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Senators decide to rebuild

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:32 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Pyke View Post
?

They have bad goaltending, and bad coaching.

Ottawa may not be in the realm of the elite teams, but they aren't a 27th place team on paper. As they said in the 24/7 series, "You're never as good as your best streaks and never as bad as your worst ones."

Ottawa is having an off year. There's a couple reasons for that. On paper though, I'd much rather have the assets the Senators have then many franchises in the league. It's not like it's a mystery what we're missing.
Well on paper they look weak as well there is no Offense on the club and I posted way earlier before the rebuild that Ottawa would be near the bottom of the league and eventualy the Islander would over take them, and you cannotn blame the coaching Cloust took this sad sack team and had them playing over there potential last year, and other than a struggling Spezza and a aging Alfie there is 0 offense on the club take of your homer goggles Ottawa is a weak club period

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01-23-2011, 02:33 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by The OttoMan View Post
You dont need to be so harsh lol. Its his perspective of what is best. He gave a very valuable deal for Spezza, and I promise if Murray was offered that he'd consider it. Spezza aint untouchable, as much as I agree that we should build around him.
Burmistrov is a Russian. We have no interest in Russians. Murray will never deal for one, and frankly, unless the name is Alexander Ovechkin I have no desire to have them on the team. The declining numbers of Russians in the NHL speak to this.

Further, even if he WASNT a Russian, the former what, 8th overall pick? + 1st Round Pick is not nearly enough to justify losing a number one center. Then we become like the Oilers and Flames for the last 15 years, searching for a #1C. Everyone forgets how fortunate we are to actually have a #1C that they're willing to trade away Spezza.

Is he perfect? No. Is he the best we have? Yes. Has he matured? Yes. Is he beginning to show signs of a 2 way game? Yes.

I think Spezza's last 10 years of his career (30-40) will mirror Steve Yzerman's last 10 years, with the transition from scoring centre to just below PPG reliable in all zones, and potential championship winning.

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01-23-2011, 02:34 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by newoilsburnsclean View Post
Well on paper they look weak as well there is no Offense on the club and I posted way earlier before the rebuild that Ottawa would be near the bottom of the league and eventualy the Islander would over take them, and you cannotn blame the coaching Cloust took this sad sack team and had them playing over there potential last year, and other than a struggling Spezza and a aging Alfie there is 0 offense on the club take of your homer goggles Ottawa is a weak club period
On papper there not as bad as there record shows.

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01-23-2011, 02:36 PM
  #29
Andre Benoit Bawls
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Originally Posted by Pyke View Post
Burmistrov is a Russian. We have no interest in Russians. Murray will never deal for one, and frankly, unless the name is Alexander Ovechkin I have no desire to have them on the team. The declining numbers of Russians in the NHL speak to this.

Further, even if he WASNT a Russian, the former what, 8th overall pick? + 1st Round Pick is not nearly enough to justify losing a number one center. Then we become like the Oilers and Flames for the last 15 years, searching for a #1C. Everyone forgets how fortunate we are to actually have a #1C that they're willing to trade away Spezza.

Is he perfect? No. Is he the best we have? Yes. Has he matured? Yes. Is he beginning to show signs of a 2 way game? Yes.

I think Spezza's last 10 years of his career (30-40) will mirror Steve Yzerman's last 10 years, with the transition from scoring centre to just below PPG reliable in all zones, and potential championship winning.
Burmistrov has a great attitude, is clearly committed to the NHL, and plays hard. Generalizing based on nationality is just absurd. Do you think I am like you whatsoever in my abilities and values? No. Nationality doesn't trap someone into a way of being. Sure, its an influence, but look at Volch. He'd be considered an outlier even if he was Canadian.

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01-23-2011, 02:36 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Kesselisboss View Post
Im predicting....

