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Kaberle to NYR

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Old
01-21-2011, 05:18 PM
  #326
eco's bones
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Kaberle is going to go somewhere this year or Toronto's gm isn't doing his job--that is if he doesn't re-sign him in the meantime because the alternative is to lose him in the offseason and have no return at all. That's the thing with talented upcoming UFA's--you try to get the best deal which might not be fair value. If the Leafs were a playoff team well then they might want to hold on to him--but they're not. I haven't read all through these pages but the idea that some think they're going to get Kreider back for him is a pipedream. Whether the Rangers give the best deal is one thing but either the Leafs sign him or they have to move him for what they think is the best offer out there--there is no other good alternative.

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01-21-2011, 05:28 PM
  #327
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Kaberle walks for nothing in return.

I know Leafs fans are pretty much (inductive logic) all delusional on the return on a Kaberle trade. Having lived through Marian Gaborik walking for nothing, do Toronto fans really *want* to lose Kaberle for nothing?

If I were Burkie, I'd take a 2nd and two middle prospects in a heartbeat.

Tell you what... Minnesota will give you Cam Barker + Anton Khudobin for Kaberle at the deadline.

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Old
01-23-2011, 11:18 AM
  #328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonni View Post
i guess that Toronto and Burke wants Gilroy and Boyle or maybe prospect Grachev for Kaberle. Is that too much, NO!
Yes it is.
Gilroy emerging as I said he might given the chance, will not be part of this equation.
For a replacement think D prospect Thomas Kundratek.

I was open to something with Boyle earlier.
This was premised on:
Orr also coming over a cheap replacement for concussed Boogie.
Dumping some salary the other way.
NYR having enough F depth to include Orr.
What the minimum price for Kaberle would be, generally to any contending club interested in the rental, and what slight premium above that a given club would have to pay to submit a winning bid.

This is subjective, obviously, but Boyle fits that profile.

However, the situation has changed dramatically, and I now update and revise accordingly.

While Sather was smart to get us Woslki for Roszival, increasing NYR Fs by 1 for an expendable D, we are losing Fs at an alarming rate. We have been forced to bring up stop gaps like Kolarek and Newbury. Under these new conditions, Boyle is no longer ordinarily expendable.

If they manufactured cap space, I'm sure the Black Hawks for one could submit a better offer, a big IF since I don't think they'll just dump somebody to make that needed room.

Regardless, NYR must re-invent its bid for the Kaberle rental, which, as it can only be assumed to be nothing more than a rental, is a reduced value situation to begin with.

New offer:
Kaberle + Orr
for
Kundratek --- prospect D
Cam Talbot -- prospect G good enough to get top dollar from Sather
Brodie Dupont -- prospect F, some scoring background, though not considered lethal sniper type
Erik Christensen -- ordinary adequate 3-4 line checking F, who is above average at faceoffs and shoot outs.
Vin Prospal -- salary dump
2nd round pick


Last edited by bernmeister: 01-23-2011 at 11:20 AM. Reason: spelling correction
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Old
01-23-2011, 11:40 AM
  #329
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2nd and Gilroy is all I would want the Rangers to give up and if the Leafs say no then move on and acquire McCabe as a rental for less

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:23 PM
  #330
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he may be too expensive.. Perhaps we get Komisarek, cheaper.. or beuchemin both are good to us

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:25 PM
  #331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonni View Post
he may be too expensive.. Perhaps we get Komisarek, cheaper.. or beuchemin both are good to us
Both are TERRIBLE for the Rangers. Say hello to one of those guys, and say bye to one of Callahan, Dubinsky, or Anisimov, because then they won't be able to fit under the cap when they need to be re-signed.

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:29 PM
  #332
CM Lundqvist
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Originally Posted by youngbloodhockey View Post
You're right, Kaberle wasn't voted in 4 times as an NHL all star for his silly assists/play making abilities.

They only time assists don't count as much is when people are trying to make baseless claims on the internet because in the real world players make millions upon millions of dollars for possessing such talents.
No they count, your argument that Kaberle is a superstar defenseman because he plays in Toronto and scores a bunch of points from assists just flat out sucks.

Kaberle is not Doughty, Weber, Keith, Lidstrom, or Pronger.

Superstars are not good at only one aspect of the game.

