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Kings inquired about Marian Gaborik

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Old
01-23-2011, 07:44 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by n8 View Post
So currently we are at "currently capable of scoring at a 40 goals/season pace on a yearly basis, as well as putting up ~80+ points that HF poster Brian Boyle approves of" heh heh. A debate that cannot be won.

I think Semin would part ways. Kariya and Selanne did so it's not unprecedented. Plus, keeping so many high priced players (AO, Backstrom, Green) is going to strain the Caps' cap. I also remember Semin spending time off of AO's line last season and still producing (40g season).
Well, considering the Capitals state of cap space, and Semin's current cap hit, I wouldn't think it would have as big as an effect on the cap as some people think. He'll get a ~1.5-2 m raise. And Laich is a free agent as well, but he'll likely get the same type of raise as well, and maybe less, considering his struggles this year. Also, Hannan's 4.5 cap hit comes off the books, as well as Bradley's 1m at the end of the year, and with about 2 mil in cap space currently, the Caps seem fine.

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I also remember Semin spending time off of AO's line last season and still producing (40g season).
He still played tons of powerplay time with Green, AO, and Backstrom on the ice, compared to what would be Staal, Dubinsky, and Stepan. AND EVEN THEN, he spent time on the 2nd line. He still played plenty of ES time with those players.

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Given the powers of magical foresight, knowing Semin was willing to sign at Gaborik's same 5 year $7.5M, would you be willing to trade Gaborik then for presumably strong assets that would improve our team further?
Depends of the assets, and the team we are trading him to. I'd prefer to get back a legitimate top-end puckmover + a semi-replacement for Gaborik back at the least, and I think those assets together + more would be incredibly difficult to require. We know Gaborik works, he's scored 40 goals for us before. We don't know is Semin will.

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01-23-2011, 07:49 PM
  #127
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I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.

Schenn + Simmonds + 2nd for Gaborik

I would be okay with that deal. The team will take 2 steps back this year in order to take 4-5 steps forward in the next couple of years.

Simmonds is a tougher, more aggressive version of Dubinsky. Who wouldnt take that?

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01-23-2011, 08:11 PM
  #128
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i would take schenn + for gabo

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01-23-2011, 08:36 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.

Schenn + Simmonds + 2nd for Gaborik

I would be okay with that deal. The team will take 2 steps back this year in order to take 4-5 steps forward in the next couple of years.

Simmonds is a tougher, more aggressive version of Dubinsky. Who wouldnt take that?
Thats absolutely not enough. Simmonds is not having an impressive year. I know he's young but I'd need a lot more convincing than just that to deal Gaborik away.

And Schenn's potential and ceiling is nice and all but that doesnt mean he is going to pan out that way. You can talk all you want about how talented he is but he hasnt proven anything yet.

The 2nd round pick would for starters have to be at least a 1st round pick in this deal.

Gaborik has 552 career points. In a big slumping year so far he has still managed to be 2nd on the team and scoring. Cant even begin to imagine the damage he'd do if he gets a little hot.

I'd rather not be set back a couple of years because we felt the need to trade one of the best snipers in the game and couldnt replace him. No Brad Richards doesnt replace him. No Parise wont hit free agency. That package is weak. Gaborik on this off year he is having will still probably produce 60-70 points especially if he gets hot for a couple weeks. You dont find players like that very often. This organization is in fantastic position. I'm all for the youth and I know the rest of you are too. And because we see dubinsky, callahan, staal, etc, succeeding meanwhile witnessing the next generation starting to come through in full force like MZA, MDZ, McD, Grachev, etc, you guys just want to keep adding more youth. But you have to have some veterans, especially if that vet is an elite player in this league. The team is very competitive and if they were healthy they'd probably be situated in the top 4 in the conference right now because thats how strong of a team we have. We dont need to set ourselves back because we're infatuated with young prospects. schenn is nice but not nice enough to give up next year and the one after that possibly of being in the playoffs where with group we have we could easily do damage in those playoffs.