Gonchar to- Caps or Boston For Boston 1st and 3rd

Alfredsson to LA For 1st+

Phillips to San Jose for 2nd+ Prospect

Spezza to Atlanta for Burmistrov+ 1st+ 3rd

Build around Fisher (basically interim captain)
Karlsson
Cowen
Burmistrov
Top 5 pick

10 bucks says they win the cup before the leafs do.
Salary Cap and NTC and 35+ contract. good luck moving that.

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01-23-2011, 02:37 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by The OttoMan View Post
Burmistrov has a great attitude, is clearly committed to the NHL, and plays hard. Generalizing based on nationality is just absurd. Do you think I am like you whatsoever in my abilities and values? No. Nationality doesn't trap someone into a way of being. Sure, its an influence, but look at Volch. He'd be considered an outlier even if he was Canadian.
You miss my point. I have nothing against signing Russian free agents (i.e. Gonchar or Kovalev). I do have something against drafting, trading for, or otherwise relying on Russian players.

So long as the KHL and NHL remain at odds, this will be an issue. It's not an unreasonable perspective to have either. Look at the clubs that have been burned by elite Russian prospects (Columbus: Filatov, Nashville: Radulov, Ottawa: Yashin).

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01-23-2011, 02:38 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by UConn126 View Post
Salary Cap and NTC and 35+ contract. good luck moving that.
Its possible to move him but i doubt it will be a first comming back.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:40 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by wjhl2009fan View Post
On papper there not as bad as there record shows.
Yeah ok If you look at roster And see a Gonchar in his prime or A Alfie in his prime or A kovalev in his Prime or a Phillips in his Prime It might look like a good club on paper I see alot of over the Hill vetrans and alot of underwhelming players IMO and there record is a testament to what is on paper

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01-23-2011, 02:40 PM
  #34
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What is the asking price for michalek?

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01-23-2011, 02:40 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Appreci8 View Post
So what is Fisher's value?
Late first and a prospect.

I am glad they are actually doing this, like most posters said its unlikely that Gonchar or Alfredsson get moved this year because they have another year on their respective contracts.

Spezza isnt going anywhere when he is playing this bad thats terrible asset management and he is only 27.

Phillips should be able to garner a late first from a serious contender. I think he would be a good fit in boston especially because they have Toronto's first this year, he has tremendous chemistry with Chara.

Kovalev may get a 3rd from a team desperate for offense and a struggling pp.

Ruutu will go for a late pic.

The only team I can see Alfredsson going to is LA. For 2 reasons he is exactly what they need and they have the cap space to keep him next season. Whoever thinks this guy is only going to bring back a 2nd rounder plus a prospect has no idea the sens will not move him for that package anyway.

No one will take Gonchar or Kuba with the amount of time they have left on there contracts and for how terrible these two guys are playing. They are the main reason why the sens are so bad this year, these guys have simply shut it down in a big way.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:42 PM
  #36
Leave Spezza Alone
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
What is the asking price for michalek?
No asking price as he is going to be part of the rebuild.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:42 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by SilencerX View Post
No asking price as he is going to be part of the rebuild.
Just inquiring.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:43 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
What is the asking price for michalek?
He is probably not going to be moved he is 26 on a good contract having an underperforming year. He is finally looking to have recovered from his knee injury and is playing good hockey right now.

Available players (or likely the players being shopped)

F
Alfredsson (only if he wants to be moved)
Fisher
Kovalev
Ruutu
Neil
Kelly
Shannon

D
Gonchar
Phillips
Kuba
Campoli
Lee

G (haha i know no one wants these guys)
Leclair
Elliot

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:45 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by newoilsburnsclean View Post
Yeah ok If you look at roster And see a Gonchar in his prime or A Alfie in his prime or A kovalev in his Prime or a Phillips in his Prime It might look like a good club on paper I see alot of over the Hill vetrans and alot of underwhelming players IMO and there record is a testament to what is on paper
The bottom line is they should be playing alot better then they are.