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:47 PM
  #333
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Kaberle for a second, Christensen and Gilroy ?


excuse me I gotta go puke, I'll be right back

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:55 PM
  #334
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Kaberle
for
Drury + 2nd. (for taking Drury) ---negitive value
+
Gilroy + condition pick (Kaberle re-signs there, how deep they go in the playoffs etc.) ---kaberle value
------

Works out to:
Kaberle for Drury + Gilroy + 2nd + cond. pick (likely 3rd to 4th[if he walks], maybe higher if he signs or rangers go deep)


Toronto can add a Center like Brent, Zigo, Mitchell. If rangers are in need of one. to round out there 4th line.


Last edited by dannyboy8920: 01-23-2011 at 01:05 PM.
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Old
01-23-2011, 12:56 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Coldshot View Post
No they count, your argument that Kaberle is a superstar defenseman because he plays in Toronto and scores a bunch of points from assists just flat out sucks.

Kaberle is not Doughty, Weber, Keith, Lidstrom, or Pronger.

Superstars are not good at only one aspect of the game.
Very good, now quote me where I said he was superstar in the same department as Pronger or Lidstrom.

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Old
01-23-2011, 12:57 PM
  #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyboy8920 View Post
Kaberle
for
Drury + 2nd. (for taking Drury)
+
Gilroy + condition pick (Kaberle re-signs there, how deep they go in the playoffs etc.)

Works out to:
Kaberle for Drury + Gilroy + 2nd + cond. pick (likely 3rd to 4th)


Toronto can add a Center like Brent, Zigo, Mitchell. If rangers are in need of one.
That's quite the reasonable deal. Contingent on Kaberle waiving his NTC and Drury waiving his NMC.

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01-23-2011, 12:59 PM
  #337
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Think I better stay in the history of hockey section, there seems to be a little bit of intelligence over there. Some of these posts are not only delusional but offensive.

Gilroy and a 2nd

Really? Would you ACCEPT that deal?

Foolishness

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraparounds View Post
That's quite the reasonable deal. Contingent on Kaberle waiving his NTC and Drury waiving his NMC.
No, it's garbage.

Drury and a 1st might get you a 5th

Burke would have no interest in Gilroy either

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Old
01-23-2011, 01:05 PM
  #338
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I suggested this in the other thread...Toronto fans seemed to like it.

I'm torn on it. It may be of benefit or not of benefit.

Drury (assuming he waives), Gaborik, Kreider

for

Kessel, Kaberle...

I personally think Kessel suits the style we want to play more than Gaborik - but losing Kreider hurts. This would free up between 5-9.5 Million depending on whether Kaberle resigns or not. I'd prefer Grachev over Kreider - but I don't think TO fans would.

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Old
01-23-2011, 01:19 PM
  #339
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poignant Discussion View Post
Think I better stay in the history of hockey section, there seems to be a little bit of intelligence over there. Some of these posts are not only delusional but offensive.

Gilroy and a 2nd

Really? Would you ACCEPT that deal?

Foolishness



No, it's garbage.

Drury and a 1st might get you a 5th

Burke would have no interest in Gilroy either
A 2nd and 3rd is more than fair, Drury would have to be included for cap reasons. If you want to rebuild the right way, you need draft picks. Burke isn't going to get a really good nhl ready player for Kaberle, he really needs to start over and build from the draft.

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Old
01-23-2011, 01:20 PM
  #340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRfan68 View Post
I suggested this in the other thread...Toronto fans seemed to like it.

I'm torn on it. It may be of benefit or not of benefit.

Drury (assuming he waives), Gaborik, Kreider

for

Kessel, Kaberle...

I personally think Kessel suits the style we want to play more than Gaborik - but losing Kreider hurts. This would free up between 5-9.5 Million depending on whether Kaberle resigns or not. I'd prefer Grachev over Kreider - but I don't think TO fans would.
I would never do that deal.

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Old
01-23-2011, 01:23 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by DatsyukSOGoal View Post
A 2nd and 3rd is more than fair, Drury would have to be included for cap reasons. If you want to rebuild the right way, you need draft picks. Burke isn't going to get a really good nhl ready player for Kaberle, he really needs to start over and build from the draft.
So the Leafs take back a terrible contract and a 2nd and send out a premiere PMD? Not going to happen.

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01-23-2011, 01:24 PM
  #342
CM Lundqvist
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Originally Posted by youngbloodhockey View Post
Very good, now quote me where I said he was superstar in the same department as Pronger or Lidstrom.
You said that he was a superstar offensive defenseman.

That's not the case, when he's good at only one thing.

Either he's a superstar or he's not.


Last edited by CM Lundqvist: 01-23-2011 at 01:38 PM.
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Old
01-23-2011, 03:57 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Coldshot View Post
You said that he was a superstar offensive defenseman.

That's not the case, when he's good at only one thing.