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01-23-2011, 08:40 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Jagr68NYR94Leetch View Post
Thats absolutely not enough. Simmonds is not having an impressive year. I know he's young but I'd need a lot more convincing than just that to deal Gaborik away.

And Schenn's potential and ceiling is nice and all but that doesnt mean he is going to pan out that way. You can talk all you want about how talented he is but he hasnt proven anything yet.

The 2nd round pick would for starters have to be at least a 1st round pick in this deal.

Gaborik has 552 career points. In a big slumping year so far he has still managed to be 2nd on the team and scoring. Cant even begin to imagine the damage he'd do if he gets a little hot.

I'd rather not be set back a couple of years because we felt the need to trade one of the best snipers in the game and couldnt replace him. No Brad Richards doesnt replace him. No Parise wont hit free agency. That package is weak. Gaborik on this off year he is having will still probably produce 60-70 points especially if he gets hot for a couple weeks. You dont find players like that very often. This organization is in fantastic position. I'm all for the youth and I know the rest of you are too. And because we see dubinsky, callahan, staal, etc, succeeding meanwhile witnessing the next generation starting to come through in full force like MZA, MDZ, McD, Grachev, etc, you guys just want to keep adding more youth. But you have to have some veterans, especially if that vet is an elite player in this league. The team is very competitive and if they were healthy they'd probably be situated in the top 4 in the conference right now because thats how strong of a team we have. We dont need to set ourselves back because we're infatuated with young prospects. schenn is nice but not nice enough to give up next year and the one after that possibly of being in the playoffs where with group we have we could easily do damage in those playoffs.
For me, this team will most likely be ready to compete regularly for The Cup in 3-4 years. By that time Gaborik will be 32 and possibly in his final year of his contract. If a team offered a player like Schenn + who I ranked as a top-5 prospect in the entire league, for a player who I think may not be a part of my organizations run in 3-4 years then I make the move and start to develop my team.

Simmonds is having a poor offensive season, so is his team. Dubinsky had a poor offensive season as well. He seems to have done alright for himself. He will be a 50-60 point power forward in the NHL.

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01-23-2011, 08:51 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.

Schenn + Simmonds + 2nd for Gaborik

I would be okay with that deal. The team will take 2 steps back this year in order to take 4-5 steps forward in the next couple of years.

Simmonds is a tougher, more aggressive version of Dubinsky. Who wouldnt take that?
That's a hugely premature and inaccurate statement. One would think you were talking about someone like Backes or Kesler. I'd think about that deal. I'd do it if it were a 1st instead of a 2nd, or if it were Johnson instead of Simmonds and the 2nd. Schenn + Johnson = Gaborik.

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01-23-2011, 08:57 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
That's a hugely premature and inaccurate statement. One would think you were talking about someone like Backes or Kesler. I'd think about that deal. I'd do it if it were a 1st instead of a 2nd, or if it were Johnson instead of Simmonds and the 2nd. Schenn + Johnson = Gaborik.
Its not at all. Watch the kid play and tell me that isn't who he reminds you of. He looks like any of the power forwards who are in his age group when they first broke into the league(Backes, Benn, Dubinsky, Ladd, Bourque). They all can skate well and have good(not great) hands and will run people through the boards. They provide(or will provide) a physical presence in the top-6 and will drop the gloves to protect themselves or their teammates.

40-60 point, 100-200 PIM power forwards. I think Simmonds is most definitely going to be in that category for most of his career.

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01-23-2011, 09:03 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.

Schenn + Simmonds + 2nd for Gaborik

I would be okay with that deal. The team will take 2 steps back this year in order to take 4-5 steps forward in the next couple of years.

Simmonds is a tougher, more aggressive version of Dubinsky. Who wouldnt take that?
I don't see LA parting with Simmonds. I'll take Schenn, Toffoli, Forbort and a #1 for Gaborik...plenty of assets to make deals when this team is ready to compete for a Cup.