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01-23-2011, 02:50 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newoilsburnsclean View Post
Yeah ok If you look at roster And see a Gonchar in his prime or A Alfie in his prime or A kovalev in his Prime or a Phillips in his Prime It might look like a good club on paper I see alot of over the Hill vetrans and alot of underwhelming players IMO and there record is a testament to what is on paper
Alfredsson and Gonchar have both been consistent point producer since the lockout iirc. Yes, aging players have a tendency to have a decline in their production levels, but they don't drop off a cliff like we've seen with these two this season.

Key injuries to players like Spezza and the teams disappointing play are obvious key factors as to why they are where they are, but glancing at a stat sheet and drawing conclusions is laughable.

As a side note, please use punctuation.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:50 PM
  #41
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To Boston: Gonchar


To Ottawa: Ryder + Minnesota's 2nd

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01-23-2011, 02:52 PM
  #42
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Mike Fisher to Nashville for a 2nd and a prospect, maybe Roman Josi.

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01-23-2011, 02:52 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Kesselisboss View Post
meh i think an Top prospect and a first is doable as he is a 1st line center.....

And

he wont win a game for you next year when the plan would be essentially to tank. So basically you win by loosing lol.


Also...i know its kinda outrageous....but what about this idea...

To LA:
Alfredsson
Spezza

To Ott:
Brayden Schenn
Jonathan Bernier
1st
LOL, LA says hell no.

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01-23-2011, 02:54 PM
  #44
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If Alfy was on an expiring contract, I'd love for the Pens to try and work something out, cap wise, to acquire him at the deadline. However, doesn't he have a couple of years (after this one) still left on his deal? Pens' don't have room for that.

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01-23-2011, 02:54 PM
  #45
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Melynk is finally getting it which is exciting

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01-23-2011, 02:54 PM
  #46
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LOL, LA says hell no.
Good, because I don't want to trade Spezza for that (or any other) package. It's just not sensible.

Schenn was lights out at the WJC, but he also was more physically mature and projects to be a 2nd line center, probably. Maybe Kesler level of production, if the Kings are lucky. Bernier is an awesome goaltending prospect but that's so random that it's hard to know, and L.A.'s 1st is irrelevant.

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01-23-2011, 02:54 PM
  #47
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what would it take from Calgary to land Spezza? yeah i know everyone thinks the Flames should rebuild but i think a major retooling would do the team wonders...


to Calgary Flames:
C - Jason Spezza

to Ottawa Senators:
C - Olli Jokinen
LW - Niklas Hagman
C - Mikael Backlund
2013 Pick (Conditional) - based on the # of games Spezza plays in the next 2 seasons... 1st if Spezza misses less than 20 games... 2nd if he misses less than 40... 3rd if he misses 40+

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01-23-2011, 02:55 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
what would it take from Calgary to land Spezza? yeah i know everyone thinks the Flames should rebuild but i think a major retooling would do the team wonders...


to Calgary Flames:
C - Jason Spezza

to Ottawa Senators:
C - Olli Jokinen
LW - Niklas Hagman
C - Mikael Backlund
2013 Pick (Conditional) - based on the # of games Spezza plays in the next 2 seasons... 1st if Spezza misses less than 20 games... 2nd if he misses less than 40... 3rd if he misses 40+
I just threw up in my mouth.

EDIT: Honestly, I don't think the Flames have the assets to make Spezza expendable to the Sens.

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01-23-2011, 02:57 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
what would it take from Calgary to land Spezza? yeah i know everyone thinks the Flames should rebuild but i think a major retooling would do the team wonders...


to Calgary Flames:
C - Jason Spezza

to Ottawa Senators:
C - Olli Jokinen
LW - Niklas Hagman
C - Mikael Backlund
2013 Pick (Conditional) - based on the # of games Spezza plays in the next 2 seasons... 1st if Spezza misses less than 20 games... 2nd if he misses less than 40... 3rd if he misses 40+
Quality > Quantity. That's not how a rebuilding minded trade is done.

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Old
01-23-2011, 02:57 PM
  #50
IcedCapp
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I thought Gonchar was the greatest UFA signing, ever? That's weird.

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