Either he's a superstar or he's not.
Again quote me if you're going to make stuff up, secondly if you think Kaberle is only good at one thing you don't know much about hockey.


Last edited by thebluemachine*: 01-23-2011 at 04:02 PM.
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Old
01-23-2011, 04:04 PM
  #344
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Originally Posted by NYRfan68 View Post
I suggested this in the other thread...Toronto fans seemed to like it.

I'm torn on it. It may be of benefit or not of benefit.

Drury (assuming he waives), Gaborik, Kreider

for

Kessel, Kaberle...

I personally think Kessel suits the style we want to play more than Gaborik - but losing Kreider hurts. This would free up between 5-9.5 Million depending on whether Kaberle resigns or not. I'd prefer Grachev over Kreider - but I don't think TO fans would.
Hard to believe you're actually a Rangers fan with that proposal.

That actually makes our team worse.

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Old
01-24-2011, 12:09 PM
  #345
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRfan68 View Post
I suggested this in the other thread...Toronto fans seemed to like it.

I'm torn on it. It may be of benefit or not of benefit.

Drury (assuming he waives), Gaborik, Kreider

for

Kessel, Kaberle...

I personally think Kessel suits the style we want to play more than Gaborik - but losing Kreider hurts. This would free up between 5-9.5 Million depending on whether Kaberle resigns or not. I'd prefer Grachev over Kreider - but I don't think TO fans would.
No big time on Kreider
prefer Gabs to Kessel
Am open minded to some variation that allows for you to marginally upgrade kessel to Gabs.
I like Drury's heart but am open to relocating his salary.

But none of this + a rental on kaberle is worth our best prospect, the next Dave Keon!

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Old
01-24-2011, 12:17 PM
  #346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRfan68 View Post
Drury (assuming he waives), Gaborik, Kreider

for

Kessel, Kaberle...
ABSOLUTELY NOT

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Old
01-24-2011, 03:45 PM
  #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youngbloodhockey View Post
Again quote me if you're going to make stuff up, secondly if you think Kaberle is only good at one thing you don't know much about hockey.
I have read through the entire thread... Apparently you are the only person who knows anything about hockey and you refuse to actually try to help the process in where we find fair value for a "Aging, At-The-End-Of-Contract, PMD" who will likely only stay with the team he's being traded to for a play off run before being resigned. Specifically because the team has no room for him after RFA's.

Also fans from Minnesota have said this plenty of times, but just a reminder... You don't want to be on the side that get's nothing in return for a player leaving. If Burke can get a return for an aging player while rebuilding, he'd be a moron not to take it if the return is helpful enough to the future of the team,

ie:
Quote:
Kaberle for Drury + Gilroy + 2nd + cond. pick (likely 3rd to 4th)
That seems like pretty decent return for a player who could be leaving the team. This was also posted by a TOR fan, and since Sather and Burke have some sort of "friendship" we can see that if the value is there and the needs are there... This is a pretty good deal for both sides.

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Old
01-24-2011, 05:23 PM
  #348
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
Staal-Girardi
Eminger-Sauer
McDonagh-Gilroy

Where does Kaberle exactly fit? And does he put us over the top? I don't think so. . . .

I'd rather see us retain our assets (not that you included any in this proposal, other than the 2nd rounder which will be around pick #20'ish).

No to Kaberle.
are you saying kaberle couldnt take over ONE of those guys positions

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Old
01-24-2011, 05:41 PM
  #349
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Originally Posted by mohare View Post
Its pretty simple. Kaberle for Del Zotto.
You must be pretty simple

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01-24-2011, 05:55 PM
  #350
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
I have read through the entire thread... Apparently you are the only person who knows anything about hockey and you refuse to actually try to help the process in where we find fair value for a "Aging, At-The-End-Of-Contract, PMD" who will likely only stay with the team he's being traded to for a play off run before being resigned. Specifically because the team has no room for him after RFA's.

Also fans from Minnesota have said this plenty of times, but just a reminder... You don't want to be on the side that get's nothing in return for a player leaving. If Burke can get a return for an aging player while rebuilding, he'd be a moron not to take it if the return is helpful enough to the future of the team,

ie:


That seems like pretty decent return for a player who could be leaving the team. This was also posted by a TOR fan, and since Sather and Burke have some sort of "friendship" we can see that if the value is there and the needs are there... This is a pretty good deal for both sides.

I was pointing out that Kaberle is good at more then one thing, which he is. Not sure how you arrived at trying to figure out what a fair proposal for our "aging" PMD would be, as if some random junk posted on the internet is going to have an effect into how Burke handles his players/expiring contracts.

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