 AM
  #44
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Why do people both arguing about Richards vs Pronger?

A team can have 2 ****ing leaders
This. (or 4-7 leaders - as people lead in different ways and they are benificial in every aspect.

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01-24-2011, 11:06 AM
  #45
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Why do people both arguing about Richards vs Pronger?

A team can have 2 ****ing leaders
The Flyers are actually blessed by having an abundance of leaders. Timonen, Briere, Pronger have all been captains on other teams, and the Flyers have done a good job grooming guys like Richards, Carter, and Giroux to be leaders as well. If there's really anything that should count as a Flyers MO in terms of player traits, it's leadership, especially considering the guys that have passed through here recently. Gagne, Smith, Hatcher, etc.

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01-24-2011, 12:11 PM
  #46
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Interesting I see an A on his Jersey there. Does that stand for Alpha dog?
Do you even know who the captain of the Ducks was??

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01-24-2011, 12:30 PM
  #47
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Do you even know who the captain of the Ducks was??
Scott Niedermayer.

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01-24-2011, 12:38 PM
  #48
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Scott Niedermayer.
Thus why Mr Pronger had the A on his sweater.

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01-24-2011, 12:39 PM
  #49
KimiFerrari
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Thus why Mr Pronger had the A on his sweater.
And since Richards is this team's captain...
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Thus why Mr Pronger had the A on his sweater.

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01-24-2011, 12:59 PM
  #50
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And since Richards is this team's captain...
This is not a discussion about who wears the C. This is a discussion that since Pronger has arrived in Philly this team has been on his back riding out the process from being a good team in the EC to being a legit Stanley Cup contender and a team who refuses to lose two games in a row. We could have discussed that at some point last year Timonen or Pronger should have been given the C roles, but management decided to let Richards have his apprenticeship under Pronger and Timonen, two players who speak in different ways but always leave their best on the ice each night.

One of the famous quotes of him when he arrived in Philly was what kind of impact did he expect to bring. His answer, do not be happy losing two games in a row. Do you really think the players on the roster under Richards cared about losing two in a row last season? If so they had a strange way of showing it, because all you ever heard was about how they "tried hard, just did not get the results"...etc....finally a coach came in who could give Pronger more free reign to act in a way that was to be expected then lo and behold, they go on a tear in the playoffs under the leadership on and off the ice of Pronger.

Let's not mince what we are talking about here. Richards is the captain of this team, but Pronger is the backbone and without him on this roster I can guarantee they would not be where they are under the Country Club Boys.

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