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01-23-2011, 09:06 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Laces out Dan View Post
Your point is weak. Yes, those are 4 elite talents. If there weren't 29 other potential teams offering them FA deals, and they were locks to come here, your point might make slight sense. But since we DO have Gabrorik, and world class snipers are not easy to come by, you damn well do hold onto him unless you get a great offer.
I certainly see how talented Gabby is, and love his sniper scoring ways. Let me just say that up front. I just think it is pretty easy to spent 7.5m productively (unless your name is Glen). If we were talking about Stamkos, Crosby etc I'd say hell no but is Gabby really in that class? He was available in FA for a reason, and so have others. My point is that if you have 7.5m, you'll have no trouble finding good players to take it. If we could get those players, Schenn, and a player or 2 from LA who is good, that's pretty much a 3 or 4 piece for 1 trade assuming we replace Gaborik effectively.

I see that you don't think we can replace him easilly an I respect that opinion. I def. think the opposite though. Just my opinion, and I guess others don't agree so I'll leave it at that.

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01-23-2011, 09:07 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
I don't see LA parting with Simmonds. I'll take Schenn, Toffoli, Forbort and a #1 for Gaborik...plenty of assets to make deals when this team is ready to compete for a Cup.
I could get behind a deal like that as well. I'm very high on Simmonds. Although, the Kings are as well.

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01-23-2011, 09:09 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
For me, this team will most likely be ready to compete regularly for The Cup in 3-4 years. By that time Gaborik will be 32 and possibly in his final year of his contract. If a team offered a player like Schenn + who I ranked as a top-5 prospect in the entire league, for a player who I think may not be a part of my organizations run in 3-4 years then I make the move and start to develop my team.

Simmonds is having a poor offensive season, so is his team. Dubinsky had a poor offensive season as well. He seems to have done alright for himself. He will be a 50-60 point power forward in the NHL.
Why cant this team compete right now or even next year as a threat in the playoffs? When fully healthy the only teams that really would be troublesome for them are the Flyers and Penguins. Everyone else has their flaws. The Rangers, when healthy, would have one of the deepest teams in the league. Maybe they wont have multiple elite forwards like gaborik but they'll have enough depth to outwork opposing teams which is what it comes down to in the playoffs.

You can rank Schenn in the Top 5. Some might not give him that. I'm not saying he's a bad player or that he wont hit his potential. But we have a proven elite goal scorer. We have him while our team can compete for something more than just a playoff spot. This team has earned that respect from us fans, at least they should have by now with how hard they play. You dont deal gaborik for a kid who is simply one of the best prospects in the league but has yet to do anything at this level. He isnt Hall or Seguin. He is not on stamkos' level when he had first broken into the league. He is just a very good prospect. The organization has progressed so much over the past couple years. I dont think this is the time to take steps back.

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01-23-2011, 09:11 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by NYRangers16 View Post
I certainly see how talented Gabby is, and love his sniper scoring ways. Let me just say that up front. I just think it is pretty easy to spent 7.5m productively (unless your name is Glen). If we were talking about Stamkos, Crosby etc I'd say hell no but is Gabby really in that class? He was available in FA for a reason, and so have others. My point is that if you have 7.5m, you'll have no trouble finding good players to take it. If we could get those players, Schenn, and a player or 2 from LA who is good, that's pretty much a 3 or 4 piece for 1 trade assuming we replace Gaborik effectively.

I see that you don't think we can replace him easilly an I respect that opinion. I def. think the opposite though. Just my opinion, and I guess others don't agree so I'll leave it at that.
Gaborik is a game changer. He has struggled this year but you shouldnt let that hinder your judgement of him. He is definitely in that class of elite players in this league.

And he was a free agent because he didnt want to stay in Minnesota. Minny offered him a contract but he didnt like it. He didnt hit the free agency market because they didnt want him, he was an FA because he didnt want them.

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01-23-2011, 09:19 PM
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Gaborik isn't getting traded but if he did we'd need to flip some of the assets received for another scoring forward. More trouble than it's worth.

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01-23-2011, 09:26 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
I don't see LA parting with Simmonds. I'll take Schenn, Toffoli, Forbort and a #1 for Gaborik...plenty of assets to make deals when this team is ready to compete for a Cup.

This is the type of deal that Slats would have to consider. LA is not dealing Brown or Simmonds to weaken one area in order to strengthen their scoring with Gabby. Rangers take a step back now but would be loaded in a few years.

Don't think Lombardi can stomach unloading that many assets quite yet.

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01-23-2011, 09:31 PM
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Don't at all see him on the Dubi, Backes, Neal level at this point. That being said, don't think Lombardi moves him.


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01-23-2011, 09:34 PM
  #141
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I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.
I do. Anyone who watched the world junior would also. He would be the only reason I'd even consider listening.

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01-23-2011, 09:39 PM
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Its not at all. Watch the kid play and tell me that isn't who he reminds you of. He looks like any of the power forwards who are in his age group when they first broke into the league(Backes, Benn, Dubinsky, Ladd, Bourque). They all can skate well and have good(not great) hands and will run people through the boards. They provide(or will provide) a physical presence in the top-6 and will drop the gloves to protect themselves or their teammates.

40-60 point, 100-200 PIM power forwards. I think Simmonds is most definitely going to be in that category for most of his career.
I do watch him play. And I totally agree with this post. But your first post intimated that he was already a better, more aggressive version of Dubinsky, which he absolutely is not. He may get there. He may not. He's still pretty raw.

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01-23-2011, 09:49 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
I do watch him play. And I totally agree with this post. But your first post intimated that he was already a better, more aggressive version of Dubinsky, which he absolutely is not. He may get there. He may not. He's still pretty raw.
Well said. We'll see where he's at when he's 24 like Dubi.

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01-23-2011, 09:50 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
I do watch him play. And I totally agree with this post. But your first post intimated that he was already a better, more aggressive version of Dubinsky, which he absolutely is not. He may get there. He may not. He's still pretty raw.
Ahh, I meant it to come across as I think they will be similar level players once both are developed. Their ceilings are similar but I think Simmonds is the more aggressive player.

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01-23-2011, 10:43 PM
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I do. Anyone who watched the world junior would also. He would be the only reason I'd even consider listening.
Call me crazy but I liked Johansen and Bjugstad more in regards to projecting centers to the NHL.

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01-23-2011, 10:59 PM
  #146
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A top 5 or 10 player thats under contract for a couple of more years...he'd pull a hefty payment, but lets not gut their farm so we'll send them back some young players and a prospect.

Gabby, Sauer, Grachev.

Doughty, Schenn, Teubert, #1 2011, #2 2011, #2 2012

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01-23-2011, 11:34 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I dont think people understand just how good of a prospect Brayden Schenn is. Future #1 center. Future Canadien Olympian. Future All-Star.

Schenn + Simmonds + 2nd for Gaborik

I would be okay with that deal. The team will take 2 steps back this year in order to take 4-5 steps forward in the next couple of years.

Simmonds is a tougher, more aggressive version of Dubinsky. Who wouldnt take that?
I would not take that deal. Schenn is gonna be good but it's still possible he ends up an NHL player with a 60 pt upside which isn't really good value for a player like Gaborik. I cannot share your optimism. I need to see Jack Johnson or Dustin Brown in there (established players) somewhere if I'm dealing Gaborik. Schenn as the key piece in the deal is not enough for me.

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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
A top 5 or 10 player thats under contract for a couple of more years...he'd pull a hefty payment, but lets not gut their farm so we'll send them back some young players and a prospect.

Gabby, Sauer, Grachev.

Doughty, Schenn, Teubert, #1 2011, #2 2011, #2 2012
hahaha, you are under valuing Doughty here. There is no way we could get that deal. At the very least, those draft picks would have to be going the other way. Doughty > Gaborik. Schenn > Sauer, maybe even Sauer + Grachev (i.e. I don't think you could get Schenn at that price). + Gaborik supposed be enough impetus to move Doughty AND Schenn? GTFO! (I mean this in the friendliest of ways)

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01-23-2011, 11:46 PM
  #148
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I don't know about you guys, but I would take Schenn + Simmonds + 1st and run with it.

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01-23-2011, 11:51 PM
  #149
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this is just the same as a GM calling asking about Alex Ovechkin's availability, guys like this wont be moved no worries Gabs aint going nowhere

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